Touhou 12 - 東方星蓮船 ~ Undefined Fantastic Object. An undefined article.

[RainfallYoshi]

I also agree that Nue is overrated, but it doesn't stop her from being awesome. :3 I also felt that some of her attacks were Flandre-ish, but I may be looking too hard into it.

As far as underrated characters go, Ichirin is rather underrated too. Sure, people were all "UNZAN BRO FIST YAH" for awhile, but she kinda got ignored once the full game came out.

It's rather sad because she has an amazing theme and a fun boss battle. I also like her design, she's so different from the usual Touhou character.

[Drake]

Ichirin is a nun.

Unzan is a giant red angry cloud face with fists of rage.

Choice is obvious?

[?q]

Tip:  The more you say "Flandre", the more overrated Nue becomes, because Flandre is the current #1 for overratedness, closely followed by Shinki.

Now that I'm done venting (nothing personal)...

I disagree with Azinth about the extra stage being fail; I actually like it best because it's not what most Extra stages are:
*Sudden barrage
*Wait
*Another sudden barrage
*Wait
*Attack that kills newbs but is actually trivializable
*Wait
*Another attack that kills newbs but is actually trivializable
*Wait
*An attack that would be difficult but you can kill the enemies that shoot the bullets immediately
*Wait
*Another attack that would be (etc.)

Yes, it's much harder than any of the other Extra stages.  Yes, Kogasa is probably the cheapest of the Extra sub-bosses.  That doesn't make it a steaming pile.  Plus I don't remember ZUN using these patterns before, so I'm not sure how it's lazy or uninspired.  Also, the stage theme needs more love.

Ichirin would probably be liked more if she didn't slow the game down to 30FPS for a lot of people - not that that's slowing down Murasa's fanbase.  Plus a lot of people (like me) find her theme uninspired.  Last and adding to what Drake said, she's kind of a lackey who doesn't do much without Unzan.

[RainfallYoshi]

Doesn't the fact that she completely controls Unzan mean anything? Unzan would be nothing without Ichirin to control it. Soo... wouldn't Unzan be the lackie? :3

[?q]

They're kind of both the gate guardians for the flying palanquin, and not really special in the scheme of things...

...great.  Now I'm starting to draw EoSD comparisons.  >_>

[RainfallYoshi]

Bwahaha.

Anyways, I agree with you about UFO Extra. It's probably one of my favorites in that it's really fun to play through. Sure, you can try to memorize general things, but it's still somewhat different everytime.

Kogasa's Wheel of Fortune Laser Death is an eye-rape though.

[Slaves]

i think everyone's being too harsh. saying things like "Extra stage is SHIT","Byakuren is SHIT"(on difficulty basis, not fun factor) and whatnot are really just plain stupid. i bet nobody liked SA in the beginning, either.

the game hasn't even been out for a week for God's sake. of course everything is going to be hard. Touhou focuses on memorization of patterns, and you're not going to memorize everything in 3 days.

i'm also really fed up with the majority of the PC98 fanatics hating the game because none of their favorites came back, and they're seeing nothing past that.

[Dizzy H. "Muffin" Muffin]

I think part of the issue with the PC-98 fanatics is that rather than getting the return of any PC-98 characters, they got something like the return of a few PC-98 references -- they're in Makai, Shinki's "spell card," etc. This is just close enough to "bringing Shinki or Mima back" that it gets their attention, but still light-years away from actually doing so to the point that it also gets their RAGE.

[RainfallYoshi]

I like it much better that ZUN is giving us a nod PC-98 is still canon without inserting characters in.

As much as I said I would love a Chiyuri comeback, I honestly think it's better that it didn't happen. I'm loving the UFO cast way too much to think that older characters could have replaced them.

[Kojiremi]

I'm sure there will be patches for both UNL and UFO that will fix/enhance things as time goes on too. IaMP and SWR had a whole lot of patches after they were released. UFO will probably get some as well. It seems the shooters don't get too many patches compared to the previous 2 fighters but i'm sure somethin will come...

I like UFO overall as i find it fun and exciting. New systems and ways to do things.   Even if some of the patterns are based off old characters or theme songs based off old characters its still good and its nice to have a little "trip down memory lane" I dun mind the throwbacks at older stuff at all. Kinda makes me want to play LLS, MS and EoSD all over again-actually thinking about it i only beat Alice once in MS. Think i'll go do a second hehe.

I like it much better that ZUN is giving us a nod PC-98 is still canon without inserting characters in.

As much as I said I would love a Chiyuri comeback, I honestly think it's better that it didn't happen. I'm loving the UFO cast way too much to think that older characters could have replaced them.

I didn't think of it like that haha nice. Yeah doing this is kinda affirming PC-98 is still canon material for the series.

I wouldnt' mind if some old chars came back. I mean imagine if outta no where Shinki the EX-boss? (upgraded from final to EX lol) I mean Gengetu and Mugetu had nothing to do with the story and they were EX bosses. woulda been funny if ZUN did that again. Simply because you was in makai you met Shinki again.

I love the new chars to though. Gotta welcome them nicely and warmly ^_^

[?q]

I'm sure there will be patches for... UFO

...

i bet nobody liked SA in the beginning, either.

Actually, this is the best response overall that I've seen to a new game.
Normally the hate starts just before the demo is released, drops after about a month, builds back up about two days before release day, and stays around until people start to realize that they don't hate the game so it's okay to stop acting like they do.

[Helepolis]

Read ZUNs afterward on Wiki about Touhou 12. It gives quite interesting information.

While the Extra theme fanboys love it. I don't love it. But neither I call it bad and "LOL THIS SUCKS". It is just not giving any charming effect. Same goes for Stage 4 bgm, also not charming.

Personal feelings about music:
Stage 1 - Awesome opener, pumps you up for the game. Very energetic and "flying"
Nazrin - Fits. Have no complaints. You can literally hear the mouse play.

Stage 2 - Again good follow up stage song. You feel like going even higher into the sky chasing that ship.
Kogasa - Fits. The poor umbrella's song is brought to life. At the raincard spell it fits even more as the music synchs great.

Stage 3 - I feel like being close to that ship in the sky. Yet you can't reach it yet.
Ichirin - Opening is really poor but it becomes better through out the song. Not charmed.

Stage 4 - Unexpected change of tune and style. Fits the "wtf is this ship no treasure" theme. Groovy and dark.
Murasa - The best opener in the entire game for my feeling. It really pumps you up for the battle. Just like Kogasa's theme.

Stage 5 - You know you are somewhere weird and it feels grand. Nazrin appearing here also fits the theme again.
Shou - Unexpected boss song, sounds sinister but I am really not charmed. The song and her appearance make me thing of ancient Aztec.

Stage 6 - Heart fills up the void. It is quite dramatic as if you can hear the heart of Byakuren beating. Though it is not pumping you up for battle, it does gives that dramatic feeling. Especially when suddenly seeing Byakuren's beauty (she is drawn within a gloomy/dreamy haze imo).
Byakuren - Cosmic Mind for sure. It fits the character, her desires and motives. It fits as a final boss to me. It caused me goosebumps which I only had with Kanako's theme and Remilia's theme in Touhou.

Extra stage - It feels very unspired but somewhat fitting. I can't really judge this song. It just is not complete.
Nue - I guess it fits her weird unpredictable form and appearance. But aside from that it is not a charming song. I don't care if it reminds people of U.N Owen. If you discard that, what is left over is uninspired.

To sum it up:
Stage 1, 2, 3, 5 and Nazrin, Kogasa, Murasa, Byakuren are the ones that on first hearing caught my attention. Doesn't mean I hate the other songs.

[Nine West]

Doesn't the fact that she completely controls Unzan mean anything? Unzan would be nothing without Ichirin to control it. Soo... wouldn't Unzan be the lackie? :3

I'd like to think that Ichirin and Unzan are somewhat of a Trainer and Pokemon. The former gets the responsibility to take command over her companion, while the latter gets the honor to do flashy techniques. Ichirin does have some Danmaku of her own, so she's not just standing on the sidelines. Coordination is their key to victory.

Spoiler:

But Unzan is STILL the more memorable due to the above reason.

I think part of the issue with the PC-98 fanatics is that rather than getting the return of any PC-98 characters, they got something like the return of a few PC-98 references -- they're in Makai, Shinki's "spell card," etc. This is just close enough to "bringing Shinki or Mima back" that it gets their attention, but still light-years away from actually doing so to the point that it also gets their RAGE.

Exactly. ZUN really set up the stage for a perfect PC-98 comeback, except... new characters. Oh, Shit. He even teased PC-98 fanatics by giving Byakuren Shinki's Danmaku pattern; something like that is not tolerable for people who want Shinki to come back. Although, another way to see it is that ZUN has never wanted a PC-98 characters' comeback but instead, he designed UFO with PC-98 nostalgia in mind, which is a perfect way to see what he has done with UFO, as seen in Stage 6.

In all reality, ZUN really doesn't have any reason to revive PC-98 characters. But we'll see what happens in the future...

[Alfred F. Jones]

the game hasn't even been out for a week for God's sake. of course everything is going to be hard. Touhou focuses on memorization of patterns, and you're not going to memorize everything in 3 days.

This. I'm going to save it and repost it every time a new game comes out.

Also, PC-98 fans that are raging confuse me. I mean, UFO stage 5 and 6 are in Makai. Stage 5 is in a provincial city in the outskirts of Makai, and stage 6 is Hokkai, a distant corner of it. The backgrounds and some of the enemies are throwbacks to MS, as well as the Shinki card. The buildings are an obvious reference to Shinki's final background, if nothing else. Anyone who wants PC-98 to return is missing something big: IT JUST DID.*

Should also be noted that Shinkicard isn't quite an exact copy of her attack, it's a bit more complex than the original version and adds another wave of bullets at the end. Though it does give you more room than Shinki's version.

_{*Besides. Bringing Mima and Shinki back would ruin them. They would need last names. And they wouldn't be Mima and Shinki with last names. :V}

[Cadmas]

I believe the only hope any PC-98s have is to come back in another Phantasmagoria or some other type of spin off shooter. I also believe only PC-98 to ever make it back into a game is Alice. (Reimu & Marisa don't count and Yuka was in a Phantasmagoria).  ZUN doesn't seem to like to bring old bosses into new games.

If I'd have to say which PC-98 I'd like to see come back the most it would be Elly.

Besides. Bringing Mima and Shinki back would ruin them.

Meh Yuka seemed to fair well and Alice seems to be all the more better.

[E-Nazrin]

WHY HAS NO ONE POINTED OUT THE SPACE INVADER FAIRIES OF STAGE 6 YET

[Suikama]

WHY HAS NO ONE POINTED OUT THE SPACE INVADER FAIRIES OF STAGE 6 YET

Well uh it's mentioned on the wiki...

[Nine West]

WHY HAS NO ONE POINTED OUT THE SPACE INVADER FAIRIES OF STAGE 6 YET

I'm pretty sure I already said EVERYTHING FROM STAGE 6 IS A REFERENCE

HELL THE DAMN FAIRIES MAKE A SPACE INVADERS LINE

[Kojiremi]

I dun think any noticed this yet but. I was playing Normal and managed to get to stage 6 for the first time finally (with only 1.8 lives and 0 bombs and game overed on the shinki attack...man so close haha) and I noticed this


Byakuren's opening attack


looks a lot like Remilia's opening attack


Byaku's was easier though but still haha. they look similar and are opening attacks. pretty sweet.

[homing curvy laser]

Byakuren's opener reminds me more of one of Flandre's spell cards than Remi's opener.
By the way, does anyone have a full Lunatic run replay?

As for PC-98 fans (like me, I guess), don't worry - if they're ever going to come back, they're probably going to do so on another Phantasmagoria-like game, like Yuka did. Well, Alice did come  back too and it was on a normal game, butbtub

[Letty Whiterock]

*Besides. Bringing Mima and Shinki back would ruin them. They would need last names. And they wouldn't be Mima and Shinki with last names. :V

Yeah, like Nazrin and Chen.

[Kojiremi]

*Besides. Bringing Mima and Shinki back would ruin them. They would need last names. And they wouldn't be Mima and Shinki with last names. :V

Yeah, like Nazrin and Chen.

isn't Chen technically Chen Yakumo though?
But what about Cirno? she too has no last name and like Shinki and Mima, is pretty popular. Too bad for Orange, Rumia, Daiyousei etc though haha. I particularly like Rumia thought but ah well.

[Nine West]

I dun think any noticed this yet but. I was playing Normal and managed to get to stage 6 for the first time finally (with only 1.8 lives and 0 bombs and game overed on the shinki attack...man so close haha) and I noticed this

Byakuren's opening attack

looks a lot like Remilia's opening attack

Spoiler:

STAGE 6 IS TRIPPY AS HELL
MUSIC IS LIKE A HEARTBEAT
REMILIA STYLE OPENER

Yeah, Drake pretty much covered everything in the old UFO hype thread.

*Besides. Bringing Mima and Shinki back would ruin them. They would need last names. And they wouldn't be Mima and Shinki with last names. :V

I fail to see why those two need last names, and as Letty pointed out, some Windows characters don't have last names.

[Letty Whiterock]

isn't Chen technically Chen Yakumo though?

Chen is a shikigami of a shikigami. Technically part of the family, but not quite a Yakumo.

[Kojiremi]

Yeah, Drake pretty much covered everything in the old UFO hype thread.

Awww someone beat me to it then. i didn't even think about the old UFO thread at all haha. dang. well at least i tried to show it eh? haha.

Chen is a shikigami of a shikigami. Technically part of the family, but not quite a Yakumo.

but but but how can one be a part of the family without having the family name?  lol sounds like a friend of the family. ah well no matter. I still think of her as Chen Yakumo. Alright then.

[?q]

Byakuren's opener reminds me more of one of Flandre's spell cards than Remi's opener.

I'm assuming you mean Catadioptric.
Neither it nor Remilia's opener are good resemblances tbqh.

Also, there's not a huge resemblance to Remilia's opener, either...

By the way, does anyone have a full Lunatic run replay?

When someone 1ccs Lunatic they'll probably let everyone know.

@Chen:  Chen is not predictable powerful enough to have the Yakumo name.

[Slaves]

By the way, does anyone have a full Lunatic run replay?

When someone 1ccs Lunatic they'll probably let everyone know.

someone already 1CCed Lunatic, there's videos of it on Youtube.

but they're really crappy.(videos, not the playing)

they're not Western though.

[Suikama]

UFO Lunatic 1CC

[Alfred F. Jones]

UFO Lunatic 1CC

I'm going to watch this for sheer WTF factor. :V

[mark2000]

funny how I found easy and normal to be almost identical (by that I mean easy is almost as hard as normal), which is pretty different compared to SA.

Anyway, I can't decide on which one is easier when it comes to stockpiling lives, the spirit item system or this one. One time, I was practically racking up lives ever other minute out of sheer luck and I would've probably filled the 8 star limit before stage 4 if only I wasn't constantly making stupid mistakes.