Welcome to Yukkuri Mafia.
Pesco is running this game and is probably the one behind all this crap that's preventing you from taking it easy.
You have no special abilities other than to talk nonsense and to vote.
You win when all threats are removed and you can take it easy
/me takes it easyI'm willing to suggest just trying to lynch Pesco. The role PM says he's probably responsible for it all, therefore...
##Vote Zakkuri
That is no Zaku, easy! No Zaku!
Anyway, lynching Pesco almost seems too obvious, so I'm afraid to do it.Honestly, think this through. Ten players, and one scum? There's no way this would be a fair setup to actually force on some poor mafia player, so the obvious answer of 'lynch another player' can't be right.
EBWOP: Also, we may as well lynch ASAP in this case, since Pesco is hardly going to defend himself.
And I don't really get Rou's rush. We have 3 days to lynch Pesco if we want. Let's just take it a bit easier.This has not been a good choice of game for me. I had forgotten how paranoid I get over Bastard Mod games, so I want to win ASAP.
Honestly, think this through. Ten players, and one scum? There's no way this would be a fair setup to actually force on some poor mafia player, so the obvious answer of 'lynch another player' can't be right.
Add that to Pesco's role PM, and...
I'm just afraid that lynching Pesco will blow up in our faces. Like I said bastard mod + the sentence "Pesco is running this game and is probably the one behind all this crap that's preventing you from taking it easy." = KUkkuri is unable to take it easy.Well the worst case scenario is we lose, right? It's a bastard mod game, so that basically means we aren't expected to win anyway.
You know that line that says 'You win when ... '?
I'll just take it easy and not join the GM wagon~
Meanwhile I'll just ##Vote UK because she is the one who has boxes to throw over us.
Nuh uh~ I'm already in the box!Sure, you want us to think you might be dead and/or alive inside the box. But maybe you were never there in the first place!
I don't think that lynching Pesco will help us, and here's why: notice the votecount. I have a vote on me from some unknown source. According to Pesco, everyone's vanilla. This probably applies to all townies, since for scum to be falsely told that there are no roles would make them not really an "informed minority," but I wouldn't be surprised if there were scum power roles despite Pesco's statement. If Pesco's really the bad guy here, I wouldn't put it past him to screw with me like this, but I don't think it's the most likely cause.This makes no sense. He said outright that everyone is vanilla, even if not that everyone was vanilla Town. Hence a mystery vote doesn't sound like it's coming from one of the players.
This makes no sense. He said outright that everyone is vanilla, even if not that everyone was vanilla Town. Hence a mystery vote doesn't sound like it's coming from one of the players.
Then what if the mystery vote is coming from a collective scum ability, even if individually they're all just goons?The flavour text specifies that there's only 1 scum in the setup. Therefore there can't be a 'collective' ability, since there's no collective.
Winning the game:Either this is a joke, or trying to figure out what's going on is anti-Town. I don't know which of these I would find more annoying.
Sodium, SDrake, Nietz, Kilga (remember that game of Dethy where he wasn't playing and got NK'd?)
The flavour text specifies that there's only 1 scum in the setup. Therefore there can't be a 'collective' ability, since there's no collective.
Either this is a joke, or trying to figure out what's going on is anti-Town. I don't know which of these I would find more annoying.
Affinity's not on the list.But it's not a matter of 'you win for not voting Pesco' either. Nor is it a matter of 'you win for voting the right player'. Given that people who are actively talking are apparently 'losing' to people who are contributing nothing, perhaps we should all just shut up until deadline and throw votes on someone randomly.
You do know that yukkuris are stupid and can't tell one human from another, right?Sure. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AssPull)
Also notice that I'm not winning the game either right now.The GM isn't MEANT to win. :V
Telling you any more would be quoting mod correspondence. I might get modkilled for that.This just in: Pesco declared insane, admits that he talks to himself.
Coming from you, that's quite rich.Hypocrisy is the funniest humour.
Rule 5 infraction btw.The GM qualifies as a player?
[23:52] <Pesco> @choose post in mafia or not
[23:52] <Keine> Pesco: I choose...not! ^_^V
[23:52] <Pesco> :3
Maybe it is the dead players vote and Pesco is considering himself as part (and the only one for now) of the "voting pool" there?Then why did he choose to vote Serp? Or is that delving too far into WIFOM?
Whoever has the secret vote obviously didn't want to bring me to L-1This means one of two things.
- Pesco is the secret vote
-After reading the first post again part of me wonders if there's no mafia at all and we're all just vanillia townies, but that seems like a boring set-up so I'm not counting on it right now.
-I'm assuming that Pesco is the secret voter since he seems to be playing. If he's not he should vote for someone since not voting is anti-town or something. That actually goes for everyone not voting right now.Let's bring this one step further. The GM is a player, but the GM knows the affiliations of all the players. What's the only way that this setup can possibly be valid?
Let's bring this one step further. The GM is a player, but the GM knows the affiliations of all the players. What's the only way that this setup can possibly be valid?
Pesco was lyingAt which point we get screwed over, because suddenly everything you say could potentially be a lie.
Let's bring this one step further. The GM is a player, but the GM knows the affiliations of all the players. What's the only way that this setup can possibly be valid?
Yeah, I guess if Pesco really is a player that being the only mafia or a third party are the only things that make sense. I lean towards the latter tbh. But geez, I still can't shake this fear that something terrible will happen if we lynch Pesco.
Pesco, can you claim?
Oh, and Rou is about to be daykilled if he ever refers to Umineko again.o_O
Zak (3): Serp, ???, !!!*slow, painful facepalm*
Oh, lovely. I'm wondering if people not voting vote people of the mod's choice.
I haven't paid any attention to who is not voting.
There will always be 11 votes in play. This is obvious now.Okay, 10 players, 2 secret votes...and 11 votes in total? I'm lost.
Pesco was lynched and Serp got himself in a cardboard box. What do you get to learn about these two entities? Absolutely nothing because you lynched the GM and now nobody else knows what the hell is going on.
##Vote: K4U for spending the entire of Day 1 saying 'we shouldn't lynch Pesco' without doing something productive like, say, forming a case against anyone else.Forming a case based in what? The only "case" there was was Pesco's, and that was more like making a wild guess and running with it.
Forming a case based in what? The only "case" there was was Pesco's, and that was more like making a wild guess and running with it.The fact that she spent a good portion of the day complaining about how the Pesco wagon was stupid, and then did nothing about it. She could easily have attacked someone based on their hastiness to attack Pesco, or chosen Serp for the same reasons Kilga stated, but instead she just hung on her random vote for you and BAWWWWWWWWED.
And what about K4U is than about, say, me?
7. Lurkers are your problem. Deal with it.
You need to chillax, dude.I DON'T KNOW HOW
In spite of all the BAAAWWing, there's still people that are figuring out the game and playing it. They are winning.I find this utterly hilarious, since on Day 1 the people who were making an active effort to figure out what was happening and play were the people who were LOSING.
In my mind I was doing something about it. I did the best I could to try to get people to think about other things. Just because it didn't work doesn't mean I wasn't trying.Let me give an example of the problem. This is like you saying "Hey, guys, we should stop using coal and oil because we're killing the planet's natural resources and giving off massive carbon emissions" and so on. But there's no mention of an alternative, and at least coal and oil give us SOME energy. Why do you think we've been using them for so long? Because we haven't quite figured out anything better and safer (I'm looking at you, nuclear power).
In theory, the nk/extra lynch is a result of us lynching the mod and getting kicked in the face. I have no idea where the secret votes were coming from. They could be a result of deadline approaching, a result of outside forces manipulating the ghost vote, or just a way of screwing with everyone's minds (Notice during the lynch that both of the secret votes that were on me disappeared).So in order to teach us to no lynch, Pesco gives us a situation which makes it logically impossible to no lynch?
I'm not sure I understand the case against K4U, except that apparently her actions being consistent with what she says is a scummy thing. :VThe point with K4U was that she spent plenty of time complaining about the Suwako lynch, but didn't make any effort to actually STOP it outside of that. Even building a weak case would have generated discussion outside of voting Pesco, so the fact that her only contribution was verbal didn't sit well with me.
The point with K4U was that she spent plenty of time complaining about the Suwako lynch, but didn't make any effort to actually STOP it outside of that. Even building a weak case would have generated discussion outside of voting Pesco, so the fact that her only contribution was verbal didn't sit well with me.Thing is, there honestly wasn't anything to form a case on. Over half of day 1 was just setup speculation. I'm not defending her or anything, but I don't think this is a valid reason to accuse her of being scum. Just my 2 cents, of course.
No Lynch seems to be a very easy solution, but it's so easy that even as a yukkuri I think it is too easy to be right.
I'm not sure I understand the case against K4U, except that apparently her actions being consistent with what she says is a scummy thing. :V
Her point against Zakeri seems valid for exactly the opposite.
However, I'm going with UK again today, mostly because she's trying too hard to take it easy. All she has done so far is put on some neutral statements and agree with both gimmick ideas so far. Even her votes so far were for inconsequential targets.
##Vote UKkuri
That said, UK's lack of any decent contribution along with her willingness to jump on the Zak 'No Lynch' theory (which even Zak himself admitted wasn't solid) instantly isn't very enticing either. If it came down to it, I'd probably be fine with either Kitten being lynched at this point.
I still prefer a Zakeri lynch because I can't think of a pro-town reason to do something you think will end badly for the town, but I can get behind a UK lynch if it came down to it. The case is solid.
UK's vote for said no lynch was weird.
I'm all for going places then.
But I have to say it's at the least ironic for someone proposing No Lynch to call it a wasted day.
I'd say it's worth a shot, but I think the others' problem with you is how quickly you jumped on it without even looking into anything else. If we don't get any solid target by the end of the day, then I'm all for it. :s
I still prefer a Zakeri lynch because I can't think of a pro-town reason to do something you think will end badly for the town...For Science. (http://xkcd.com/242/)
UK: It was weird because it seemed sudden, and you didn't really think it through. Doesn't help that the only thing you said when you voted was "I like Zak's theory".
Well, no lynch does seem pretty safe because we'd be only losing at most 1 more person with the chance of winning(or something that isn't dying), but we should look at other options, and I have a feeling Pesco is going to bastard mod a no lynch too. =V
tl;dr: No lynch is fine, but lets see if there's anything else we can try.
EBWOP: By anything else, I mean still try to look for potential scum, should this game actually have scum, and anything else. Better safe then sorry, and we can always no lynch at the end of the day instead of ending it prematurely(unless we really don't have anything to talk about).
Wait...what case?
And isn't it the same one as the one on you?
Further, on MS there have been discussions about the idea of a game where the goal is for town to no lynch and everyone's vanilla. I wouldn't be surprised to see Pesco spring this on us.
That's part of the reason I don't think this is the case. In every thread I've seen suggesting this idea it's been shot down and called absolutely horrible. Most people go as far as to call it "not Mafia." I guess it's possible that Pesco decided to do it anyway, but I'm still not counting on it.
Um no? The case on me was that I thought it was bad but I brought up no alternatives. My case on Zak is that he thought the Pesco lynch was a bad idea, voted for him anyway and then proceded to say nothing for the rest of the day. Basically his words don't match his actions. I don't see how that's at all similar to the case on me.
Wait, I thought you meant case on me. I apologize for the misunderstanding.
Oh wait, maybe I did misread what you said (I blame eating too much). I don't see how the case on you and the case on me is similar. Can you explain?
The list of winners Pesco presented to us only had one thing in common. They all said they were going to take it easy.
ITT, goddamn apathy.
Seriously people, the last thing we need is absolutely everyone getting a clear because no-one who didn't like the Pesco lynch could be bothered to DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT.
You complain there's nothing to work with? Then MAKE SOMETHING. Make a crazy accusation, build a flimsy case, do SOMETHING to get discussion going. Don't sit on your ass and do nothing, then whine that there was nothing to do later.
Secondly, UK's immediate assumption that's she going to get lynched ahead of, y'know, actually defending herself, is inducing much raeg. Also her 'early on my wagon = scum' comment feels very iffy, because if she IS scum then she's obviously trying to incriminate the early voters who caught her out. And of course we can't KNOW if she's innocent because Pesco is being a dick and playing a no-reveal.
(So, UK, agree that no-reveal is bastard moddy yet?)
K4U at least seems to be pressing a case on Zak, but UK just says 'lol nolynch plz'. T_T
Thirdly, now that it's been brought up, what exactly is the 'win' condition if Kilga was also classified as a winner? Any chance of the GM posting a new 'currently winning' list, or is he too busy being dead?
Winning: The House (because it always wins)
Finally, I'll just say right now that if we ARE expected to no lynch I will fly over to Africa and punch Pesco in the face myself. Mafia is NOT a game of diplomacy.
That would be very sweet of you
Wasn't Serp revealed as town? At least, that's what I read. So, I'm not sure I understand the "incriminating people early on my wagon" thing here ^-^.The only reason we're relatively sure about Serp is because he was hit. We can't be certain about lynches based on the lack of reveals that we've managed to bring upon ourselves. Therefore my point stands.
As for not defending myself, there's nothing to defend against. I'm being lynched cause I was a little too quick to agree with no lynching. Can I really say anything that would change anyone's mind? Rather, anyone who's voting me for something like that?You could do something productive rather than buy into some crazy theory which, for the record, would be easier to instate in later days anyway. So can't we leave No Lynch until Mylo or something?
And yesh, about the lol no lynch thing. I've further explained my stance on it. If you don't accept that as my "case", then there's really nothing I can do.Besides, I dunno, HUNT.
HOLY CRAP AFFINITY IS PLAYING THIS GAME! WHO KNEW?This point I will agree with you on. Afffinity's been even quieter than you, and AFTER all the fuss over you jumping on so quickly, he proceeds to...jump on quickly. I am not impressed.
Well, I consider lynching a townie more wasteful.Right, and if you were scum you wouldn't lie to us about being townie, would you? ;)
The only reason we're relatively sure about Serp is because he was hit. We can't be certain about lynches based on the lack of reveals that we've managed to bring upon ourselves. Therefore my point stands.
You could do something productive rather than buy into some crazy theory which, for the record, would be easier to instate in later days anyway. So can't we leave No Lynch until Mylo or something?
Besides, I dunno, HUNT.
This point I will agree with you on. Afffinity's been even quieter than you, and AFTER all the fuss over you jumping on so quickly, he proceeds to...jump on quickly. I am not impressed.
You spent most of the game avoiding taking any instance and being eager to join in any crazy idea that could buy scum time. And when confronted you say that you are not scum because you didn't do anything scummy, that you believe there's no scum in the game and that anyone against you is scum?
And I just can't believe people are buying into the No Lynch thing. Have you actually thought of just who is making the NK, if there's no scum?
Rou, what's with the sudden change? Day 1 was "there are no scum, Pesco must die", and now it's "There's scum, no lynch is stupid".
Kanako (2): Sodium, AffinityWat.
No Lynch (2): UK, Affinity
I still say it's a soft reveal of his alignment. And I expect more.Okay, now you're outright misrepping what I'm saying. The point is we can't be certain of YOUR alignment, so claiming 'people who vote me early are scum' doesn't work because we can't be sure of your alignment even after your lynch. Why do you keep redirecting to Serp?
Ah, wouldn't that be nice, but...first, we don't know when Mylo is (and do you really think Pesco will tell us?) and secondly, in the variations of an all vanilla game that I read, part of it was that town had three days to realize they were to no lynch.And several people have already mentioned that this game is absolutely retarded, haven't they? I'm willing to agree on that count.
Rou, what's with the sudden change? Day 1 was "there are no scum, Pesco must die", and now it's "There's scum, no lynch is stupid".The role PMs said 'Pesco is probably responsible'. Therefore given that the game's a Bastard Mod voting the GM seemed logical at the time. Now that that's been proven wrong, though, there's no alternative that seems viable. There's a difference between lynching a player who you shouldn't be able to lynch and actively doing nothing.
Okay, now you're outright misrepping what I'm saying. The point is we can't be certain of YOUR alignment, so claiming 'people who vote me early are scum' doesn't work because we can't be sure of your alignment even after your lynch. Why do you keep redirecting to Serp?
And several people have already mentioned that this game is absolutely retarded, haven't they? I'm willing to agree on that count.
The role PMs said 'Pesco is probably responsible'. Therefore given that the game's a Bastard Mod voting the GM seemed logical at the time. Now that that's been proven wrong, though, there's no alternative that seems viable. There's a difference between lynching a player who you shouldn't be able to lynch and actively doing nothing.
@Affinity: So you're basically saying that we should figure out how the game works before we try to actually do anything? Or am I just misinterpreting your post?
HOLY CRAP KANAKO IS PLAYING! WHEN DID THAT HAPPEN?Since I got trashed by Cybele on Devil Summoner 2. :3
Pesco to the last part, and as for the first part I actually said that if there IS scum, they are on my wagon, and early on it. But I enjoy the strawman, it tastes good when I'm in a cowgirl mood.Pesco's dead baby, Pesco's dead.
What I'm saying is that if/when I'm lynched, I assume my alignment will be revealed as Serp's was.
Pesco was lynched and Serp got himself in a cardboard box. What do you get to learn about these two entities? Absolutely nothing (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX7V6FAoTLc#t=0m11s) because you lynched the GM and now nobody else knows what the hell is going on.
And several people have already mentioned that this game is absolutely retarded, haven't they? I'm willing to agree on that count.And what's the problem with that? Zombie Feynman knows that I for one get tired of being a scientific mastermind the whole time and can use a chance, even if a retarded one, to take it easy.
Oh hey, you misrepped what I said in your laughable attempt to accuse me of the same thing.Nietz beat me to this point, so :V
What I'm saying is that if/when I'm lynched, I assume my alignment will be revealed as Serp's was. Meaning that we can use the information from my wagon, which at the time I thought had a horrible smell of opportunism on it.
Ok...and?I'm saying your game plan where No Lynch = win is stupid, because it goes against every basic principle of Mafia.
"actively doing nothing". Really now? Except it's a damn decent shot at winning. But since you want to raeg at me so badly, go ahead.Oh yes, doing exactly what you AREN'T SUPPOSED TO DO IN MAFIA and choosing NOT TO LOOK FOR SCUM is a 'decent shot at winning'.
I love how stern you try to sound when you vote me. I'll give you a hint hon. It makes you sound retarded ^-^;Oh darling, I'm only doing it for your own good. Now get back into the kitchen and make me a sandwich.
And what's the problem with that? Zombie Feynman knows that I for one get tired of being a scientific mastermind the whole time and can use a chance, even if a retarded one, to take it easy.You may as well argue that you should No Lynch during ANY game of Mafia where scum aren't forced to kill, because there's a (retarded) chance of a Happily Ever After scenario.
I'm saying your game plan where No Lynch = win is stupid, because it goes against every basic principle of Mafia.
Oh yes, doing exactly what you AREN'T SUPPOSED TO DO IN MAFIA and choosing NOT TO LOOK FOR SCUM is a 'decent shot at winning'.
Oh darling, I'm only doing it for your own good. Now get back into the kitchen and make me a sandwich.
tl;dr FOR THE LOVE OF BYAKUREN WHY ARE PEOPLE LAZY ENOUGH TO NO LYNCH
Nah, it's you. I really can't respect your ordersOuch.
And PESCO is the mod.Question. Why should we lower ourselves to his level if he's going to make a travesty of Mafia?
Any questions?
I already found scum if they exist. I'm just not pushing it unless no lynch is proven wrong.So again, you choose the outside theory of 'no lynch could win for us' ahead of 'there are scum out there like there are MEANT to be'?
Nah, it's you. I really can't respect your ordersAnd yet the self-proclaimed sub is refusing to follow orders. Guess you're not quite as good as you made yourself out to be.
Rou: Taking mafia too serious'd since...forever.I signed up to play a game of Mafia which pretty much no-one else seems interested in taking seriously. Hell, Nietz basically ADMITTED he's interested in no lynch because it requires less effort on his part. T_T
Seriously, why are you getting so pissed?
Question. Why should we lower ourselves to his level if he's going to make a travesty of Mafia?
So again, you choose the outside theory of 'no lynch could win for us' ahead of 'there are scum out there like there are MEANT to be'?
And yet the self-proclaimed sub is refusing to follow orders. Guess you're not quite as good as you made yourself out to be.
I signed up to play a game of Mafia which pretty much no-one else seems interested in taking seriously. Hell, Nietz basically ADMITTED he's interested in no lynch because it requires less effort on his part. T_T
I like winning. I think No lynching will lead to victory. Therefore, I am following that course of action.I also like winning. I think No Lynching is a blatant waste of time. Therefore, I am following the relevant course of action.
My answer once again is that "It's Pesco"You can't use that as a magical explanation for anything. You may as well argue we need to lynch Kilga or TSO or someone else outside of the game by that logic.
The expanded answer is indeed in one of my earlier posts. Ever tried reading it?Your argument revolves around 'some people on MS talked about this' and ignores the fact that when said topic rose it was shot down rapidly. Your only attempt at truly clarifying your actions is 'it's Pesco'. T_T
Oh, just orders from you. There are a couple people I refuse orders from. Usually these are wastes of human flesh that I usually wouldn't even bother interacting with normally ^-^.Aw, how touching. I'd have thought that with a profession like yours you'd be able to come up with some more creative insults~
Congratulations, you're the only one not taking it easy.Yay, I'm the only one who gives a shit.
I signed up to play a game of Mafia which pretty much no-one else seems interested in taking seriously. Hell, Nietz basically ADMITTED he's interested in no lynch because it requires less effort on his part. T_TUh... Rou? If you paid any attention to my posts you should've noticed that I'm very AGAINST No Lynch, and have a beef mainly with people who are arguing for it.
Uh... Rou? If you paid any attention to my posts you should've noticed that I'm very AGAINST No Lynch, and have a beef mainly with people who are arguing for it.Considering that Pesco stated there was only a SLIGHT degree of bastard modding, that means there likely IS a valid solution to the problem, i.e. we can win by LYNCHING SCUM.
What I meant to say back there is that there's no reason to get worked up because of a game in which you're supposed to to enjoy the silliness.
Oh man, Rule 5 is being borked.UK threw the first punch with 'you sound retarded'. I'm just repaying in kind~
I also like winning. I think No Lynching is a blatant waste of time. Therefore, I am following the relevant course of action.
You can't use that as a magical explanation for anything. You may as well argue we need to lynch Kilga or TSO or someone else outside of the game by that logic.
Your argument revolves around 'some people on MS talked about this' and ignores the fact that when said topic rose it was shot down rapidly. Your only attempt at truly clarifying your actions is 'it's Pesco'. T_T
Aw, how touching. I'd have thought that with a profession like yours you'd be able to come up with some more creative insults~
UK: Why not just say who you think could be scum? It's not like it'll make you not want a no lynch or anything, and you'd be giving your opinion on other players.
Considering that Pesco stated there was only a SLIGHT degree of bastard modding, that means there likely IS a valid solution to the problem, i.e. we can win by LYNCHING SCUM.
UK threw the first punch with 'you sound retarded'. I'm just repaying in kind~
What's gonna happen? I get modkilled? Because if I do that's a weight of MY shoulders, I'll tell you. This game is infuriating because everyone is just sitting back and going for the easy No Lynch option rather than doing what you're MEANT to do in Mafia and scumhunting. If No Lynch is the solution to this 'game' then I demand a refund, because a game with a solution like that is DEFINITELY not Mafia,
Oh hey, what's that fallacy? Reducto ad absurdium? I've provided reasons for why I think no lynch is a good choice. Far as I know you've never answered them. Your use of fallacy doesn't make me feel any better.Reducto ad absurdium is proof by contradiction. By that logic the only way you could 'prove' No Lynch was viable is by lynching every possible candidate and seeing that every result failed.
Actually, you forgot the argument that the goal is to TAKE IT EASY[/u][/b], which is actually more relevant. The MS discussions just support said idea, even if it was called bad design.Honestly, this is your interpretation and yours alone. And the role PM specifies that we win 'when all threats are removed', hence THERE'S A THREAT.
I'm the one that gets insulted. Further, I try not to waste the good ones ^-^;.Well sorry for making you waste your breath. Maybe we should just kill you quickly so you can shut up~
Roukanken, who apparently wants it both ways. He wants me lynched but he doesn't want to vote me? Huh? I know he finally did, but it was AFTER he was called out on it.So being angry at you means I immediately have to STOP being angry at K4U for all of her useless BAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWing yesterday? It was your constant misrep of my case that convinced me to switch
Eh, I'd consider an all vanilla game with the goal of no lynch only slightly bastardlyThe goal for town is to eliminate the mafia. If we're being mislead with OUR MOST BASIC GOAL, that comes across to me as very very bastardly.
To be fair, saying you sound retarded and you are retarded are two completely different things. We've been bouncing into an escalation ^-^;Calling me 'hon' didn't exactly help you either, sweetie. When I start using these demeaning nicknames for you, doesn't that make the itty bitty kitty angry? Doesn't it, sugar?
A refund of what?Several hours of my life, and various medications to reduce blood pressure.
Reducto ad absurdium is proof by contradiction. By that logic the only way you could 'prove' No Lynch was viable is by lynching every possible candidate and seeing that every result failed.
Honestly, this is your interpretation and yours alone. And the role PM specifies that we win 'when all threats are removed', hence THERE'S A THREAT.
So being angry at you means I immediately have to STOP being angry at K4U for all of her useless BAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWing yesterday? It was your constant misrep of my case that convinced me to switch
The goal for town is to eliminate the mafia. If we're being mislead with OUR MOST BASIC GOAL, that comes across to me as very very bastardly.
Calling me 'hon' didn't exactly help you either, sweetie. When I start using these demeaning nicknames for you, doesn't that make the itty bitty kitty angry? Doesn't it, sugar?
Several hours of my life, and various medications to reduce blood pressure.
EBWOP: Okay, this is actually getting to the point where I'm convinced more or less EVERYONE is in on this except me. Except Nietz, maybe, but he could be just trying to fool me into trusting him by acting friendly. If we're talking things that we can't put past Pesco, running an entire game for the sole purpose of pissing me off probably isn't beyond him, is it?
So, you guys do realize that your argument is going no where right? Actually, let me say that in a direct way.
Seacat and Blade that can't actually cut much, you two aren't going to convince each other and other people that you're right by throwing insults.
##Unvote Still don't like Kanako's lack of voting, or offering anything important but
##Vote All Threats
Can't miss with Auto Target. I actually wonder if this is a stupid enough way to bend Pesco's "YOU CAN VOTE ANYTHING" into lolwin.
UK: I'm trying to strike a balance between "SRS BRS" and "Easy! >=3". This is basically a game where getting angry will do nothing but entertain the mod, but doing nothing will obviously go no where.
What if the threat is ourselves?Isn't that the basic definition of scum?
No. What it means is you need to take a firm stance on me and back it up. You were supporting my lynch for quite awhile before you shifted to me.What's the harm in not instantly shifting to the case? If I'd waited until a good few people had moved onto you before voting that would be suspicious, true, but that isn't the case because everyone's busy FUCKING NO LYNCHING.
And what misrep? The bullshit you've been spewing all game?'We can't trust what you say after you die because we won't know your affiliation' is what I said. You went into a useless tangent about the Serp flip.
I guess I define bastardly differently.Good for you. Do you think the sky is green as well?
Oh no, I revel in it. You forget, I like being demeaned ^-^. It makes me feel cute :).Goddammit. Of all the people I had to pick a fight with. >_>
Can I find Pesco's address for you?Much appreciated, thanks.
Hmm...I want to say it is but...um...Precisely. If you want to play the whole 'It's Pesco, he can do anything' angle, we can validate ANYTHING up to and including 'everyone is conspiring against me and me alone'. Hence it's safer just to play logically at this point.
Isn't that the basic definition of scum?
And if you mean that we have to stop fighting, then that wouldn't be Mafia. Remind me again what the name of the topic is, please.
What's the harm in not instantly shifting to the case? If I'd waited until a good few people had moved onto you before voting that would be suspicious, true, but that isn't the case because everyone's busy FUCKING NO LYNCHING.
'We can't trust what you say after you die because we won't know your affiliation' is what I said. You went into a useless tangent about the Serp flip.
Good for you. Do you think the sky is green as well?
Goddammit. Of all the people I had to pick a fight with. >_>
Precisely. If you want to play the whole 'It's Pesco, he can do anything' angle, we can validate ANYTHING up to and including 'everyone is conspiring against me and me alone'. Hence it's safer just to play logically at this point.
Now if you don't mind me, I'm off to get my head and hand inflated so I can perform a large enough facepalm in response to Sodium's idea. Seriously, this is like saying Vote: Mafia and expecting to win. Why is everyone so convinced that there's some secret way to win when the LAST time we took a hint to think outside the box we threw ourselves into a no-reveal?
It's pesco, etc.FOR THE LOVE OF GOD WHY DO I EVEN TRY
There's no harm in not instantly shifting. But your vote should reflect your words. And it wasn't.Where did I say that I didn't suspect K4U, exactly?
Which I didn't realize was useless at that point. It was ENTIRELY relevant and directly addressing what you said. In other words, not a misrep. Wherever you got that idea, I'll never know.THE ENTIRE POINT I WAS MAKING THERE WAS IN RESPONSE TO YOUR 'READING MY OWN BANDWAGON' IDEA. HOW IS SERP'S DEATH RELATED TO THAT IN THE SLIGHTEST
Oh, well, I can reject your theory since I didn't get a memo that I should be tormenting Roukanken.And likewise, I CAN'T reject that theory because I have no reason to believe you're telling the truth. See? Should I sit around and mope about all these possible theories, or should I PLAY THE DAMN GAME?
Well, you were the one that proposed that hint so...The alternative was 'everyone is Town and we have to No Lynch'. Why do you think I've been trying to avoid that? Because it's retarded and the sheer idea makes me want to throttle Pesco across the internet.
Where did I say that I didn't suspect K4U, exactly
THE ENTIRE POINT I WAS MAKING THERE WAS IN RESPONSE TO YOUR 'READING MY OWN BANDWAGON' IDEA. HOW IS SERP'S DEATH RELATED TO THAT IN THE SLIGHTEST
I WOULD BEAT YOU OVER THE HEAD UNTIL YOU UNDERSTOOD BUT I HAVE A FUNNY FEELING YOU'D ENJOY THAT
And likewise, I CAN'T reject that theory because I have no reason to believe you're telling the truth. See? Should I sit around and mope about all these possible theories, or should I PLAY THE DAMN GAME?
The alternative was 'everyone is Town and we have to No Lynch'. Why do you think I've been trying to avoid that? Because it's retarded and the sheer idea makes me want to throttle Pesco across the internet.
@Mod: What happens when there isn't a majority, and there are two options tied?
Misrep. You suspected me more than her for a while.Where exactly is this coming from? Do I have to outright say 'I suspect K4U more than UK' before you believe it?
The point you were making was one I thought was invalid because I thought Serpentarius flipped town. I didn't realize it was no reveal.Again, HOW IS THAT RELEVANT TO YOUR OWN FLIP?
As I said. Several times.
Dumbass
Well, we could try to get a consensus. But your theory is a little more farfetched than mineBut the point is that we should be ignoring BOTH of these theories and PLAYING THE GAME. I raised the 'everyone is against me' argument as an example to show how 'It's Pesco' is intrinsically a slippery slope argument because it can be used to explain anything.
Your anger management is not my problem.Disregarding LOGIC as anger = no.
Where exactly is this coming from? Do I have to outright say 'I suspect K4U more than UK' before you believe it?
Again, HOW IS THAT RELEVANT TO YOUR OWN FLIP?
I can't seriously believe that you would miss the fact we got flipped into a No-Reveal when IT WAS MENTIONED OUTRIGH IN TH PHASE CHANGE.
A hint: Majority lynch and deadline majority lynch are treated differently, i.e. they do not count as the same conditions.
A hint: Majority lynch and deadline majority lynch are treated differently, i.e. they do not count as the same conditions.You can't change the rules in mid-game, you will regret this!
I feel the need to repeat this: if there no scum, then who is doing the NKs? And don't say it's Pesco because we lynched him already. I really don't see any marginally possible setup in which a No Lynch victory would work like that. (And don't say "It's Pesco." again, because he did say the setup would be only mildly bastardly.
RNG NKs, Pesco is not a lynchable entity. In fact, do we even know Serp was an NK? He could have been vengeful'd by Pesco. I don't see any proof of NKs yet.
InferenceASS, U, ME.
But, as I said, it's relevant to my own flip because the idea I was proposing was that when I flip town, we'd know that there was potential for people on my wagon to be opportunists.And my point was YOU CAN'T FLIP TOWN. So your immediate jump of 'everyone early on my wagon is highly likely to be scum' was worthless because we could never be sure of your affiliation.
Also, calling something retarded != logic. You have to show why :P.We are playing a game of Mafia.
Oh hi, Pesco has a slight support for my theory. Could be mod screwery but I'd like to think it isn't.I sincerely hope it is, because if not I WILL be violently ill.
I'm not going to get a Zak lynch am I? I still don't see how UK, who has at least been consistant in her statements, is worse than Zak who has not.
I still think a no lynch and lynching someone that's not in the game (the game, all threats, a cardboard box etc.) is a bad idea and I think those that are jumping on it look bad. It doesn't help that all of them were on Pesco's wagon too.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in order to be vengeful'd wouldn't have Serp needed to have actually voted for Pesco? There also hasn't been a secret vote floating around today. I still think that secret vote was Pesco, and the end D1 flavor suggests that Pesco was indeed lynched.
Really, this no lynch thing just sounds like a huge conspiracy theory and I don't like it.
ASS, U, ME.
And my point was YOU CAN'T FLIP TOWN. So your immediate jump of 'everyone early on my wagon is highly likely to be scum' was worthless because we could never be sure of your affiliation.
We are playing a game of Mafia.
Mafia is a game where you have to lynch scum to win.
Therefore if we are playing a game where we do NOT have to lynch scum to win, we are not playing Mafia.
But it is already established that we are playing Mafia.
So a contradiction occurs, and therefore the theory that 'we do not need to lynch scum to win the game' is false.
Q.E.D.
I sincerely hope it is, because if not I WILL be violently ill.
Huh?I thought you would know the phrase 'To assume makes an ASS of U and ME'. Guess I just proved it. >_>
And I thought your point was wrong. WHICH IS WHY I WAS ARGUING ABOUT SERP.So I should believe that you were just too lazy to READ THE GODDAMN PHASE CHANGE?
Now, have you POSSIBLY been illuminated to how this works and no misrep was involved?
It's PescoI will find some way to punch you through the internet, I swear.
/me giggles
You really need to avoid connecting your physical health to mafia.This is hardly new ground for me. After Suwako flipped Town I ended up lying on the floor in the foetal position for about an hour. At a friend's house.
Mafia is a game where you have to lynch scum to win. (http://www.mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=...and_they_all_lived_happily_ever_after)...and before you accuse me of supporting No Lynch again, I'll point out again that I don't.
I thought you would know the phrase 'To assume makes an ASS of U and ME'. Guess I just proved it. >_>
So I should believe that you were just too lazy to READ THE GODDAMN PHASE CHANGE?
I will find some way to punch you through the internet, I swear.
This is hardly new ground for me. After Suwako flipped Town I ended up lying on the floor in the foetal position for about an hour. At a friend's house.
...and before you accuse me of supporting No Lynch again, I'll point out again that I don't.Happily Ever After is proof that humans aren't logical creatures. Plus those probabilities, from what I know, assume that lynch targets are chosen AT RANDOM EVERY TIME. Hence HEA is a pointless idea to raise.
I just wanted to crush your itty bitty faulty logic a bit.( ≖‿≖) ufufu that's indeed kind of fun...
Um...are you sure you should be playing?Why not? I'll be right one of these days, surely.
Happily Ever After is proof that humans aren't logical creatures. Plus those probabilities, from what I know, assume that lynch targets are chosen AT RANDOM EVERY TIME. Hence HEA is a pointless idea to raise.
The I find rather moronic is that everyone who isn't for No Lynch or 'all threats' and actually wants to 'play the goddamned game' is merely arguing endlessly about theories and not, well, actually playing the goddamned game, except to the extent that 'those who vote No Lynch are really bad'. Fine, Zak contradicted himself and whatever but that's more of a gotcha game than anything else; as Sodium said, there isn't any reason to be active in this game.Explain to me what the fuck I'm meant to do when nearly half the players suddenly decide 'I'm not going to contribute anything useful because no lynch requires less effort on my part'. I made a case against K4U, and then I started pressing UK before moving onto her. What else can I do if so few people are cooperating? Why are you making it sound like our like of information is the fault of the few people trying to get something USEFUL from the game? I can't make a case against 4 or 5 people at the same time when you're all doing the same useless shit, can I?
Besides, that case is deadlocked and has not moved anywhere for 3 pages, which is just as good as day one. In fact, the rest of the game shall just be as good as day one with no flips to work with.
Speaking of no effort, can we please modkill Drake?
Happily Ever After is proof that humans aren't logical creatures. Plus those probabilities, from what I know, assume that lynch targets are chosen AT RANDOM EVERY TIME. Hence HEA is a pointless idea to raise.Actually, Game Theory-wise, if people were completely logical, HEA would be chosen every time it's favorable to both sides (like even-numbered Lylo). The fact that people are at least somewhat irrational is why GT can't be applied to all circumstances.
7. Lurkers are your problem. Deal with it.According to Pesco's attitude, I guess it's too late to want out now. If you don't want to play you'll have to accept that you'll remain as a dead-weight to Town.
Well, I can't say anything game relatedHuh, why not?
Huh, why not?
Actually you can since you can vote and all thatWait WHAT? This game keeps getting weirder and weirder. ;_;
Ein (aka, the Gasp! Theory): The Not Lynch theory actually has a point to it, and the Day 1 NK was indeed Pesco's revenge kill or somesuch.
##Vote: RoukankenNo.
Main problem with him is the whole "I'm going to bitch about how terrible the setup is but I'm not going to do anything about it." That's all he's been doing really (well also pointless arguments with UK, but)
UK is town except if there is more than 1 scum in the game, in which we have no fucking clue.There's no sense to the whole no reveal flips thing if there's only one scum. And before anyone says "It's Pesco. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RsepQh342g)" again, for what I know, if he comes up with a new gimmick for a gem he would want to see it in effect.
Anyway. Current theory is that the scum have to send in their kill during the day, and they must have targeted UK. That or they weren't paying attention and just didn't send anything.Well, it's pretty obvious that scum would have to choose their targets during the day. But I really don't see why they would target UK since she was the player most likely to be lynched. And if she was the one supposed to deliver the kill, then it's only logical to suppose that action would pass on to the remaining scum.
Or, y'know, UK was scum and thus she was meant to give the kill, but died.
Seriously, I can't accept that I'm getting voted because I'M TRYING TO FUCKING DO SOMETHING.No, it's pretty clear that you are being voted for acting like a hysterical bitch. ｏ-_-)
And I lean Pesco giving mafia extra info on how to turn role reveal off.Care to elaborate on that?
Care to elaborate on that?
Hm, I never said that. They are just my top three suspects I guess if there were scum.
went for No Lynch without actually voting for it, as K4U said.
I said leaning on the three as scum, nothing about being sure that there's three scum, I think.
Also, I said this on Day 1, but I'm not sure anyone really paid attention... The win condition says "when all threats are removed" right? However, one thing to note... Anyone who can vote is a threat. Not just scum, ANYONE. Which makes it sound awfully like we win this game once all of us are dead. So what if the point of this game really IS to take it easy since we can't do anything? Or maybe the point is that even though we're supposed to be Yukkuri's, Pesco knows that the odds of everyone taking it easy are next to nothing and he's just enjoying watching Rou panic
Eh, it does seem like the most likely way that we can win if the goal isn't to just die. Though honestly, I somehow doubt the odds of No Lynch working at all if it isn't unanimous. Which I REALLY don't see happening. Anyway...
##Vote: No Lynch
I agree that Kanako actually needs to do something. I keep forgetting that he's actually playing. Anyway, I don't like his case on Rou. It looks like he's been trying to me.Sodium told me to vote someone, so I did. To be honest, I'm really really confused with this game. :V On one end we have UK and Affinity suggesting a no-lynch, and on the other end we have people saying that we shouldn't no lynch and voting the people who suggested that. I don't really see your problem with Zak, K4U. Perhaps I'm blind?
GM got lynched, no reveals.What.
I humoured your Bastard Mod madness for one day. What did it earn us? A No Reveal. Now you want to vote for No Lynch, and Pesco will probably claim No Lynch-tan died or something.
I'm willing to suggest just trying to lynch Pesco. The role PM says he's probably responsible for it all, therefore...You were the one who started this whole Bastard Mod business in the first place by whining about the fact that there would be a no reveal back when Pesco did promise us information upon lynch. You got your "wish". (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-fulfilling_prophecy) Be more careful next time.
NoLynch (2): Ghost vote, Affinity, SDrake Edible, Zak
I can also say that I don't quite understand how voting No Lynch and not voting are particularly different.
A hint: Majority lynch and deadline majority lynch are treated differently, i.e. they do not count as the same conditions.
Well, would you like to add your support to the ghost vote? It's not necessary and in fact basically does nothing, but you can vote no lynch anyway :P
Pesco's hint that I just quoted indicates that voting for No Lynch won't win the game for us. We have to unvote and let the deadline hit.
Pesco's hint that I just quoted indicates that voting for No Lynch won't win the game for us. We have to unvote and let the deadline hit.
My Theory is that we all have to take it easy and no lynch, since the only true threat to ourselves is our paranoia and stupidity :V
You're such a liar I'm going to buy into your theory.
##Vote: No Lynch
Rou, do you need a hug?
I've been keeping tabs on the game. I'm a supporter of the No Lynch theory. The only problem is our win condition states "when all threats are removed" AND "take it easy." If taking it easy is accomplished by No Lynch, then the threats may have been removed when we fed Pesco through the yukkuri bean paste factory.
The biggest threat to a yukkuri is its own stupidity. So, we're safest taking it easy.
Easiest game ever. <3 Man I'm awesome.
Why did you kill master though, Pesco :(...I dun care if it was random :(.
I will destroy you.
Rou, I'd like to request that you run your UFO game now. I think running a well-structured game and not banging your head against one would be theraputic.Honestly, I think I should avoid Mafia. For a long, long time. I get way too stressed and just screw up the game for everyone else.
When can I pick you up from Durban International?Whenever you least expect it.
Letting No Lynch get deadlined WOULD NOT fulfill the win condition of taking it easy. It had to be an active choice.
Rou, I'd like to request that you run your UFO game now. I think running a well-structured game and not banging your head against one would be theraputic.
Hahahah, so the distinction ran the other way. Well, I would've had egg on my face if we let the deadline hit and the game hadn't ended.
Whenever you least expect it.
I'm serious. Got my license a week ago. It's only polite to pick you up when you come visit me.If only I could actually afford a plane ticket to South Africa. T_T
No scum, all VTs. But even in a normal game of 10 players, there would be at least 3 scum.
7/3? Ick. Enjoy your Day 2 LYLO.
Meh. I still think it was kinda of a waste to have a No Reveal/No Death flips game without actually having to find scum. But it's all right, I can take that easy.