Author Topic: Art Tips Thread II  (Read 214830 times)

Yookie

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #150 on: March 12, 2014, 10:04:03 AM »
It depends on where you want to put your focus. That is where you model the rest around.
You can go into detail right away if you know, that you will have enough space for everything (nothing worse than drawing a fine face only to end up at the edge of the paper somewhere leaving you with no choice but to start over :V) but I guess that is not an issue for digital drawing.
Basic shapes are mostly for getting the pose right and fitting the character into the rest of the motive. It is easier to fit the shape of the face around the features than the other way around.

KrackoCloud

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #151 on: March 12, 2014, 05:00:43 PM »
Some people can get away with no guidelines because they're familiar with the shapes and have been drawing for some time. If you've just started drawing, I would probably suggest heavier use of guidelines like the basic shapes in those tutorials.

HakureiSM

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #152 on: March 13, 2014, 03:05:09 PM »
Almost every art tutorial I have seen so far always draw the basic shapes before getting to detail, but watching some artist stream and drawing video on youtube, I noticed that most of them don't do that at all and get straight to draw the facial feature detail.
That's because they're good. They already got the basic down and memorized and won't forget ever, because before doing youtube videos they've drawn basic shit 200 shitbajifucktillion times. So the answer to your question is
Quote
my question is: is basic shape drawing necessary at all?
Yes. Completely. 150%.
That goes for anything, everyone knows I don't draw very well :V but everything takes effort and starts from the basic
[20:45:19] Ciryano: come and behold why they call it the Panzerfaust
[20:45:39] Hakurei Reimu: ... because it shoots once and then you throw it out?
                                                                                   .

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #153 on: March 13, 2014, 08:33:35 PM »
Almost every art tutorial I have seen so far always draw the basic shapes before getting to detail, but watching some artist stream and drawing video on youtube, I noticed that most of them don't do that at all and get straight to draw the facial feature detail.

my question is: is basic shape drawing necessary at all? is it only good for learning artist to get the facial position and anatomy right?

"Most" is a little overbroad. I've been drawing for more than 10 years and I still draft out basic shapes, map out facial features on the head, every time I draw. What you have to understand about streams and drawing videos is that the artist is going to pick a pose that they're already very familiar with--because they know viewers don't want to see them fumble and redraw 20 times. So if you already know exactly what you intend to draw, if every feature is already committed to muscle memory, then you can get away with launching right into details, maybe. But for a new artist--indeed, for experienced artists working with an unfamiliar pose or perspective--the way that lines and details map onto three-dimensional forms is not going to come intuitively. Andrew Loomis explains the dangers of skipping over construction:

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Teewee

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #154 on: March 13, 2014, 08:51:41 PM »
How so? Reading that page, I just see Loomis explaining that children draw things like those little figures, and that adults that havent been practicing constantly since childhood will be unable to draw better than those little figures without proper instruction.

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #155 on: March 13, 2014, 09:22:42 PM »
The point is that the basic forms--the "essential" shapes that make up the body--are more important than the details. Figures 1 and 2 indicate form without detail; therefore, they show more promise than figure 5, which shows detail without form ("buttons and clothes with a face on them.") Incidentally, many beginning anime artists wind up drawing things like figure 5 above, because they want to draw a pair of eyes, a set of bangs floating in space, and line in the rest of the figure around those elements. It doesn't work that way. As this attachment shows, even very simple, highly stylized figures benefit from starting from basic forms.

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SuperParadox

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #156 on: March 13, 2014, 09:34:35 PM »
Welp, I need to remind myself to update the OP later tonight.

I don't really have anything else to add on to drawing the basic shapes but yeah, don't skip out on them.


I decided to halt on practising drawing anatomy and human figure drawing to focus on the face until I could draw a decent anime face.

is there a good tutorial, tips to draw specifically anime face? the tips on the OP is about human face at general, which somewhat different from how faces and hair is draw in anime facially and anatomically.

and no, I'm practice art as an hobby, I want to draw anime because it is what I love and because I want to one day create something visually beautiful, so I wouldn't care less about not being able to draw anything but anime-style drawing.


Even if you just want to learn anime its always a good idea to learn proper human anatomy, especially if you want to become good at it. Once you learn how the human body works you'll find it 500% easier to draw in an anime style.  I don't think there are any proper how to draw anime faces tutorials out there but i'll look when I get the chance.

HakureiSM

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #157 on: March 14, 2014, 02:25:16 AM »
Even if you just want to learn anime its always a good idea to learn proper human anatomy, especially if you want to become good at it.
Especially since anime styling is generally very reliant on consistent anatomy, even if its very caricatured. A good artist will always follow a strict set of anatomical rules they've developed from combining their experience with proper anatomy with their stylistic goal.
[20:45:19] Ciryano: come and behold why they call it the Panzerfaust
[20:45:39] Hakurei Reimu: ... because it shoots once and then you throw it out?
                                                                                   .

Teewee

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #158 on: March 14, 2014, 04:03:02 AM »
Explanations

I see, that makes sense. Thanks.

A good artist will always follow a strict set of anatomical rules they've developed from combining their experience with proper anatomy with their stylistic goal.

Well, not always; I happen to have a friend who when asked about it, pretty much said that she didn't really get as good at drawing people as she did from learning any theory. There's always the exception for these things :/

pineyappled

Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #159 on: March 14, 2014, 04:11:21 AM »
Well, not always; I happen to have a friend who when asked about it, pretty much said that she didn't really get as good at drawing people as she did from learning any theory. There's always the exception for these things :/
...but is she good at drawing

Don't expect to be the exception.

Teewee

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #160 on: March 14, 2014, 04:39:42 AM »
She's very good, and I never said one should expect to be the exception. It's still right to say that beginner must start small with shapes and such, but that was just something I wanted to mention :P

« Last Edit: March 14, 2014, 03:23:40 PM by TEspeon »

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #161 on: March 14, 2014, 06:39:37 AM »
Just because she didn't study theory doesn't mean she doesn't use it: she could have had the talent to develop her forms from observation alone. If you asked her to draw a chair or a human hand or something else that isn't in her usual style, I bet you she would still draw it better than an average untrained person. That's theory at work.

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SuperParadox

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #162 on: March 14, 2014, 07:53:15 AM »
(Also im updating the master post so if theres anything that you guys are looking for its a good time to say what you might want more of :v)

Teewee

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #163 on: March 14, 2014, 03:30:02 PM »
Just because she didn't study theory doesn't mean she doesn't use it: she could have had the talent to develop her forms from observation alone. If you asked her to draw a chair or a human hand or something else that isn't in her usual style, I bet you she would still draw it better than an average untrained person. That's theory at work.

You're probably right.

(Also im updating the master post so if theres anything that you guys are looking for its a good time to say what you might want more of :v)

I found this website a while back which has tuts that come with exercises to apply them. How about more tuts and websites like that?

Kimidori

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #164 on: March 15, 2014, 12:30:12 PM »
ok, after some hours trying hard I think I got the basic neutral eye down, I could draw this somewhat consistently now.

here is my failed attempt at drawing the face, did not manage to draw the left eye quite right, and failed so miserably at hair that I erased it, any tips for anime hair?
« Last Edit: March 15, 2014, 02:29:14 PM by Kimidori »


"No matter what, cute is justice. If you're watching shows without moe, you should really be questioning your life decisions. The creation of 2D anime girls is the pinnacle of human achievement." -Logan M

Delfigamer

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #165 on: March 15, 2014, 04:10:34 PM »
I would still recommend to grasp at least basic workings of an RL face.

BTW
hair 'tutorial' for a fren
Here you go. :derp:

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #166 on: March 15, 2014, 05:02:22 PM »
The way you are trying to draw a face now, drawing and redrawing the same line, you're essentially attempting to copy a symbol you've picked up from watching anime and reading manga. That's not a useful approach. I suggest practicing the ball-and-cross technique. While it's usually used for realistic drawing, I use the ball and cross for anime drawings as well (examples 1 2 3 4.) It helps you quickly identify the general shape of the head (hence where to draw the hair,) the centerline, and the eyeline all at once. Furthermore, for most artists, drawing a simple ball and cross is much faster than drawing a full-on face. Therefore, rather than spending hours laboring over a simple jaw line (not productive,) you can fill up several pages with balls and crosses in different perspectives (productive.)

One final note regarding hair: as yofukashi shows us, hair is made up of a few discrete 'blocks.' Again fundamentals and theory are important in being able to place these blocks correctly.


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Kimidori

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #167 on: March 18, 2014, 11:22:46 PM »
I was quite busy the last 2 days to practice anything, anyway, having a entire afternoon free today so I decided to practice the face a bit, my attempts:

I still tried to draw without using circle and cross and got  this, for some reason, I kind of "panicked" after I draw the 3 main front chunks and draw the outer hair chunk randomly  :V, I also think that the face is a little too narrow, so in my second attempt here, I tried to draw the face a little wider also, experiment with another iris style and tried to control the hair drawing a little. first attempt with ball and cross did not go very well, the second attempt seemed to have gone better though, experiment with hair style, still having trouble with the outer hair chunk though.


"No matter what, cute is justice. If you're watching shows without moe, you should really be questioning your life decisions. The creation of 2D anime girls is the pinnacle of human achievement." -Logan M

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #168 on: March 19, 2014, 07:38:49 AM »
Have you tried drawing faces facing different directions? This is one of the chief advantages of the ball-and-cross setup -- it lets you plot the main volume occupied by the head, map out the main features, in any perspective. After you do a page or 20 like this (as you can probably tell, a fairly early attempt on my part), you should start to get really comfortable with laying down the ball and cross facing any which way you please.

Nothing in this post should be construed as legal advice, nor as creating an attorney-client relationship, nor as an advertisement for legal or law-related services.
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Kimidori

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #169 on: March 20, 2014, 12:23:03 PM »
hhmm, now I find myself having more control of the face shape and drawing better face proportion when drawing without ball and cross, but only cross, drawing with ball and cross most of the time result a face that is either too long, or too narrow.


"No matter what, cute is justice. If you're watching shows without moe, you should really be questioning your life decisions. The creation of 2D anime girls is the pinnacle of human achievement." -Logan M

Kimidori

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #170 on: March 22, 2014, 04:39:35 PM »
I think I have made a good progress with hair drawing today with this

any suggestions on it?


"No matter what, cute is justice. If you're watching shows without moe, you should really be questioning your life decisions. The creation of 2D anime girls is the pinnacle of human achievement." -Logan M

Delfigamer

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #171 on: March 22, 2014, 05:47:08 PM »
Draw the same head from the side.
Then - from below.
Good luck!

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Teewee

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #172 on: April 06, 2014, 12:05:36 AM »
So, I've heard that a good way to soften digital shading is to lightly use the airbrush over it. Quite a few artists on here do it, but could someone explain to me how it's supposed to be done? When I do it, it doesn't soften at all :/ When I do it, it deepens the color instead of softening it.

pineyappled

Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #173 on: April 06, 2014, 05:34:19 AM »
Use a big, soft brush.

Teewee

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #174 on: April 12, 2014, 11:29:53 PM »
Wouldn't that leave a mess, though? I don't see that happen in the streams I've watched, nor do I see the artists use such huge brushes.

pineyappled

Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #175 on: April 13, 2014, 02:36:58 AM »



Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #176 on: April 13, 2014, 11:04:06 AM »
Wouldn't that leave a mess, though? I don't see that happen in the streams I've watched, nor do I see the artists use such huge brushes.

Use a masking layer for area u wanna soft brush so it doesnt leave a mess
there are lots of other way to soften the shading
come in to my stream someday and i will show it mostly will be Fri,Sat
But I will be in Sakura con next week ....so a week after?

Teewee

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #177 on: April 13, 2014, 06:16:05 PM »
Will do, should I find the time. Thanks.

Mеа

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #178 on: April 21, 2014, 11:18:59 PM »
So hands are notoriously hard to draw, but well drawn ones are darn right frickin' sexy. Which is why I offer the following advice: develop a semi- hand fetish.
Well how do I do that? One needs only look upon the work of the master anime hand animator Takahiro Kagami. Allow me to supply you with some ammo:
Videos: 1 2 3 4 5
Just one shot short of 6 rounds, I suppose.

Anyway, fooling around aside, it really is easy to just skimp on the hands and hide it behind something or whatever. You try to avoid things you know you're bad at or don't like because of the difficulty. To overcome this, you need either will or a massive like for the subject. When you start liking something, that's all you draw. So get a hand fetish; remove all fears.

(also note how the guy actually draws each character's hands differently according to their personalities. And you thought drawing more than half a dozen different faces was hard.)

If I get a bit better I may or may not post up some actually useful tips.
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Colticide

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Re: Art Tips Thread II
« Reply #179 on: April 23, 2014, 02:49:48 AM »
My apologies if this is the wrong area to for this but can I ask a question about something digital related?
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