The iDOLM@STER Mafia Thread 1 (Locked)

[Sky_Paladin]

Ughh not being able to hit edit is a pain. 

What I mean to say is: CF7's claim is easily tested.  We'll know during the commercial break if we can talk or not.  I think that if he was scum, he would claim another, harder to verify role. 

[Serela]

Ughh not being able to hit edit is a pain. 

What I mean to say is: CF7's claim is easily tested.  We'll know during the commercial break if we can talk or not.  I think that if he was scum, he would claim another, harder to verify role.

scum could also be able to actually make it happen in some way (such as him actually having that role)

PX's last RM game had some of the most ridiculous roles, I wouldn't put it past him. CF7 isn't confirmed to be town even if we can all actually talk at night.

[CF7]

CF7's claiming shenanigans are the weirdest thing ever (I'm a vanilla townie, oh my role name, it's just idol, oh no everyone's yelling at me uh I'm a vanilla townie with one little power nevermind, oh wait you want to actually know what it is, uh okay it makes me insomniac, I mean uh it makes EVERYONE insomniac that's cool right) but I guess it's super confirmable? Not that it doesn't mean he can be scum but it's still odd

But seriously, if you're going to claim, you CLAIM. And you especially don't claim HAVING ABSOLUTELY NO POWERS when you ACTUALLY HAVE POWERS THAT YOU SHOULDN'T BE AFRAID OF CLAIMING (I have no idea why someone would ever be afraid of claiming insomniac, so)

I said i am a VT. Technically a VT. Since i don't have any active powers that influence the game, which fits the description of VT. And it doesn't contradict itself. It only expands previous claim.
Since it's my claim, i think i'm free to claim information i want. I'm just used not to reveal any personal information at all. So i just was cautious not to reveal too much information so it will violate rules.

[CF7]

In Role Madness scum can just assume everyone has some kind of power, so it's not that bad to claim you have something- although obviously you wouldn't want to claim what it -is-

Still i think it's counter-productive for a town player to claim this. Because if i were scum i would want to kill a townie that gets almost guaranteed bonuses by hammering.

scum could also be able to actually make it happen in some way (such as him actually having that role)

And the point of this scum!role is?

[Serela]

VT means no powers period, if you have a power you are not a VT, this is like super basics stuff here :C

Insomniac is actually a pretty good power if used well!

[Mitsuki]

CF7 STOP IGNORING ME AND CLAIM YOUR ROLE NAME AS IT WAS GIVEN TO YOU! (?__________?)

[CF7]

CF7, I meant role name, not character name.

I am the Goddess of Singing.

VT means no powers period, if you have a power you are not a VT, this is like super basics stuff here :C
Insomniac is actually a pretty good power if used well!

But as long as this power is active which coincidentally is tied to me being alive, everyone has the same power, which basically become basic for everyone (woah tautology here), so technically i don't have any powers that are not shared by anyone else and therefore... let's just stop here. Even tho i enjoy some sophism here and there...
Also
##Vote Serela
Since his answers only strengthened my conviction.

/cut
I just did.
Fixed

[CF7]

Oh... I screwed up quote tags.

[PX]

Oh God, I can finally wake up after the sun rises!

Song: Ohayou! Asagohan

Conq (1) - Sky Paladin
CF7 (6) - Darkninjaabc, Serela, Zakeri, Validon98, NekoNekoRex, Raikaria
Darkninjaabc (1) - Serious Bananas
Raikaria (2) - Conq, Shadoweh
Serela (1) - CF7
Not Voting: ActionDan, BT, Mitsuki

|||||||||||||||||||||(40%)

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.
CF7 is at L-2

Friendly reminder that players are allowed the ask the mod all questions, even if I may refuse for balance reasons. Just don't ask for my 3 sizes  :blush:

[Sky_Paladin]

Maybe I missed something obvious, but it seems Serious Banana's has a x2 vote?  All the players are accounted for in the voting tally now, so there's no invisible voter power. 

No idea what you're talking about  :derp:

[Mitsuki]

Mitsuki I will forgive you if you ~*~vote raikaria~*~ with me

I admit that I should read him better as now I don't know if he's just being Raikaria or if he's actually scummy. But right now I want to
##Vote: Zakeri

Serela always pointed out that it's too early for lurker hunts, but why does putting a vote on a lurker now make it harder to consolidate lynch at the end of the day?

I don't like the way he misunderstood what I said and asked about it; it just felt like he was looking for excuses to vote someone other than CF7.

He just has 4 posts with almost no content. He picked BT's reasoning when voting CF7. I understand that there wasn't much to say when he placed his vote, but I'd expect him to bring up something on his own by now.

He's also somehow contradictory on his last post:

This actually isn't that bad of a point against CF7. It's just an observation of the unfortunate Debater's Paradox. basically, because BT put the most effort into his case, He's the one that's getting the rep for it's existence. This is why people should be more weary of sheepers.

Here he thinks that what BT brought up is a relevant point against CF7 and he explains it.

I'm already getting to the part where I don't feel good about the major wagons
CF7 needs an update before I change my mind on him though.

But here he says he's beginning not to like the CF7 wagon.


It's not that much but considering that he's only made 4 posts and that he's supposed to be a good player I think this all is meaningful enough to vote him.

Also, as a separate thing: Zakeri, could you please claim your character name? (I won't ask anyone else to claim character name, but now I might bring up a relevant point depending on what he claims)

I am the Goddess of Singing.

I wanted to see if CF7 made up some weird role name, and he hasn't.
His claim is very easy to prove and it gives an advantage to town regardless of his alignment, so I think people voting him should reconsider and postpone the lynch.

[Validon98]

Agh, I've been so busy I haven't really had time to look at things and read. I'm sorry. ;~;
As for my reasons for voting CF7, it was for how his posts about Dark were contradictory in terms of both saying he was being silly and then later implying he was scum. It was someone else's reasoning, I believe. Of course, now that he has claimed... yeah, I don't know. His power is definitely easily tested, so sure, let's not lynch him for tonight.

##Unvote

When I have time later, I'll reread. Again, argh, so busy.

[DNAbc]

By ''not convincing'' I mean as in "this is ridiculous''.

At the moment, we should lynch CF7 for d1.

Up till now, CF7 responses to our cases are vague, disorganized and do not coordinate to his actions,  even when he actually touched L-1. When asked to claim, he again went the weird route and pulled a gradient colour vanilla claim  in a goddamn role madness game? Did you seriously expect us to believe that? Were you a townie, wouldn't it be easier and more convincing were you to simply name the full name, title and ability of your role and the thought process behind your contradictory case and votes and allow us to deem whether it makes sense or not? All your deliberate acts of concealing your intentions only make you reek more of scum. If anything, at least make a response to everyone's doubts on you.



--------
Another interesting thing to note is how Rai originally jumped on me, then swapped to the CF7 leading wagon when he's nearly a goner. Your arguments along the way are also pretty forced, suggesting that instead of actually making a push for your objective, you are more of showing the incentive to make a push for said objective. In other words, you are bussing. Please clearly explain your thought process to us.



I understand that discussion should go on more, but my vote is definitely staying where it is.




 

[CF7]

Darkie, did my cat piss in your shoes or something? Because right now you're being unreasonable. Or is this berserk behavior your normal behavior?
I fully claimed my role, i don't have any abilities that can bite you or anyone. If you don't want to talk at night then go ahead.

[BT]

Huh. That role usually has a name called Insomniac. It's kind of weird that you'd be marked as a VT with it. Even a rainbow colored one.

uh shadoweh our roles aren't 'marked' or named
is that a scum thing or are you high

Considering the stuff going on i don't like this one bit. Even if it's a RVS joke. Every joke has something in it, that is actually true.

Oh it is true, like I said. I thought the way he immediately started rolespeccing for scum roles in a role madness game is completely warped for scum to do. It's similar to the reason I was wavering on you in my last content post.
I'm actually trying to explain why it's warped right now and failing. Maybe it's more how he did it. "oh you must be one of those scum roles" is totally town playing their first online game (check the rpg thread for reference).

I can understand conditional hammering bonuses. I can understand that the role can even be town. Yet BT just said that he gets something out of hammering. It's kind of weird tbh. Why announce it in the first post? To paint yourself as a target for scum? Because really what scum wants a townie who's getting stronger and stronger with each passing day?

Actually since it'll be revealed anyway I'll say it right now, you can tell from how I worded my reveal that it takes several hammers for me to activate my power. No way I'd be achieving that without letting everyone know and cooperate. It's either make yourself a kind-of target for scum but eventually get an ability or do nothing and stay vanilla. It's an obvious choice.

So. Either i am wrong on all accounts and can't read people at all, or there's a scum here somewhere. Darkie, Serela and BT. Maybe all 3, which is unlikely, but still possible.

Town, town, town. Not gonna lie, this entire post was pretty bad but I think it's the null kind of bad at this point. The think Mitsuki raised and his response to it are good examples of why, he's probably town playing badly.
Though I still want you to answer me why you didn't react to my role when I revealed it if you apparently had some prejudice against that kind of role.

But seriously, if you're going to claim, you CLAIM. And you especially don't claim HAVING ABSOLUTELY NO POWERS when you ACTUALLY HAVE POWERS THAT YOU SHOULDN'T BE AFRAID OF CLAIMING (I have no idea why someone would ever be afraid of claiming insomniac, so)

I guess he just wanted to be technical about him being "VT" because by his definition his ability is 100% passive and doesn't count.
Oh he makes this exact reply later, I guess that's cool.

And the point of this scum!role is?

Technically speaking: the point of it would be for you to be able to make this argument. It's a "why would scum have this role" scum role.
(CF7 saying this would probably make no sense if he actually had the role as scum right now so more town points here yo)

##Vote Serela
Since his answers only strengthened my conviction.

Tell me why. Serela is semi-obvious town at this point imho (though I guess it's mostly a meta thing).

I burst out laughing from CF7's last post. Dark, you're sure CF7 is scum and you're going from there when your basis for doing so isn't nearly as strong to make such a move accurate. Try ~resetting~ and looking at things again.

##Vote Raikaria

This is momentarily a gut vote from his recent interactions with CF7. I'll try reading into his play some more now.

(we still have time - I'll unvote and hammer later)

[BT]

So first, what made me vote. Pretty telling that Rai's 'reread' sums up to a runthrough of CF7's posts and why they look bad. Why thank you much. A big influence is how he said

Yeah... no. If anything this is a good reason to lynch you. Either you have some hidden power even you don't know about that likely works on lynch, or you're scum who can't think up a good fakeclaim because this is Role Madness. I think the latter is more likely.

since the bit about 'a hidden power even you don't know about' just reads bad to me, it's like he considers CF7 fully claimed and is looking for answers why his claim is what it is. If you really did think his role was hiding something why not inquire about it instead of drawing conclusions like this?

VT's don't even exist in Role Madness. Everyone has some kind of power.

Like, this matter-of-fact approach is how scum would approach this. What I linked earlier is exactly how I think scum would react to a nonsensical VT claim from someone they know is town.

[BT]

In essence instead of trying to get reactions out of CF7 in real time about his weird claim he tacks it on to his votepost because hey this is something I can use. That's the feeling I get from that.

[Raikaria]

Pretty telling that Rai's 'reread' sums up to a runthrough of CF7's posts and why they look bad. Why thank you much. A big influence is how he saidsince the bit about 'a hidden power even you don't know about' just reads bad to me, it's like he considers CF7 fully claimed and is looking for answers why his claim is what it is.

I've seen roles before where they don't tell you everything. Things like Millers. I can't recall if this game was ever stated to not be bastard.

The rules don't say anything about it either way.

Actually:

@ Mod: Can you rule out bastard elements or not? I cannot recall you doing either way before.

[PX]

There should not be any bastard elements. If you are unsure, ask the mod

[Conqueror]

I said i am a VT. Technically a VT. Since i don't have any active powers that influence the game, which fits the description of VT. And it doesn't contradict itself. It only expands previous claim.

derp. actually, any role that has a power other than the standard voting and talking in the thread during the day is not a vt. just a bit of advice for future games, since this is reminding me of what happened last game. :V

pretty sure cf7 is town now since I think the way that played out would have been...cleaner as scum. >_>

I normally don't think dropping someone is that scummy, but the way raikaria drops darkninja to move to cf7 for is completely unconvincing. and like bt said, it looks like raikaria basically went through cf7's posts and told us why they're scummy instead of trying to read cf7's posts and get his alignment that way.

Wait; what case?

not to mention his points like this one are LOL. seriously this is raitaki from town mafia all over again; blatant word nitpicking at stuff out of context.

Yeah... no. If anything this is a good reason to lynch you. Either you have some hidden power even you don't know about that likely works on lynch, or you're scum who can't think up a good fakeclaim because this is Role Madness. I think the latter is more likely.

1) why would having a hidden power make him scum?
2) i thought the vt claim out of nowhere was more townish than not myself. it adds nothing to his survivability. in a role madness game, wouldn't he try to go for something that would draw a counterclaim or something that would stop people from lynching him?
3) did the mod say somewhere this is role madness? I see people assuming it but like does it actually say somewhere that everyone has a role?

[Conqueror]

While I'm somewhat tempted to let him live for a day just to see if it's true, this is the most unbelievable string of events I have ever seen, so

(that being said we're not hammering immediately because there's actually still delicious discussion to be had, it's funny considering I usually want the day ended sooner the better)

SERELA DO YOU THINK CF7 IS SCUM OR NOT
ALSO DON'T YOU REMEMBER THE TREE STUMP DEBACLE FROM LAST GAME THIS DOESN'T EVEN COME CLOSE TO THAT

[Serela]

SERELA DO YOU THINK CF7 IS SCUM OR NOT
ALSO DON'T YOU REMEMBER THE TREE STUMP DEBACLE FROM LAST GAME THIS DOESN'T EVEN COME CLOSE TO THAT

I THOUGHT IT WAS OBVIOUS THE ANSWER IS YES
AND OH GOD WHY ;_;
(I also want to keep my brain half turned off because it's d1 and doing that so far has made it so much easier for me to actually post, I'm not lurking through d1 and not having cases like I normally do!)
(Maybe I should reread Raikaria though because on gut I'd kinda lynching him/her too, but that's purely gut)

[BT]

I THOUGHT IT WAS OBVIOUS THE ANSWER IS YES
AND OH GOD WHY ;_;
(I also want to keep my brain half turned off because it's d1 and doing that so far has made it so much easier for me to actually post, I'm not lurking through d1 and not having cases like I normally do!)
(Maybe I should reread Raikaria though because on gut I'd kinda lynching him/her too, but that's purely gut)

male

go see a doctor, with any luck you won't be diagnosed with the NNR

turning head off is bad, you sheeped the rest of my posts so at least read my last few ones and tell me how you feel about CF7

[PX]

Confirming that this game is role madness, everybody has a role with an ability, and there is no functional vanilla

[SB]

Responding to BT's #94:

SB's post bothers me. For its content. His point on Dark bothers me because no, that doesn't really imply he thought CF7 was town. His point on Conq bothers me because no, that one line on Dark shouldn't be screaming 'buddying' at you. His point on Mitsuki bothers me because no, taking into account other people's reads like that is fine.

I interpretted what Dark said that he wanted to lynch someone suspicious (CF7) so that scum couldn't use them as a mislynch later on. Looking back over it, I can kind of see the other side to it now. I felt like Conq was buddying due to how the entirity of his Raikaria suspicion was based on his attack on Dark, and how much he kept getting brought up in the post. Taking other people's reads into account is one thing, but Mitsuki pretty much says that "Shadoweh reads Serela well", so it makes it Shadoweh's fault that Mitsuki voted for Serela, if Serela flips town. She also doesn't really give an explanation of why Serela is worse than everyone else in that post, she just asserts that he is.

Raikaria's response to my criticisms bugs me.

Yes, at the time I did it I thought it was OK... but likewise I am aware that you guys tend to act badly towards that, and take it as a scumread. So now I'm taking it as a scumread... I'm impressionistic.

You're missing the point. You did it as town in the past and got mislynched for it, and now you're calling it scummy because of how other people have responded to it in the past, rather than what YOU think of it.

The majority of NNR's #104 looks like a retelling more than anything else. I'm not fond of it.

Shadoweh's #114 bugs me. You can find multiple people who suspect each other scummy, can't you? It's possible that it could be a bus, and shouldn't be written off so quickly.

Zak's #118 looks kind of like he's overreacting to the 2 MAN STRONG DARK WAGON and doesn't really give scumreads aside from CF7. Do you have any others?

CF7's #119 attack on Serela is bad. It's like he's suspecting Serela for voting him and then still finding him scummy after new posts, but apparently Zak is alright? Why is Zak so different?

Disagree in #128 that outing is definitely a towntell, because town and mafia both want to gain their abilities. Don't think that the suggestion is scummy though.

Maybe I missed something obvious, but it seems Serious Banana's has a x2 vote?  All the players are accounted for in the voting tally now, so there's no invisible voter power. 

I'm just that good.

I think that the CF7 claim mishap is a null tell if nothing else, I think he could've been scum panicking and claimed way too early with no teammates around to help his claim sound believable, but it might just be another treestump incident. The infinite nighttalk thing is a null tell imo, like Conq having the Neighborizing role last game, there's nothing to say that it isn't his only ability, and I still think his earlier play was bad.

[NekoNekoRex]

I need to stop putting this shit off, seriously, I am terrible.

[Mitsuki]

Also, as a separate thing: Zakeri, could you please claim your character name? (I won't ask anyone else to claim character name, but now I might bring up a relevant point depending on what he claims)

Forget about this, it was all a HUGE misunderstanding;;;

[NekoNekoRex]

Agh I'm suffering trying to read this game here.
##Unvote CF7 no longer looks like scum to me, mostly because his claim is flailing bad, which reminds me of the Tree Stump thing from last game (although that's already been compared, but w/e)
@CF7: That would make you a Night Talk Enabler, if you really want a title for your role.

Anyway
I want to vote Serela because a lot of his posts look like sheep behavior, but my Gut isn't really there.

I need to ISO more people (and actually get it done now), but one thing I do want to do in the meantime:
##Vote: Darkninja
Dude seriously, stop the goddamn tunneling. It's getting grating watching you post blocks of text on the guy and have next to nothing to say about anyone else.

[Shadoweh]

I'm so sad. I was going to scream at people for how this is exactly like what happened last game
Especially at Serela
AND CONQ ALREADY BEAT ME TO IT WHAT AM I EVEN HERE FOR?!

Serela if you aren't unvoting CF7 and going after someone else by your next post I will spend the night listening to a symphony of your screams. Idc who at this point but your brain has to turn on long enough to sheep someone (hint IT SHOULD BE ME)

SB: Considering he wasn't actually talking about Conq being scummy I don't believe I was incorrect. I don't think voting for someone your suspects are voting for is scummy exactly, it's more that people do it alot without thinking about it. I've been firmly in the Ninja-town camp since ED1.

I also don't think this claim debacle is null at all. Consider what happened last game with CF7 getting lynched because his roleclaim was so confusing no one wanted to think about it. As scum in the very next game, do you really think he would claim a bunch of confusing things again? All it does is have the potential to make everyone mad and want to lynch him again, and scum generally want to impress on you that their claim is work keeping them alive over. It's really town. Come vote Raikaria, that Ninja wagon is never happening.

[Shadoweh]

Neko what did I just say? >:< THAT IS OFF-LIMITS