Touhou Rage Thread XVI: Last-Second Clipdeaths Edition

[Mino ☆]

I'M QUITTING TOUHOU!!!!

April Fools.

[Mino ☆]

April Fool's Joke aside ^

Just lost a potential 2 billion run because I died twice at Yuyuko (second spell, third non).

Shame that I keep losing good runs to Yuyuko because I can't do static attacks when nervous...

[Szayelaporro Granz]

I tried to (blindly) 1cc MoF Hard with ReimuA today. VoWG crushed me completely when Kanako's life is somewhat less than the half  :getdown:

[Arcengal]

Fucking Rings of Death.

Actually, just the entire sodding Mokou fight. I thought I might break the 2xxxxxxxxxx mark last night but I messed up Hourai Doll and died to literally the last threatening bullet in Imperishable Shooting. Probably either or both not happening would have got me there.

[LunarWingCloud]

I. Hate. Flandre's. Q.E.D. That is all. >:I I've gotten to her final spellcard 5-6 times and have yet to beat her.

[cactu]

If you're having trouble with it, I find the best strategy for QED is to simply stay under Flandre at all times and damage rush it.

[LunarWingCloud]

I'll try my best to do that on my next attempts. ^^ I'm gonna need to work on my vertical dodging, I find myself going far right or left to get away D:

[Makedounia]

I almost perfected Satori on hard with ReimuA. Hell, if it wasn't for the last spellcard, I'd say Yuugi is more difficult than Satori (at least with ReimuA).

[LunarWingCloud]

FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU...

I'm still having trouble with Flandre. .-. The Extra Stage, it's so different to TD's. TD I am very consistent with, but EoSD there's this feeling of randomness that just overtakes some of the patterns that screws me over at any given opportunity. D:

Also despite many people claiming it's an easy attack, I NEVER do well with Cranberry Trap. EVER. Having my homing amulets home in on the familiars is not okay. It's not okay at all.

Typically I get to Flandre with either 3 spare lives and 3 bombs or 4 spare lives and no bombs. I tend to either need all 3 bombs on my first life for Patchouli's cards or I need 2 for Patchouli (Silent Selene's the only one I can capture, ever, and I hate Royal Flare so much... >_>) and then need a third during the books before Flandre (usually the last wave).

But then I get to Flandre, and between the Rank system making the noncards a lot denser than and faster and her spellcards just giving me trouble I thought I'd be over, I never manage to do well with her. And I REFUSE to use the blind spot on Starbow Break in order to clear her. If I wanna do it for fun, sure, but I refuse to use it as my 1st clear. It just feels dirty. Also Starbow Break is fun and I'd be missing out. :V

A rundown of my typical experience with each spellcard:

Cranberry Trap - I hate this one. I hate not having my homing amulets going for her, and the pink static bullets always nab me when I'm trying to stream the blue ones away. No matter WHERE I try to dodge this attack, I always mess up, ALWAYS. It's worse because Flandre decides, sometimes, she just DOES NOT wanna stay in one place and will flutter between both ends of the screen sporadically.

Laevateinn - Easy! ^_^ I like this attack and it's a lot of fun to dodge.

Four of a Kind - Ehhhh, sometimes I get hit by something when trying to direct traffic. Which is exactly what this attack is like, is directing traffic. I manage to usually dodge it perfectly fine for a while, but then I mess up near the end.

Kagome Kagome - Usually not too bad, except for the off times when Flan decides to hide in a damn corner. >:I

Maze of Love - NO. NO. NO. I can dodge this attack for like all of 4 seconds before either panicking or just straight-up dieing because the sounds of the bullet fire don't give me ANY indication of where to go, I have to completely rely on seeing, which isn't helpful for me since the aimed bursts of round bullets always get me.

Starbow Break - Fun attack, really tricky, It's just pure dodging really. I REFUSE to use that blind spot under the 'N' in 'Enemy' in order to clear the stage (at least for my first run, I don't wanna remember my first Flandre clear as that one I played dirty to do it).

Catadioptric - Fun attack, usually not too hard for me. Only gets tricky near the end when slow bullets that haven't off-screened meet up with the new wave. Even then, I tend to capture about half the time.

Counter Clock - I never capture this, but I always have resources going into it, so I try to just minimize the need to use them. Not too bad at first, but the dodging to the right part which I think is the second of the three parts to each wave tends to screw me up, mostly because the red bullets are at their fastest at that point.

And Then Will There Be None? - Not too worried about this one, I can never capture it, but I hardly need to bomb. Only concern is sometimes escaping the red bullets that move to the center. Otherwise this is okay.

Ripples of 495 Years - I haven't been able to try the "just stay under her" thing yet. Since my last post I have only gotten to her survival card as the farthest, I've been doing downright bad lately at trying to clear the stage the past night or so. :/

[I have no name]

Maze of Love is the same every time, no aimed component at all.  For the first wave you circle around Flandre clockwise, then go back around counterclockwise.  Some people have more success micrododging at the bottom of the screen, but I find circling much easier.

For Philosopher's Stone, some of the attack is aimed at you.  As strange as it sounds, start about halfway up the screen and stream down for the start of the card-it makes it much easier!

Royal Flare is also the same every time, with any shot type that isn't ReimuA you can sit under Patchouli and dodge through 1 wave and the card dies.  (Notably, switching from ReimuA makes Cranberry Trap easier as well)

[LunarWingCloud]

Unfortunately there's no way I could beat Flandre as anyone else but ReimuA, she's just my best shot type. D: Also I've tried circling Flandre during Maze of Love. Did not go well at all. I'd do better to just micrododge it.

I don't have _THAT_ much trouble with Philosopher's Stone, my biggest problem is ironically, Cranberry Trap. .-. I'd be able to get to the later half of the fight more if I didn't died and spend 2-3 bombs on it...

[Sakurei]

A lot of the cards you are having problems with are static or aimed (Royal Flare, Cranberry Trap, Maze of Love, Counter Clock, ATTWBN) and can therefore be memorized. Instead of complaining (alas, this is what the thread is for), you could try watching a replay or two and try to mimick the player's movement. I admit the execution for ATTWBN and maybe Maze of Love can be tricky, but the other three are absolutely trivial once learned. I recommend sitting down and studying the attacks instead of playing a credit in hopes of getting past them somehow.

[Mr Jovial]

Trying to timeout Scarlet Destiny at 120 fps, got hit at 00 on the timer.

EDIT: Happened again.
EDIT2: Again.

[cactu]

LunarWingCloud, if you're too lazy to look at a replay and don't mind a video with a safespot use on Starbow Break, maybe having a look at this would help. I think that the strategies I used were the most safe ones.

[Snakebite969]

I am cursed.
Used almost all continues at Prismriver sisters. Survived Youmu twice,
At Yuyuko on PCB, Normal.
Used 1 continue in battle, now have 0.
Win! Yay!
THE RETURN OF YUYUKO
All lives but 1 lost.
Life regained during border.
Life lost immediately due to me not even realising I had a border.
Life lost at final second of spellcard.
Game over.

REIMU WHY ARE YOU SO LAZY THAT YOU CAN'T EVEN DODGE A SINGLE BUTTERFLY?!?!?!?!

So, it seems that my null hypothesis of never managing to ever beat the game unless I beat the Prismriver sisters on Lunatic is still relevant.

[Sakurei]

PoDD is pain. Beating Chiyuri would have meant 100m. Of course Chiyuri disagreed, so she went apeshit on me. I wasn't even playing badly against Chiyuri, but the game decided it would be fun to throw shitstorms at me. I entered stage 8 with 2 extra lives at 74m, that makes 22m for 3 rounds. That was a good Chiyuri. Aside that I didn't win. I cried. Not lucky enough.

This game hates my guts.

[LunarWingCloud]

A lot of the cards you are having problems with are static or aimed (Royal Flare, Cranberry Trap, Maze of Love, Counter Clock, ATTWBN) and can therefore be memorized. Instead of complaining (alas, this is what the thread is for), you could try watching a replay or two and try to mimick the player's movement. I admit the execution for ATTWBN and maybe Maze of Love can be tricky, but the other three are absolutely trivial once learned. I recommend sitting down and studying the attacks instead of playing a credit in hopes of getting past them somehow.

I don't have trouble with her survival card. And Counter Clock fluctuates from being a problem to not.

The other three on the other hand...

Although I don't care enough about Royal Flare. It's just one bomb I don't even need, really, I can go without needing to learn to dodge it. I'm no perfectionist, I just want to beat her.

[I have no name]

Although I don't care enough about Royal Flare. It's just one bomb I don't even need, really, I can go without needing to learn to dodge it. I'm no perfectionist, I just want to beat her.

Every bomb counts when you're just going for a clear, and Royal Flare is one of the easiest places to learn to avoid using one.

[Szayelaporro Granz]

Every bomb counts when you're just going for a clear, and Royal Flare is one of the easiest places to learn to avoid using one.

This. I eventually learn how to do it and now it has a pretty good capture rate thanks to cactu's replay. I still need to learn how to circle around Maze of Love like, really badly urgh :ohdear:

Edit: Argh I was REALLY close at defeating Eiki, I can't believe it costed me more than 3 lives to defeat her  :colonveeplusalpha:

[LunarWingCloud]

Are you guys _sure_ it's that easy to capture Royal Flare? I mean I'm using ReimuA and I just can't see to output enough damage and the pattern is just way too... funky for me to find openings in. :/

[Jirachi]

^It's pure memorization. Once you capture it like 2 times you'll almost never fail it.

[I have no name]

Are you guys _sure_ it's that easy to capture Royal Flare? I mean I'm using ReimuA and I just can't see to output enough damage and the pattern is just way too... funky for me to find openings in. :/

ReimuA can't speedkill it with one dodge like every other shot can-she is still able to capture it with only a few dodges, the method starting here.  (The irony is the run being linked here isn't even my best any more, but oh well)

[Star King]

ReimuA can't speedkill it with one dodge like every other shot can-she is still able to capture it with only a few dodges, the method starting here.  (The irony is the run being linked here isn't even my best any more, but oh well)

what

only MarisaA can do that

with the other shottypes, I find it's best to do what's shown in the video, then immediately go to the bottom left corner (the big opening inside the lane), then go back to the center inside the lane, should end shortly after that

[LunarWingCloud]

FUCK.

FUCK.

FUCK!!

I'm making so many rookie mistakes that are messing me up now! I've been off and on trying to beat Flandre since OCTOBER. OCTOBER. No amount of trying to learn how to dodge attacks I'm shaky with has helped me. No amount of practicing lately has helped me. No amount of ANYTHING has fucking helped me!! I'VE HAD TIMES WHERE I CAN GET TO FLAN'S LAST SPELLCARD WHEN I SPENT MOST OF THE FIGHT WITH ONLY TWO SPARE LIVES!! BUT THEN THE NEXT CHANCE I GET?? I WALK IN WITH 4 SPARE LIVES AND DIE BEFORE HER DAMN SURVIVAL CARD.

I feel like there's just too much pressure I'm putting on myself to forcefully be "this good" at "this section", and it's screwing me over. And lately, I CAN'T EVEN BOMB PROPERLY. Every time I wanna bomb, I'm a SPLIT SECOND too late, but when I don't wanna bomb, I panic or lose focus and BOMB ANYWAY... >__________> This is pissing me off because no matter how much input I get on how to do this or that, no matter how much I practice and try to use new methods of dodging other attacks, I ALWAYS MAKE DUMB MISTAKES and I NEVER MAKE ANY PROGRESS. I've been able to get to the last spellcard since last October and I've shown ZERO improvement.

I keep telling myself: "If I can get to Flan with 4 spare lives I should have a shot" (4 spare lives and 0 bombs is where I usually end up, I either need to bomb all of Patchy's cards or I end up using the one bomb I keep from the Patchy fight on the books near the end...), then I watch myself as I fuck up on Cranberry Trap and even Four of a Kind, then get fucked over by Flan's random movement in Kagome Kagome despite it being a piss easy attack otherwise, and slowly lose my resources until I SOMEHOW MANAGE to make it to the last couple of spellcards with some bombs left and then not have enough left to make it all the way.

I'm fucking done with this, I'm so close to giving up and moving elsewhere. But the problem is, EoSD is my favorite game of the series... I just wanna be able to say that I beat the Extra in my favorite game of the series... I just wanna be able to do that.

But despite all the input, all the watching videos of other runs, all the practicing, everything, I feel there's SLIGHT random factors in the stage or just SMALL FUCKING MISSTEPS that royally screw me over every chance they get. I'm doing well? I overhit the left or right key and crash into a bullet while dodging an otherwise easy attack. It's nonsense. I can't begin to explain how pissed I am at myself for being unable to improve just a LITTLE bit more. And the worst part is even if I TRY. Even if I WANT to. I STILL FUCK UP ANYWAY.

You guys suggested I try to give Royal Flare a shot at dodging since it's static, instead of bombing it. I looked for a video SPECIFICALLY of ReimuA doing a perfect run of the Extra so I could see how to do it. I STILL can't replicate that and constantly need to bomb. THERE'S EVEN TIMES WHERE I GET FUCKED OVER BY SILENT SELENE DESPITE MY EXPERIENCE WITH CAPTURING IT BEFORE. The pressure to do well on Patchouli crushes me to the point where MOST of my attempts lately don't even MAKE it to Flandre, I end up ragequitting before I even get past the halfway mark... Maze of Love? I've tried multiple times to dodge it in a circle with the big gaps. I NEVER GET IT RIGHT. I end up needing to stick to the bottom and micrododge the BULLSHIT flying at me from there. Cranberry Trap is by far the WORST NIGHTMARE I HAVE because it's like "oh, hey, hope you don't feel bad about losing half your damage output" (I know it's not quite that much but it's a considerable amount lost to being homed in on those familiars). And Cranberry Trap's factor of random movement PISSES ME OFF so much because I might look like I got it, but then she'll fly halfway across the screen and I'll be left maneuvering a pattern I am no good with no matter how hard I try.

Don't even get me STARTED on random missteps that CONSTANTLY PLAGUE my fight. I sometimes even fuck up on Laevateinn and start unfocusing across the right to left too late and get snapped by the laser on the way over to the left edge. Four of a Kind? I'll do fine for all of 15 seconds before the large bullets wall me and I make that ONE wrong move that pushes me into a bullet. I've had this happen TOO MANY TIMES, despite me having so much experience with the attack.

And then I'll get to say, Catadioptric and I usually do well on that, and I get cornered by a bullet or two on that too. I've flat-out given up trying on Starbow Break, despite me telling myself I DON'T wanna do something that dirty to be able to beat her. But there I end up sitting on the blind spot so I have a CHANCE, just a fucking CHANCE, to practice her later attacks with a good amount of resources.

No matter how much I try, I feel like I'm putting too much pressure on myself to do too well. Maybe I should just let myself bomb when I need to bomb instead of trying to push the thought into my head that I NEED to capture this card to stand some sort of a chance. Because somehow, I get farther when I feel I'm doing worse, than when I do well but crack under pressure to maintain it.

I think I'm gonna take an extended break from trying to fight Flandre, unless I can't find anything else to do. I just can't bring myself to keep suffering through a stage I used to enjoy but it's become tiring and repetitive, with mistakes made where they just don't make any fucking sense to.

Whatever the case, I am at least done for tonight, and possibly tomorrow. I'll try watching some anime or something in place of trying EoSD's Extra. Hell, maybe I'll fart around with Extras I KNOW I have no shot at at my current level (I can't even do well at all on say, Mokou or Suwako's stages), just to take a load off. But I'm staying away from EoSD. I don't need this shit when Touhou's supposed to make me happy. >_>

[Oh]

[LunarWingCloud]

XD

I just had to vent.

I'll give it another go when I'm not too focused on beating her, and when I'm a lot more calm. I may not actually BEAT Extra Stages or make 1cc's when I'm more relaxed, but I tend to make progress and find openings I don't otherwise, so maybe it'll be good if I just... stop worrying about it for a while.

[Andrew]

Have you tried downloading the Vsync patch? On most computers, older Touhou games like EoSD will have input lag, where for example, your character doesn't move until a little bit after you pressed the movement keys on your keyboard. Using the Vpatch will fix the input lag, making the older Touhou games a lot easier. A lot of people use it for EoSD and PCB, but I find that it helps to a lesser extent for IN, PoFV, StB, and MoF as well. If you try EoSD Extra again, I wish you luck. I remember EoSD Extra giving me a lot of trouble back in the day.

[cactu]

Gameovered with 1 bomb on Vampire Illusion on a 650M potential run... Beat my Highscore by 7000 points.  :V

[Mino ☆]

Remilia is why we can't have nice things!

[LunarWingCloud]

Have you tried downloading the Vsync patch?

I forgot all about that! I'm gonna try that, thanks.

EDIT: IT WORKS LIKE A CHARM. I didn't beat her yet, but my first attempt getting to her, I got to her with 4 spare lives and 1 bomb, I haven't had that extra bomb getting to her in like, FOREVER. And I managed to make it to her survival card before I died. I got way too nervous, and way too cocky, and didn't bomb, but I think this'll do the trick. With a little more trying I'll be posting in the accomplishments thread that I finally beat Flandre~! ;w;