League of Legends Thread 10 - Threads...threads are truly outrageous.

[triangles]

First ranked game completed!

As Lulu I go 2/3/12, team is 20/7 with a ~25min surrender.  Minus jungler going "gg afk farming" because we got 5 man blue invaded who quickly changed his mind, everyone was encouraging, giving us tips to deal with Urgot bot lane (wtf I never saw him in SR before) and I was being the team cheerleader.  Everyone was civil in champ select, and I got two friends requests after the game!  Totally surprised me, as MJP tried rank last night and it was pretty much the complete opposite experience for him

Of course, watch my other 9 placement matches end in tears, rage, and liberal usage of the mute button :V
But I think I will stick with support, both mechanically and in terms of team spirit.  Cupcakes and squirrels for everyone!

[Raikaria]

@ Balance topic: I like to think Riot went through phases since I joined:

Phase 1: Can't get it right, weak is left alone, strong is reacted quickly

Fiora: Pretty weak, left alone for a while
Lulu: Pretty OP [Albeit, everywhere except where she should have been]
Hecarim: Pretty weak, left mostly alone for a while


Phase 2: Actually getting stuff right

Varus: Was pretty balanced on release. Has had a inconsequential AP Ratio buff, and a visibility buff to his Ult [The width increase wasn't much at all, it was just so people could see 'oh Varus ulted!']
Darius: Actually fine, just a minor nerf to shut GD up.
Draven: Fine
Jayce: He wasn't fine. It just took people a while to figure it out

Phase 3: Extremes. Riot react swiftly and harshly

Zyra: Hotfix nerfed
Diana: Buffed patch after release, then nerfed to the ground with an OBVIOUS overnerf [R less range than Q? Seriously?]
Rengar: Buffed a lot patch after release, then nerfed, then nerfed, then nerfed...
Syndra: Buffed constantly, still trash, but at least playable
Kah'Zix: Actually left alone, probobly because Riot designed Kah with S3 in mind
Elise: Buffed + QoL immediately after release. Then broke her.

Phase 4: Riot release a champion and wait a few patches to do anything. They take small steps. They don't want another Diana/Rengar/Elise

Zed: Left alone for a while. Getting minor nerfs now
Nami: Left alone for quite a while before buffs rolled in
Vi: Got some QoL changes quickly, and became strong, but nerfs were hardly swift after.
Thresh: Took way too long to nerf him
Quinn: Buffs rolling in slowly
Zac: Too new, no changes yet
Lissandra: Lol

@ ADC: Just learn to play MF. Even if you lose grab a LW and BC anyway and just press R.

[Think Komachi with a Rifle]

Nami was nerfed massively between PBE and live (huge mana cost increases i think it was), as she was crazy powerful mid. This wrecked her sustain as a support and she ended up out of mana all the damn time.
The speed boost was to make up for the  nerfs to her mana sustain, as she needed to trigger her passive to move at "normal" speeds. Her R was too slow to use as a primary engagement tool, still amazing follow up if you could get a slow on their team , and that got fixed.

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3422263

We have riot hinting at the next champ (and thread all turning into Lux x Ezreal speculation due to the OP pic. Which they altered, actually making it more clearly Lux, but not being a shot of her and Ez anymore.

[Raikaria]

1: Champion is clearly the figure from Trynda's lore.

2: Ezreal made a post about the image change:

Uh oh.

Don't pay any attention to that sketch of me and whoever that is, it's not important. I didn't mean to leave it out.

I'll just? put it away.

It's in character. Ezreal's like 'Oh... uh... you shouldn't see that. Ahem

Ezreal x Lux is now canon it seems.

===

Stained Glass Widnow = Damacian
Statuette = Noxian

So whoever this is, has ties with both sides. Who knows, seeing he effected Frejord... waaaait a second.

Always linked to violence
Interested in every place.
*this dark figure has been at the center of many bloody conflicts and tales of war.*

You don't think this could be *the* Ruined King, do you? You know, ruler of the Shadow Isles and all that. Riot did say they would do more on the Shadow Isles at some point, and the quotes were hinting something. And there were items introduced in S3 for the Frejord event [ICEBORN Gauntlet. Shard of TRUE ICE]. Why not the Blade of the RUINED KING?

[Raitaki]

Ahgerdz guis I wanted to improve early game adv in general I don't have the cash to shell out for all those extra adds :V Especially since I'm only playing adv lately just cuz botlane is pretty much the only one people don't call by default now, and I still have too many map awareness problems to support :V

Maybe I'll try adc Kayle for a while and see how well that goes in ranked. Every time I go Kayle I become a damage magnet though :C

[Cadmas]

Whoever this new guy is, he looks a lot more interesting than Flubber and the Blue Falcon.

[Widermelonz]

Yesterday, I played a game with me as Thresh top, and my two of buddies as Kha'zix+Darius in bot lane. We were winning with a score of something like 20-3 by the 20 minute mark. That shit was the most fun I've had in a while. You guys should give it a try.

[Mr. Sacchi]

Ahgerdz guis I wanted to improve early game adv in general I don't have the cash to shell out for all those extra adds :V Especially since I'm only playing adv lately just cuz botlane is pretty much the only one people don't call by default now, and I still have too many map awareness problems to support :V

Maybe I'll try adc Kayle for a while and see how well that goes in ranked. Every time I go Kayle I become a damage magnet though :C

Just learn how to CS properly, know that you're absolutely nothing without your support, always followup whatever your support does, know the weaknesses and strengths of every ADC and how to counter them (Not staying close to walls against Vayne, hugging your second tower against caitlyn, etc.) as well as what to do against every support, and above everything: ADCS DO NOT JUMP IN, IF THERE'S A BRICK WALL BETWEEN YOU AND THE HIGH-VALUE TARGETS, YOU SMASH THE BRICK WALL OR MAKE IT LEAVE BEFORE DOING ANYTHING ELSE.

I've seen so many people just get wrecked because they jump in as ADC. Meanwhile I'm killing malphites and Xin Zhaos before doing anything about their apc, adc and support, and winning teamfights because of it.

Also, know how to orb walk/stutter step. That makes one HELL of a difference.

Finally, don't expect to ever be perfect at ADC'ing, as the carry you need amazing positional awareness and mechanical knowledge just to keep yourself alive in a realistic situation. Of course, if your team just CCs everyone then you can just sit there and autoattack to victory, most of the time there's going to be a tank and a bruiser between you and the rest of the teamfight, and with most teammates, you're going to get maybe one person protecting you.

It's still satisfying to be getting completely destroyed one minute and right after you're wrecking face harder than that 10/0 guy ever could.

[theshirn]

zaun lab bot is my hero

[Yukarin]

rumble is so underrated man

[Cadmas]

Our Jungler picks shaco. Entire enemy team buys nothing but pinks wards and orcales. Mid and jungler bitch about wards.

I can't play support in rank. It is such a waste.
Just wait till they put the damn WoW dungeon finder in the game.

[Raikaria]

Just wait till they put the damn WoW dungeon finder in the game.

Keep dreaming.

*Pick Mid*

Queue Time: 1 Hour

*Pick Support*

*Instant Queue with nothing stopping you from not picking a support anyway*

Not to mention issues with enforcing the meta when it could change at any point and everything, and stopping development. Like, Nautilus wasn't designed as a jungler. Oh wait he's played as one now. With this syetm? Nope. Never would happen.

[Cadmas]

Welp guess the only thing to do then is be a dick and pick a damage role and force a million queue dodges.

Looking at the support meta. Looks like Leona good, everyone else bad.

The only champ I know that creates a reliable stalemate with that woman is Amumu and his hugs.

[Ryuu]

janna ruins leona's day

[Raikaria]

Alistar also has a habit of pressing Q and/or W to ruin a Leona's day.

[Ryuu]

though alistar and janna are both kind of eh right now so i guess that's part of why leona is getting strong

[Raikaria]

though alistar and janna are both kind of eh right now so i guess that's part of why leona is getting strong

http://www.lolking.net/champions/janna#statistics
http://www.lolking.net/charts?region=all&league=ranked&type=champion-winrate&range=daily

Janna - Kind of eh with 55%+ winrates, and the highest winrate in the game

It's funny how every time Janna gets nerfed she manages to get back to good winrates. People say Janna got destroyed, stop playing her, then realise 'Janna's actually still good'. To be fair, this time took a minor mana cost buff to R.

*On the other hand the Cow is kind of eh legitimately, although I wonder how much of that is due to people not playing him in the right matchups*

[hyorinryu]

http://www.lolking.net/champions/janna#statistics
http://www.lolking.net/charts?region=all&league=ranked&type=champion-winrate&range=daily

Janna - Kind of eh with 55%+ winrates, and the highest winrate in the game

It's funny how every time Janna gets nerfed she manages to get back to good winrates. People say Janna got destroyed, stop playing her, then realise 'Janna's actually still good'. To be fair, this time took a minor mana cost buff to R.

*On the other hand the Cow is kind of eh legitimately, although I wonder how much of that is due to people not playing him in the right matchups*

I imagine it's partially because most people who pick Janna have a lot of experience with her, kinda like with Shaco a while back. If she because flavor of the month, I'm sure her win rate would take a nose dive.

[Raikaria]

Her pick rate isn't exactly low ya'know.

Speaking of winrates, Sona is the Queen of ARAM.

Do you want to know Sona's usual winrate in ARAM?

Somewhere between 67% and 69%.

That said, ARAM skill level generally isn't that high. QWE on Sona takes... pretty much no skill, and how do you miss R on Murderbridge?

[Ryuu]

I imagine it's partially because most people who pick Janna have a lot of experience with her, kinda like with Shaco a while back. If she because flavor of the month, I'm sure her win rate would take a nose dive.

this is pretty true

also her pick rate is high because she's incredibly easy to play


additionally, citing win rate as the end all be all stat really just shows you have no idea what you're talking about

[Raikaria]

It's pretty indicative when there's over 250,000 Ranked Janna games which comes out for a total winrate of 55.55% in a monthly period.

Is it the only thing to look at? No.

Is it not a good statistic? Of course it's still a good statistic. It gets better the more games there are as well, as that increases reliability.

On the Sona Topic, in a month, with over 50,000 games, she gets a 67% winrate in ARAM. Obviously this games played will rise a lot with the new ARAM queue.

[Ryuu]

It's pretty indicative when there's over 250,000 Ranked Janna games which comes out for a total winrate of 55.55% in a monthly period.

Is it the only thing to look at? No.

Is it not a good statistic? Of course it's still a good statistic. It gets better the more games there are as well, as that increases reliability.

On the Sona Topic, in a month, with over 50,000 games, she gets a 67% winrate in ARAM. Obviously this games played will rise a lot with the new ARAM queue.

it's not a good statistic. it's incredibly misleading and only one part of a much larger picture. what are popular playstyles? what is the current popular strategy? who is safe to pick in more situations than others? which champions are seeing a lot of play? why? which items are good? who fits easily into teams and who is more niche?

these are just a handful of questions to ask when determining if someone is strong or just popular. tournament stats are also a useful thing to look at that can point you in the right direction. for example, janna has a 10% pick/ban rate in lcs compared to sona's 48%.

none of these pieces of information alone are "good statistics" on their own. only in conjunction with each other, and with proper analysis and thought can you get a good statistic.

[Raikaria]

Except LCS =/= Normal play. Who's better in a 2v1 lane, a passive support like Janna, or an aggressive poke-based support who can bully ranged champions, let alone melee? Obviously the latter.

LCS is such a different environment, especially with the whole 2v1 lane swap deal, that using LCS as an indicator is inherently flawed. These 250,000 Janna games represent what people are actually playing on the ladder, in the environment you and me play in.

Please don't tell me my evidence is flawed and then pull out something that's hardly even relevant as a counter-argument.

Although yes, a number on it's own isn't good. You analyze said number, you compare, ect.

Except there isn't much to analyze. Janna has a winrate over 55% with 250,000+ games. That says pretty clearly that right now Janna is strong. Now, if this was, say, Old Sejuani with like 200 games and a 60% winrate, wouldn't read much into that, 200 games is nothing, and easily skewed.

[Cadmas]

Idk I played 2 Janna games one versus a sona and the other a leona last night. Janna still feels like trash with a support item build.

Nothing more frustrating than failing to kill someone with 100 hp over and over again b/c of no damage Janna.
Is the whole idea to build ap on her now b/c my tornadoes and shields seem bring nothing of value anymore?
Even the slow is so weak now. Running away is real difficult.

[triangles]

Speaking of Leona (sort of)

Draven/Leona bot lane HALP HOW I FITE?
We got absolutely massacred as Graves/Zyra last night, I picked Zyra after MJP took Graves and Leona was picked on the other side, figuring the root would help Graves and keep Leona out of our hair but then the Draven showed up and WELP.  At least our team wasn't a jerk about it and other team acknowledged we were outplayed no OMG FEEDER UNINSTALL and our top lane also got slaughtered so it wasn't 100% us causing the 20min surrender....

[Cadmas]

Personally I've given up on Graves. The AS nerf to quickdraw was the last nail in the coffin.

Draven, MF, Twitch, Quinn, caitylin, Varius, even Ezreal. All better than Graves.

[Raikaria]

Personally I've given up on Graves. The AS nerf to quickdraw was the last nail in the coffin.

Draven, MF, Twitch, Quinn, caitylin, Varius, even Ezreal. All better than Graves.

The AS nerf to Quickdraw happened when it was Graves and Ezreal. And occasionally Corki. And it was still Graves and Ezreal after.  [Also bear in mind with Hurricane Graves can keep the buff active almost indefinitely as long as he has mana]

Graves is certainly better than Quinn. Graves actually has an Ultimate that's not a suicide button.

But yes, right now MF is Graves but better.

As for Janna? Yeah, the thing with her is now to build some AP, bigger shields, ult heals more. Full Ult is a 140% AP ratio per person. That's a total AP ratio of 700% if 5 people get the full heal. I think a 700% AP ratio heal kinda turns a fight on it's head. [Not that you'll get that situation often, but still, puts Monsoon's AP ratio into perspective] Shields are 90% AP.

And most supports don't exactly have much more damage than a Janna, pre-6 at least. Especially when factoring in the indirect damage from her shield. Her slow only got it's AP ratio nerfed. And AP Janna is still obnoxious anyway. She won't kill you, but she will insta-clear the wave, and then roam everywhere. Then she'll just splitpush and be uncatchable with Nado's and 5000 MS.

A guy managed to reach #1 and #2 in NA Challenger simultaneously playing AP Janna as his main...

I mean, what else do you transition into with Janna now? Junglers take both Ageis and Locket usually.

[Cadmas]

I mean, what else do you transition into with Janna now? Junglers take both Ageis and Locket usually.

In Bronze 1, you need to build all the support items and have enough damage and CC to carry bads b/c your jungler is gonna build straight damage items and everyone is gonna suffer for it.

[triangles]

I can't really control who he plays, he only has Ashe and Graves in terms of ADC I think.
Any tips other than "play someone else?"   Even general things considering I Lulu a lot too.

In Bronze 1, you need to build all the support items and have enough damage and CC to carry bads b/c your jungler is gonna build straight damage items and everyone is gonna suffer for it.

Same here in un/nonranked limbo zones!

[hyorinryu]

I can't really control who he plays, he only has Ashe and Graves in terms of ADC I think.
Any tips other than "play someone else?"   Even general things considering I Lulu a lot too.
Same here in un/nonranked limbo zones!

They should be fine. What you guys need to do is poke them down and disengage when they jump on you. Lulu's great for this, and Graves can poke Draven down with his Q.