Author Topic: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis  (Read 77037 times)

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #30 on: August 11, 2009, 05:47:40 AM »
I woke up at 2PM. Figures. Starving, alone, afraid.

I have school at 4. I came home from lunch at 2:45.

I'll get as much Koishi as done as possible right now, while completely ignoring my homework.

hard at work fixed. and I'm pretty sure it means both.

5/7 Koishi complete. I'll do the rest at 22:00 Tokyo time.

Then the next person.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 06:41:37 AM by Lucarius »

Helepolis

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Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #31 on: August 11, 2009, 07:07:29 AM »
only thing so far is that Marisa does have Final Spark in IN (not to mention IaMP), both as a non-playable character and as a playable character:
http://touhou.wikia.com/wiki/Imperishable_Night:_Characters
http://touhou.wikia.com/wiki/Imperishable_Night:_Stage_4B_Spell_Cards#Spell_Card_098

Sadly, no mention of Orreries Sun.. but at least there's Spark (which also doesn't mention Yuka's original Master Spark). Will wait to see what Marisa has to say about Patchy's Non-Directional Laser (which is a non-spellcard), if it's present.

She mentions her slaves (familiars w/e) in her Event Horizon which are the orreries I believe. One thing I am confused: If she mentions/analyses her own Masterspark (which is supose to be a imitated from Mima/Yuka) why not the other imitated ones. She does however admit she is being inspired/basing things on other character's techniques, like she explained Alice her exploding dolls for her Shoot the moon. Marisa has alot of different named cards which makes it even more confusing. I believe Shoot the Moon is the hard/lunatic version and Milky Way is the easy/normal version.

Basicly she is analysing her most beloved and interesting cards it seems which fits her.

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #32 on: August 11, 2009, 07:42:55 AM »
This was really fun to read, thanks.  I'm really looking forward to more!

Zengar Zombolt

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Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #33 on: August 11, 2009, 11:30:59 AM »
I believe Shoot the Moon is the hard/lunatic version and Milky Way is the easy/normal version.
Actually, that's what's confusing me.
The Easy/Normal version isn't Milky Way, It's Earth Light Ray. Yet, she does not mention that spell card.

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #34 on: August 11, 2009, 12:44:45 PM »
To all of you who are commenting on what spellcards Marisa did or didn't right down, read the afterward.

She wanted to drink tea. Moreover, she wanted to do the thinking part about her research. Even moreover, she says "representative" spellcards.

Finishing Koishi.

(You have no idea how much nicovideo time I'm sacrificing. Just look at my storage mylist inflate. It was even hammer day today...)

So watch for me.
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/nm5028603
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/nm5064729
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/nm5156038
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/nm5353992
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/nm6259324
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/nm7023809
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/nm7901605

It's by the person who drew my avatar. 2 4 5 and 6 are a must watch.

Working.... working...

Aww gifs don't work. Her eyes are supposed to rolling.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 12:54:28 PM by Lucarius »

Helepolis

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Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #35 on: August 11, 2009, 12:56:26 PM »
Actually, that's what's confusing me.
The Easy/Normal version isn't Milky Way, It's Earth Light Ray. Yet, she does not mention that spell card.
You got my post wrong. What I mentioned are two different attacks:  1st card (Milky Way easy/normal  & Astroidbelt hard/lunatic)  4th spellcard (Masterspark: easy/normal & Doublespark: hard/lunatic)  and 5th card: (Earth Light Ray: easy/normal & Shoot the Moon: hard/lunatic:)

@Lucarius,
I am not complaining about why she doesn't names ALL spellcards. More like trying to figure out why she selects a few of her own spellcards. It is a little shame there is no indept analysis of Marisa for explaining why she selects certain cards.

And ZUN's afterward is somehow really amazing. As far as my english goes and understood: He doesn't want people to read this book like as a strategy guide or something but more like "grab it when your heart asks for it".

PS: Who is "Hakurei Kannushi" ?

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #36 on: August 11, 2009, 01:08:10 PM »
I purposely avoided using the term "complaining" to make it sort of like a joke... but I failed. Like always.

Hakurei Kannushi 博麗神主 = the holy owner of Hakurei. Holy gives the meaning of the name a different and more gloating taste... but it's the closest. Simply put, it's his way of saying he's the author. Most people in nicovideo address ZUN as Kannushi.

I'm sure many people would agree with me when I say that the Afterward and the Foreward are the best part of his books. I'm pretty sure I got that translated right, because I really wanted to get the message across.

Listening to Vocaloid Ranking 97~... You murderer~♪ Yeah~♪
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 01:11:54 PM by Lucarius »

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #37 on: August 11, 2009, 01:50:43 PM »
Double post, cuz I finished Koishi.

Lots of problems... concerning word play. I don't know if I got Marisa's message across accurately. Well, I never know, but I mean my level of confidence.

I had to look up two kanjis this time, but it was no sweat. 疎ら means spaced out, both the physical and psychological sense. 抑 means forced or pressured.

That's Koishi for y'all. I like her spellcards because they resemble me.

You all do realize that that's already a little more than 1/10 of the whole book.

I'm going to be watching nicovideo for about an hour, and then I'll do whoever is up next.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 01:55:05 PM by Lucarius »

Helepolis

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Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #38 on: August 11, 2009, 02:19:51 PM »
but I failed. Like always.
You are being way too negative about yourself. Atleast that is the tone I am sensing from reading your previous posts which puzzles me as I see no such reason.

I'll see if I can get my hands on the book somehow from a certain site. Think Paletweb was selling it.

Gpop

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #39 on: August 11, 2009, 02:50:12 PM »
but I failed. Like always.
You are being way too negative about yourself. Atleast that is the tone I am sensing from reading your previous posts which puzzles me as I see no such reason.

He's like that in general, although he seems better than how he was over at FFR back then.

Anyways, I read through Koishi's spellcard comments. A lot of things I never thought about through most of them, but the first one I questioned. I never noticed ancestors as well =/.

Also, I found her spellcards Honnou, Yokusei and Kirawaremono most interesting. It seems like those spellcards changes her mood and facial expressions as well. Of course you never see that in the game.

Kuma

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Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #40 on: August 11, 2009, 02:57:57 PM »
what, where can I read it, I want to see!
Wotters gonna' wot


Gpop

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #41 on: August 11, 2009, 02:58:19 PM »
what, where can I read it, I want to see!

OP post.

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #42 on: August 11, 2009, 03:36:39 PM »
He's like that in general, although he seems better than how he was over at FFR back then.

Anyways, I read through Koishi's spellcard comments. A lot of things I never thought about through most of them, but the first one I questioned. I never noticed ancestors as well =/.

Also, I found her spellcards Honnou, Yokusei and Kirawaremono most interesting. It seems like those spellcards changes her mood and facial expressions as well. Of course you never see that in the game.

This made me feel queasy. It must be the id and the superego. Id says thanks, awesome buddy. Superego says shut up. \(=_=)/~

I don't believe pessimism is worse or better than optimism. I believe both is neither. However, I really do suck at both grasping and making jokes and sarcasm, because I'm serious as long as I'm not tired or starving.

It's 12:35AM here, and I don't know if I want to start Yukari today. Primarily because the first two letters are probably the hardest letters I'll face in this book.

Gpop

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #43 on: August 11, 2009, 03:41:32 PM »
Hey, it's great that you're translating this book, but you don't have to kill yourself over it really. Take your time. We're not that eager over it (well, not me at least).

Alfred F. Jones

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Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #44 on: August 11, 2009, 03:44:44 PM »
Koishi's spellcards made for some really interesting readin' for me. This entire book seems to be turning out to be an excellent source for information, which is good (Koishi is the main character of my fiction, after all) for a writer who would like to draw as much help from canon as she possibly can. Thanks much.

Also, Lucarius' comments/analyses remind me of ZUN's for whatever reason. This is a very good thing in my eyes. Keep at it.

It's 12:35AM here, and I don't know if I want to start Yukari today.

Go to sleep~ Nobody's so eager to see this that they'd run the translator into the ground. Or at least, I should hope no one thinks that way.

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #45 on: August 11, 2009, 03:52:49 PM »
if you translate this book, my god we'll love you.

GOD iz srs biznis. No doubt.

Koishi's spellcards made for some really interesting readin' for me. This entire book seems to be turning out to be an excellent source for information, which is good (Koishi is the main character of my fiction, after all) for a writer who would like to draw as much help from canon as she possibly can. Thanks much.

Also, Lucarius' comments/analyses remind me of ZUN's for whatever reason. This is a very good thing in my eyes. Keep at it.

Go to sleep~ Nobody's so eager to see this that they'd run the translator into the ground. Or at least, I should hope no one thinks that way.

My Japanese is affected by other Japanese. My thought is mostly done in Japanese now-a-these-days. Hence, my thought is affected by other Japanese.

It's probably not just that, though. I don't like to say it, but I've been thinking in a similar fashion to ZUN before I knew Touhou. If people observed the world outside the box, you can end up somewhere near ZUN. I just happened to be raised outside the box.

As for sleep, I used to not sleep at all, and I travel globally often so my sleeping habits are completely astray. I'd rather translate this than face the boredom I face during the process of getting to the subconscious state. It's just a matter of which process I feel is more boring, and more worthwhile in the mid-run.

I got the kanji, so I'll translate Yukari now. The kanji, by the way, was 魍魎. It's part of a yonmoji jukugo (four-letter saying). It's a collective reference to youkai that arise from natural concepts. More to come from the first spellcard analysis...

I'll be translating while I watch Mars Story CPV part 47~, so it'll take a while.

As for the Touhou wiki, if you don't want this translation to become buried and unknown to the greater half of the American Touhou community, I would suggest someone put it up there without mentioning my name. I have no intention of doing so. I also don't like to look at wikis to get information, though I know it could answer the kanji questions I have. It's a feeling analogous to the use of a strategy guide for beating an RPG. Translation, like everything else in this world, to me, is a game. Even life is a game, a game in which you have no idea what the rules are supposed to be, and are forced to speculate. Well, not "even," but it is.

Yukari has 6 pages, 7 spellcards. The analysis may take a while, considering she's one of the founders of Gensoukyo, and THE most intelligent. Expect 1.5 hours.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 04:00:28 PM by Lucarius »

Gpop

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #46 on: August 11, 2009, 03:55:39 PM »
if you translate this book, my god we'll love you.

GOD iz srs biznis. No doubt.

Hey, I said that we'll like you, but that didn't mean that you had to cram yourself into this book.

Hieda no Aya

  • I see you remodeled.
Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #47 on: August 11, 2009, 03:58:42 PM »
Shush, I'll thank you if I want to. It's not like it costs me anything, and I really do appreciate this whether or not you do.

Anyway, that's really interesting stuff. Marisa's surprisingly insightful too. But more than her, one should never underestimate ZUN... And since it looks like she's leaving a fair number of spellcards out -- picking the ones that stand out most to her -- I wonder if the selection is more him or her. Ah, fictional authors are fun like that.

I've also been asked to relay a request for poor Reimu herself. Though at this rate, I can't think of anyone I'm not interested in seeing.

ETA: Also, this inspired me to finally get around to watching a video of the Koishi fight. Damn she has some cool-looking attacks!
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 05:36:08 PM by Hieda no Aya »

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #48 on: August 11, 2009, 04:02:08 PM »
Bookworms cram themselves into books. It's a natural law, because that's where bookworms reside.

Have the guests join shrinemaiden lol.

Working... working...

I think I edit my posts too much. However, that's mostly because of my personality. Philosophy changes according to the raw information that is gathered. Whenever something new comes up, it has to be hastily recorded before the rawness dissipates.

Reimu added.

One reason you might want to get this recorded somewhere else, is because I'm not saving it anywhere else.

I'm going to idly check for new posts when I'm done with a spellcard...
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 04:29:58 PM by Lucarius »

Drake

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Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #49 on: August 11, 2009, 04:11:06 PM »
I'm saving it all.

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Helepolis

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Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #50 on: August 11, 2009, 04:30:14 PM »
Ditto here. When I get the book I can simply print this stuff out and read the translation and look up the images in the book.

if you translate this book, my god we'll love you.

GOD iz srs biznis. No doubt.

Hey, I said that we'll like you, but that didn't mean that you had to cram yourself into this book.

I am sure on the net being thankful is mostly overrated as you cannot expres is like you can in real life. You cannot hear the persons who are thankful thus cannot judge their tone of their voice, their face or simply the thankful radiation they emit. Like Gpop says: You don't need to cram yourself, bookworm or not.

Afterall it is a privelege we get this translated by your help, not a right. Thus atleast I am thankful and this translation really motivated me to buy the book. Paletweb sells it still.

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #51 on: August 11, 2009, 04:43:31 PM »
I must really suck at joking. Ya know, there are always those people who know how to make jokes on the internet. I thought I did a good job with the bookworm.

I'll just shut up. =)

Halfway done with Yakumo. I'm just going to add Satori because she only has one spellcard, and she's in between Yukari and Koishi.

There's half of Yakumo, about. Taking a break~

minute break done. Back to work. Breaks are boring for the superego.

I wonder if anyone notices subtle changes I make in the ones I already posted...
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 05:22:21 PM by Lucarius »

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #52 on: August 11, 2009, 05:37:20 PM »
I would be pleased if you could do Komachi as well.

Thank you very much for your translations up to now.

Zengar Zombolt

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  • Green-Red Divine Clock
Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #53 on: August 11, 2009, 05:56:55 PM »
...Woah.
Just woah.
This is far too awesome for my mind to process.
I... damn.
* Zengar genuflects
By the way, Yukari Ougi [Danmaku Kekkai] is what we know as Danmaku Bounded Field?

Gpop

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #54 on: August 11, 2009, 06:25:15 PM »
I must really suck at joking. Ya know, there are always those people who know how to make jokes on the internet. I thought I did a good job with the bookworm.

I'll just shut up. =)

Halfway done with Yakumo. I'm just going to add Satori because she only has one spellcard, and she's in between Yukari and Koishi.

There's half of Yakumo, about. Taking a break~

minute break done. Back to work. Breaks are boring for the superego.

I wonder if anyone notices subtle changes I make in the ones I already posted...

Internet is hard to detect sarcasm btw.

Drake

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Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #55 on: August 11, 2009, 06:26:56 PM »
Yeah, you can't discern whether a person is joking or not just by their manner of typing, or something. That'd be stupid.

A Colorful Calculating Creative and Cuddly Crafty Callipygous Clever Commander
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Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #56 on: August 11, 2009, 06:40:41 PM »
I would be pleased if you could do Komachi as well.

Thank you very much for your translations up to now.

Komachi added.

By the way, Yukari Ougi [Danmaku Kekkai] is what we know as Danmaku Bounded Field?

Why can't there be a single word for "the space within a barrier or border"? I think I'll stick with Danmaku Barrier, if you all don't mind. Kekkai is barrier. Kyoukai is "bounded field." Kyou is border, kai is area. It's simply a matter of naming sense.

Done with both Yukari and Satori. I didn't reread, because I don't have the power to reread efficiently. List up errors while I take a bath. I probably wrote something wrong about modern thinking towards perpetual motion.

Also, I'm planning a prank for you all sometime in the distant or near future. ~♪ Hopefully, I'll remember to do it. I wonder how many people will notice. It'll be big and noticeable but inconspicuous and deceitful. Not a small typo or something. I do that all the time.

3:48AM right now. I have no school tomorrow, so I can do this for a while. As long as I can translate efficiently. I'll probably be doing some CASL and C# while I do this.

Do you know how shampoo turns into glue if you don't wash the tub after you use it? Ugh...
(I'm living alone in an apartment, fending for myself in modern society.)

Please don't say you are lazy ~♪
(You know this album sold 2x as much as the third place album did within the anisong industry... a whooping 130000 for spring 2009. The OP sold 120000. Never will watch the anime though. Kyoani has been hitting the dumps.)

There's this term, 動揺, which I can't seem to translate in a satisfactory fashion. It's like being mentally shaken. It comes out in the Komeiji sisters' spellcards. It's not as far as a mental breakdown, but it's that status in which you become vulnerable because of trauma or guilt or fear or regret or taunt. Any ideas?

The best way to concentrate is to not concentrate. Otherwise, you put too much concentration into concentrating.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 07:18:39 PM by Lucarius »

Hieda no Aya

  • I see you remodeled.
Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #57 on: August 11, 2009, 07:26:39 PM »
I suppose that's a necessary problem of translating. You can try as hard as you like to be precise, but one language simply won't always be able to convey the same things as easily as another.

I always find it really interesting to see how different people translate the same thing, though. Feels like getting a glimpse at the connotations and obliquenesses behind words I don't know, like triangulating. Different langauges really function differently in basic ways sometimes.

But "Arousal", huh... ;D

I'm also slowly becoming more amused by the various weird things Marisa rates these spell cards on. And your notes sound more ZUN-like by the minute, at least aside from the parts where you get all nihilist. A couple other points -- for one of Yukari's cards, Marisa's remark is "Seen at meikai, theatrical type". What's meikai? Also, I just noticed that back in Koishi's, you repeated her remark from the first card ("So many ancestors") on the second.

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #58 on: August 11, 2009, 07:35:24 PM »
I'm glad someone's reading to a level of satisfaction~

I'll add meikai.

lol nihilism. If you mean something about "there's no reason for life, everyone just makes believe there is" it's just my way of respecting the youkai acceptance of reasoning. It's the bliss of ignorance. All creatures find their own form of joy in life by doing so. There is no reasoning. Science is not reasoning either at the existential level.

I found several typos after rereading, while trying to fix the distraction/disturbance cross term. I would like to be notified of typos.

Added meikai.
Fixed the nihilism into something more optimistic. To me, optimism and pessimism have no value like everything else in this world. Not the same value, but no value. They're mirror images of each other. But if it makes you all happy, fine. The wordiness becomes tedious after a while~

I'm taking half the posts on here. I wish there were more posts to respond to =_=
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 07:46:18 PM by Lucarius »

Lucarius

Re: The Grimoire of Marisa Translation and Analysis
« Reply #59 on: August 11, 2009, 09:09:35 PM »
Double posting because I'm done with Shikieiki.

Lots of good read for existential philosophers.

If there is some demand, I can sum up my philosophy both about Touhou and about our existence. I doubt there is though.

I don't want to double post. You guys post. My double posting and my post proportions in this thread measure demand and cooperation.

6:09AM. When the higurashi cry.

Oh noes. Patchouli has 13 spellcards... Although the names are all katakana meaning not Japanese, the analysis may get offhand. First of all, I have no idea what foreign word the katakana is supposed to resemble, and there is no way for me to know unless if I know the original word in the first place. For instance, アグニシャイン looks like Agni Shine, but I don't know what Agni is. =_= Research time. I know Princess Undine though lol. Silphy Horn (Silph from Tales of Phantasia?). Metal Fatigue. I have no idea what the dirt one is. I can't imagine why the name would double up on vowels. レイジィトリリトン Regit Liliton? Regi Triliton? It could be anything. Silent Serena, Royal Flare. Larva Kromlek(?), Forest Blaze, Water Elf, Emerald Megalis. Now he mixes Japanese using katakana... Satelite Himawari (sunflower). Even more confusing. And of course, the one and only Japanese name, Kenja no Ishi, or the philosopher's stone.

Agni seems to be fire in sanskrit. I should've known that from the Bartimaeus Trilogy.

As for the dirt one I had no idea about, it's Radiatory Riton. Radiatory lol. Not even a word. Riton is an Alexandrian wine vessel made of metal, forged in Thracia. Makes sense. I found Riton, so I think Radiatory is right. If anyone can think of a better word, tell me. The romaji is RE I JIi TO RI RI TO n. The Rs could be Ls for all I know. Try twisting them about. It's about what it sounds like, not what it's spelled like. The lowercase stands for the lowercase katakana, which is used for emphasis or tailgating.

The remarks are amusing. Look forward to this one.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 09:35:11 PM by Lucarius »