So You Want To Be The Townest Mafia (Thread 1)

[Omba]

It's pretty hilarious that Omba keeps harping on people for going after Bob today when a majority of his D1 was just focused on BT and Bob. His only other scumread toward the end of the day was on Chaore, which he never bothered to actually support and just kind of dropped after he said he needed to re-read Chaore.

D1 != D2 obviously. Also I have no name was accused of having no cases of his own and pointed to only Bob in response. And just... wtf, read the things I wrote again.

(quote shortened because :words:)

Basically, Omba has to be a total ditz[...] etc).

You haven't pointed out anything that actually does not fit together there.

(shortened)

Reading his posts[...] His #578 is a pretty solid example of him doing this.

Attempts to discredit my cases. And uh, maybe, just maybe, I limit myself to saying things that I deem important?
Also what? Where I have stated things that require assuming the person in question is scum beforehand to be valid? The example you point out is bullshit.

Note that he also spent most of early D2 responding to my attacks but not Affinity's, which is quite ridiculous when Affinity and I did not have the exact same cases. Has he even responded to Affinity's specific points yet? I can't find any instances of him doing so.

Responding to Affinity's case on me (specifically #667) would require me to give explanations that are not validable because I haven't stated them on D1. Which I pointed out in #675.
Also I'm pretty damn certain Affinity is town, so what good could come of that? I doubt I'll get lynched over this bullshit so unless people are idiots and try to do it, why bother wasting words on irrelevant things?
I want to get scum lynched. Period.

Your point was awful, so yeah.

Uh... no, that's not going to fly.

--cut by Serela

[Mr_Bob]

Omba's current trend of posting makes me lean towards scum.  I'll post later after 'swimming during spring break'; I'll answer questions, etc. then.

[Omba]

So it's IHNN's fault that Rawr didn't post for 24 hours, now? It's rawr's fault for not posting, IHNN shouldn't be obligated to say "Oh hey rawr by the way you haven't posted" and then wait awhile to see if he doesn't.

Pray tell what happens if rawr later gets cleared as very likely town? By a cop claim, to name an easy example? And if that were to happen in LyLo? Exactly, scum would have a way to off someone who's town without needing town to agree on it. It's quite possible to be unable to post for 24 hours because of matters outside of the game.
Tarring is not a free vig shot and should not be treated as such because you cannot control when someone actually gets set on fire and you do not know what will hapen later on at the point you tar someone.

[Omba]

He (HW) questions someone (Affinity) who did something so as to help him understand them and possibly influence his read on them, and... it's scummy because they're voting the same person as he is?

There's a difference between attacking someone for clearly scummy actions and nitpicking and you know that.

You go for little points when there's either nothing else (ED1) or you already suspect the person because of large points.

[ActionDan]

Guys guys Guys guys Guys guys.

Let's not get lost in Omba's bosom altogether.

I have yet to look at this game since a day ago but I'm pretty sure there is more than Omba that exists.  Look at the big picture at least once more.   

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

You haven't pointed out anything that actually does not fit together there.

Trailing off and forgetting about your opinions is not townie. If it is, then where's your conclusions on Chaore? He hasn't been lurking to the extent that you can't press his posts for anything worthwhile. The way you treated him is actually quite inconsistent with your general approach to scumhunting in this game.

Also what? Where I have stated things that require assuming the person in question is scum beforehand to be valid? The example you point out is bullshit.

Have you read your own cases? A lot of your points are nitpicky as hell and require a ton of stretching to come to a conclusion of scum intent, like whenever you accuse people of referring to you in any slightly negative or patronizing manner as ~ATTEMPTING TO DISCREDIT YOU~, or your entire #758.

Uh... no, that's not going to fly.

Not really, it's a reasonable response. Your point is bad, I've already addressed it, and if you're going to keep pressing your insanely backwards interpretation of my post then it's because you're scum and arguing about it with you would be a waste of time since I'm not going to convince you otherwise.

Dan cut: People weren't even paying attention to Omba until like a page ago. <_<

[Omba]

Trailing off and forgetting about your opinions is not townie. If it is, then where's your conclusions on Chaore? He hasn't been lurking to the extent that you can't press his posts for anything worthwhile. The way you treated him is actually quite inconsistent with your general approach to scumhunting in this game.

Pretty townie. Now guess why I haven't addressed him D2.

Have you read your own cases? A lot of your points are nitpicky as hell and require a ton of stretching to come to a conclusion of scum intent, like whenever you accuse people of referring to you in any slightly negative or patronizing manner as ~ATTEMPTING TO DISCREDIT YOU~, or your entire #758.

That does not mean they require the assumption of the person in question being scum beforehand as you said they did. Everything I point out is either clearly scummy or scummy if scum / oh my god bad if town.
Since things that are oh my shadoweh bad if town in addition to clearly scummy things added together mean SCUM, I point them out. None of my cases save for ED1 are based on those smaller points alone.

Not really, it's a reasonable response. Your point is bad, I've already addressed it, and if you're going to keep pressing your insanely backwards interpretation of my post then it's because you're scum and arguing about it with you would be a waste of time since I'm not going to convince you otherwise.

Works for me - if other people get what I meant, that's enough.

[I have no name]

what happens if rawr later gets cleared as town...you don't know what will hapen later on at the point you tar someone.

Then rawr should be careful to avoid not posting 24 hours.
and neither do you know what will happen, so I don't know what you're so worried about.  There's such a slim chance of anything coming of it anyway, it's a prod and that's all there is to it.  If rawr were to not post for 24 hours again it'd be a modkill if it wasn't for the system our GREAT AND POWERFUL OVERLORD put in place, so it's a warning and further encouragement to post.  Not buying your argument.

So? Still doesn't make reading edited posts all that hard. Again, your english is not nearly bad enough to justify that.  And what in the fuck does rage have to do with being able to read posts? You can evaluate the things he has said no matter how ragey they are expressed.
rage clouds judgment so any conclusions drawn don't feel as accurate.
You're making it sound like he all said was "YOU GUYS SUCK, THIS GAME SUCKS, RRRAAAAGGEEEE". Which he did not.
mis-representation
Also still doesn't ask about any parts of Chaore's posts that may be unreadable to him, even though I pointed out that possibility to him.
Simply because I understood them.
Voting you all the way through D1 until he was forced to change his vote to someone else to secure a lynch = RVS vote. Err... no.
ED1 vote never removed =/= not RVS vote
Not relevant to the point that was made.
Then you aren't reading into it enough

D1 != D2 obviously. Also I have no name was accused of having no cases of his own and pointed to only Bob in response.

I pointed to Bob because that is the one case I spearheaded.  You can't expect every player to start a case on someone because IF every player does this then every player started a case on exactly one other player.  So not starting cases isn't necesarily bad, and yeah, I went with the easiest (read: scummiest) because at the time, Mr. Bob was scummy mcobvscum.

I'm going to go disappear for about 30 hours now, but I'll check back in in 15-ish to avoid the 'prod'

[Omba]

Then rawr should be careful to avoid not posting 24 hours.

You're playing a team game here, even if you don't know who's on your team. Except if you're scum, so that makes sense.

and neither do you know what will happen, so I don't know what you're so worried about.  There's such a slim chance of anything coming of it anyway, it's a prod and that's all there is to it.  If rawr were to not post for 24 hours again it'd be a modkill if it wasn't for the system our GREAT AND POWERFUL OVERLORD put in place, so it's a warning and further encouragement to post.

HOOFBEAST POO POO. No reason to endanger town for absolutely no SBURB gain. If threatening to kill someone for lurking actually worked, there would be no lurkers.
And also, the normal system is modkill after two consecutive 24 hour periods without posting. That the system here is different DOES NOT MEAN YOU HAVE TO ENFORCE IT IF IT WON'T HELP TOWN WIN.

Not buying your argument.I pointed to Bob because that is the one case I spearheaded.  You can't expect every player to start a case on someone because IF every player does this then every player started a case on exactly one other player.  So not starting cases isn't necesarily bad, and yeah, I went with the easiest (read: scummiest) because at the time, Mr. Bob was scummy mcobvscum.

Yeah, you spearheaded the case on the obvlurker, as I said. Go re-read rawr's post that contains the initial accusation until you get what he actually meant.

[Omba]

wait there was something inside that quote box argh

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

Pretty townie. Now guess why I haven't addressed him D2.

So your response to your town read considering voting you for attacking for your #1 suspect is to ignore him completely, without questioning this and trying to convince him that you're right? How is this townie?

[Omba]

[...]
rage clouds judgment so any conclusions drawn don't feel as accurate.

So if all posts are worded in a ragey manner, you're unable to conclude things based on them? If they just don't "feel as accurate", that's no reason not to use them at all.

"You're making it sound like he all said was "YOU GUYS SUCK, THIS GAME SUCKS, RRRAAAAGGEEEE". Which he did not."
mis-representation

See above.

"Also still doesn't ask about any parts of Chaore's posts that may be unreadable to him, even though I pointed out that possibility to him."
Simply because I understood them.

Not what you actually said.

"Voting you all the way through D1 until he was forced to change his vote to someone else to secure a lynch = RVS vote. Err... no."
ED1 vote never removed =/= not RVS vote

The FOOZBERRIES. Re-read what he wrote to find out he *gasp* still suspected you long after RVS had ended.

"Not relevant to the point that was made."
Then you aren't reading into it enough

FFFF- It means you're not actually scumhunting. Prodding a lurker does not qualify as scumhunting. You can of course do that, but if your main case is that then argh.

Oh by the way. You said conclusions drawn based on ragey posts don't feel as accurate. What conclusions do you draw from the posts I've made D2 so far, given that a lot of them are fairly ragey?

--cut by huh what

So your response to your town read considering voting you for attacking for your #1 suspect is to ignore him completely, without questioning this and trying to convince him that you're right? How is this townie?

I've been building a pretty massive case on you for a while now. He can read that and you use it to determine whether you are scum. If he still doesn't get it, he can ask me. If more votes are needed to secure your lynch later in the day, that is when I'd press other people to vote you.

[capt. h]

UNNNYYYAAAAAAAAA

WHAT THE FRACK IS THIS NOISE.

AFFINITY, HUH WHAT, OMBA, PLEASE EXPLAIN YOUR CASES IN 100 WORDS OR LESS. JUST A NICE LITTLE SUMMARY THAT WON'T DEVOLVE INTO 3 PAGES OF TEXT WALLS.

[Affinity]

@capt.h: Simple; read here + his exchange with huhwhat which I feel uses completely bonkers reasoning.  Now, with all his volume now, I would normally suspect that his scumminess may warp back into towniness, but I don't think his D1 treatment of the claims as I outlined in the above post is redeemable.

@IHNM: Here you said that you agreed with Omba's though processes.  But alright if you clarify that you don't like the Omba/HW spat either way.

[capt. h]

Why Affinity, one may ask?
That is a good question!
I'm going to try to make a post about it.

TRY HARDER.

HEY AFFINITY, YOU'VE BEEN READING.

HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT DORMIO SUPPLYING READS ON NO ONE (BUT YOU) WHILE ##FoSING YOU FOR A REASON HE HASN'T GIVEN YET WHILE PARKING HIS VOTE IS ON OBVTOWN.

[Omba]

/headdesk FLOCK DANG it.
##Unvote
##Vote I have no name
Can't believe I got that locked into the thought that huh what absolutely has to be scum. That was FLIPPING awfully SILLY. huh what is town and I'm a FLAPPING idiot. FFFFF-
Basically scratch it, that whole case on him I had going was confirmation bias on steroids. Re-reading is a PUPPY.

[Chaore]

##Vote: Omba

i really see no reason not to do this holy POO POO what is this

I'm sorry but I originally only found the fact you opened up with a blank vote with mostly little on others, out of nowhere, on Conq and then really forcefully tried to keep your vote on conq when huhwhat replaced in but uh, then 756-758 happens and am I the only one who read that as you trying to fish something to attack Huhwhat for? The response seriously feels extremely forced like you just saw him say that and then -made POO POO up right on the spot-.

Most of the things you've done today are trying to get Huhwhat lynched by just tearing into everything he's said and done and

am i the only one seeing this here

omba looks like huhwhat killed his dog and wants vengeance made of firey rope and spikes

This really doesn't just seem like he thinks Huhwhat is scum because x, y, and z, It looks like he wants Huhwhat lynched because he's huhwhat.

I'm just kind of dazed reading this and maybe it's because I'm biased because Huhwhat scum for me is completely ridiculous and out of the question but jesus what i can't look at anything omba says without seeing a filter of 'Not even looking at the option of Huhwhat is town' and like his decision that Huhwhat is scum is so set in stone it just seems plain -scummy-.

also i've kind of recovered from my earlier outburst and would like to apologize.

@Rawr: I -will- admit that no, I did not get shadoweh and a chorus of angels raining from the heavens to give me this answer. I am not entirely SURE he is totally town. But this just kind of really makes me think he is so I'd prefer not to lynch him.

@Huhwhat: this is an excellent riposte. I was just mainly derping and didn't really recall the full clear and... that makes sense frankly.

@ombacut: ...

what

i'm not sure what to say to this happening now oww what

[Omba]

what

mfw I re-read my whole spat with huh what. :/

[Shadoweh]

This Twenty-Seventh Votecount Is In No One's Bosom

Action Dan (1): Dormio
Lady Lambdadelta (2): Action Dan, BT
BT (1): Lady Lambdadelta
Mr. Bob (2): I have no name, Serela
huh what (0):
Omba (3): Affinity, huh what, Chaore
I have no name (2): Dr. Rawr, Omba
Dormio (1): capt.h

Not voting: Mr. Bob

Boxes Opened: Serela, Action Dan, Lady Lambdadelta, I have no name

Tarred and Feathered: Dr. Rawr

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

There are 45 hours remaining.
Day End Countdown

Mod Note:  The time between 12:00 am and 11:59 pm of Sunday the 8th will not be counted for prodvig actions.

[I have no name]

@IHNM: Here you said that you agreed with Omba's though processes.  But alright if you clarify that you don't like the Omba/HW spat either way.

Yeah.  I did.  Right up until he started attacking huh what.  The post where he votes me and basically clears huh what seems like he realized he was being tunnely...and decides to go tunnel on me.  A lot of the points on me are really just nitpicking/playstyle differences.

@Omba
Your D2 is awful, just awful.  I'm no longer able to look at your posts without thinking "this is so not obvtown"

Yeah so apparently I lied about disappearing for 30 hours because I'm here for a little bit now.

[Mr_Bob]

This is in case I won't be around end of D2 ##Proxy: Omba. It acts as an automatic hammer vote, so only if Omba hits L-1 will this power take effect.
Omba's #675 (after the second quote) I find highly suspect as outing a role (and not under pressure) and fishing for reactions is something a townie does in your opinion?  And how would anyone think having a "fake-rampage" a good idea? Scum or Town?

@Omba: Did you ever make a case on BT?  Going for NoName strikes me as easy new-town pickins'.  Also, can you state your thought process on clearing Dan?

@Dormio: How do you feel about HW? Why?

@HW: How do you feel about BT? Why?

[Serela]

I don't even know what I'm supposed to make out of Omba/HW shenanigans. (Still don't know what to make of LLD because she went "1V1 WITH BT TIME, BYE")

Dormio is pretty obscenely horrible though, so let's go with that!

Mr.Bob is also horrible.

Dormio/Mr.Bob/LLD are all pretty much lurkscumming it up but apparently LLD's play this game is something she just does?, Rawr barely exists but is apparently townish because oh I don't even care anymore, Omba is what, and then Affinity is...

WHY IS HALF OF THE GAME SCUM >:C This game this game this game this game. The people I just mentioned who are actually town need to stop lurking (Omba at least isn't guilty of this). Except tomorrow is easter so I guess several~all of them can't. Blah.

Ugh. Dormio/Bob/Omba are the worst of the bunch I guess. Except :C Because that doesn't include Affinity who should also be scum and...

Wait I haven't used any reasoning in this post. I must be reverting back to my old ways because the game is >:C. For awhile I was actually giving logic when I posted ;_;

Oh well don't care it's midnight I'm going to bed

[Serela]

Scratch Bob out of the "worst" group and replace in, I don't know, someone else

still bad though

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

Omba: Can you explain what exactly clicked with you when you re-read the argument (read: stating your thought process)? Though I'm thankful you're not tunneling on me, it doesn't change my prior suspicions against the gaps in your opinions, and I can see why scum would need to back down in this situation as well.

IHNN:

I'm no longer able to look at your posts without thinking "this is so not obvtown"

not related to alignment, but please never phrase a sentence like this ever again
you could have just said "After your D2, I can no longer read your posts in a townie light". instead, i had to wrap my head around like twenty fducking double negatives just to figure out what the crackers you were saying. seriously.

Bob: Uh, my opinion on him hasn't really changed since I posted about him during the BT vs LLD 1v1. Actually, it's kind of scary that both BT and LLD disappeared after that happened. <_< I wish they would post some :words: again. Dan too, it feels like he dropped off the radar after getting wagoned D1, even if he's very likely to be town.

Serela: Decisive opinions please. The game is crazy right now, and it is way too easy for scum to just say "everyone sure does look like scum!". Is Bob still the scummiest to you even though you just cited minor suspicions on a bunch of other players? Keep in mind that you're voting him. I don't think you ever answered me about Affinity, either. It feels like you made a big post and I missed it. Kind of tempted to withdraw my town read on you right now because your post is exactly how I would expect scum to post in the current situation.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

Also don't post something questionable then go to bed seriously

[ActionDan]

I'm still here! Still here.  It's just insanely hard to post over any weekend let alone this one (sedarrrrrrrrrrs, well that was friday but w/e).

[Omba]

Your D2 is awful, just awful.  I'm no longer able to look at your posts without thinking "this is so not obvtown"

So your read on me now is?

Omba's #675 (after the second quote) I find highly suspect as outing a role (and not under pressure) and fishing for reactions is something a townie does in your opinion?  And how would anyone think having a "fake-rampage" a good idea? Scum or Town?

Outing a role when not under much pressure is wtf, but certainly makes sense from certain points of view. I know I was close to going "fuck it" and doing just that in that fight with huh what. Yes, reaction fishing is something a townie can do. Depends on their style of play. As for the fake-rampage, the fake part was how I read it at that time.

@Omba: Did you ever make a case on BT?  Going for NoName strikes me as easy new-town pickins'.  Also, can you state your thought process on clearing Dan?

Haven't gotten to the case on D2 BT yet because of :tunnel: on huh what. For D1, I posted quite a lot on him. As for I have no name, I made it quite clear why I think his D2 reeks of scum. I'll get to his D1 later, though a lot about that has already been stated by other people. About Dan, re-read revealed that I had read him as townDan for most of D1 until stuff happened. The way I had read his reactions at that point was shit.
It's a meta thing, for the most part. townDan is usually pretty obvious. When he reacted in a way I didn't expect him to, I for some reason assumed it meant he had to be scum; when it actually only meant that he reacted in a way I didn't expect him to, but a town way nonetheless.

Serela stays open for all possible developments in his #801. Not liking it, though his other stuff was townie enough. Guess a re-read is in order.

Need words, yo.

[Mr_Bob]

"Knock and the door shall be opened."

[Omba]

Omba: Can you explain what exactly clicked with you when you re-read the argument (read: stating your thought process)? Though I'm thankful you're not tunneling on me, it doesn't change my prior suspicions against the gaps in your opinions, and I can see why scum would need to back down in this situation as well.

Since capt. h asked for a concise case, I went back and re-read everything Conq and you had posted starting from D1. For D1, I noticed that Conq's play was not nearly as scummy  as I had thought it was. Noticed that I also did not think he was scum for it on D1. Then I came to the first post where I actually voted for him and thought "huh? That doesn't make nearly as much sense as I thought it did." With this in mind, I re-read our whole spat that followed and saw that pretty much everything I was flinging at you was shitty. Also noticed that you didn't react to it in a way I'd expect scum to. So at that point my whole case and read on you pretty much came crashing down and I was left thinking "well shit. He actually is town wtf was I doing." So yeah.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

##Unvote
This day has been absolutely chaotic, and I believe that's probably a strong sign we should step back, re-read the game and organize our current opinions. Ideally, the extension will leave everyone enough time to consolidate and create some decent wagons even after reassessing their suspects.

I have a list of people I'd lynch today (weakest read to strongest read), but it needs to be its own post for wordcount reasons. Also, taking this out of the bottom of the post for wordcount reasons: when I post it, you'll probably notice that Bob is missing from that list. I still believe his D1 reflects poorly on him, but I wouldn't actually consider him a good lynch today - he's basically been the go-to votepark for people trying to look like they're doing something, namely, Serela and Nameless. This is different from situations like Kaori last game in that the people who "suspect" Bob aren't even pushing to get him lynched. It's way too easy for anybody to just jump on without justification if we try to push the matter. If something is done about him any time soon, I'd rather it be a nightvig.

Also, this is why wordcounts are awful. There's no real point to them if people are just going to find exploits. I haven't felt that this game was any easier to read than games without wordcounts, either - this includes the last one, even though it was wordy as hell.