NSP Mafia - Game Over

[SB]

The post didn't seem to be there with the purpose of defending you so much as criticizing NNR's vote. The question was practically an afterthought, and it feels kind of odd that you're focused on that. What makes it scum asking the question instead of a townie using it to try and improve their reads?

SB and BBM For mafia.

I wish.

[WHMZakeri]

hmm, I suppose that's a valid interpretation. The use of the question just jumped out at me, though, as a thing that I did not like for textbook principles. I'll wait and see what he has to say on the matter.

I wish.

Yeah, thinking about it that'd be kind of scary. Only a little, though.

[DNAbc]

i feel better unvoting because a vote signifies you want that person ded. i dont agree with the wagon so i am showing my disagreement with the current wagons by not placing my vote

and i trust i have enuff time to come back to vote

tbh i find shadoweh to be scummy, that attack on not elaborating during rvs feels off and her activity is unlike most d1s where she would abuse her mind control beams

[Sky_Paladin]

Just had a skim read because fireworks brb later

However - still no posts from Poly? 

re pokemon:  I think the deal with two suns means they can't post for two days, or they can only post at night. 

Pokemon - do you have this restriction for the entire game?  Day phases only e.g. can post at night? 

Is it a restriction that was placed on to you by another player (which is odd because day 1 but okay)?

I want to

uh gotta go

[Sky_Paladin]

Ok back momentarily before out for the night. 

I wanted to say, I don't want to focus entirely on the post restriction since it's not really contributing much to the discussion. 

I'm going to change my avatar since I keep confusing myself with NNR. 
***
The exchange between DNA and BBM on page 1 raised an eyebrow.  Yes it is RNG.  For me, I put down a random vote until I have something to improve it to.  I do think DNA's shift was odd.  On page 2 he had another run in with BBM after his 'BBM is tryhard = town' comment re: unvoting. 

DNA

like i dunno, mb we can start guessing at what Junko is saying? that seems like a massive waste of time to me tho so i would just wait for him to simplify his codes

I think...trying to decrypt what Pokemon is saying would be a massive waste of town's time since they will probably be able to post normally at some point to explain and if they wanted to be clearly understood they would surely post more intelligently than they are now.  At the moment they just have a random vote, I'm sure once they have a serious vote down they will try to explain it better in some way. 

EG this post I don't know that face; is it one of the dudes from the Godfather series?  What's it supposed to mean?  I don't understand but I want to believe if it was something important, Pokemon would make it clear.  Until then let's move on. 

Zak said:

Basically, the use of "Why X not Y?" is a fallacy based argument which is a soft scumtell.

People make bad arguments because they aren't good at logic.  Scum make bad arguments because they have to make up stuff. 
I can't really agree that a logical fallacy is a scumtell.  It just invalidates the reason for their vote; if somebody pushes their vote even after their reasoning has been pointed out to be flawed, theeeen you probably have a scumtell. 
I also disagree with this:

I don't like that he used it in what was basically a unneeded defense for me, in what might have been an attempt at buddying me.

I don't think that's what happened at all.  BBM was asking NNR to explain why he was voting for you instead of another player who had also voted for Pokemon (himself).  I don't think he was defending you, he was interrogating NNR.  In the same way that I don't think I'm defending BBM now; I'm questioning your interpretation of the events because see point a) if somebody pushes their vote even after their reasoning...etc etc. 

Anyway I'm more concerned with how DNA keeps coming back to Junko who can't really defend themselves at all right now. 

DNA

i feel better unvoting because a vote signifies you want that person ded.

I'm gonna paraphase Kilga here; an empty unvote could be a scumtell because town are always trying to improve their vote. 

I can see the arguments for Zak and BBM, and I feel that DNA's focus on Pokemon and...I want to say flawed but I feel like it's more misguided...arguments are damaging. 

So I'm gonna go with this for now. 

##unvote
##vote DarkNinjaABC

To be clear, my case is 'wasting time, misguided or anti-town points, empty unvote'. 

I want to see some content from Polaris real soon. 

[Sky_Paladin]

Sigh I just realised on the re-read DNA said

that seems like a massive waste of time to me tho so i would just wait for him to simplify his codes

Which undoes about a third of what I was saying.  I have to rush out the door though so I'll look at it later

I'll leave my vote because even with 1/3 gone there's still 2/3 of a case there, I'll evaluate when I get back.

[pokemon123]

##Unvote

##Vote Sky Paladin

Ok back momentarily before out for the night. 

I wanted to say, I don't want to focus entirely on the post restriction since it's not really contributing much to the discussion. 

I'm going to change my avatar since I keep confusing myself with NNR. 
***
The exchange between DNA and BBM on page 1 raised an eyebrow.  Yes it is RNG.  For me, I put down a random vote until I have something to improve it to.  I do think DNA's shift was odd.  On page 2 he had another run in with BBM after his 'BBM is tryhard = town' comment re: unvoting. 

DNA
I think...trying to decrypt what Pokemon is saying would be a massive waste of town's time since they will probably be able to post normally at some point to explain and if they wanted to be clearly understood they would surely post more intelligently than they are now.  At the moment they just have a random vote, I'm sure once they have a serious vote down they will try to explain it better in some way. 

EG this post I don't know that face; is it one of the dudes from the Godfather series?  What's it supposed to mean?  I don't understand but I want to believe if it was something important, Pokemon would make it clear.  Until then let's move on. 

Zak said:People make bad arguments because they aren't good at logic.  Scum make bad arguments because they have to make up stuff. 
I can't really agree that a logical fallacy is a scumtell.  It just invalidates the reason for their vote; if somebody pushes their vote even after their reasoning has been pointed out to be flawed, theeeen you probably have a scumtell. 
I also disagree with this:I don't think that's what happened at all.  BBM was asking NNR to explain why he was voting for you instead of another player who had also voted for Pokemon (himself).  I don't think he was defending you, he was interrogating NNR.  In the same way that I don't think I'm defending BBM now; I'm questioning your interpretation of the events because see point a) if somebody pushes their vote even after their reasoning...etc etc. 

Anyway I'm more concerned with how DNA keeps coming back to Junko who can't really defend themselves at all right now. 

DNA
I'm gonna paraphase Kilga here; an empty unvote could be a scumtell because town are always trying to improve their vote. 

I can see the arguments for Zak and BBM, and I feel that DNA's focus on Pokemon and...I want to say flawed but I feel like it's more misguided...arguments are damaging. 

So I'm gonna go with this for now. 

##unvote
##vote DarkNinjaABC

To be clear, my case is 'wasting time, misguided or anti-town points, empty unvote'. 

I want to see some content from Polaris real soon. 

[Raikaria]

I think he can only type during night phases; basically; he's an insomniac.

Pokemon considering when I told off NNR you posted that mafia image and I got confused who you were calling mafia; canyou use people's avatars to say that? BecauseI don't know if you're saying Sky_Paladin is scummy or if you're agreeing with him and saying DNA is scummy.

SB's defense of DNA gives me a little pause, but I wouldn't jump to conclusions like Zakeri. It just seems he's missing the point of Zakeri's beef against DNA; which; by the way; Zakeri had not returned to explain in a clearer manner after I showed he needed to elaborate on what exactly was bad.

It's kind of a big leap to assume someone is scum based on their reaction to a part of a post that at least one other player was a little confused about; IMO. It's not something to write off entirely, but it's also not something that should entice a reaction like 'scumteam confirmed'.

[NekoNekoRex]

Getting on quick to mention that yes, I was busy today, and I am super tired and need to sleep, and yes, I am sorry I have been mostly absent on D1 for the umpteenth time, but I'm more confident I can get shit done this time around.

[Vhaltz]

A newborn deer runs through a field, a votecount shines from heaven.

Zakeri (3): Shadoweh, NNR, SB
Pokemon123 (1): SB
Candeloro (1): Raikaria
NekoNekoRex (1):  BBM
Skypal (1): Junko
BBM (1): Zakeri
DNA (1): Skypal

Voteless scrubs: Poly

With 10 alive, 6 are required to hammer. Countdown to D1 end, you have 30 hours remaining.
Candeloro/Poly has been prodded. They will be forcereplaced if they don't post by phase end.

[NekoNekoRex]

I got semi-prodded to post so I'll just write this up before sleeping

##Unvote, ##Vote: NNR

That's not what Zak said at all; he said that he had nobody else to vote, not that he was voting Junko for having the posting restriction. For one thing, he was voting Junko before we realized he had a posting restriction. And for that matter, I also posted after the posting restriction became clear and didn't move my vote away from Junko either. Why is Zak worse?

Tone mostly, and parking your vote because you have 'nothing better' also seems kind of bad. however, Zak does do stuff later on so it's mostly moot at this point.
I sometimes don a self-enforced post restriction so seeing people whine about it is kind of dumb, they're rarely completely unreadable (or unreadable in any major amount), but I digress. PRs=/=scum.

ut what is worse is DNA's empty unvote

i am getting tryharding vibes from BBM, generally that's pretty safe coming from town!BBM on d1 so i am waiting and seeing
##Umvote to remain politically neutral

Empty unvotes should never be a thing, really. If you don't have a scumread, you should get one and vote, generally.
DNA also brings up wanting to vote because PR=scum, which is a red flag too.
Later suspects shadoweh but still no vote:

i feel better unvoting because a vote signifies you want that person ded. i dont agree with the wagon so i am showing my disagreement with the current wagons by not placing my vote
and i trust i have enuff time to come back to vote
tbh i find shadoweh to be scummy, that attack on not elaborating during rvs feels off and her activity is unlike most d1s where she would abuse her mind control beams

uses a double standard here, he disagrees with the wagons and doesn't vote, but he thinks that someone else is scum and still does not vote.
##Vote: DNA

Basically, the use of "Why X not Y?" is a fallacy based argument which is a soft scumtell. I don't like that he used it in what was basically a unneeded defense for me, in what might have been an attempt at buddying me. It also makes the NNR vote look more opportunistic than a regular RVS-jumping vote should be.

This seems like a good catch the way you interpret it, Zak, but I guess BBM's defense would be nice as well. I'm tempted to side with Zak and sheep but that's probably biased because BBM is voting me.

[DNAbc]

lol @ silly arguments
 
have motk!town always been like this or was it me not paying enough attention to mafia

anyway
@skypal:
what you cited was out of context and blatantly wrong.
my respond to BBM after he told me not to townread him;
>we had nothing better to do so i latched on him and spoke my thoughts, yet he shut down the topic himself
>anyway since we have nothing better to do how about deciphering Junko's stuff?
>tho i think thats silly and is a waste of time so i would wait until he simplify his stuff

thats what i said morons, get your facts straight. because i included 'a waste of time' in my statement doesnt mean i am telling you to waste time. in fact if that was my intention i would've packaged it better so it would seem like a more attractive proposal. it amuses and irritates me how willingly you people just swallow this senseless BS without even referencing the actual post itself

-----
@nnr
>you echoed everyone's bits of problems
>then exaggerated them by assembling them in a wall
>then threw in some more weight by extracting bits of my posts to supplement everyone's suspicion

biggest. derp. follow. the. leader. ever.

infact this reminds me so much about scum sheeping, i am voting on you
##Vote NNR

and since i think i saw >3 times people complain about my ''empty unvote''. i will also respond to it here
@general public
 
pls read my actual post where i explain why before i swear slifhoasdhaksjhd'kajhdkjasd
its my playstyle, take it or leave it. i cant really defuse your crazy conspiracy paranoia about ''SCUMSLIPS'' so i am saying you can keep losing games or give people an ounce of trust with their explainations. you guys do realize we have different standards of maf and what applies to you doesnt necessarily applies to me right. that said anyway i will take care not to sit on another empty unvote if that really irks you so much

later

[Candeloro]

argh sorry I forgot I was in this game
I'll try and do an actual content post in a bit when I can get back on my laptop

[BigBangMeteor]

##Unvote, ##Vote: Zak

His vote against me is absolutely terrible because he firstly agrees with my defence of him and then votes me for a part of it??? Then, "why X not Y" is a perfectly logical reason for a scumread because when there are multiple people doing Action A but someone votes one person for it without mentioning the other, at all, that person is arbitrarily pushing one person over the other for no real reason, which is generally because they're scum BSing something. Additionally he didn't actually say what's scummy about what I did originally. In fact he let Raikaria clarify it for him as "a gut reaction". So basically that's what his vote against me is, gut. The reaction to SB defending me is also hilariously bad because if scumbuddies automatically defended each other, one could say that me and him were buddies because I defended him (until his vote against me, anyways). His premature "I bet people are going to talk about scumbuddy theories" looks  self-conscious.

I don't like Raikaria either; he hasn't given a straight stance on anything yet. He first says Zak's vote is a little confusing but then says he sees where it's coming from- so am I scummy or not? Same with SB's Zak vote, and same with Zak himself. In fact his vote is still on Poly from RVS for...?

Shadoweh- do you actually find Zak scummy? Your vote is still there from RVS but your language implies you find DNA worse.

[NekoNekoRex]

I know I try to really avoid using the term a lot, because it's easy to abuse the meaning of it, but DNA, that vote looks a lot like OMGUS.

[NekoNekoRex]

BBM's vote looks REALLY reactionary too, geez.

[BigBangMeteor]

But do you think that either DNA or I are scum?

Also I missed the part where Zak said it could be an attempt at buddying him- maybe if I was Conq this would be more valid, but as Sky points out, attacking somebody's vote doesn't mean you're defending the target of the vote.

Sky puzzles me a little. He made good points about Zak's vote for me, but his DNA vote (and NNR's DNA vote, for that matter) seem really... easy. Empty unvoting is like...  not optimal play but it doesn't really have scum intent by itself. Still think Raikaria is worse for content that isn't actually content while he continues with his RVS vote. Of the two DNA votes, I think NNR's is better for pointing out that he could have voted Shadoweh and didn't, while Sky's seems to be more focused on the empty unvote and the reference to Kilga feels like appeal to authority.

So right now I'm at like... Zak > Raikaria > Sky?

[Raikaria]

I don't like Raikaria either; he hasn't given a straight stance on anything yet. He first says Zak's vote is a little confusing but then says he sees where it's coming from- so am I scummy or not? Same with SB's Zak vote, and same with Zak himself. In fact his vote is still on Poly from RVS for...?

Haven't given a straight stance on anything because I don't *have* a clear stance on anything yet. I'm still attempting to figure out everyone. The only person I'm pretty sure if town is pokemon; aka: That guy with the posting restriction.

That and myself.

I mean; usually by this point I see something that makes me go 'This guy is scum' and start a D1 slapfight. But this game I've not seen anything that definitive.

Not to mention the amount of content to go on at this point is ugh.

[Vhaltz]

You're probably thinking to yourself, NSP Mafia is awesome. I know. But thank you anyway.

Zakeri (3): Shadoweh, SB, BBM
Candeloro (1): Raikaria
NekoNekoRex (1):  DNA
Skypal (1): Junko
BBM (1): Zakeri
DNA (2): Skypal, NNR

Voteless scrubs: Poly

With 10 alive, 6 are required to hammer. Countdown to D1 end, you have 17~ hours remaining.

[SB]

Zak's last response was okay but I want to see where he goes from here.

Sky: How is trying to decipher Junko's posts a waste of time? Even if he can do it later, where's the harm in it? How is it anti-town to try and do so? Like, the strongest thing there is the empty unvote I guess but after his explanation I'm of the opinion it's null. Not having another suspicion to fall back on is perfectly reasonable at that stage, and who do you think he was going to vote?

My opinion on Raikaria is blatantly sheeped from BBM. It feels like he's fencesitting on pretty much everything that's going on and feels like really cautious play rather than trying to get scum lynched.

##Unvote
##Vote: Raikaria

I feel like this is really weak considering 18 hours left but yeah...

[Shadoweh]

This kind of sucks. Deadline happens while I'll be in the middle of work. (I'll try to stop in before work at 9am but no promises >_>)

I don't like Raikaria either; he hasn't given a straight stance on anything yet. He first says Zak's vote is a little confusing but then says he sees where it's coming from- so am I scummy or not? Same with SB's Zak vote, and same with Zak himself. In fact his vote is still on Poly from RVS for...?

Shadoweh- do you actually find Zak scummy? Your vote is still there from RVS but your language implies you find DNA worse.

Raikaria is being indecisive, but imo he doesn't seem scummy. I'd be surprised if he turned out mofia.
As for Zak, I'm really not sure. His posts make me nervous but I'm not really sure why? I wanted to see more of how you two played out first (not that that's worked well. :S Everyone's asleep this game.) In a few hours I'll be more free to make a decision on it.

 DNA's freakout in response to being voted was pretty hilarious. I don't think anyone mentioned scumslips did they? (unless Sky P did, I haven't read his giant post yet).

[NekoNekoRex]

I think DNA is scum, but could go either way on BBM.

Raikaria is kind of iffy, but mostly out of gut. I don't really like his dull lack of stance on anyone, and his vote is currently a votepark, which is kinda bad.

[WHMZakeri]

People make bad arguments because they aren't good at logic.  Scum make bad arguments because they have to make up stuff.
I can't really agree that a logical fallacy is a scumtell.  It just invalidates the reason for their vote;

This why I specified that it's a soft scumtell, as oppose to the usual hardness of one.
Of course, the only way it could even turn into a full scumtell is after somebody calls him out on it to begin with, which is exactly what my vote was intended to do.

I already kind of agreed that it could have been a perspective of wanting to grill NNR rather than defend me. but the reason I was focused on the defense was because I didn't actually see his questioning as valid interrogation.

Then, "why X not Y" is a perfectly logical reason for a scumread because when there are multiple people doing Action A but someone votes one person for it without mentioning the other, at all, that person is arbitrarily pushing one person over the other for no real reason, which is generally because they're scum BSing something.

This is false. a natural part of scumhunting is picking out and singling people for actions they've done, and a natural part of human psyche is to pick up on the first instance of something they notice and call out against it- especially since Mafia is a game where we're racing for information. I already said his reason for picking me out was because He noticed I did it but didn't notice others who also did it - are you actively denying this could happen?

His vote against me is absolutely terrible because he firstly agrees with my defence of him and then votes me for a part of it???

Active Misinterpretation.
I don't think it's normal after I've tried to explain my reasoning this many times to assume that I liked the whole defense including the part I've tried to call out as scummy.  You know, rather than only liking the part of the defense I reused myself but also not liking the part of the defense that I called him out on.

If there are two parts to something, and I use the first part saying I like it, but then attack the second part, it shouldn't be so confusing to think that I only liked the first part.

It just seems he's missing the point of Zakeri's beef against DNA

I don't even remember having a beef with him. Let me check.

Even if he can do it later, where's the harm in it? How is it anti-town to try and do so?

I think the harm comes from the fact that it wastes brain power and is not scumhunting - it's the same set of problems as trying to rolegame the setup, except instead of getting alignment info, we're just getting the thoughts of a person posting on day one anyway.

[pokemon123]

This kind of sucks. Deadline happens while I'll be in the middle of work. (I'll try to stop in before work at 9am but no promises >_>)Raikaria is being indecisive, but imo he doesn't seem scummy. I'd be surprised if he turned out mofia.
As for Zak, I'm really not sure. His posts make me nervous but I'm not really sure why? I wanted to see more of how you two played out first (not that that's worked well. :S Everyone's asleep this game.) In a few hours I'll be more free to make a decision on it.

 DNA's freakout in response to being voted was pretty hilarious. I don't think anyone mentioned scumslips did they? (unless Sky P did, I haven't read his giant post yet).

[BigBangMeteor]

Whenever I see something that I feel is scummy, I also look to see if anyone else is doing it. The more people there are doing something, the less likely it is to be indicative of scum intent. Just going with the first person I see doing something suspicious leads to me pushing someone for something that isn't that suspicious. I'll admit upon a revisit that my characterization of your vote as voting me for a defence that you agreed with was not wholly incorrect and a little knee-jerk but I still feel like the main part of your vote doesn't actually say what's scummy about me.

ehhh I reread SCP D1 and I feel like scum Raikaria is capable of BSing content even if it's contrived; fencesitting and not giving a clear stance is not something he really did at all. He abruptly changed stances as required, but never just refused to give one... bluh

Shadoweh is not inspiring me currently. I guess I'd like to see her response to Zak's latest post.

[DNAbc]

i dunno why NNR and Shadow seem to have a bone to pick with me. NNR essentially gave up on further elaborating his case and just use vague methinks DNA iz scum and shadoweh somehow treated my perfectly justified irritation as a freakout, what?

glad SB has some common sense here, and no, I dont agree with Zak being scum because the case on him consists of insignificant aspects that are either irrelevant or transitioned from RVS, i personally dont remember having a problem with zak aside from RVS prod

also BBM is posting alot, while my exp with mafia!BBM mb outdated i stilk strongly incline to believe him town for now

i dont wholly agree with any of the cases here, mostly because of simply how little content is present at this stage so i am resorting to my next most reliable d1 scumhunt tool, my experience playing with you guys. admittedly it may be wrong (in the case of nnr) so pls convince me why i should agree with the zak wagon. which, as i mentioned, is based on baseless crap that either transitioned from rvs or involves imaginary events that never took place

god its hot over here

[Shadoweh]

Junkos: I thought he was putting effort into getting the game rolling early. He also gets thought scummy and lynched a lot early because of his early confused activity so etc. It's hard to explain 'he feels townie'.

I'm much more iffy about voting Zak at this point. The argument between him and BBM about why me fry me seems to be semantics, I'm pretty sure they're actually saying the same thing, especially since "picking out and singling people for actions they've done, and a natural part of human psyche is to pick up on the first instance of something they notice and call out against it" is a good description of what BBM did with Zak's defense in the first place.

I'm much more comfortable voting DNA for his breakdown in waiting. I'd comment on other wagons but uh, everyone is being super indecisive for some reason. I'll have a peek this morning to see if wagons change and suddenly wagons. Looking at what I said about Zak I supose that's not really a strong reason not to vote him but, I'd prefer to have him around, if that makes sense.

##Vote: DNA

Cut: Didn't you tell me to lynch you in mafia over costing me my title? >:C BBM always posts alot, that's the laziest reason for a townread you could make. Also maybe I'll be more inspiring when I actually have time to read, I'm having a hard time remembering how to mafia in an hour. >_>

[NekoNekoRex]

i dunno why NNR and Shadow seem to have a bone to pick with me. NNR essentially gave up on further elaborating his case and just use vague methinks DNA iz scum and shadoweh somehow treated my perfectly justified irritation as a freakout, what?

But I have totally justified it, in my posts reasoning why I think you're scum.

"Playstyle" isn't really an argument here, and it's a fancy word for "I'm townie because ~meta~".

[Vhaltz]

There's 5 hours, 45mins left in the phase. Hammer is required for a lynch, and no lynch may only happen (whether through lack of majority or through voting) once.

[Sky_Paladin]

Finally I got a couple of hours. 

On the re-read of my case against DNA, I realised one of my points against him was invalid; but I had no time to do anything about it.  The feeling was, I thought he was encouraging players to spend time decrypting Pokemon instead of scumhunting and I felt this was misdirecting towny effort.  He was also voting them at the time or something, anyway I thought there was more in it than that but I completely missed that he said that 'it was probably a waste of time'.  If I had seen it the first time properly I wouldn't have used it in my case. 

So remove that, what's left -

1 - The small encounter with BBM and DNA on page 1 where BBM challenges DNA for why he changed his RVS vote.  I expect town players to try to improve their vote; DNA didn't provide a reason except for 'RVS duh'.  It's early enough in the phase that you could get away with that kind of line, it's not scummy on it's own but along with his empty unvote later on, I consider the first vote switch as more meaningful.  He switched from Shadoweh, to Zak. 

2 - There's a couple of statements from DNA that I particularly don't like:

***Some kind of pyro/planet crumbs?***

BURN THE ALIENS AND THEIR MIND CONTROL BEAMS

impale you on a stick and burn you

the sun reminds me of how hot and wet it is

god its hot over here

mother earth

I saw DNA make a comment in the Great Raid thread about heat so it may just actually be very hot but we don't need these kinds of distracting, non-content comments here.  Basically there's a lot of these comments, but I can't see why a non-town-aligned role would crumb unless they had to because of the role; unless it's a captain planet type role who can kill players that says the magic words, or something like that. 

Anyway I don't like it. 

***staying neutral***
remain politically neutral

i just have no opinions, is that a problem?

i dont agree with the wagon so i am showing my disagreement with the current wagons by not placing my vote

I don't like anybody trying to 'stay neutral'.  Getting involved with discussions and disagreeing with people is how we catch scum.  Good town content requires you to poke people and see what comes out; only scums want to stay in the background. 

***Actual opinions***
Townclear of BBM * 1
Scumread of Shadoweh (but no vote). 
Townclear of BBM * 2
v
There's not really much here.  I'm going to hit post now, we are near phase end and there's really only votes for Zak at this stage. 

Cut:  Scratch that now it's DNA. 

Up until now I've really only looked at DNA so I'm going to re-examine the Zak/BBM interactions and see what all the fuss is.