Author Topic: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (The Last Stand) (Contains Lots of Images)  (Read 39336 times)

Patorikku

  • Weird country-bumpkin city-boy hybrid
  • (ง ?̀_?́)ง
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #30 on: July 30, 2015, 05:53:57 AM »
Okay yeah, I'm gonna sleep too. Ima read through D2 interactions starting tomorrow, but for now, my read is back on Serela. I'm ultimately sheeping a lot of DNA's points, particularly on the N2 roleshen argument, but like I said I need sleep and also less heatwaves but I'm only getting one of those right now and that is the sleep.

Cut by 1

Oh look, I got an image in my signature. Finally.
Click here for Tumblr nonsense.

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #31 on: July 30, 2015, 06:01:16 AM »
Why Serela, could it be because you actually.... assumed Shadoweh is not a retard? So she will eventually turn against you as Dorian flipped town? Also, when Shadoweh shit on me for probing you Serela, she was explicitly saying 'seeing we can afford one mislynch', implying she either agree with me being town or ateast think the likelihood of me being scum is low, so contrary to your misrepping, Shadoweh is just antagonizing me or entertaining my lynch for pissing off people. Which is understandable behavior for her as she's also the one to immediately tell me to stop posting dank memes when I attacked Shalako. Therefore it would only be reasonable for scum!Serela to get Shadoweh out of the way when he's still defending you and can't screw up your intended kills with bodyguard.

Cut again
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ActionDan

  • Teaching old dogs new tricks
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #32 on: July 30, 2015, 06:21:57 AM »
If one believes that commuting is mutually exclusive to killing as it is in every game I've ever seen, Shadoweh dying points to there not being a no-kill 2 nights ago. 

Serelas case on me still translates to "he's too correct to be town".  Nor is it true that I  wasn't paying attention to the rest of the game as my first post in the old thread documents whilst a late post d2 gIves my stongue town reads.  And dorian has said in thread that I greeted him in the qt with a town read.

I'm also not sure on the role aspect of the game why my commute is more or less town looking than DNAs vote manipulation.

The only thing I have not yet done was look at Serelas d2 in depth.  I took a look at Conqs and DNAs and both seemed town.  I'm not about to clear Dna from that though because there is a possible narrative in which Dna is scum.
 

Don't lynch me.

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #33 on: July 30, 2015, 06:40:13 AM »
I don't think Dan is scum, we can already confirm Dan blocked my drone attack, so his commuter claim is likely true. In addition, since Shadoweh flipped, we can be sure scum shot shadoweh(or conq whom Shadoweh said she protected) during the day when there was no death. Therefore as Dan was commuting, he couldn't have also shot off Shadowehs bp vest.

Also Dan, if you think my narrative also applies as scum, I want you to case me under that assumption. Since I need your analysis in order to get a better read on you and determine whether you have a genuine thought process behind your views, otherwise you are just doing more Serela tier explanation.

To explain in detail, my role is town because in scum hands this role is basically a doublevoter, which would be overpowered because it is guranteed to hit town, and they already have a governor to block one lynch on the scumteam. Which means scum itself can constitute four votes and push town to SYMLO a day earlier with one less mislynch and requiring town to coordinate the same lynch twice in order to win. That's fucking ridiculous.

I bite, but I don't gnaw and I know when to let go.
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Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #34 on: July 30, 2015, 06:45:18 AM »
Actually, that reminds me, before I forget, DNA did you send your drones to anyone last night?


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #35 on: July 30, 2015, 07:05:08 AM »
Serela already asked that on page one and the mod answered that, I didnt. Reason being that as the mod refused to answer if last scum can use abilities with nightkill, I can't confirm my innocence even if I send drones. Also, since nobody ever confirmed my beloved status, todays as good as any to get it out of the way and prove I am not fakeclaiming.
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DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #36 on: July 30, 2015, 08:18:40 AM »
Serela, your behavior can basically be summed up by this article

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Active_Lurking
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DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #37 on: July 30, 2015, 10:08:07 AM »
Also, I forgot to mention that I will need to sub out in three more IRL days time, since I expected the game to end last phase. So I might not be available until this phase end and definitely will not be here provided we even have a day 6 (god forbid), so I am trying to make the most of my time here.

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Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
  • VIA PIZZA SLINGING
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #38 on: July 30, 2015, 01:21:53 PM »
It's kind of funny when DNA blames me for bias when he's saying things like my posting style was specifically adopted for the sake of being harder to read and that I'm manipulating everyone's impression of Serela town. >_> (Or in other words, I am a master puppeteer who has carefully calculated everything. This seems about as likely as Raikaria being convinced Shadoweh is using mind control beams on everyone.) Could you get any more biased than that? I've always posted like this. It's probably more notable now than it usually is because I'm being actively hounded, so I have a lot of things to respond to.

When you directly accuse me of Active Lurking, which is so disgustingly inaccurate that it's very insulting, I can see there is obviously no point in continuing the discussion. You already heavily implied earlier you are more or less convinced I am scum, as you starting referring to times you thought I may be town as "regretfully coming to the wrong conclusion about Serela", or something close to that. I have been responding to every point you bring up against me in a way I feel is quite good, but you only continue to prove your viewpoint of me is so warped and biased against me that it's entered conspiracy theory territory where in your eyes I have gone to every extent to tailor my play to be as misleadingly townish as possible.

At this point, rather, I'm waiting to see where Patorikku/Conq get with their rereads instead. It's very clear you are as likely to vote someone other than me as ActionDan is to vote himself and I have done everything I can to change your mind already, so time to pay attention to the rest of town :V
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #39 on: July 30, 2015, 01:30:38 PM »
Quote from: Serela
I assert your arguments as assertions, and refuse to response

That seems awfully familiar
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Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
  • VIA PIZZA SLINGING
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #40 on: July 30, 2015, 01:37:04 PM »
refuse to respond, sure, view it as that, whatever

the point is we've been going back and forth for quite awhile and you're basically a brick wall here, past that you're a brick wall whose accusations keep making less and less sense and aren't even very refutable in the first place anymore past going "...what????"

what kind of a response do you expect to accusing me of being biased and then biasedly accusing my entire posting style and responses to people's questions to be subtle manipulation of everyone's opinions?

that's a rhetorical question btw
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #41 on: July 30, 2015, 02:06:14 PM »
Which is why, as with all your other rhetoricals, are not answered with directly because they are not meant to. And then you accuse me of jumping to conclusions. Wow.

Reiterating here. I am not a brick wall. My scumread on you is a conclusion constructed off the arguments we had and roles and flips. In fact, last day phase I actually ended up rescinding my vote from you precisely because I processed the facts on the table and others opinion and your behavior, then came to the conclusion after also processing Dorians post that Dorian was a more likely scum target last phase.

Since I was admittedly basing my scumread on Dorian less on my own terms, but is instead more influenced by others, it was a very unsettling experience to just shut off my usual alarms and tolerate your obsessive and overly eager push on Dorian. In fact, I had a generally positive opinion on Dorian, coupled with my suspicion at the scum safeclaim argument upon rereading the game, as I have posted yesterday. I am ashamed to admit therefore the fundamentals my read on Dorian, and subsequently my decision to instead leave Serela for next lynch are largely influenced by the consensus Serela being unpredictable (read: crazy) is just part of his meta.

Which is why I am so irked. You are a player well versed in the meta, you have shown that you are capable of playing well. Regardless of alignment, you have an obligation to play like a decent human being with sportsmanship, and yet you revel and take advantage of others' benevolence by faking incompetence and using spam tatics. My bias and anger are therefore exclusively on your decision to adopt such a low down playstyle. And has nothing to do with the conclusion drawn which is based off facts.

Also, if there's anything to take away from my arguments, its that they all articulate themselves fucking crystal clear. I thought we could at least agree on that.

##Vote Serela
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Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
  • VIA PIZZA SLINGING
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #42 on: July 30, 2015, 02:07:59 PM »
(I couldn't let this one go without a response because it's based on something more tangible, but at the same time I still don't really want you to respond because I want the argument to be over already D;)
Quote
you feel like my case on sky p sucks, oh, sky p is the obvious wagon now? 'Hey guys, I feel that DNAs case is starting to hold more water!' *bus sky p*
This is a pretty biased oversimplification of events; when you first made the case you were accusing SkyPal's content of being nitpicky and bad, but SkyPal had only managed to read up through like day one (and maybe a lil' d2) of the game at that point. In fact, soon after that you even awknowledged that SkyPal was too busy to post and give him some space for a little while. Later though, SkyPal finished catching up and to my surprise didn't really improve his opinions much or give other things one would expect from reading the second half of the game, so then your case became more valid. This thought process was explained in my posts at the time.

cut
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #43 on: July 30, 2015, 02:10:03 PM »
Also, since I didn't address this, me, and by extension pretty much everybody, went back and forth alot yesterday because there was a limited number of lynch targets which is further diminished now. I am just more OCD about placing my vote to mark my stance.



Cut by 1
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Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
  • VIA PIZZA SLINGING
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #44 on: July 30, 2015, 02:10:22 PM »
Quote
yet you revel and take advantage of others' benevolence by faking incompetence and using spam tatics. My bias and anger are therefore exclusively on your decision to adopt such a low down playstyle.
See, this is why I said there wasn't a point in continuing the discussion; you are convinced that I am masterfully designing everything about my play this game as a scum tactic to mislead everyone.

There's really no way to refute something like that!
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
  • VIA PIZZA SLINGING
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #45 on: July 30, 2015, 02:25:58 PM »
in other news, I mean, the way dan acts and the fact that, yes, commuting normally comes across as mutually exclusive from killing (Note:He could possibly just be completely untargettable all the time, it's not a town clear) would normally make me want to humor the thought of dan!town

but that means I'd have to more seriously consider conq scum which is very difficult for me, still would sooner believe it's dan

or DNA scum that assumed we would never test his beloved I guess? I'm not going to lie though, after all this it'd just be so satisfying to lynch him >.> However on second thought I think his rabid anti-Serela sentiment feels very not from scum, so yeah no, DNA is still definitely town.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #46 on: July 30, 2015, 02:26:51 PM »
There was nothing being simplified other than you and I having different interpretations on how 'complete' sky p's reread is, and even so, it is hardly relevant at this stage of game.

Far as memory recall, Sky p posted during N2 his general comments on skimming the game at that point, my inference was that he already had a gist of the happenings of the past days. So I consider his further response which backtracked on many his initial points scummy. And since we do know Sky P is flipped scum, your initial defense and subsequent rapid push when he's likely the next wagon comes off as anything but an opportunistic attempt to garner towncred. If sky p is busy, he won't suddenly become less so and gain coherency upon reread. Its a weak excuse to pass that off as a scumread.

Cut by2
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Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
  • VIA PIZZA SLINGING
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #47 on: July 30, 2015, 02:39:24 PM »
Reread Conq up to the end of N2 (Shalako's death), there's a quite notable amount of bard/shalako interaction there D1/D2 (amusedly in rvs/ed1 he's even responding to them back to back) but it doesn't seem fake to me, the only suspicious thing I could possibly say is about how much there is but that's a very unreliable metric and isn't really worth much, especially towards D2 it really doesn't look particularly fake to me so at best (worst? depending on your PoV) there it'd be null.

Quote from: Conqueror
Serela has posts that make me think he's town and posts that make me want to strangle him.
:3

And then Conq's rereading of Sky where he becomes increasingly convinced of Sky's scumminess doesn't look faked. It's possible for it to be scum just cashing in on the bus cred since Sky was clearly doomed to die then or very soon, but at it's scummiest again this would still only be null.

Yeah, there's no reason for me to want to lynch Conq unless Dan flipped town, at which point it'd already be at "uuurghhhhh so one of the super town people is actually scum".
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #48 on: July 30, 2015, 02:49:25 PM »
I appreciate you brought up that bit, Serela! Dan could actually be an ascetic scum. Which is something I didn't bring up...yet. Basically, commuter is a much better and townier fakeclaim than ascetic. Plus, his vague claiming on 1 or 2 shots is also ambiguous and seems to be a ploy to provide an explanation if my drone attack targets him again and it fails. Plus, ascetic fits in much more snugly as scum and is a reasonable gambit seeing he's the last man standing.

I was initially planning to push you as hard as possible and determine my vote based on the quality and quantity of your push and whether Dan decides to keep coasting, so Dan should remain a very plausible scum option!
>Link to my Steam Account: Add me! http://steamcommunity.com/id/9898981-02
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Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
  • VIA PIZZA SLINGING
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #49 on: July 30, 2015, 02:52:03 PM »
I was initially planning to push you as hard as possible and determine my vote based on the quality and quantity of your push and whether Dan decides to keep coasting, so Dan should remain a very plausible scum option!
....

HHNGNGNGGGHNNNAAGGHGHHHHHHHHHHHH DNA PLZ I'M CHOKING ON MY WATER HERE WHY ;_______;
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Serela

  • Moon Tiara Magic
  • VIA PIZZA SLINGING
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #50 on: July 30, 2015, 02:54:25 PM »
And then the punchline was that DNA really was, to some degree, trolling the shit out of me (even if he does still legitimately believe I'm probably the scum)
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

ActionDan

  • Teaching old dogs new tricks
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #51 on: July 30, 2015, 03:10:12 PM »
Ascetic scum is not going to exist in a game with a full roleblocker and a governor not to mention that it counters everysingle town role single handedly, and in some circumstances would provide a false clear if targeted by dorian's jail or Serelas ability (which incidently wold be neutered completely in any case, since ascetic scum always preforms the kill.)

If I'm not posting it's probably because I was sleeping in the time the last page got filled up with way too many words

Don't lynch me.

ActionDan

  • Teaching old dogs new tricks
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #52 on: July 30, 2015, 03:14:07 PM »
Also Dan, if you think my narrative also applies as scum, I want you to case me under that assumption. Since I need your analysis in order to get a better read on you and determine whether you have a genuine thought process behind your views, otherwise you are just doing more Serela tier explanation.

I'll get to it after I look at serela

Don't lynch me.

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #53 on: July 30, 2015, 03:14:23 PM »
Serela, everything I launched about your play still stands, I have even higher expectations of you now that I had to bring this up earlier than I intended. My opinion about you just improved, slightly.

But I am just initially confused, and then suspicious why would Dan claim 1 or 2 shot commuter. From a town perspective, if he does need to withhold his claim the motivation is because he wants the imaginary scum to hit him, so it is with the intention of blocking the kill. And off that angle, claiming 2 shot is merely deterring a scum hit and making others a more appealing kill target, while ending up with the bonus effect of dealing with my ability and having a strong town claim.

Besides, he literally has nothing to lose. And strategic coasting and lurking are indeed both integral parts of Dans scumstrat. I don't think Dan is 'too correct', he just speaks too little, and often inconclusively and revealing little of his analysis, he is more 'politically correct' if anything.

It was something I already considered yesterday and planning to disclose on my next wall. But since DorIan cut the day short and I reckon my towness still has some pull, I can manage to pressure you, serela, and squeeze more info.

Cut by 2
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DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #54 on: July 30, 2015, 03:21:55 PM »
Dan, ascetic could have a cause that specifies being not immune to kills. Nnr previous hosted game has Dormio rolling the same role, abeit as town, so it is within reason.
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ActionDan

  • Teaching old dogs new tricks
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #55 on: July 30, 2015, 03:26:14 PM »
Ascetic is not immune to targeted killing actions.  To everything else, it is

Don't lynch me.

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #56 on: July 30, 2015, 03:27:44 PM »
Also, Dan, I figure you will at least be somewhat well versed in reading the mafiascum wiki, and should know ascetic can have extra clauses added on it to limit its power.

Also even without modifers, I would actually call ascetic not quite overpowered. Let's not forget this game does start off with a universal backup, so it means town has potentially two shots of kills(1 certain, 1less so, assuming serela is town), two sources of investigation and 2 sources of protection. One roleblocker is actually not quite enough in terms of balance to ward off all those abilities, and an ascetic does fit much better to serve as someone who can be a reliable killer.
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DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #57 on: July 30, 2015, 03:29:46 PM »
Serelas ability (which incidently wold be neutered completely in any case, since ascetic scum always preforms the kill.)
I was referring to this, since serela is claiming to have a vigkill that only works if he targets his killer, I believe it does count as a killing ability and thus will go through ascetic.
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DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #58 on: July 30, 2015, 03:32:49 PM »
Surprised at how rapid you are posting now. Dan. We mentioned you alot of times when discussing your activity at many different times, especially serela, who really wanted your lynch. It was definitely over the span of not just a few hours of sleep , and you never responded as eagerly and consistently since the initial day which you subbed in.
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ActionDan

  • Teaching old dogs new tricks
Re: FTL: Faster Than Light Mafia Pt. 2 (Sector 5, Combat Cycle)
« Reply #59 on: July 30, 2015, 03:38:18 PM »
I was referring to this, since serela is claiming to have a vigkill that only works if he targets his killer, I believe it does count as a killing ability and thus will go through ascetic.

It wouldn't.  Not from the MS wikis definition anyway.  Show me Dormios role from that game.

As for the balance of it, I'll defer to conq to tell you how ridiculously op it is.

Unsure why you're surprised that I can twitter post

Don't lynch me.