Official Rate the Game Difficulties Thread! [Done for now.]

[Mino ☆]

I'm rating this on LNN/LNNN difficulty because why not (I honestly don't think I could make an accurate scoring comparison since I lack experience in all game scoring systems)

1. LoLK - This game is really tough for something like an LNN. Stage 1 already starts off rough with Seiran's first spell. Stage 2 has some tough things like Ringo's second non and final spell. Stage 3 really ramps up the difficulty. Doremy is annoying with all of her nons really (And her laser spell!). This is the type of game where you would very rarely see stage 4 (When Gobou streamed it, he was almost always losing to stage 2 and resetting). Stage 4 lowers the difficulty and offers the player a breather (but don't underestimate Sagume's nons as they are kinda weird sometimes). Stage 5 brings the difficulty back up with Clownpiece. Her nons are dumb and weird. Her spells are thankfully mostly memo (although the second and third ones I find tough). Junko really makes this difficulty as she's just overall a beast. Her nonspells aren't trivial (except MAAAAYBE the first one but I've seen Gobou 1MNB the game with a death only to that non). Her second spell is just absurdly stupid (to the point where people do risky strats that involve staying in the center just to kill it faster). Her final spell is its own level of difficulty and having to gamble everything on that spell after going through the entire game of hell. No. This game is tough to LNN.
2. EoSD - This game's stage 1-2 are very trivial. Meiling has a few difficult things though, so don't underestimate her. Stage 4 is where the hell starts. The books are absurdly difficult for something you'd just see on a stage portion. They're very prone to killing and the game can easily become a reset fest where you just keep playing until stage 4 and reset, never making it past. If you DO get past books, you then have to deal with Patchouli. Unless you're playing ReimuA, you're gonna have to deal with Megalith. Stage 5's stage portion is very easy, but Sakuya is pretty tough. Her nons are insane and Killing Doll is just deathworthy. Finally, stage 6 peaks the difficulty with hard things even in the midboss (Meek). Remilia is a very wall-tastic boss with crazy RNG and many, many chances to die. (Yay VI/SM/SG trio!)
3. UFO - Slightly easier than EoSD but has a harder early game IMO. Kogasa is actually threatening unlike Cirno. Stage 3 has weird spam sections. Ichirin is at least easier than Meiling although her first spell is annoying (dies really quick with ReimuA). Stage 4 is much easier than EoSD's. The stage portion only has one tricky section (ying yang spam before the endstage). Murasa is pretty tricky with stupid things like Sinkable Vortex, final non (Vortex bullets will most of the time overlap), and Ghost Ships Port (ZM's arch-nemesis). Stage 5 is where the real difficulty begins. With stupid things like GT, Shou, and Byakuren, this game's end game is very similar to EoSD's. I would still say UFO is slightly easier because it's definitely easier to make it to stage 5 NMNB than it is in EoSD. And Remilia's probably slightly harder than Byakuren.
4. PoFV - Unfortunately this game has to be placed on the list somewhere even though something like LNN would never be feasible (Does it even include no hit or just no round losing?). Technically, if you aren't some broken shot, this would be the hardest probably, since Eiki's timer is effectively endless. I honestly don't know where to put this so I'll placeholder it here.
5. IN - Assuming FinalB (although tbh I still find Eirin harder for some reason). Nothing early game is that threatening (as long as you know how to kill Mystia's first spell to manipulate her positioning at the start of the second non). Stage 4 has some annoying things, and stage 5 has Tei and Remote Rabbit. Stage 6 has most of the difficulty.
6. SA - Probably not that different than IN in terms of difficulty. Again, stages 1-3 are trivial. Satori is annoying though. Cat Walk is mega hard and you still can't underestimate things like Needle of Yore/Orin last spell. At least stage 6 is mostly light but Utsuho's first two spells are a pain.
7. DDC - Very feasible with SakuyaA/ReimuA yet it still has its hard moments. If you don't know how to properly do Kagerou (how to misdirect midboss, handle her first and third spells), you're not gonna make it. Benben also cannot be underestimated as her last two attacks are deadly (Yatsuhashi is irrelevant since no one will ever get LNN with a B-shot, although Miduki came close). Seija is the most difficult boss IMO as she's got some really annoying gimmicks. At least stage 6 is rather light to top things off.
8. MoF - Urghhhhh. It's not supposed to be THAT hard yet I'm still struggling with it. Stages 1-3 are mildly difficult with some hard moments. Stage 4 has most of the difficulty. Stage 5 is a natural breather. Stage 6 is moderately difficult for a stage 6. VoWG is mega hard IMO and you gotta be a superplayer to cap it consistently (dont' judge I lost 7 runs to this damn thing!)  I still put DDC above this game even though I got DDC. Thing is. I think DDC has a lot more BS'y RNG patterns and has more potentials to die in late game than MoF. While MoF takes a break in stage 5 before the final rush in stage 6, DDC never stops being hard from Kagerou onwards (in terms of bosses). Thus DDC is kind of an adrenaline rush all the way through while MoF is kind of singled out into two stages.
9. PCB - One of the more relaxing LNNNs. It took me quite a long time to get this but I wasn't as experienced back then so something like this was still pretty crazy to me. Mostly everything can be done consistently until Prismrivers. The Prismriver opening nons can be scary if you're Reimu or Sakuya. (Marisa gets the easy ones). Prismriver final is annoying. Youmu has some pretty hard things too (first and final spell). Stage 6 spam makes this game's LNNN a lot more troublesome than it should be. Yuyuko is at least the easiest final boss for survival (although don't underestimate her penultimate. I lost two runs to that!)
10. TD - The easiest LNNN in my opinion. It's not trivial, but it's probably the easiest game to do if you wanted an LNNN under your belt. It's difficulty is generally light. The early game is steady although there are a few rough patches. Kyouko's nons, fortunately, can be memorized. Her last spell is annoying though. Yoshika's second spell is also slightly troublesome. If you want full spell, that's also a thing, because then you have to deal with her final spell. Stage 4 onward is where the difficulty ramps up. Except this stage 4 isn't really too bad. Seiga's midboss non is slightly troublesome, but the spam section after the midboss isn't too threatening (nothing like PCB stage 6 spam or the UFO spams). Seiga is very doable if you know how to cheese her 2nd nonspell. The only threatening thing is her opener (sometimes) and Tongling Yoshika (which can be routed). The stage 5 end section is kind of annoying as it can be wall-y at times. Futo's first spell is very difficult but overall she's not THAT hard of a stage 5 boss. Miko has probably the majority of the difficulty in this game, if only because her fight is so long (and her nons are... weird). Thankfully, her attacks usually die quickly (bar her penultimate).

[Choco Beam]

1. UFO
2. EoSD
3. PCB
4. IN
5. SA
6. MoF
7. PoFV
8. LoLK
9. DDC
10. TD

[Mero]

Going from my No Bomb experience
1. LoLK
2. UFO
3. EoSD
4. DDC
5. SA
6. PoFV
7. IN
8. PCB
9. TD
10. MoF

So... LoLK, this game is hard and stupid. You get plenty of lives, but it has many patterns where the skill the matters the most is luck (see: Doremy's opener), It also has difficulty all over the place (Seiran's 1st spell is really hard for stage 1, and one of the easiest boss patterns in the game is on Junko's fight), which can be disorienting. That works in PD mode, where you literally can only lose by giving up, but in Legacy it's just... no. Also, Reimu is the only character in the game (I mean, Sanae's not bad, but her best attribute are her bombs and she doesn't have much on Reimu without them).

Everybody knows why UFO is difficult. Even if you know the UFO system, the very random and dense patterns may just make it impossible to get resources sometimes, and Shou and Byakuren are very hard.

EoSD... I think I've just had good luck with this one, I've never found it to be of the level people describe it. However, I've seen what this game can do and give trouble to even the best players, so I know this game knows how to kick your ass if it feels like it.

DDC has difficult patterns, but stages are fairly easy to learn, so you can rack up lives for the difficult bosses that are Kagerou, Benben/Yatsu and Seija. I don't find Sukuna that hard, but then again, ReimuA doesn't have to deal with half of her stuff.

SA is moderately difficult, it's mostly memorization, the patterns are pretty dense so you still have to be careful. The good thing about this game's power system is that doing NB also means you're at full power for the whole game

PoFV picks up really fast on Lunatic, and some characters just cannot beat opponents reliably. Then there is Aya, whose EX bullets can actually outspeed the AI reaction, Medicine who slows it down to hell, and opponents don't seem to register Eiki's giant laser as a threat and can literally run right into it. Characters like Reimu, Marisa and Reisen make for a decently challenging run on average.

IN is not that hard, and knowing how to handle familiars can help you dodge less from certain sections. Playing with Magic or Scarlet team can be troublesome, as Reimu is a much harder boss than Marisa. For Finals, I dunno, a lot of people say Kaguya is one of the hardest final bosses, but I very much prefer to fight her than Eirin...

PCB is also not that hard, and shots like MarisaA and ReimuB hardly lose anything from not having bombs. Borders are a really nice safety net if you don't mind them breaking, which is very likely on stuff like Youmu's 1st spell and the Spam. Yuyuko is an easy boss and every patterns starts you with a border, so not difficult

If you don't forfeit your trance, TD is hands down the easiest, it has mostly easy patterns and you can skip the hard ones with trance. If you go the extra mile for NT though, it jumps up a bit, because your resources are very limited and you have to deal with stuff you won't like, like Futo's first or Miko's penultimate.

MoF is quite easy to LNB. Like SA, going for NB means you'll have full power the whole game. Your first difficult pattern will likely be Nitori's HydroCamo, but since stages 1 and 2 are so simple you can reset and get back really fast. Momiji/Walls can be bad and PWG is no joke, but stage 5 is not very difficult and outside of VoWG, Kanako is one of the easiest (if not the easiest) final bosses in Touhou

[ZoomyTsugumi]

1. EoSD - RNG hell also the controls feel so bad after playing solely second gen windows 2hu for a long time.
2. PCB - I can't play this game well at all due to aforementioned control issues here. Also this game has micrododging from really early on which is something I suck at majorly.
3. LoLK - I suck at this one cos I always feel compelled to not bomb so much which is really stupid considering the mechanics basically encourage bombing.
4. UFO - Game becomes easy easy when you use a decent char and can resource your way to the end. Just requires beating stage 3 with a sufficient amount of lives and the rest is basically guaranteed. However it's still high up cos of the massive amount of difficulty it had before I got good enough to resource abuse my way through.
5. TD - I am accident prone and low resources are the death of me. This game was probably my first Lunatic 1cc but I've never 1cced it since then (and that was at least 4 years ago).
6. PoFV - RNG but also more abusable than EoSD. Shiki is the worst part by far and am prone to using a continue, but I rate this difficulty wise different to the other games due to the way the game works alone.
7. DDC - Getting good PoC grabs is basically what makes a 1cc for me, I'm still not that consistent but it's not tooo bad with Reimu A/SakuyA.
8. SA - I'm pretty good at consistently beating this with Reimu shottypes, Marisa is a different beast, but still, the game isn't tooooo bad and it's my favourite so I've played it a ton.
9. IN - Just practice good cancel timing on stages and you literally have both stages figured out and also near guaranteed time requirements obtained for every single run. Bosses can be bomb spammed if you really need to but spell practice makes it so easy. I can beat this with anyone (even solo alice) so it's definitely one of the easier ones for me.
10. MoF - bombs, nuff said. Also I'm soooo close to a perfect Kanako fight it's crazy.

[Nolegs the Cat]

*pops in out of nowhere*

Coming in with my shitty opinions

Uh, I'll do this for patterns only. I feel this would get the best average across playstyles - scoring, bombs allowed, no bombs, et cetera.

Honorable mention/Unofficial number 1. PoDD - Just all around insane. Unforgiving, extremely fast, hard right from the start. Good luck if you're using Chiyuri and not named "ZIL".

Effective number 1 because no PC 98 games pls don't shoot me: LoLK - Do I really need to say anything? the difficulty is all over the place. Sagume is a breather, but shouldn't be underestimated, Ringo and Doremy are hell for stage two and three, and then you have Clownpiss and Junko to finish you off.
2. UFO - A lot of very random stage portions, UFO system can be annoying at times, and Shou and Byakuren are very hard.
3. DDC - There's a lot of very hard patterns here. You get a lot of resources, but good luck if you're going for an LNN or an LNB. (Also, Seija.)
4. SA - Has some hard parts and easy parts. I really don't get why others rate this game so low, but oh well. I guess it's because I barely play SA?
5. PoFV - Abusable, but the patterns can be quite hard. Eiki is by far the hardest part... another game I barely play. Can't even remember how the mechanics work off the top of my head  :derp:
6. IN - Mystia has two hard attacks early on, and Keine has some harder attacks, but overall early game isn't that hard. Neither is Reisen, but she has some legit attacks, too. But Marisa/Reimu and Kaguya more than make up for that... this is definitely the easiest game to lunatic 1cc, but this game has consistently suprisingly difficult patterns.
7. MoF - Sort of a toughie between this and EoSD. Aya and Kanako are both very hard for me, especially VoWG, PWG and Yamato Torus, but the rest of the game isn't that bad in terms of difficulty. Stage 1 is certaintly harder than in EoSD, but it isn't that bad. On the otherhand, you get a LOT of resources.
8. EoSD - This game has some tough patterns. It's easy early on, but Sakuya is brutal, so is the books, and Patchy is fairly difficult with most shot-types, and just downright evil with MarisaA. Remi's fight is a juxtaposition of very easy/doable attacks (Nonspells, sort of spellcard 1/2, VI is in the middle - entirely dependent on luck), but when she gets serious, boy does her attacks pack a punch. But even Meister and Gensokyo aren't that bad in my opinion. Overall though, unless you're going for an LNN or LNB, it isn't that bad. (god help you if you are though)
This would be a fair bit higher in a difficulty list of just 1cc-ing: you get less resources than later games. Maybe the fact I've played this game's lunatic a ton is why I put it so low?
9. PCB - Easy patterns, helpful system, lots of resources. This game is just all around easy. Nothing else to say, honestly. Though, Alice is evil. This is probably harder than some of the other games to LNBNBB/LNMNBNBB.
10. TD - Very easy patterns, but few resources. But the trance system can help you get through - overall, very easy. Kyouko is hard though, and this game has IMO an annoying early game. Even so, the main barrier to 1ccing is how much of a chore the early game is to play :V

So, uh, yes. My list. Here you go and all that shin-digs.

[Sakurei]

A fair number of people cleared PoDD with Chiyuri, not only Zil. That of course includes people in this forum. It only becomes really problematic to clear if you try to score as well but why take that into consideration if you don't do it for other games. Anyway, I don't play hard like ever so I ignored last week but I used to play lunatic at least. Not to mention Ellen is arguably harder than Chiyuri to clear with.

1. PoFV: Same as before. Eiki is essentially impossible to beat. Try not to die because she won't. The bullets are faster now than they were on normal, too. Scary game.

2. PCB: It's very approachable and easy to get into but may be the hardest game to get good at in the series. The game has been pushed beyond what was thought possible some years ago and there is still room for improvement in even the best runs there are right now. An incredibly deep and complicated game.

3. EoSD: Simply brutal. More often than not, the RNG will really screw you over and the times it does not, you still have to face some ridiculously difficult stuff and have to do some really annoying things. EoSD may be the most cruel Touhou game.

4. UFO: I don't like this game very much and that's probably well known but it is undoubtedly very hard. Byakuren and Shou are both very difficult bosses late into the game and Ichirin has to have the patterns with the worst feel overall in the series. Very hard, very annoying and you have to do them. Not to mention just learning a route in the first place might or might not be difficult.

5. LoLK: I'm not sure this is the right place but it probably is. You still get 25 lives but you can't just spend them all on the final boss. Still, a lot of it seems very doable and unless you die in a really bad place, you should be fine even with an accident or two.

6. DDC: Might be slightly easier than LoLK, might be slightly more difficult. Probably the former which is why it's 6th and not 5th for me. Stage 3 is hard and so is stage 5. Stage 4 seems perfectly doable even though the boss is hard regardless of your shot.

7. SA: Very VERY annoying early game. SA's stage 1 has to be the worst one in the series. Fortunately the late game is significantly easier than in most other games. Of course nerves aren't pleasant on Okuu but at least she's no Remilia by any stretch of the imagination.

8. IN: I have a hard time placing IN because it's the game I play most. Is it easy, is it hard? I don't know. The games I listed until now all give me the impression that they're either just flat out harder or at least way more annoying to play. IN also strongly depends on your level, I think. High level play might be in the top 5, but low level might as well be below TD.

9. MoF: I've seen really good players struggle with it. But of course that might just be because their goals are difficult to reach. But aside from stage 4 (which looks really ball busting), it never struck me as super difficult. Naturally, this is because subtleties are lost on me but the same can be said for every game :^)

10: TD: I can't not think of this as the easiest game for some reason even though I know it is still quite difficult. I'm a bad person towards everyone who plays this. Sorry.

[TableCloth]

Oh God I hate this difficulty.

1. UFO - TOO. FUCKING. DIFFICULT. Them stage patterns can snap you easily when you're too greedy, and those boss will simply annihilate you when you are running low of resources.

2. LoLK - With my amount of skill, even passing Seiran's midboss spell using Reisen (without bomb, of course) requires nortorious microtapping and one hella good luck. Not to mention those early stages are brutal aside for stage 2. After that, it's just practice and a lot of 'praying that dem bosses don't get too low'.

3. SA - INTENZ PATTUHRN. Really, with those punishing resource system, this game would've been the hardest if not for the difficulty drop in Stage 6. Yuugi and the entire Stage 4 are hellish already, and Stage 5 is just... no. Goddammit Orin.

4. DDC - Why does almost every 2nd & 3rd gen Windows Touhou shmup always have difficult early stages!? Luckily, despite those annoyingly random patterns, there's a lot of resource you can easily gain (even more with Marisa B lol). Strangely enough, I noticed that some of the later stages patterns are no different than the Normal or Hard counterpart, especially Shinmyoumaru's Spellcards.

5. PoFV - Randomness. And difficult AI.

6. EoSD - Again, randomness. Doing this in max rank would make it way harder than DDC because some of those patterns in stage 5 are almost impossible to do at max rank, but then it become trivial even if you bomb only once. Sakuya doesn't have much of difficulty leap. The only bosses with over-the-top difficulty are Patchouli and Remilia.

7. PCB - This game is meh on Lunatic. While the bosses in the earlier stages get increasingly difficult, Yuyuko didn't even get harder, and Youmu is just... Youmu. It doesn't help that the Border system trivialize some patterns.

8. IN - Surprisingly enough, this one is actually quite tough from Keine onward. Also, stage 5 is quite fun. Other than that, just prepare for Eirin's hard ass-kicking Spellcards.

9. TD - Not much of a difficulty leap, other than some parts in the earlier stages. Again, resources are scarce, but it might get rather problematic on Miko (her penultimate spell goddammit)

10. MoF - Lotsa bombah. I don't play this in Lunatic much, but I do remember that Nitori get rather difficult with her 1st boss spell. Aya and Sanae also get a bit harder, but Kanako is the main entertainer here.

By the way, dem Stage 5 are all fun aside for PoFV.

[Monarda]

Even though i have yet to truly touch Hard and Lunatic, this is really nice to read, i'm eager to see the Extras section.

Not that my opinion would matter much.

[Giratina93]

My experience is mostly limited to what I have seen of most Lunatic playthroughs of the Windows games from top players, but here's my opinion (Based on 1CC run):

1. UFO. Yeah, alot of people have already said why Lunatic UFO is BS. The UFO mechanic+lots and lots of hellish bullet patterns= HELL. Trying to get all the lives and bombs you need in the first 3 stages is hard enough (Thanks Kogasa and Ichirin) but once you get to Murasa, all your lives and bombs just melt away until either Shou or Byakuren obliterates you. This is truly suffering.

2. SA. Thankfully, there's no gathering UFO's, but the difficulty is still obscene. Parsee can catch you off guard as bad, or even worse than Kogasa, and stages 4 and especially 5 WILL make you rage, plus every time you bomb, you get weaker, which only makes things worse. Utsuho isn't as hard as the likes of Junko and Byakuren, but what comes before is still absolute hell, and Utsuho isn't a pushover herself.

3. LoLK. You got alot of lives to work with, and stage 4 is something of a breather, but good god can things get asinine real fast, Clownpiece and Junko are the real big offenders, and you will need all of those lives and bombs to survive. Thankfully, some shot types make LoLK less painful to deal with, but you still need to be careful.

4.  EOSD. Unable to see hitbox without patch+RNG walls of DIE+ the absolute hell that is Sakuya: NOT FUN. to make up for it, stages 1-3 are a breeze for the most part.

5. DDC. While it is technically harder than SA based on bullet patterns and OH MY GOD WTFness of it all, the difficulty is offset by the dozens of lives you can get with smart streaming, and certain shot types trivialize most of the adventure. Still stage 3 and stage 5 can be real pains to deal with (Goddamn wolf)

6. PoFV. For most characters, this is the pinnacle of suffering on Lunatic. fighting Eiki especially is an uphill climb unrivaled by anything in the Windows series. However, certain characters trivialize the game to the point of Lunatic being easier than the above games, such as Aya, Medicine, and Eiki herself, thanks to their properties. Still very hard, but not impossible.

7. MoF. Most of MoF is very easy, with stages 1-3, and stage 5 being relative cake walks compared to what most Lunatics have to offer. Stage 4 with Aya? Yeah, enjoy that time out card and PRAY, as well as fast non spells up the wazzo, and Stage 6 is THE biggest reason why I rank this game higher than the below ones for difficulty: Virtue of Wind God, which I consider one of, if not THE hardest spell in the series to capture, let alone survive against. It's not uncommon to go from 3 or 4 lives to NO LIVES, JUST ONE BOMB because of how EVIL VoWG is.

8: PCB. It's not an easy game by any means, but I've never really seen anyone have that much difficulty with PCB's lunatic mode. stages 1-3 are pretty easy for the most part, stage 4 itself is way too long and filled with trial and error BS, but the Prismriver sisters aren't too bad depending on who you use, and Youmu is probably the hardest boss in the game, and even then, she's not too bad. Yuyuko's spells are mostly slow and meant to lull you into a false sense of security, but keeping alert negates most of those, bar her final time out spell.

9. IN. Team Reimu/Yukari cheese this game to oblivion. Seriously, the only real challenge is stage 4 and some minor annoyances in stage 6, but for the most part, it's easier than what is above. CATCHING all the spellcards, though... is a different matter, especially against Kaguya.

10. TD. even with the early game being somewhat challenging, it's not very bad. once you get past Seiga, it's relatively smooth sailing, with Futo and Miko being pushovers compared to how stage 5 and 6 Lunatic bosses usually are.

[Hainiryuun]

1. UFO - HAHAHAHA....haha...ha.... pls no. Hope you got good routes or get bent, pretty much.

2 . SA - Please save me from Orin. Lack of good bombs also kills me.

3. LoLK - First few stages aren't that bad, imo, but the ramp in difficulty to stage 5/6 is just insane.

4. TD - My strat of 1CCing any lunatic is usually get infinite resources in stages 1-3 and then bomb my way through 4-6. Lack of resources kills me and I'm terrible at collecting souls.

5. MoF - Bombing everything doesn't work so well on Lunatic...

6. DDC - Difficult bullet dodging wise, but you can just get so many resources that it doesn't matter. Plus Marisa B(roken) and Sakuya A are OP.

7. EOSD - It's just vanilla bullet dodging with decent amount of resources.

8. PoFV - Marisa makes this super easy. Cruise through 1-6. Lose to Aya once, Lose to Komachi once, hope the beat Shikieiki before she kills you like 4 times.

9. PCB - Run Marisa and border break ALL the things. Super easy.

10. IN - Everything, period, in IN is a joke with boarder team.

[Sen]

Can't wait for Extra!

1 - PoFV - if for no other reason than the game is literally unbeatable on Lunatic. You don't "win" PoFV; the AI allows you to win after x amount of time. The difficulty spikes once you reach Aya/Medicine (Aya is much more manageable, though), and Shikieiki EX attacks are made of despair and hopelessness. As much as I adore PoFV, it's the only game where Lunatic has actually pissed me off. After so much bullshit, it's just not fun.

2 - UFO - patterns are incredibly dense, but you still have to weave through them to find your UFOs. Few things are more frustrating than the Green UFO turning Blue because you were trying to get around a wave of bullets, and the fact that you can't get resources back during boss fights (and it's extremely difficult to regain an option after taking a hit during a boss) really ups the difficulty. Shou's and Byakuren's nonspells are an absolute nightmare, and I have forever given up hope of capturing Murasa's third card.

3 - LoLK - goodness gracious. All the lives in the world, but good luck holding onto them. The difficulty in LoLK is all over the place-- Doremy and Clownpiece's nonspells are fucking stupid, and Junko is in a league of her own, but Sagume is a joke compared to the rest of the game, and Stage 5's stage portion is pretty simple overall. The stages feel like a CAVE game.

4 - EoSD - your performance on EoSD Lunatic is heavily RNG-dependent. The game is pretty consistent up until Stage 4, but all bets are off once the books come out. From there, you have the books, Patchouli (as a MarisaA player, Sylphae Horn High Level is one of the most frustrating cards in the series), Stage 5 fairy spam, Sakuya's awkward knife bullets, and everything Remilia throws at you. The random nature of the bullets means you can get walled in at any time, and the low amount of resources means you're less likely to have bombs necessary to survive. 

5 - SA - some of the most insane patterns in the series here, and with the weakest bombs in any Touhou game, there's no getting around them. Thankfully, most of SA can be memorized, but you still have to deal with things like Cat Walk, popcorn fairies in Stage 5, Double Black Death Butterfly if you're playing as ReimuA (and really, why would you ever play as anyone else), and the claustrophobic nature of Utsuho's stars. I will say that Drake's SA boss rush patch on Lunatic is some of the most fun I've had in a Touhou game in a while, though.

6 - DDC - I think DDC has the largest jump in difficulty from Hard to Lunatic, starting with Kagerou and ramping up as the game goes on. The stages are random enough that you have to truly be able to dodge, rather than just memorize your way through, and getting up to the PoC for all the resources isn't nearly as easy as on Normal or Hard. Both Stage 4 bosses are incredibly difficult, Seija's flipping mechanic adds another level of insanity to an already difficult fight, and Shinmyoumaru's size manipulation combined with the wonky bullets really messes with your perception.

7 - TD - the extremely low amount of resources (for a Touhou game) in TD means you have to get really good at using your Trances, otherwise you'll fall as early as Kyouko's stupid fucking spellcards. The patterns aren't as bad overall as the other games, so resource management becomes the biggest challenge.

8 - IN - the patterns here are very dense, but can be memorized for the most part, and the game is generous enough with lives, deathbomb timers, and strong bombs that it's manageable. The spike in difficulty between Reisen and Kaguya always throws me off.

9 - PCB - the first game I 1cc'd on Lunatic, so I may be biased, but with the memorization-heavy nature of PCB, generous lives, and Supernatural Borders, it's one of the more manageable Lunatics.

10 - MoF - the patterns are difficult, but the sheer power of bombs hugely offsets this. You still have to deal with shit like the Stage 4 maze and garbage like Exteeeeeeending Arm or Aya's survival card, but it's definitely the most manageable. It's a shame MoF doesn't have grazing, the patterns would really lend themselves to supergrazing in any other game.

[Nameschonvergeben]

10. IN - Everything, period, in IN is a joke with boarder team.

post you are scores to be h

[iVAwalys]

The results for Lunatic Mode are finally out!

1. UFO - 1.80
2. LoLK - 2.87
3. EoSD - 4.47
4. SA - 4.53
5. PoFV - 5.27
6. DDC - 5.53
7. PCB - 7.27
8. TD - 7.53
9. IN - 7.60
10. MoF - 8.13

FINALLY A WEEK WITHOUT A SINGLE TIE!
And I also got result for the overall main game difficulty!

OVERALL HARDEST TOUHOU MAIN GAME: UFO - 2.13
OVERALL EASIEST TOUHOU MAIN GAME: IN - 8.36

Now, now. It's still now over yet. Now we're rating Extra stages!
...But I don't feel like rating those now, so I'll rank them later. :V As for everyone else, feel free to rank the Extras.

[ZoomyTsugumi]

1. LoLK - still not really consistent at this
2. DDC - still kinda inconsistent here too
3. EoSD - somewhat worse at this than most other extra stages
4. MoF - yes bombspam makes things easy but the second card makes me sooo nervous
5. TD - sort of middle ground here I guess
6. UFO - Kogasa is the only nervewracking thing about this
7. SA - more intimidating than it actually is, but once you get the gimmicks down its so easy
8. PCB  - easy easy easy
9. IN - Favourite EX fight also happens to be the easiest

If we're counting PoFV in this, put it at the top. otherwise here's the list.

[Monarda]

Just a question, about games with a Phantasm Stage like PCB, how do we proceed ? Do we rate only Extra, only Phantasm or both and take in account the jump in difficulty they have between them ?

[TresserT]

I'll include Phantasm but leave out Phantasmagoria.

The top 3 are all really close.

1. DDC- Raiko has a lot of random, reaction-dodging based patterns, which is abnormal for an extra stage. Extras are usually very memo-heavy. While the only thing that's ridiculously hard is "Joruri World", Raiko as a whole is consistently difficult. The stage is a breeze, though.

2. LoLK- The stage, the midboss, and most of the boss fight are all really easy. Hecatia and Junko have a few nons that are way beyond anything Raiko does, plus "Lunatic Impact". Raiko wins, though, because the rest of Hecatia's spells are laughably easy.

3. EoSD- The patterns aren't super dense, but there is quite a lot of random stuff going on so you have the chance of getting walled. The patterns are definitely easier than DDC or LoLK (though waaaay harder than TD), but the fact that you only get 4 lives makes this extra about as difficult as the top 2.

4. TD- There isn't much to say here. The stage isn't bad. Mamizou doesn't have any extremely difficult attacks, but most take some figuring out and at least a decent amount of skill. Difficulty jumps up if you play as Youmu, but even then isn't as hard as EoSD.

5. UFO- The stage portion is by far the hardest extra stage in the series (bar maybe GFW). Kogasa isn't so much hard as much as annoying. Clip death hell. However, Nue is a breeze so long as you keep your power up. Killing the UFOs can be a pain if your power drops below 4, though. Especially on Green UFO invasion.

6. PCB Phantasm- Nothing is extremely hard. You have to memorize DBF which is annoying, but it's just memorization. Pretty much everything else is about routing or foguring out the trick with some random spam mixed in, but it's sparse enough to not be a problem.

7. SA- The only extra I've NMNBd. Almost everything is either easy or can be routed. This is an extra where you just have to play it over and over until you know what to do.

8. IN- Has quite a few difficult spells, such as the last nonspell, Woo, and Fujiyama Volcano, but like Hecatia most of the fight is really easy. IN's hour long death bomb timer also trivializes clearing the stage, so it's only hard if you want to capture those patterns.

9. MoF- The stage portion is among the harder ones, but Suwako is so easy this still gets 9th place. Every pattern is either memorization, figuring out the trick, or clip death hell, except for Froggy Braves the Elements and Suwa War. MoF's infinite bombs doesn't actually help much.

10. PCB Extra- This takes Yukari, but makes every pattern either even sparser, or changes it from reaction dodging to memorization. This is the easy mode equivalent to Phantasm in every way. The one exception is Charming Siege, which has a very restricted space and has a high chance of walling you (it's also one of my favorite spells in the series).

[Mero]

post you are scores to be h

Honest question, how difficult is to score with Border, compared to the other teams?
I'd imagine not much with how simple and relatively strong they are

[iVAwalys]

Just a question, about games with a Phantasm Stage like PCB, how do we proceed ? Do we rate only Extra, only Phantasm or both and take in account the jump in difficulty they have between them ?

Oh yes, I did forget about that, didn't I?
Rank PCB based on the PHANTASM stage, not the normal Extra stage. (PCB's Extra is just an easy version of Phantasm with some slight changes.)
Second, I really approve of not putting PoFV anywhere on the list.

[ふねん1]

All the Extra Stages are actually fairly close imo, at least compared to Lunatic, so ordering these might come down more to how comfortable you are with them. Here's my take at any rate.

1. LoLK - I would probably rate this lower if I spent more time to get used to her various "Earth" attacks (the blue spells and nonspells) and "Moon" spells, but most of her and Junko's other stuff otherwise isn't too bad. Junko's nonspells might throw off anyone who's not a Lunatic player though. The stage portion also isn't too crazy, though Doremy's first two spells are a bit of a step up.
2. EoSD - More so because some things behave weirdly in this game's old engine, and because you don't have many resources. Thankfully a bunch (though not all) of Flandre's spells become easier with practice.
3. DDC - This probably would be #1 if you couldn't get so many resources, which is really the exception to the norm for Extra Stages. Some of Raiko's attacks still remain tricky even with practice (and with Spell Practice to help out too), though the stage portion isn't much harder than most others, Joururi World aside.
4. SA - This is where the ranking starts getting really murky. While SA Extra is still subject to the usual memo like in others, the patterns in this one punish you more than usual for not knowing them, which is why I rank it in the upper half of the list.
5. UFO - Not as many opportunities to build up resources with UFOs as in the main game, but perhaps not worrying about UFOs could also make the stage portion more comfortable, so there's a balance there. Nue's attacks are almost consistently middle-of-the-road in difficulty, with a few easy nonspells and trickier spells near the end being the only exceptions.
6. PCB - I put Phantasm down here because just going through Extra is already a good introduction to how most stuff in the former works, so you won't need as much practice with this one. Getting lots of borders helps too.
7. IN - Like with the rest of the game, this Extra is particularly prone to memorization. Pretty much the entire stage portion and most of Mokou's spells fall into that category, but any attacks that don't, especially her last three nonspells, save this from being the easiest overall Extra.
8. TD - Any lack of life or bomb resources isn't as prominent here since Extra Stages usually have fewer of those. Only a handful of Mamizou's spells are tricky even with Spell Practice to help you out, but everything else can be mastered fairly quickly.
9. MoF -  Originally I would've considered putting TD or IN here, but after thinking about it, MoF doesn't even stand up to those two. Even without Spell Practice, the tricks to all the Spell Cards can be figured out pretty easily (save for Froggy Braves the Elements and Suwa War), and the stage portion isn't any harder than IN or TD's.

[Sakurei]

PCB extra and Phantasm only look quite similar. In reality, they play very differently but whatever.

1. PCB: Phantasm is definitely the hardest extra stage. Precise timing, positioning and movement in the stage portion (including the mid boss) and a long boss fight with a lot of room for error, especially since some spells are very random (3rd) or just incredibly difficut (8th). Fortunately the non spells aren't too bad, generally. The finish is a pretty tough gauntlet, especially if the penultimate doesn't cooperate with the safe spot.
2. LoLK: This isn't really right because Both GFW (2nd) and PCB extra (3rd) are harder than this by a long shot. The reason I place this here is because Kisara is pretty good and he struggles with it a fair bit. The non spells seem pretty hard.
3. IN: Probably, at least. Difficult timings in the stage portion and some of the spells are quite difficult to do well. In addition there is a somewhat difficult finish with the final non, Hourai Doll and Imperishable Shooting.
4. EoSD: It's EoSD so the last spell has to be a dick. Laevantein looks impossible tbh and kagome kagome looks like hell too. Fortunately Flandre has a good number of easy spells and her non spells are all pretty easy too.
5. TD: Some things looks really hard, especially with Youmu. Really looks like RNG could just kill you really easy on some spells. I guess just get lucky.
6. UFO: Crazy stage portion. Fairly difficult and Kogasa is just luck but Nue is uneventful and fairly boring so it's not higher up.
7. DDC: figuring out a good balance between resource spending and capturing stuff may be difficult and I can see some 2.0s being annoying but it's really not that bad.
8. SA: Hella boring, man. I also don't think this extra had anything that I thought looked particularly difficult. Not that I want to try, I don't need help falling asleep just yet.
9. MoF: Most likely the easiest. Suwako's only difficult attack to not die on is Suwa Wars. Speedkills may be risky but they're never going to be riskier than graze heavy patterns unless it's on the level of a spell of Greatest Treasure but Suwako doesn't have anything like that.

[Monarda]

Unofficial Rating due to only being about EoSD and PCB Extras, please do not use this when ranking the places:

Let's start with EoSD:
As said before it has a annoying amount of RNG, and you will have to use well your few lives and use safe bombing strats, a newcomer will also likely hit some minor walls such as Royal Flare (unless they use Marisa A, then lol) and major walls such as the pain Maze of Love can be for first-timers (The way i dealt with it was doing the first counterclock cycle and then enduring the clockwise cycle in the bottom with the help of a bomb, since i don't play for score.), patterns are pretty simple but still make you stay on your toes so you don't pay a hefty price, overall it's a simple yet tough challenge.

PCB goes here:
PCB`s Phantasm patterns are harder and more annoying to learn, however there is a great difference in resource availability, compensating for said patterns, having 3-ish Survival Spellcards in the end phase, these cards will become a major pain for newcomers, not considering the stage and how you gotta do your routes, i still have trouble with it because i`m a stubborn averager that refuses to watch Replays to learn tricks and wants to learn them the hard way, i can`t really say much on this since i have yet to get it done, although i did get Extra done, but there are some things i noticed that for me ended up being easier in Phantasm than in Ran Extra, the most iconic being the Second Spellcard of the boss, eh, i really can`t say much, this is just to put up how a averager sees stuff, so....

[Choco Beam]

Honest question, how difficult is to score with Border, compared to the other teams?
I'd imagine not much with how simple and relatively strong they are

Easier to learn and do scoring stuff but scores lower. You might still need to spend a few hundred hours to get use to the timings and grazes with them though.

[Uruwi]

M'kay, extra, that's going to have a completely different order than Normal.

1. SA (1st spell)
2. PoFV (at the highest, stage 3 or 4)
3 - 4. UFO and MoF (5th spell without exploiting MarisaBugged, though I did clear it with MarisaBugged)
5. PCB (6th spell) - the most troubling part is Princess Tenko.
6 - 7. EoSD and LoLK (7th spell)
8. TD (last spell) - this is also one of the most frustrating stages.
9. DDC (cleared)
10. IN (cleared)

[FleetingGaze]

I can finally participate! I haven't seriously played PoFV, so that would have screwed up my votes. GFW had a similar extra to the main series, so I'd put it in between EoSD and DDC. (If we count it.)

I had to do this list in reverse, because LoLK offsets everything. I wish I could put IN, MoF and PCB on the same level.

1. LoLK
This is uncontested. This is many times harder than the other extras. Terrifying nonspells and Junko are enough to ruin my day. It doesn't help that only Reimu and Reisen are truly viable, since Sanae can't bombspam for lives due to the 5 fragment requirement. The stage is simple and Doremy...is surprisingly tame.

2. TD
Low resources = costly mistakes. Though the nonspells are throwaway, Mamizou's spells are a wee bit more gimmicky than most extra bosses.

3. EoSD
The limitations of the game is what makes this difficult.

4. DDC
Stage is simple and you get plenty of resources. Raiko's not terribly easy, but she's not notably hard, either.

5. SA
I remember trying to do this one for the longest time as I first started out.

6. UFO
The only reason this is up this high is because of Kogasa, and *maybe* the section afterward. Nue's a joke. The only reason I didn't perfect her on a recent run was because I somehow got hit during the 3rd nonspell.

7. MoF
Spellcards don't last as long, but you can do all the non-spells nearly blindfolded.

8. IN
Only thing that's really a problem here is Mokou's last nonspell. Everything else is manageable.

9. PCB (Extra+Phantasm)
Borders and potential loadout of 4 bombs trivialize the stage.

[Hainiryuun]

1 - LoLK. So much rage.

2 - SA. I'm just terrible at this game, in general.

3 - UFO. I probably could get a lot better at this with practice, but too often I just go "TOO MANY BULLETS NO UFOS" and spam bombs.

4 - TD. Low amount of resources and I fail at trance.

5 - DDC. Get infinite resources in stage. Bomb through Raiko, if necessary.

6 - MoF. Nothing too fancy from Suwako and the stage up to her is trivial.

7 - PCB. Again, nothing overwhelmingly fancy, and you can border break just about every spellcard.

8 - EoSD. Patchouli is harder than Flan. Flan is a joke other than her last spellcard.

9 - IN. I've cleared this on Ultra. I've cleared this at 120 FPS. Mokou's most powerful attack is her last nonspell and is laughable, otherwise.

[Failure McFailFace]

This is one of those I'm not going to copy in my difficulty tier with this one.

I have yet to clear an extra stage, barring DDC MarisaB on Ultra because resource farming lol
1. LoLK: OMGWTFBBQ. I've practically memorized the entire stage, and I have yet to get through even TWO of Hecetatia's cards.
2. UFO: I hate random bullets.
3. SA: Streaming, but life pieces are not enough
4. TD: random bullets
5. MoF: It's alright, especially w/ MarisaBug
6. IN: Border Team helps
7. EoSD: Easier, but I've yet to make even halfway.
8. PCB: Somehow made it halfway through Ran.
9. DDC: MarisaB 2 op

[Mero]

Easier to learn and do scoring stuff but scores lower. You might still need to spend a few hundred hours to get use to the timings and grazes with them though.

Thanks for answering, I thought it would be like that, since other teams also have other advantages (or at least I think they are), like Scarlet's larger graze area or Ghost having just having 3/4 of youkai gauge

Anyway, my Extras:
1. SA
2. TD
3. EoSD
4. PCB
5. UFO
6. IN
7. MoF
8. DDC
9. LoLK

SA Extra is all about the first impression, everything is hard and intimidating the first time, but then it's just standard. I put this at first because it's the Extra that took me the longest to get a clear of (after GFW). Also a little thing I believe most people overlook is that if you get hit on Sanae or Koishi, you essentially died twice, since you're not getting every life piece anymore, so you have very few mistakes to make

TD is actually not that hard if you route correctly, but it does have difficult patterns, mainly because of wonky animal hitboxes, and mistakes on TD are hard to deal with

EoSD is just a rough game, resources are fairly limited, but it's not terribly difficult, just don't do dumb stuff (like challenging Maze of Love at the bottom) and you'll be fine

PCB is just there, I feel like Ex and Phantasm are longer than average, so it's more an exercise of patience, but resources are plenty and like on Yuyuko, patterns cancel into cherry items so you have multiple borders (and you can even nearly trivialize DBDB by abusing the i-frames on the end of a border)

UFO has a very annoying Ex stage portion, but Nue is really not hard, you could enter her fight 0/0 and still clear quite handily, especially with shots like SanaeB or MarisaA

Mokou has mostly easy patterns, and you have extended deathbomb timers, so...

ReimuA tears MoF Extra apart, the stage is trivial to her and Suwako is very easy. Other shots can do the same, they just require some effort on your part

If you're not getting 2 lives out of all of Raiko's nons with MarisaB you're doing it wrong.

Reisen can actually get lives in LoLK Extra's stage portion and you get a minimum of 10 hits per life, you can't not clear with her

Also, GFW is both best and most difficult Extra, period.

[Hainiryuun]

EoSD is just a rough game, resources are fairly limited, but it's not terribly difficult, just don't do dumb stuff (like challenging Maze of Love at the bottom) and you'll be fine

Not gonna lie, clearing Maze of Love from the bottom is the only way I capture it. I think I've captured it the way you are supposed to, once, and realized that tapping left a couple times from the bottom is just easier.

[Sen]

Oh boy, Extra stages have always been my favorite.

EoSD - Probably my favorite stage in the entire series; beating it no-focus with MarisaA was one of my favorite accomplishments in these games. The stage is consistently challenging (especially the books at the end) and Patchy is a clusterfuck no matter what you do. Flandre herself is a great mix between puzzle danmaku (Maze of Love, Counter-Clock) and flat out dodging (Q.E.D., Catadioptric), with very few tricks to get you through it (Starbow Break safespot nonwithstanding). Not to mention only getting four lives for the whole stage.

PCB - Phantasm really feels like what PCB's Extra was supposed to be, and Yukari delivers. Her cards are pure chaos, and the surprise survival card at the end always catches me off-guard. Really enjoyable battle overall.

LoLK - The stage portion is surprisingly easy for LoLK, and Doremy is much easier than her Stage 3 iteration. Hecatia is the only Extra boss where I can say her nonspells are significantly harder than her spellcards. Same goes for Junko. Reimu is the only character I feel comfortable playing in Extra because the nonspells are so claustrophobic.

SA - I feel weird rating SA Extra because I either NMNB it, or Koishi smashes my face into the pavement. There never seems to be an in-between. The stage portion can be overwhelming, and Sanae's third card always makes me nervous, but they're doable. Koishi herself is definitely one of the harder Extra bosses, with cards like Genetics and Embers of Love that can easily overwhelm you without plenty of practice. I've still never captured Koishi's survival card-- just don't know how to deal with the second phase.

TD - It says something that I was able to go into TD Extra completely blind and get to Mamizou's last spellcard on my first try. The stage is a joke, but Nue provides a good challenge every time (I actually really like the Nue battle, it really has the UFO feel to it). Mamizou is...conflicting. Her nonspells are a joke and her spellcards are more puzzles than anything. They range from laughable (second card) to hilariously overwhelming (second-last card). The low resources definitely hurt, like they do in all of TD, but I'm very comfortable with this Extra.

UFO - Weirdly enough considering how batshit most of UFO is, the Extra stage isn't that bad. The stage portion is actually significantly harder than Nue; aside from Undefined Darkness and Rainbow UFOs, Nue isn't much of a threat. MarisaA and SanaeB also completely eliminate any difficulty in the UFO cards aside from Rainbow UFOs.

IN - Mokou has some difficult cards for sure, and that last nonspell is horrendous, but overall her cards (like most of IN) can be memorized and beaten very easily, just takes a lot of practice. The stage isn't too difficult aside from EX-Keine, whose third spell always gets me.

DDC -

MoF - The stage portion of MoF Extra consists mostly of flying around in circles and streaming, so nothing here is really too dangerous. Kanako is a non-threat. Aside from Froggy Braves the Elements and her survival cards, Suwako is by far the easiest Extra boss. The infinite bombs actually don't really help that much, given the nature of Extra bosses, but Suwako is easy enough on her own that they don't really come into play.

[iVAwalys]

And the week is over and I still haven't rated the extras yet. :V RESULTS COMING SOON.
best thread op 2017

1. SA - Koishi's attacks are hell. Everything except her first spell, second spell and Embers of Love is pure hell. When I completed the Extra stage, I timed out Subterranean Rose, because the last phase is so goddamn hard.

2. UFO - Even the Extra stage is hell in this game. No, not because of the boss. Nue is actually one of the easiest Extra bosses. I'm talking about the stage, mainly the UFOs and midboss Kogasa with her Guerilla Typhoon.

3. LoLK - Hecatia's nonspells are INSANE. This is probably the first time in the series, where the hardest attacks the extra boss throws at you are nonspells. If you're playing someone other than Reisen, that is.

4. EoSD - Welcome to RNG clipdeath nightmare, featuring everyone's favorite overrated vampire loli.

5. TD - This one has the same case as UFO. The boss is super easy, the stage is a struggle. It made me restart the most. Also, Mamizou's last spell is stupidly easy.

6. IN - The stage is easy, excluding hakutaku Keine, I ALWAYS bomb her every single card. Mokou, while not being particularly hard, is also not very easy either.

7. PCB (Phantasm) - (Yes, I do know that PCB Extra varies in patterns from Phantasm a lot, but I've always considered it an easier version of Phantasm.) This one is incredibly easy, even on Phantasm, even without abusing supernatural borders. Once you make a good route, you're only going to die by clipdeaths. It's also a very fun stage.

8. MoF - Once again, make a good route. Once you do, most of the stage revolves around circling around the enemies again and again. Suwako's attacks spike in difficulty all throughout the fight, and she has two friggin' survival spells, but you get a lot of resources before battling her.

9. DDC - It's so easy, it's almost insulting. I beat the whole Extra in just 3 tries.

...And now, I'm going to calculate the results.