Author Topic: Medaka Box Mafia - Night 4  (Read 115561 times)

Conqueror

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #300 on: March 10, 2014, 06:03:18 AM »
On the other hand, I realized I don't want to hear Serela's claim anyway.

##Unvote
##Vote: CF7

L-2



On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Dormio Ergo Sum

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #301 on: March 10, 2014, 06:26:04 AM »
Votecount
CF7 (6): NekoNekoRex, Shadoweh, BT, Kingault, Serela, Conqueror
Serela (5): Bardiche, Zakeri, CF7, SB, Sky Paladin
BT (1): DrRawr
Zakeri (1): ActionDan
Shadoweh (1): Sacchi Hikaru
Kingault (0):
Sky Paladin (0):
NekoNekoRex (0):
Dr Rawr (0):
ActionDan (0):
SB (0):
Sacchi Hikaru (0):
Conqueror (0):
Bardiche (0):

Not voting:
With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

You have ~5.5 hours remaining.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 10:34:06 AM by Definitely Not Dormio »

SB

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #302 on: March 10, 2014, 07:39:18 AM »
Proven ability does not mean town. Regardless I don't want CF7 lynched so.

##Unvote
##Vote: Sky Paladin


I can pray for a turbolynch here I guess.

Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #303 on: March 10, 2014, 07:47:01 AM »
So If I'm reading right, the wagon's are between a guy that's had the case stick around since ed1 and a case where half of the people voted because mod shenanigans.

The only thing Serela has going for him is that scum wouldn't initially have a reason to use their voteblocker to confirm BT is ascetic. Still, I think I'd rather have the wagon go through on CF7 than let this one pass without people actually coming back to explain their votes.

I would rather CF7 had voted for King, even though I'm still pretty convinced King is town. Shadoweh is right when she says CF7 is too apathetic.

Quote
Zakeri, if your top scumpicks are in order of mention CF7, Sky Paladin and Serela, then why is your vote on Serela? It honestly reads like a votepark considering you're voting him "until he develops reads [...]" on basically others. That's an extremely lazy vote if you can just abandon it once Serela does develop reads.
To be honest, my vote on Serela was kind of a votepark at the time, mostly because like I said I gave up hope of Cf7 improving. That, and also the fact that I pretty much have to force a scum read on Serela because I can't seem to think he's anything other than town no matter what his alignment is. Even now my stance is "Okay, let's lynch Sere-WHAT ARE ALL OF YOU OTHER PEOPLE DOING AAUGH".

Actually now that I'm not glancing at the thread and instead reading it, I really don't like how Serela ended up using his role because Bard provoked him. Between that and the way he roleclaimed (Using "Prove it tomorrow" to buy time even though it doesn't prove his alignment, using WiFoM for why he used his role the way he did, the general Appeal to emotion surrounding the whole issue) I don't see how it feels like a town reaction to me (I notice NNR said it was, and I'd ask him to explain it but it probably won't help this close to deadline).

Quote from: BT
Sacchi might be worth looking into as well. People pointed out how he's paranoid and that's good (IDR who) but I think he's overdoing it, like he's pointing out every little thing because why not. Take the comment on Bard/Serela for exampe.
I disagree with this simply on the basis that for people who don't have as much experience in what to look for in scummy behavior, I would rather they be Sacchi overdoing it rather than King "Beats me" ault.

I swear I read page six (remember I have 50 post per page) I honest to god swear I read it at least twice but I don't have anything to comment on other than bleh Serela for overreacting to wagons.

Conqueror

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #304 on: March 10, 2014, 07:55:05 AM »
Quote
I'm still pretty convinced King is town
Could you elaborate on this a little? There's defeatism when you're looking to be the likely lynch, and then there's hyperdefeatism when the game's barely started and there's just a smidgen of pressure.

Zak, the alternative to Serela using his voteblock on BT would be to use it on Bardiche. I don't see how that's any more town than what he did. I think the entire role thing is a distraction. If Serela hadn't done it it wouldn't even be an issue. Unless you think he's scum who decided to use an ability (or fake an ability) on BT for...some reason?

I don't think Sky_Paladin turbo lynch is possible at this point even if I supported it (which I don't).


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Shadoweh

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #305 on: March 10, 2014, 07:58:28 AM »
Ew, this statement reeks of fallacy. We're looking for reasons to lynch people, not reasons to not lynch people.
That's not a good mindset to have.
Except that I'm obviously asking because I don't think people have any real do not lynch reasons and should switch to wagoning CF7 with impunity? this is ignoring that I disagree with the sentiment in general. Has CF7 claimed yet?


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia

Conqueror

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #306 on: March 10, 2014, 08:00:18 AM »
Quote
this is ignoring that I disagree with the sentiment in general.
shadoweh isn't this a blatant lie on your part :v

cf7 hasn't appeared since his last post.

also shadoweh why did you respond to nnr instead of the bajillion posts i made about you >_>


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #307 on: March 10, 2014, 08:04:42 AM »
Quote
Except that I'm obviously asking because I don't think people have any real do not lynch reasons
Also I hope you don't actually believe this. You ask for "real do not lynch reasons." Others ask for "real lynch reasons." No one gets anywhere. You read my posts (presumably). You saw that my points boiled down to "it's not scummy play, it's just plain bad play." So what, that's not a real reason now? Give me your real reasons.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #308 on: March 10, 2014, 08:06:40 AM »
##Unvote
actually. cf7 hasn't even been online since yesterday. no wonder he hasn't posted.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #309 on: March 10, 2014, 08:07:53 AM »
Except that I'm obviously asking because I don't think people have any real do not lynch reasons and should switch to wagoning CF7 with impunity?
Perhaps CF7 is Town Playing Badly. That is Just As Likely As Your Scenario Where He Is Lazy Scum. So why is it the latter and not the former?


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Shadoweh

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #310 on: March 10, 2014, 08:09:09 AM »
Because I'm rereading backwards.
I didn't, it was clearly a post about Serela. >_> I was more pointing out the fact that you declared yourself as super-paying attention Shadoweh when I saw nothing like that.
No, actually. The burden of proof is on you. Otherwise I can just go "Man Look At All These Reasons Shadoweh is Scum. Why Is She Town?"
Although this one sums a bunch of them up nicely. You called my "bluff" while I was unconscious you know. I don't get why you think that post was me not paying attention, I was saying Serela is town and Serela is really super obvtown being wagoned for stupid reasons, this means I'm not paying attention because ???

It's funny that you say the burden of proof is on me when two seconds of reading CirnoF7 should net you the same conclusion as me, CF7 is on snoremode. Why tthe fuck are you advocating quicklynching me if someone whose wagon I would support flips scum? If SeaEffSet claims something big we can quickwagon non-care #2 together.


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia

Conqueror

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #311 on: March 10, 2014, 08:09:39 AM »
##Vote: CF7
Never mind, I don't want Serela lynched.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Shadoweh

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  • The STRONGEST Day Effect
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #312 on: March 10, 2014, 08:11:54 AM »
I think you're wrong. You could argue last game he was playing badly. Right now he is not playing as himself.


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia

Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #313 on: March 10, 2014, 08:15:38 AM »
Could you elaborate on this a little? There's defeatism when you're looking to be the likely lynch, and then there's hyperdefeatism when the game's barely started and there's just a smidgen of pressure.
That's actually a good point and I swear I had a town read somewhere where did I put it?
Looking back on it, the read was just one of those things where I got King was town because CF7 was doing the same thing only scummier. It's kind of weird in retrospect because I just now did that same thing with Sacchi where King was scummier.

Regardless of whether King is scum or not, I think I can still maintain that CF7 should be lynched before him just going by the way they handle their apathy towards reading the game.

I think Town!Serela's alternative was to just not use it to begin with. Also I think I eventually turned towards the way of thinking you spouted at me about how Serela used his role. I think the reason he used it on BT was as a panic button to get some sort of roleclear cred, and of course he couldn't use it on the only guy tunneling on him because that would be hyper-self-defencism which would only cause people to look at him more suspiciously.

Conqueror

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #314 on: March 10, 2014, 08:16:18 AM »
Because I'm rereading backwards.Although this one sums a bunch of them up nicely. You called my "bluff" while I was unconscious you know. I don't get why you think that post was me not paying attention, I was saying Serela is town and Serela is really super obvtown being wagoned for stupid reasons, this means I'm not paying attention because ???
I don't know what you're even talking about. If I had cared anything about your Serela posts I would have quoted the ones that came after that progression. The "paying attention" bit was bravado that felt fake, like you were trying to imitate what you usually do in your town games, but it was different. The other part of that first quote was pointing out the bit about Kingault, but apparently you've thought he was scum the whole time so that doesn't matter now.

It's funny that you say the burden of proof is on me when two seconds of reading CirnoF7 should net you the same conclusion as me, CF7 is on snoremode. Why tthe fuck are you advocating quicklynching me if someone whose wagon I would support flips scum? If SeaEffSet claims something big we can quickwagon non-care #2 together.
It's funny you should say that because I spent way more than two seconds reading CirnoF7 and I didn't get the same conclusion. CF7 is on snoremode, sure. That doesn't make him scum, that makes him a lazy bum like half the players in this game.
If Kingault flips scum you're probably his buddy from glorious D1 interactions. On a more serious note, if you want to support it, vote it.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #315 on: March 10, 2014, 08:18:52 AM »
Actually scratch the last sentence of that post since like 99% of the time I've said something like that I've been wrong. It's just a GUT feeling I guess. Turbolynching is more if I die mysteriously overnight.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #316 on: March 10, 2014, 08:19:54 AM »
I think you're wrong. You could argue last game he was playing badly. Right now he is not playing as himself.
Remember that game where Validon got replaced by a weird bear?


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Shadoweh

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  • The STRONGEST Day Effect
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #317 on: March 10, 2014, 08:26:56 AM »
I don't know what you're even talking about. If I had cared anything about your Serela posts I would have quoted the ones that came after that progression. The "paying attention" bit was bravado that felt fake, like you were trying to imitate what you usually do in your town games, but it was different. The other part of that first quote was pointing out the bit about Kingault, but apparently you've thought he was scum the whole time so that doesn't matter now.
Oh yes, I've read how my Serela posts appaently don't matter because no one listens to what I say, and in otther news SCREW YOU. Sometimes I do imitate what I do in my town games. In other games I'm just fucking obvtown reading what's going on and apparently being misunderstood because you listened to who Bard thought I was talking about instead of who I was clearly saying Bard should stop making Epilectic Tree cases over. Why on earth did you think I would be telling Bard someone other then Serela is town anyways considering who he was spamming the lynch button on?

If Kingault was my buddy there'd be alot more honk honk involved. Or completely avoiding talking about him. Screw you, if you want to bum rush your choice wagon you can do the work yourself, I'm not pulling you favors for tanking my credibility because you're a blind spammy SDGDFHGJ. YOU KNOW VERY WELL HOW I TREAT MY BUDDIES, WHY ARE YOU BEING SO NOT-CONQ.


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia

Shadoweh

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #318 on: March 10, 2014, 08:28:13 AM »
Remember that game where Validon got replaced by a weird bear?
Conq, it's 4am and I'm sleepy, the coffee is not telling me what you're talking about.


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #319 on: March 10, 2014, 08:34:08 AM »
If Kingault was my buddy there'd be alot more honk honk involved. Or completely avoiding talking about him. Screw you, if you want to bum rush your choice wagon you can do the work yourself, I'm not pulling you favors for tanking my credibility because you're a blind spammy SDGDFHGJ. YOU KNOW VERY WELL HOW I TREAT MY BUDDIES, WHY ARE YOU BEING SO NOT-CONQ.
I wasn't talking about your posts in relation to Serela in the first place, I was talking about how you approached CF7. I have no idea how we came to this issue.

Also, you are totally capable of soft bussing your buddies, c'mon. Are you telling me your scum game is shit Shadoweh. :V Regardless this isn't a productive line. It'd be like me saying if I was scum with CF7 here I'd have bussed him right from the get-go for the cred (I only tend to defend those buddies that will survive to the end) (but scumplay isn't static anyway)

I've decided Kingault can be left to the vigs. I can't deal with this nonplayer shit. I want to lynch it on sight.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #320 on: March 10, 2014, 08:35:18 AM »
Conq, it's 4am and I'm sleepy, the coffee is not telling me what you're talking about.
I think it was town mafia. Validon wasn't posting neurotically and several of us thought he was scum for it. But he was town and just not in his groove yet.

it's 4 am and i should have gone to sleep hours ago. about 10 morem inutes and im done.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #321 on: March 10, 2014, 08:36:27 AM »
shadoweh if you are scum trying to manipulate me by being fakemad i will hate you forever


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Shadoweh

  • I will ahn~ vote count for you
  • *
  • The STRONGEST Day Effect
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #322 on: March 10, 2014, 08:48:27 AM »
The funny thing is when I'm scum it doesn't seem like I have to try to make you say quotes you'll be sorry for.
Mmm, yes I remember that. Maybe you should go look at that case again if you want to see me tunneling on a person for awhile, btw. I don't know, I think this time is different? I have high hopes thhat Serela is a town counterwagon made out of terrible votes and the dreams of Bardiche and we're all going to dance together tonight in happiness.


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #323 on: March 10, 2014, 08:52:19 AM »
Okay.

More posts like these tomorrow and we're getting somewhere.

Sleeping.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Sky_Paladin

  • Caution is advised.
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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #324 on: March 10, 2014, 09:27:42 AM »
##unvote
Not an empty unvote.  I am putting my vote somewhere.  I just have pages of reading to catch up and apparently a Serela lynch is possible before I've read.
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CF7

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #325 on: March 10, 2014, 09:44:42 AM »
For CF7, since it would help your case lot if you posted beyond the bare minimum you're posting now.
Why these three?
Mostly gut. But my gut reads are usually more or less right and i tend to trust my gut. But it's not enough of reason at this point.
Sometimes rumors are just... rumors

Sky_Paladin

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #326 on: March 10, 2014, 09:45:18 AM »
OK. 

I think there's something going on with Hikari and Kingault.  I also have a couple of problems with what they've done specifically. 

When I voted Kingault for his terrible vote on CF7 around midphase, and Hikari responded at the end of his wall with a vote on me.  Here. 

The reason for the vote was:
Quote
Okay, so you vote Kingault for what I can understand are valid reasons, but your case on dan is just... No. And I don't think this game works on statistics.

Kingault's answer feels incredibly anti-town to me however, if you really are town then why is your answer basically amounting to "sure, whatever"?

I think Hikari's vote is worse than Kingault's for a couple of reasons, so that's why I challenged him on it twice and set a trap. 

Part 1:  I didn't make a case on Dan.  I put a RVS vote out on Dan because I was frustrated with his apathetic performance last game and was happy to policy lynch him if nothing better came up.  Dan put out a good first effort though so I was willing to shift my vote.  I didn't exist in Hikari's analysis until I voted for Kingault.  Hikari even agreed that Kingault's answers are incredibly anti-town yet still votes for me

So, the initial reason for his vote was officially 'because my case on Dan was bad' and 'actually I agree with you'. 

Hikari is aware their vote looks awful and feels compelled to post this shortly after, "Clarifying a bit more on my vote here: It feels like Sky Paladin is really grasping at straws here, plus the Kingault thing actually feels a bit opportunistic to me since people have been dismissing the CF7 wagon"  At this stage, CF7 was at L-2 so this 'dismissing the CF7 wagon' bit is baloney.  Actually, I was one of the people dismissing the CF7 wagon because I don't feel like there's really a case in there; however CF7's ACTUAL behavior is kind of anti-social so I'm not hard defending him like I was last game.  So this is incorrect. 

I then challenged Hikari for a better explanation; "Kingault's post was bad, yes, but I also feel that you're way too opportunistic for immediately hopping on him."  So now it's an opportunistic vote despite agreeing that King is totally scum for his post.  Why won't Hikari vote for scum?  Hikari also admits in this same post that he doesn't have any scum reads apart from Sky, necessarily excluding King. 

I challenged a second time and Hikari responds with the same basic point (opportunistic vote), but then adds "I'm not giving him a beginner pass however, mostly because I'm also a beginner and I'm trying my darnest".  Except that you are giving him a beginner pass, aren't you?  Then Hikari says, quite unprompted:
"Shadoweh > Serela > You"
Why were you voting for Sky_Paladin if you had higher scumread priorities?  It sounds like there's a tactical reason behind not wanting to move your vote. 

Anyway, so at this stage I felt Hikari isn't really voting me for the reasons they say.  So I shifted my vote (Serela and Bardiche coincidentally provided a nice timing to look natural, thank you~) to see what would happen. 

Sure enough, Hikari's next post is him vote shifting off of me on to Shadoweh. 

Now, you could make the argument that Hikari was thinking about vote hopping already, but I want to make the argument that Hikari countervoted me to protect his scumbuddy Kingault, and then when no wagon eventuated, needed to find a better place to vote park. 

##vote Kingault

King voted CF7 so for this story to make any sense at all, CF7 is probably town, and Shadoweh/Serela are probably also town. 

Well, this is my last post probably before phase end, so fingers crossed it's a good one. 
My programming et al blog;
http://infinitestateautomaton.wordpress.com/

You want more mafia?
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Sky_Paladin

  • Caution is advised.
  • Unit vector from the center is the surface normal?
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #327 on: March 10, 2014, 09:47:24 AM »
Actually, throw SB into my scumpick bin, just for the hell of it. 

Ah, there was one more thing. 

I'm voting Kingault instead of Hikari because there's already a vote on King, so while it's increasingly unlikely any of them will get lynched, no reason to make it impossible and vote Hikari.  A flip of either one will be informative. 
My programming et al blog;
http://infinitestateautomaton.wordpress.com/

You want more mafia?
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BT

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Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #328 on: March 10, 2014, 09:47:59 AM »
Okay no, we have 2 hours left.

Shadoweh

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  • The STRONGEST Day Effect
Re: Medaka Box Mafia - Day 1
« Reply #329 on: March 10, 2014, 09:52:49 AM »
Mostly gut. But my gut reads are usually more or less right and i tend to trust my gut. But it's not enough of reason at this point.
HEY DUDE what's your claim. You are like super getting lynched, lay it out.


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia