Miscellaneous Questions Thread 3 - Ask Question, Receive Answer

[Tiamat]

Well yeah, I think it's easy to imply this was a contract written by a youkai (according to a most unreliable narrator, anyway; I think the Spell Card Rules benefit humans more than youkai, but that's totally off topic), but a devil's contract? Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you mean by this. I don't see the connection. Can you explain it more?

Ah, I see what you're asking now. Well, in this case, what I mean is that as far as I know, "youkai contract" (probably) = "devil contract" based on how there probably aren't many other types of youkai contracts (a "youkai contract" presumably being something mystical and fantastical in nature, not just some run of the mill paper legal document that any ol' human could produce on normal paper).  Because all devils are youkai, one could simply use "youkai contract" interchangeably with "devil contract". Sure, all youkai aren't devils, but the amount of youkai that actually do have contracts (authentic mystical contracts that have their own type of presumably mystical paper) in their repertoire of things they do that aren't devils is low enough that one wouldn't always have to make the differentiation.

Not that I have much knowledge of Japanese myths and youkai. Maybe the concept of tanuki contracts exist and it's one of those. Or maybe there is an umbrella concept of youkai contracts different from devil contracts which... does.... something that makes it worthy as being a notably different thing than human contracts and having its own paper. *shrug*

The details were given to show that some youkai could have proposed the rule to the shrine maiden.

The Stage 3 dialogue of th11 uses this word too, and it's quite sure nothing supernatural is forcing them to keep the promise.


I always thought any youkai who eats humans from the Human Village would be severely punished, and that's how the promise is kept.
(I currently have nothing to back this up.)

Which stage 3 dialogue uses that word?  And er.... which word? (honest questions. As shown slightly earlier in this thread, these things happen when one translates from one language to another, alas)

Personally I always thought that having spell card rules being under a magical contract that binds the entire area was a convenient way to explain how ridiculously independent or chaotic or just plain baka youkai and fairies, new completely destructive youkai like Medicine Melancholy, or newcomers who otherwise wouldn't be aware of the rules ((such as... well, almost every major antagonist and their relations from the past 6 games or so, unless they like... found out about the rules off-screen or something) instinctively or whatever-else know to follow them.  Meanwhile someone outside of Gensokyo being fought outside of Gensokyo (such as Yorihime) wouldn't know and would have to voluntarily follow the rules.

The idea of a bunch of youkai enforcers going around giving the beatdown to anyone who doesn't follow the spell card rules is cool and hilarious, but not really very youkai-like.  The only one I can really imagine agreeing to do such a thing is Yukari herself (also cool and hilarious to imagine), but she's too lazy for such a thing (maybe she sicks Ran on people? Release the hounds!  ...also cool and hilarious but hard for me to swallow). Oh, and Tengu (wolf tengu, specifically. Release the hounds!) but I doubt they'd want to get involved with policing anything outside of their own society.

[CyberAngel]

The idea of a bunch of youkai enforcers going around giving the beatdown to anyone who doesn't follow the spell card rules is cool and hilarious, but not really very youkai-like.  The only one I can really imagine agreeing to do such a thing is Yukari herself (also cool and hilarious to imagine), but she's too lazy for such a thing (maybe she sicks Ran on people? Release the hounds!  ...also cool and hilarious but hard for me to swallow). Oh, and Tengu (wolf tengu, specifically. Release the hounds!) but I doubt they'd want to get involved with policing anything outside of their own society.

I'd say that in such cases that would be done by human youkai exterminators, be it Reimu, Marisa or a group from the village. Like in OSP chapter 16, when a wolf turning youkai killed a few humans, and Reimu was pretty intent on putting it down for good.

[Drake]

I have troubles with "devil's contract" (悪魔の契約) because the PMiSS Vampire article is, as far as I can tell, literally the only time the term ever appears. The fact that there has to be the distinction between it and any other contract, that the "devil's contract" [alone] is absolute and can never be broken, is itself really odd. Is there something inherent about the case of vampires attacking humans that requires such a binding contract, whereas everything else talked about as a contract/deal/etc is not as important? It doesn't make sense to make a special note for Remilia simply because she's a vampire, either. Are the vampires for whatever reason not able to keep the "usual" sort of contract? I wouldn't assume so, so there doesn't seem to be a need for there to be anything special about this case.

Furthermore, the fact that they need to take the extra step in the first place is questionable. If the youkai in general weren't able to attack humans since the formation of the Barrier, and this is why "their willpower faded" and so on, we'd still have to assume that they got food "elsewhere" as they currently do. This being the case, why would Remilia have to agree to a contract that is basically the same as what all the other youkai adhere to, but is still something "different" because it's a "devil's contract"? It should be evident that even newcomers have to adhere to the general no-eating-humans rule, so why this is mentioned specifically in regard to the Vampire Incident is unclear.

The main solution I see here is that the "devil's contract" is just an over-explanation of the rules that were already in place and known about, and Remilia just had to explicitly agree to it. Whether this is a special case or that all youkai have to explicitly agree is another matter, but the conclusion here would be that this devil's contract isn't anything out of the ordinary, and this sort of all-binding contract is the same for everyone.

[Biakmon]

There is one law in the spell card rule which I don't really understand.

1) "Relying on stamina" and repeating an attack is not allowed.
What does this mean "relying on stamina" is not allowed? (still confuse about that one)

[Sungho]

Which stage 3 dialogue uses that word?  And er.... which word? (honest questions. As shown slightly earlier in this thread, these things happen when one translates from one language to another, alas)

Oops, my bad. In Reimu/Yukari's scenario.
Yukari uses the word 約束(which was translated to promise in the translations) when talking about the deal between the surface and the underground.

[Drake]

Netherlands

lol

- "Relying on stamina" and repeating an attack is not allowed.
What does this mean "relying on stamina" is not allowed?

It isn't relying on stamina, it's relying on physical strength and simply wailing on the opponent. refer to below

It seems Aquamarine made massive edits to the translation of the wiki page, and I seriously do not agree with these changes.

[cuc]

The "contract" topic:

Here's another translation omission. The original text is 妖怪同士の契約書, "contract between youkai".

I'd say it's explicitly got nothing to do with "devil's contract"; instead it's based on the idea of an imaginary youkai society.

lol
It isn't relying on stamina, it's relying on physical strength and simply wailing on the opponent.

Actually aquamarine is right, and you are wrong. The only problem is with the wording.

This is the second sentence of a clause about "announcing your number of rounds beforehand", i.e. the number of lifebars for bosses, and number of lives for players. Its real message is intended to be "you can only fight your pre-announced rounds; you can't keep attacking if the rounds run out, even if you still have physical strength left."

[Drake]

I completely missed that it was part of the previous term. Reading through the passage in my copy makes it much clearer. I'm sure many others have made this mistake too; this should be made a bit clearer in the transcription, I think.

That being resolved, I also don't like the term "naming duel" and partially "duel" even though that's a more literally accurate translation of 命名決闘. We do use duel for 決闘 in all other cases I'm aware of, and I acknowledge using the term to introduce the concept of a spell card is a formality, but it still reads really awkwardly, what with things like "giving a name to the duel" and "if you are defeated in a naming duel".

[cuc]

Yes, the phrase 命名決闘 is the temporary (and explanatory) name of the concept, later christened "spell card". It's a duel that has been given a name. I don't think the word "duel" here is used in the correct way, even in Japanese.

"Denominated duel"?

[Clarste]

"Named" would roll off the tongue better.

[Starxsword]

It's the law of the conservation of detail.  "Paper used to make youkai contracts" isn't something most authors would bother bringing up if youkai contracts weren't involved somehow.

How is that relevant though? Spell card rules is assumed to not be the original draft. I do not think the shrine maiden was involved in the original draft.

And I wouldn't really take Yorihime as a good example. She's not from Gensokyo nor was the battle in Gensokyo.

Then, lets use Dolls in Pseudo Paradise as an example, where a youkai, killed 7 honest men(thieves).
Or just generally, the Youkai Article in PMiSS.

However, the reason most youkai attack humans is because they need prey.
That's why one should offer something else to eat in place of themselves.
Offering a cow will save you from being attacked for a while.
There are many that have a strong sense of duty, and will befriend those who do not turn against them.

Personally I always thought that having spell card rules being under a magical contract that binds the entire area was a convenient way to explain how ridiculously independent or chaotic or just plain baka youkai and fairies, new completely destructive youkai like Medicine Melancholy, or newcomers who otherwise wouldn't be aware of the rules ((such as... well, almost every major antagonist and their relations from the past 6 games or so, unless they like... found out about the rules off-screen or something) instinctively or whatever-else know to follow them.  Meanwhile someone outside of Gensokyo being fought outside of Gensokyo (such as Yorihime) wouldn't know and would have to voluntarily follow the rules.

I don't see how that is the case, as youkai are able to not play by spell card rules. I have mentioned on my example from Marisa's Grimoire. What Suika does is not a spell card.

Oni Sign "Complete Massacre on Mt.Ooe"
She catches and throws you, usually when she's drunk at parties.
This isn't danmaku either, and it really hurts.

Is there something inherent about the case of vampires attacking humans that requires such a binding contract, whereas everything else talked about as a contract/deal/etc is not as important? It doesn't make sense to make a special note for Remilia simply because she's a vampire, either. Are the vampires for whatever reason not able to keep the "usual" sort of contract? I wouldn't assume so, so there doesn't seem to be a need for there to be anything special about this case.

This article here elaborates on it. http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Perfect_Memento_in_Strict_Sense/Vampire. Vampires are, by contract, forbidden to attack humans living in Gensokyo.
The article on Youkai mentions no such restriction.

The details of this contract are that the youkai will offer them humans from which to feed (*3); in return, the vampires will not attack humans living in Gensokyo.
3: It is said these are humans from the outside world or those whose deaths are of no consequence (suicidal, etc.).

It should be evident that even newcomers have to adhere to the general no-eating-humans rule, so why this is mentioned specifically in regard to the Vampire Incident is unclear.

The spell card rule is something that I do not think anyone has to adhere to. As mentioned in Akyuu's monologue, if youkai in Gensokyou are too weak, bad things will happen.

That flaw was that the youkai's inability to attack humans began to weaken their powers.
That meant that if a new and powerful youkai ever ceased to exist in the outside and passed into Gensokyo, the denizens would be unable to resist if it decided to subjugate them.

Overall, the way I see spell card rules is that it is a rule where youkai adhere to. However, it is not binding and they are not forced to adhere to it.

[Drake]

Then, lets use Dolls in Pseudo Paradise as an example, where a youkai, killed 7 honest men(thieves).
Or just generally, the Youkai Article in PMiSS.

However, the reason most youkai attack humans is because they need prey.
That's why one should offer something else to eat in place of themselves.
Offering a cow will save you from being attacked for a while.
There are many that have a strong sense of duty, and will befriend those who do not turn against them.

DiPP is usually considered "just a story" (as in, possibly not "just a story", but it's formulated as such and doesn't seem to be strongly connected to anything else), and that excerpt from the Youkai article is basically just what Akyuu recalls from all of her previous incarnations, which Akyuu admits herself isn't all that necessary anymore. It's correct, but actually attacking the humans is no longer relevant.

I don't see how that is the case, as youkai are able to not play by spell card rules. I have mentioned on my example from Marisa's Grimoire. What Suika does is not a spell card.

Oni Sign "Complete Massacre on Mt.Ooe"
She catches and throws you, usually when she's drunk at parties.
This isn't danmaku either, and it really hurts.

While the attacks she used aren't very danmaku-like, they're still spell cards formed under the same rules. Marisa just doesn't find them very representative of what danmaku is supposed to mean. It gives valuable insight on what is in-universe actually considered an "unfair" attack.

This article here elaborates on it. http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Perfect_Memento_in_Strict_Sense/Vampire. Vampires are, by contract, forbidden to attack humans living in Gensokyo.
The article on Youkai mentions no such restriction.

The details of this contract are that the youkai will offer them humans from which to feed (*3); in return, the vampires will not attack humans living in Gensokyo.
3: It is said these are humans from the outside world or those whose deaths are of no consequence (suicidal, etc.).

First of all, while it is obviously implied the vampires are the subject of the contract, it doesn't actually say "the vampires" will not attack humans; just that in exchange for proper humans as food, "they" (rather, whoever the implied subject of the contract is) will not attack the indigenous humans. I think you missed the point of what I'm saying, which is that this is exactly the same rule as all of the other youkai, and this has been going on since the Barrier was formed. The only difference is that it's explicitly mentioned as a contract in this case, which is what I find curious. It doesn't make much sense to establish that there is a devil's contract that is absolutely binding when it has no real bearing on the matter at all.

The spell card rule is something that I do not think anyone has to adhere to. As mentioned in Akyuu's monologue, if youkai in Gensokyou are too weak, bad things will happen.

That flaw was that the youkai's inability to attack humans began to weaken their powers.
That meant that if a new and powerful youkai ever ceased to exist in the outside and passed into Gensokyo, the denizens would be unable to resist if it decided to subjugate them.

It's that the current youkai, then weakened, wouldn't be able to stand up to the new oppressor, and Gensokyo could end up being dominated. Not humans. Since this is talking about battles among the youkai, it isn't really discussing the inability to eat Gensokyo's humans or following the spell card rules. The spell card rules being absolute or not has nothing to do with what the problem was before the spell card rules, anyway. It's because of the rules that said problem is now fixed.

[Tiamat]

Hrm... well, this whole fiasco is what I meant when I said "It's annoying how the only time the contract was ever brought up anywhere else was in Cage in Lunatic Runagate".  What I meant was that it was annoying because you'd think such a huge concept (devil contracts) could almost be as fundamental to Gensokyo as physics is only brought up/confirmed again in one source. But if even Cage in Lunatic Runagate doesn't use the same contractual word-age as PMiSS, that just.... makes it even more annoying, I suppose.

I guess at this point the only path one could take to figure out if the contract (....both of them, if the spell card one even exists) applies to all youkai is to gather regular examples/evidence, but even that probably won't confirm or unconfirm anything (I'm not sure that wolf turning into a youkai would apply, since we don't know if contract applies to animals that are on the brink of becoming a youkai). Bah.

I still think it makes more sense for it to apply to all youkai (...both of them) rather than youkai just voluntarily following the rules. Binding youkai to follow something through some magical source seems more plausible to me considering the sheer chaotic nature of youkai (and again would explain several other things rather conveniently). But that's an opinion rather than anything that can be factually proven (the exact nature of youkai could be exaggerated, for one thing).

[Biakmon]

I have posted some questions above but after all those talk about whether the contract and spell card, it seems nobody have noticed them so I will re-post them here.

There is one law in the spell card rule which I don't really understand.

2) Does the spell card rule battle necessary applies also to the residents of "hell, heaven and/or even Netherworld" or only to the residents of Gensokyo?

Let suppose their a fight between the residents in either of those 3 places (hell, heaven, Netherworld), do you think they have to follow the spell card rule or can they fight normally?

- Suppose Marisa Kirisame was to have a fight with someone in hell (e.g Utsuho Reiuji) or in heaven (e.g, Tenshi Hinanawi). Would the spell card rule still apply or not?

3) Also from what I had understood you can only use one spell card once in a duel/fight, isn't?

4) From what I read, even before the creation of the Gensokyo, youkai already exist. But there something which I don't quite understand.
Since youkai are suppose to be immortal in a sense and thus cannot die from old age.

- Does that mean they don't have a lifespan to begin with?

Since I'm not too familiar with Japanese folktales I may have miss something but let say Vampire and other youkai are considered as some sort of immortal creatures (cannot die from aging).

- What about "European dragons" those lifespan generally range from let say 250 - 500 years and even more according to some sites?
- Can they also be consider as youkai?
- If they (European Dragons) can be classified as youkai, what about the lifespan thing?
- Does being a youkai make you immortal (cannot die from aging) or does becoming a youkai and residing in Gensokyo make you one??

- Finally do you think if an let say European dragon was to live in gensokyo, will he/she become immortal?

Can anyone help me with those questions, please.

[KuroArashi100]

There is one law in the spell card rule which I don't really understand.

1) "Relying on stamina" and repeating an attack is not allowed.
What does this mean "relying on stamina" is not allowed? ( Am still confused about this one. Can anyone provide an example.)
Can anyone help me with those questions, please.

http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Perfect_Memento_in_Strict_Sense/Draft_of_Spell_Card_Rules
The spellcard rules say, that battles must not be completely based on power alone, so that weak humans/youkai could still win.
If everyone just tried to survive, the strong would be able to easily defeat the weak, which would be a somewhat unfair battle system i.e.:
Yukari fights with Rumia. While both are able to defend themselves, Yukari would always win because her stamina is higher.

2) Does the spell card rule battle necessary applies also to the residents of "hell, heaven and/or even Netherlands" or only to the residents of Gensokyo?

I don't really understand what you mean with hell, heaven and Netherlands.
Hell and heaven are for the dead; those that reside in there have yet to make an appearance so we don't now.
If with Netherlands you mean the underground, Palace of the Earth Spirits, etc. they do use spellcards, so the rules do seem to apply to them.

3) Also from what I had understood you can only use one spell card once in a duel/fight, isn't?

You said so yourself in the first question.

4) From what I read, even before the creation of the Gensokyo, youkai already exist. But there something which I don't quite understand.
Since youkai are suppose to be immortal in a sense and thus cannot die from old age.

- Does that mean they don't have a lifespan to begin with?

Since I'm not too familiar with Japanese folktales I may have miss something but let say Vampire and other youkai are considered as some sort of immortal creatures (cannot die from aging).

- What about "European dragons" those lifespan generally range from let say 250 - 500 years and even more according to some sites?
- Can they also be consider as youkai?
- If they (European Dragons) can be classified as youkai, what about the lifespan thing?
- Does being a youkai make you immortal (cannot die from aging) or does becoming a youkai and residing in Gensokyo make you one??

- Finally do you think if an let say European dragon was to live in gensokyo, will he/she become immortal?

Most youkai do seem to be biologically immortal, so they can die from injury, just not from old age.
These "European Dragons" are somewhat vague, since there are so many stories about them. In some stories they are immortal, and in some they are not.
Since youkai simply means something like supernatural creature, they would probably indeed be classified as youkai, and they might become immortal if they already weren't.
Youkai always existed, however, if humans forgot about them, they would disappear. This is one of the reasons Gensokyo was made. Because people in the outside world didn't believe in youkai anymore, they stopped existing everywhere except for Gensokyo.(Where there still were humans that believed in them.)

[TrueShadow]

Hmm...Didn't Eiki say to Yuuka in POFV about "You have lived a bit too long"? Wouldn't that imply that youkai do in fact have a lifespan? Maybe it's different for each youkai?

And somewhere (WaHH I think) Reimu said that Gensokyo youkai don't really need beliefs to exist.

[Sagus]

Hmm...Didn't Eiki say to Yuuka in POFV about "You have lived a bit too long"? Wouldn't that imply that youkai do in fact have a lifespan? Maybe it's different for each youkai?

Eh, dunno if Eiki is that trustworthy. She probably exaggerates her sermons so that people will listen to her. I think she probably meant that in the sense of "someone should've exterminated you already" or something.

And somewhere (WaHH I think) Reimu said that Gensokyo youkai don't really need beliefs to exist.

Going by what Byakuren said in SoPM, Gensokyo's youkai don't need belief to shape their existence anymore (for instance, regardless of what humans think the tengu should be [monks, ninjas, whatever], they won't change to fit that view), but at the end of the day, they still need to fullfill their purpose and make humans fear them, or else they'll become weak (and eventually die, I suppose).

Youkai always existed, however, if humans forgot about them, they would disappear. This is one of the reasons Gensokyo was made. Because people in the outside world didn't believe in youkai anymore, they stopped existing everywhere except for Gensokyo.(Where there still were humans that believed in them.)

Monsters aren't completely dead in the outside world (hobgoblins, chupacabras and tanukis, were all shown to still exist there), probably because there's always someone to believe in them.

I'm beggining to think that Gensokyo's true purpose is to eventually completely free youkai from humanity's imagination, turning them into real beings, while also being a good way to keep some of them safe just in case humans completely eradicate the belief in the supernatural in the outside world. But eh, I don't have much to back that other than Byakuren's lines on SoPM, which don't really imply that.

[Prime32]

On the topic of youkai sages, I'd say the Three Great Evil Youkai would be good candidates, two of whom would correspond to Suika and possibly Tenma.

I'm beggining to think that Gensokyo's true purpose is to eventually completely free youkai from humanity's imagination, turning them into real beings, while also being a good way to keep some of them safe just in case humans completely eradicate the belief in the supernatural in the outside world. But eh, I don't have much to back that other than Byakuren's lines on SoPM, which don't really imply that.

There are cases of younger youkai being noted as less "youkai-ish" than older ones. See Aya and Hatate.

[Tiamat]

Isn't Aya... old?  Or do you mean Aya compared to Hatate? (though I forget if it was stated if Hatate was younger/newer or not. My memory vaguely recalls something implying she was but...)

[Clarste]

On the topic of youkai sages, I'd say the Three Great Evil Youkai would be good candidates, two of whom would correspond to Suika and possibly Tenma.

The last one is Ran, isn't it?

Isn't Aya... old?  Or do you mean Aya compared to Hatate? (though I forget if it was stated if Hatate was younger/newer or not. My memory vaguely recalls something implying she was but...)

Aya is over a thousand years old, but due to age inflation that's no longer particularly impressive. Every last one of Byakuren's and Miko's respective entourages is over a thousand years old, for example.

[Prime32]

The last one is Ran, isn't it?

If Ran is Tamame-no-Mae then that would be gross cheating on Yukari's part, effectively giving her twice as many votes and letting her dominate the council.

So... pretty in-character then. Honestly I kinda prefer Ran just being a random nine-tails though; it's not like that isn't impressive in itself.
I do like the idea of Yukari being granted audience with some giant shadowy figures when she's trying to build up her powerbase - two of them try to project an aura of mystique, while the third has visible Suika-horns and keeps goofing off.

[Tyraxx]

Hi everybody,

I have been wondering for a real long time.
But in every doujin work and also between touhou fans, Murasa Minamitsu (LastName, FirstName) is always called by her last name "Murasa".

I checked the wiki and also the name in-game, and it both says that Minamitsu is her first name.
So why is everyone calling her Murasa, instead of Minamitsu?

PS: I'm sorry if this is the wrong forum, but since there is no forum for general discussion of the touhou universe, I put it here in the doujin-sector.
Since we and the doujins all call her Murasa.

[Drake]

Minamitsu is her first name, but as captain everyone calls her Captain Murasa, or ムラサ船長. In becoming a youkai, she was also called Murasa, based on her human name before she died. The music comments make note of this interesting bit too:
しかしみんなムラサって呼ぶけど、ムラサのは妖怪の名前なので 実は名前で呼ばれていないというオチが。
"Even though everyone calls her Murasa, 'murasa' is the name of a youkai, so surprise, they really aren't calling her by her name."
That is, "Murasa" (村紗) is her family name, but "murasa" (ムラサ) is the actual name of a ship phantom.

[Clarste]

In terms of the fandom, I think the strongest reason is simply that her theme song is titled "Captain Murasa". In-universe, everyone always calls Byakuren "Hijiri" but that seems to have made no difference whatsoever to the fandom.

[Drake]

And somewhere (WaHH I think) Reimu said that Gensokyo youkai don't really need beliefs to exist.

Going by what Byakuren said in SoPM, Gensokyo's youkai don't need belief to shape their existence anymore (for instance, regardless of what humans think the tengu should be [monks, ninjas, whatever], they won't change to fit that view), but at the end of the day, they still need to fullfill their purpose and make humans fear them, or else they'll become weak (and eventually die, I suppose).

In the outside world, a youkai's existence is determined purely by humans believing in them. From a completely meta perspective, the youkai don't really exist, they're just the supernatural things that humans attribute weird happenings to, or make up stories about. In Gensokyo, they have crossed the boundary from fiction into reality, where they actually exist in a tangible form. So it would be apt to say they don't need belief from humans to shape or define their existence. However, the reason for that youkai being created in the first place is because the humans gave it some purpose, some void to fill. That youkai, to remain a youkai, needs to fill that purpose by keeping up its influence on its surroundings. Otherwise, they might as well not even exist, because their entire existence is literally that purpose. It's been shown that youkai don't necessarily need to adhere to their original purpose, because again, unlike the outside world they actually have a body and a sense of self, so they can go do whatever they feel gives them purpose in life. This whole principle is the basis of why youkai need to attack humans, why these youkai have a theoretically infinite lifespan, why they can survive massive physical damage but are harmed by "spiritual" damage, why they don't die and enter the cycle of reincarnation as other beings do, and so on.

[Clarste]

why they don't die and enter the cycle of reincarnation as other beings do, and so on.

I'm pretty sure they're still part of the cycle of reincarnation. Otherwise, why in the world would Eiki bother lecturing them at all? In most Biddhist beliefs, youkai are considered merely a lower rung on wheel.

[Drake]

She might just lecture them about faltering in their purpose as a youkai, or otherwise that they aren't doing their job, whatever it may be.

[Clarste]

But her goal is to save souls by letting them take action top prevent themselves from ending up in Hell. What does it matter to her if a few youkai lose their purpose or disappear? There's nothing wrong with that, from a moral perspective.

Edit: Oh yeah, SoPM also contains a line about how most youkai don't mind the thought of becoming vengeful spirits in Hell.

[Sagus]

Also, Eiki says this to Cirno (emphasis mine):

"At this rate, you will not be able to return to your original power of nature and you may receive damage. In other words, that means death. If you die, then we will most definitely judge you. At that time, whether you will go to heaven or hell... Well, we don't know that yet."

I know that fairies aren't exatcly the same thing as youkai, but their existence is probably similar (as in, need human beleif to manifest). If a fairy that suffers a permanent death is judged by a Yama, as Eiki implies, then I don't see why a youkai wouldn't.

In the outside world, a youkai's existence is determined purely by humans believing in them. From a completely meta perspective, the youkai don't really exist, they're just the supernatural things that humans attribute weird happenings to, or make up stories about. In Gensokyo, they have crossed the boundary from fiction into reality, where they actually exist in a tangible form.

...would that mean then that Mamizou, the hobgoblins and the chupacabra only gained a definitive body upon entering Gensokyo?

What happens to youkai that leave Gensokyo, anyway? Yukari does it all the time and doesn't seem to be affected. Nue had to leave to go call Mamizou, and didn't seem worse to wear.

[Clarste]

According to Mamizou, there's a whole population of tanuki living in Sado by blending in with the humans (and their own part-human descendants). She didn't seem to be just a figment or anything.

The simplest answer is that the Outside World hasn't completely run out of belief yet. There's nothing so hard and fast about Gensokyo's barrier that's absolutely necessary to keep them all alive inside it. Outside, they'd be weakened and gradually disappear, but they can still live. They're endangered, not extinct.