Himelander Mafia Thread (Over! Scum Win!)

[UncertainJakutten]

Here's the deal. I'm not supposed to be online right now. Through a fluke I have un monitored access at the moment, but I can't actually make an analysis post til tomorrow evening. Which appears to be after deadline. Honestly, losing today really pisses me off, and I'll TRY to do something before deadline, but I highly doubt I'll make it. So, odds are I'll be posting during the challenge phase.

Sorry that my parents are draconian fucks.

[Jam-Kiske]

This sentence contradicts itself. Please restate/fix your reasoning or re-think your case, thanks.

What I meant is that Pesco may have been trying to start a challenge depending on the fact that people would trust him due to his usually correct instincts and the fact that just going for someone seems to be a reasonable D1 strategy in some people's minds. Therefore it's scummy as he assumed people's thoughts of him would make it easy for him to challenge and win.

Pesco's statement of letting Rou kill him next round to confirm he's town is interesting though. It can't be scummy because despite the fact that scum know who is scum, a scum v scum win does not count for anything so it's not really possible that he's scum if he's setting himself up to lose as he wouldn't be giving Rou a win as scum.

I'm thinking the duel at the moment is town v town...

[MissCiato]

@Kitten4u: Who ever said I was using WoT as a scumtell? Established scumtells won't work in this game, as has been pointed out numerous times. I voted based on WoT because it gave me a headache.
We're probably not going to catch scum based on scumtells or scummy play or what not. We will need to look for patterns in the records. I'm also wary of those pointing out strategies to break the game; scum might know something about the setup which we don't.
Also sorry for inactivity, I was at a wedding for most of yesterday/last night. Haven't really had time to follow the game properly.

Wait, what? We can't catch scum based off of scumtells? Are you kidding me? I realize that this game is different, but I still feel like reading people, trying to find scum, and not being tricked is still the best strategy. What kind of defeatist statement is this? I feel like you are making a very small contribution to anything with this and all your other posts.

I am still deciding on Pesco vs. Bard, but I think as crazy and illogical as Pesco has been acting, he has had some thoughtful stuff in his posts even though... the reasoning is a little off I can't really say the same for Bard. I must say I approve of someone who wants to follow instinct sometimes, but I think his logic of Rou being retardedly easy to read is hard for me to follow (although I might feel differently if I wasn't new here!).

With that said, I think that Bard hasn't been very helpful, and Pesco has been helpful in his own way.

##VOTE: Pesco

I also agree with whomever said that the time for challenging should be longer.

[Ranmilia]

Not much new today.

- "If we can confirm a townie beyond a doubt we'll win!"

Good luck with that, also I'd like a pony that shoots missiles, but it isn't going to happen.  Handing all the wins to one person is a very risky strategy that I am not at all keen on supporting.

- "I think today is town vs town"

While town vs town duels don't give scum a head directly, too many of them leads to a scum cleanup and almost certain scum victory.  We do still need to hunt and kill scum.

- "Pesco's playing so suicidally he must be town!"

A:  No.  In general.
B:  No, to Pesco in specific.  Historically his playstyle is "Do what's amusing for Pesco."  What's good for his team doesn't factor into it.  I dislike bringing that up but I guess we can't get away from it here.
C:  We can't change challenge targets like we can change lynches in a normal game.  The only relevant issue here is which of them is more likely to be scum, not which is more likely to be town - trying to evaluate on the basis of townieness rather than scumminess makes it much easier for scum to take a couple of heads with risky crazy gambits.  "So crazy scummy he must be town" is still more likely to be scum than someone middle of the road (which is about how I see Bard.) 

Not 100% yet on who I want to see challenging tomorrow.  I'm leaning Tom vs Ciato at the moment; both of them posted very odd, nearly forced sounding defenses of Pesco, which is quite suspicious regardless of Pesco's actual alignment (and whether he winds up dying today or not.)

[Pesco]

'It's a Pesco idea. I must fight it with my every being!'

'Policy lynch Pesco. Whoever he is accusing can not be scum because it's Pesco!'

Alex, you knew what you were getting into when you sign up for a game here. So why go back on your vehement word to never be in a game with me? What pro town value is there in your play when my name is removed? You claim meta for wanting me lynched  yet you've avoided being in games with me. What credibility can you prove when you're acting purely on prejudice that should have been left by the door?

[Kilgamayan]

This is the second time you've brought that up. What relevance does it have to the game? Are you suggesting Alex is scum because he signed up for a game with you in it?

[Pesco]

Pot calling the kettle black. How is what he's doing any more pro town than what he's accused me of?

[Ranmilia]

Initiating a challenge unilaterally within the first few hours of the day on no reasoning is a very scummy thing to do in this setup, as has been covered before, and I would be voting against anyone who did that as I think there is a much higher chance for them to be scum than the person they issued the challenge against to be scum.  Particularly when the reasoning given for issuing the challenge is essentially nil. 

[FinnKaenbyou]

'Policy lynch Pesco. Whoever he is accusing can not be scum because it's Pesco!'

When did anyone say something like this? Why not something like 'Whoever he is accusing is unlikely to be scum given the lack of points against him, and he's probably scum given his hastiness to get someone killed'? Why jump to such crazy levels of misrep if you're Town?

Alex, you knew what you were getting into when you sign up for a game here. So why go back on your vehement word to never be in a game with me? What pro town value is there in your play when my name is removed? You claim meta for wanting me lynched yet you've avoided being in games with me. What credibility can you prove when you're acting purely on prejudice that should have been left by the door?

This reeks of desperation, to be frank. 'You said you didn't want to play a game with me, why are you paying so much attention to me now that we're in a game together?' :/

Happy with my vote.

[Pesco]

My post was directed at one person only. One that assumed scum before finding evidence.

I can only assume you haven't read anything else if that's all you can say, Rou.

[Serp]

I can see how doing a unilateral challenge in the first hours of the day could have townie intent behind it, because it forces the town to start taking stances on players' scumminess rather than getting bogged down in setup speculation and pouncing on stupid townies.  But I've got to admit that the points that have been raised about how it would be a likely scum strategy as well have merit.  Pesco's meta means that if anyone would do that sort of thing as town, it's him...  But Pesco is capable of abusing his own meta as well.  Basically, it's a huge pile of WIFOM.

Meanwhile, Bardiche just seems a little strange, not really scummy.  I'm more inclined to lynch the case covered with WIFOM.  I don't want to bring Bardiche to L-1 ("live minus one") when discussion time is so precious in this setup, but if votes start swinging towards Pesco in the last hours of the day, I'll be switching.

[Pesco]

By my count, only a little over 4 hours left.

I'm ready to self hammer just btw.

[FinnKaenbyou]

My post was directed at one person only. One that assumed scum before finding evidence.

- I said 'when has ANYONE said that' to point out just how exaggerated it was. NO-ONE has said anything like that.

I can only assume you haven't read anything else if that's all you can say, Rou.

Or alternatively I think people are already talking way too freaking much for DAY 1. What do you want, a list of suspicions signed in triplicate? It's sort of hard to produce cases when you cut the voting spectrum down to 2 players in a matter of hours.

[Pesco]

Talking way too much? When did everyone take a level in Mindhax to determine scum from single posts like me? There's no such thing as too much info in a game like this.

[EvilTom]

Right. I just don't see why Pesco's actions are considered scummy. As far as I can tell, it's created massive amounts of discussion, which will later be used to find scum. I agree with Pesco when he says there's no such thing as too much info. I don't want to be a Pesco fanboy, but I don't agree with Alex's inherent dislike of Pesco either. But whatever.
Anyway I'd rather see Pesco live since he's beeing flamboyantly pro-town with his die-hard discussion generating or whatever you want to call it, so I will not vote for mr. walls of quotetextreply. That is all.

[El Cideon]

My post was directed at one person only. One that assumed scum before finding evidence.

Pot calling the kettle black.

Anyway, not real convinced either of our challengers is scum but sticking with a Pesco lynch for kickstarting the whole insane situation to begin with. Bard's recent silence is eerie but I agree with everything he's said about his challenger, so.

[Edible]

DAY 1 CHALLENGE: Pesco vs. Bardiche

Vote Count - Time Is Running Out™ Edition
Bardiche (7) - Bardiche, Kilgamayan, Ranmilia, El Cideon, Kefit, Roukanken, Kitten4U
Pesco (5) - UncertainKitten, Serpentarius, Pesco, Tom, MissCiato

It takes 9 votes to secure a win.  Remember that you are voting for who you want to -win- the duel.

You have ~3.25 hours remaining.

[Kiro]

Pesco: I see what you mean about wanting to eliminate Bard and then have Rou eliminate you afterwards. It however, is a viable strategy for both Town and Scum. Even if Rou were a scumbuddy of yours, you'd still get that one kill on a Town Bardiche to salvage your headlong rush. And Rou may not be touched for a while at least so it could be counted as a gain for awhile. Or Rou could also be Town anyways to give you arguing room to at least get a 1 for 1 trade (even though he's actually voting against you right now).

It's troublesome that Bardiche hasn't posted in a while. But I imagine he'll be held in check for awhile anyways while different leads are pursued. It still boils down that I feel you'd be more likely to be scum than him just based on the early aggressiveness. I can't ignore the slight attitude adjustment you've given either.

##Vote Bardiche (L-1)

[Pesco]

Since we've come so far. Let's talk about what next after I flip town. What are you guys going to do about my idea of letting Rou take all the wins from there on?

[Chaore]

Since we've come so far. Let's talk about what next after I flip town. What are you guys going to do about my idea of letting Rou take all the wins from there on?

Ignore it, likely.

The practice it comes from seems half-plausible, sure. But in reality it just turns the game into a 50-50 chance to fail or win. Organized lynching doesn't seem like something town should really do anyway. More like something scum would want done.

[Pesco]

Sad to hear it. A straight up win and you guys don't want to listen to the only confirmed player at this stage of the game.

I need to head out and won't be around until the last second. My guess of scum (up to 5 players): Bard, K4U, Kefit, Jam and Tom.

##Unvote
##Vote Bard

[Edible]

MALLET

YOUR SILENCE IS APPRECIATED

[Carthrat]

"If this is about Tokiha-san, then I-"

The nun shook her head, and levelled a finger at Mashiro, quivering with accusation- "Why did you bring the children here in the first place, Kazahana-san? Ishigami-sensei told me everything. The purpose behind the scholarships... and the First District, too."

Mashiro looked away. "It was unavoidable. The festival was inevitable, in some form or another. But, I-"

Light spilled forth from Yukariko's palm, soon taking on a tangible, stretchy form similar to doughy flour. Within seconds it had become a silver bow, an arrow nocked and ready. "I assumed you'd have no choice to admit it," she replied. "Anything else you have to say is suspect, Kazahana-san. If I start with you, do you think God will lead me to the others?"

Gripping the arms of her wheelchair more tightly, Mashiro tried again- "Listen to me, Yukariko-san! I truly am on your-"

"Vlas!" A shadowy unicorn seemed to wisp into existence behind Yukariko, and all around the two women, the colours of the world began to shift into greys and whites.

"Would you kindly stop cutting me-"

Arrows thudded into the pillars of the arbor, and Yukariko's no longer appeared to be listening. As the world warped around her, Mashiro's sight became hazy and indistinct. Gritting her teeth and giving up entirely on words, she reached for a rip-cord just to her right.

A moment later, there was a thunderous roar, and jets of violet flame blazed forth from the rear of Mashiro's wheelchair! Yukariko only had a second to blink before the entire contraption slammed into her legs. The wheels did the rest of the work, consigning her to a fate shared by hundreds of unfortunate car-crash victims around the world.

<->

Pesco, aka Sanada Yukariko, Town Lovestruck Nun was run over!

<->

Mere hours after Yukariko's death, rumours had spread rapidly throughout the school. Naturally observant of such talk, the HiME decided that in order to prevent further ambushes they would travel about in pairs from now on, each person with someone they trusted.

Unfortunately, there is nothing schoolgirls like to do more than gossip, and the circumstances brought about the nastiest of paranoid chatter...

<->

It is Round 2. The Hime Star is high in the sky! Today, it is a Team Battle! The duel today will take place between four players divided into two groups. When making a challenge, use the following format-

##Team: Nao - identifies your teammate.
##Challenge: Shizuru & Natsuki - identifies your opponents.

If someone allies with you you have no choice but to accept. Similarily, if you are challenged as a team with another player you must accept this as well. Voting will procede as normal after the challenge is made, with votes being counted against the team rather than the individuals involved. Solo challenges will be ignored! Decide your team and challenge your foes in the same post.

Teams are inseperable, and will live or die together depending on the duel.

If scum are on the winning side, they can only claim wins from taking townie heads, and only one head per victorious scum. (e.g. if a team with one scum defeats two townies, he only gets one win. If a team with two scum defeats a team of one townie and one scum, they only claim one head, and so on.)

Today's challenge phase will run for 48 hours instead of 24! Thus, you have 48 hours from now to make a challenge.

the soul still burns in

1. Kazahana Mashiro is bardiche, who should've been midori *
2. Minagi Mikoto kitten4u likes cats can you tell
3. Kuga Natsuki dread thomas needs a lift, big boy
4. Kikukawa Yukino alice has a thing for tentacles
5. Sugiura Midori ciato can't get nightkilled this game
6. Higurashi Akane chaos will probably die first
7. Yuuki Nao kiro climbed up the water spout
8. Himeno Fumi serpentarius is a teacatching fiend
9. Okuzaki Akira roukanken epitomizes gender identification issues
10. Munakata Shiho kefit can strangle you with her hair
11. Fujino Shizuru uncertainkitten hates old people with passion
12. Alyssa Searrs jam-kiske's ion cannon is ready
14. Senou Aoi kilga is determined to be powerless at all costs
15. Harada Chie cid couldn't wait for fatal frame mafia
16. Miyu Grear siralex was forced out the coolant tank

all sparkly now

13. Sanada Yukariko (pesco) was defeated by Kazahana Mashiro (bardiche) in The Battle of the Unexpected Motorist

[Ranmilia]

Ah.  Quick post before bed.  Hm, daily effects, team battles.  Interesting.  Makes it a bit harder, rather than putting two scummy people together I think we want to go for two scummy people vs two not very scummy people here.  Decreases odds of scum getting a head, which they are much more likely to do if we throw four scummy people in the mixer together. 

#Propose: Tom and Ciato vs ... uh... I dunno Kefit and myself I guess.

I definitely want to see Tom and Ciato on the losing end, both of them had odd tones and Tom was downright nonsensical.  The winning end I'm not sure about, I know I'm town and Kefit's been nice and logical and said the same things I've thought so I like him - I am very open to debate here if someone has good reasons for the winners, but this is a very tricky part of the game indeed. 

[EvilTom]

##Team: (Kilga) Senou Aoi
##Challenge: (Alex) Miyu Grear & (Ciato) Sugiura Midori

GG ScumAlex lining up lynches. This way we get to see both you and Ciato flip (scum).

Obligatory.

[Carthrat]

Challenge Begins!


Alex (Miyu) & Ciato (Midori) (0)

vs

Dread Thomas (Natsuki) & Kilgamayan (Aoi) (0)

48 hours remaining!

[UncertainJakutten]

Um...what do I owe you all? Since...apparently pre challenge discussion has suddenly become uncool. I wanted fast earlier but...dear god people.

[Kilgamayan]

what is this i don't even

[Kilgamayan]

Okay I was going to kneejerk vote for myself but I got called away for a moment and thought about this and realized that this new team battle mechanism is a sufficiently different spin on an already crazy victory mechanic that it might not actually behoove me or town to blindly save myself. I don't particularly think Alex is scum and I think the "lining up lynches" accusation is silly because planning is everything in this game and there needed to be discussion about how to proceed into Day 2 as well as future days.

I will need to reread Tom and Ciato today before deciding who I want to vote for, as I didn't recall having much of a problem with either of them on Day 1.

[FinnKaenbyou]

what is this i don't even

If I had to guess I'd suspect scum have put one member on both sides, therefore ensuring a recorded victory whoever wins. Of course this means that whoever enforced the challenge is scum, so...yeah.

##Vote: Alex/Ciato