RPG Mafia Thread IV (Current Game: NSP Mafia)

[BT]

If you're running up a lurker, make sure there's some rival wagon going, or else there really will be no info gained from the flip.

Lurkers are a problem the instant they're in the game and it doesn't really matter how you treat them. People need better mafia discipline - if you think you're going to lurk but you really have to sign up anyway, force yourself to play because you're committed to it. I'd say "play once every few games to make sure you're motivated to play" but this place doesn't have the numbers for that.

[ActionDan]

I contend that reading lurkers is pretty easy

[O4rfish]

I contend that reading lurkers is pretty easy

##Vote: ActionDan

[Kilgamayan]

People need better mafia discipline - if you think you're going to lurk but you really have to sign up anyway, force yourself to play because you're committed to it.

We have a winner.

MotK Mafia's main problem isn't lurking or scummy townies (though those are problems), it's people's lack of respect for the game and their fellow players.

[NekoNekoRex]

To be fair, our playerbase is really, really good about not lurking and being active compared to other places I've played Mafia at, like TWO WEEK DEADLINES Mafiascum. I played a game at Skypal's native forum as well, and there's people who basically don't post the entire game, as well as deadlines where only half the people actually have a vote submitted.

[Bardiche]

That's like saying murderers are really good about not killing that many people, because there's a lot of serial murderers who keep killing shit!

Just because some other places manage to be even worse doesn't mean that our current meta is fine. We have two types of players: Those who actively contribute often and want to play, and those who feel play is best defined as twitterposting and "getting to it" when you've ten minutes to spare after two days. And I don't personally find it fun to play with people who belong to camp 2.

[Shadoweh]

That does remind me though, that MS posted replacement stats and something like 80% of their games have replacements, 25% of all slots average. I wonder how that compares to our statistics.. (They didn't include newbie games in this for obvious skewing reasons)

[Chaore]

That does remind me though, that MS posted replacement stats and something like 80% of their games have replacements, 25% of all slots average. I wonder how that compares to our statistics..

I'd wager about the same to less- depending on where we start.

It's gotten really bad recently, but it's kind of because of exactly what Kilga said becoming more common in the playerbase over time.

[Conqueror]

we actually dont really get many replacements given the short length of our games; lurkers can just stick it out as opposed to a several month long committment where you have people calling for the mod's head if someone hasn't posted in weeks. it'd probably be fairer to compare to the micro stats, and even then our rate is probably lower because most playerlists here have significant overlap.

edit: we dont have rage replaceouts either because the person either gets lynched or modkilled >_>

[SB]

That's like saying murderers are really good about not killing that many people, because there's a lot of serial murderers who keep killing shit!

Just because some other places manage to be even worse doesn't mean that our current meta is fine. We have two types of players: Those who actively contribute often and want to play, and those who feel play is best defined as twitterposting and "getting to it" when you've ten minutes to spare after two days. And I don't personally find it fun to play with people who belong to camp 2.

I don't think twitterposting is bad as long as you're still active, but shrug. I'd rather read twitterposts than massive wallposts, honestly.

But yeah, lurking sucks.

[Bardiche]

I don't think twitterposting is bad as long as you're still active, but shrug. I'd rather read twitterposts than massive wallposts, honestly.

Notice the "and" portion. Combining twitterposts with one post a day is why the meta needs to step it up.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

those who feel play is best defined as twitterposting and "getting to it" when you've ten minutes to spare after two days. And I don't personally find it fun to play with people who belong to camp 2.

well I mean I was misreading you as scum last game for your lack of effort so...

as is my biggest turnoff from playing here is people who do dumb things over and over and never change no matter how many times you lynch them. It just makes playerlists unfun to read. You can't policy lynch 3+ people and still have mislynches left over.

Conq's post about lurkers is pretty much correct though, I've been feeling that a lot on SF lately. If given the chance I would basically always lynch somebody like PX D1 just to get it over with. This probably extends to active people that my previous complaint applies to as well. Dan pretty much fits in both categories, it's like his play peaked in Graveyard and has only declined since then.

But mafia itself just isn't enjoyable when you have to do this every time you join and the targets don't actually learn from it.

Note: I'll take everything in this post back and /in immediately if K4U joins a game

[Dr Rawr]

think motk town could lose if scum had no night kills :V. i mean it could let town blow more lynchs

[Bardiche]

well I mean I was misreading you as scum last game for your lack of effort so...

I kinda gave up after seeing the quality of posts. Why put in effort when no effort gets you a Town pass? Dormio put more effort into his roleplay than into scumhunting, and people didn't even talk about whether or not he was scummy. Since that was the game we were going to play I figured I might as well post only barebones.

I think Sky_Paladin put it best in his rant: MOTK Town meta is aimed at punishing the players who put in effort.

[Kilgamayan]

think motk town could lose if scum had no night kills

http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,5016.0.html

[Serela]

Dormio put more effort into his roleplay than into scumhunting, and people didn't even talk about whether or not he was scummy.

to be fair it seemed like it would have been very difficult to lynch him even if we tried (I agree with you about the overall lack of content though in that game)

And even after his restriction was revealed, it still would have been pretty hard to lynch him for a few days. Scum having a role like that would have been ridiculously bastard. Sometimes rolegaming isn't misplaced.

Anyway re:no nightkills, popcorn mafia anyone?

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

I think Sky_Paladin put it best in his rant: MOTK Town meta is aimed at punishing the players who put in effort.

I think this is just an easy trap to fall into in general in mafia; people who post more give you more to lynch and potentially misread them on. Doesn't make it good, but yeah.

[Bardiche]

Being a difficult lynch doesn't mean you don't need to consider whether he was Town or not. Just because it's overpowered for Scum doesn't mean that Dormio is a) speaking the truth and/or b) not a third party.

Whenever I post in Mafia I feel like I'm incredibly genuine and thinking things through and trying as hard as I can to express my thoughts, but no one ever reads them or cares about it. Like, people call me a "strong" player, but all I'm really good at is not getting myself lynched. I've never been able to convince people quite as much or get them to read my posts and consider my arguments. Game is too hard. I think I'm going to take a hiatus again.

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

Yeah, I shouldn't have /in'd to this game considering how little time I had to read mafia.
I didn't think that my schedule would be that bad until I remembered that I had more assignments to work on and it didn't look like the signups would fill any time soon.
As for scumhunting, I was doing it in my head but I couldn't find a way to put it into words so I ended up giving up since whatever I can lynch whoever I want.
The only problem with this is that I didn't lynch whoever I wanted.
I didn't trust my own reads at all since I wasn't as invested into the game as I should have been so I ended up just going with the majority opinion.
Oh well, mafia is too hard so I should just study for the exam I have tomorrow or something.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

Whenever I post in Mafia I feel like I'm incredibly genuine and thinking things through and trying as hard as I can to express my thoughts, but no one ever reads them or cares about it. Like, people call me a "strong" player, but all I'm really good at is not getting myself lynched. I've never been able to convince people quite as much or get them to read my posts and consider my arguments. Game is too hard. I think I'm going to take a hiatus again.

I can't comment on this because I just realized we haven't been town together in over a year.

[Dr Rawr]

Whenever I post in Mafia I feel like I'm incredibly genuine and thinking things through and trying as hard as I can to express my thoughts, but no one ever reads them or cares about it. Like, people call me a "strong" player, but all I'm really good at is not getting myself lynched. I've never been able to convince people quite as much or get them to read my posts and consider my arguments. Game is too hard. I think I'm going to take a hiatus again.

isnt that pretty much saying theres room for improvement. maybe not improvement if you feel everyone is terrible, but just finding a way to get people to take you seriously? though i guess this is difficult since all we have are lame smileys and words

also i hated popcorm mafia

[Serela]

I actually was seriously considering Dormio third party when he suddenly wound up nightkilled instead.

But I probably wouldn't have ever acted on it. It was more being WAH over him denying the PX lynch to instead kill the cop that I was pretty sure was town, even if I kept being bad about organizing my thoughts correctly on d2. It turns out this was justified!

[Schezo]

some of the lame smileys own :colbert:

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

Serious post on the subject:

I generally try to consider everybody's opinion but going by Rewrite the literal only recent time I've played with bard while not being scum (and we were both ITP...) my biggest issue is that our methods of scumhunting are very different; he is very by-the-book "everyone is scum" whereas I try to consider if a case makes sense going by what I know of the person's thought process before I vote them, which leads to me going "I understand where you're coming from but think you're wrong", and there's just not much to be done about that, especially since I don't think either method is innately bad scumhunting, it's all about what works for you. I guess my point is that I don't find Bard bad at pushing cases, I'm just very set in my own reads and seem to disagree with his.

Also iirc I thought he was scum that game so yeah...

E: this post is a dumb unreadable run-on sentence. oh well

[Serela]

And then I run on some weird touchy-feely system I don't fully understand. Well, when people aren't being obvscum, at least.

Each time I fail I learn better what kind of touchy feels I can rely on and which ones I can't :D But people with toxic meta is the worst ;_; Or people like HW who just play too good as either alignment, whenever I decide "Yes, this must be HW town" he flips not-town.

I'm good at yelling "dude no this guy is town" when it's probably too late, though. In my experience everyone usually gets off when I do this though, for some reason.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

generally it's better to yell "dude no this mafia guy is scummier" rather than "dude no this guy is town", same thing you'd do if you were trying to avoid lynch yourself

[Serela]

The issue is I generally already used all my scumhunting effort on my preferred target before it comes down to "no don't lynch X they're deffo town" and there's just no support for it.

But people generally get off when I do this, for some reason, so okay.

[Shadoweh]

I kinda gave up after seeing the quality of posts. Why put in effort when no effort gets you a Town pass? Dormio put more effort into his roleplay than into scumhunting, and people didn't even talk about whether or not he was scummy. Since that was the game we were going to play I figured I might as well post only barebones.

Dormio caught scum on Page 1 with a huge case >_> I mean if you're going to talk about the lack of effort, it was probably in response to getting ignored?

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

Dormio caught scum on Page 1 with a huge case >_> I mean if you're going to talk about the lack of effort, it was probably in response to getting ignored?

my immediate reaction to that post was to PM chaore saying dormio was scum for using that many words on d1

[Serela]

oh my god that did actually land on scum didn't it