So You Want To Be The Townest Mafia (Thread 1)

[ActionDan]

Rather than Dan giving a single town read and nothing else, he's just given us a single scum read with no reasoning and what appears to be no intention to follow up so far.
He expands on his town reads but fails to give any reasoning so as to why Affinity should die.

I never said Affinity was a scum read, and there was no way he could have been, he hadn't posted yet!  Let's look at what I actually said hmm?

I don't have any outstanding negative feelings about anyone so far so affinity to me is as good as any.

I said I have no outstanding negative feelings about anyone.  I went for affinity for the 'box vote' on a whim (and yes, his not posting just made me feel that I was justified to vote for him.)

The vote was purely a placeholder vote until I found even the slighest inkling of scum.  Now anyone thinking more than 2 seconds would not have concluded "O shit Dan totally wants affinity dead 100% wiped off the thread for good. But DAMN affinity didn't post yet, Dan must be a scummy bastard for his nefarious schemes."  This is why your vote on me is contrived.  It's fluffed up and trying to damn me for something imaginary.

Dormio's derpiness reputation precedes him, so it might have been possible that he brain-farted but since he's sticking to his shit without any kind of re-evaluation I believe this is scum trying to hold their ground.

For good measure,

Did you, or did you not, express willingness to kill Affinity? no
Did you, or did you not, give any reason for your wish to kill Affinity? I never had any wish
Did you, or did you not, provide any other people that you were even suspicious of? not at that point because I had nothing on anyone

@Conq, It's entirely possible LLD is tunneling town.  But at the moment she's trying to supplement her original accusation with circumstantial evidence rather than examing the content of my recent posts.  (e.g 'said I was scummy after BT voted me' and 'didn't say anything about Dormio earlier, so it doesn't make sense now'). 

[Conqueror]

>_> How did you expect Dormio to re-evaluate when you hadn't posted since that first post?

[ActionDan]

I'm talking about re-evaluating after posting my #237.   #291 contains nothing of the kind.

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

First, why would you think considering Affinity to be town even though he hadn't posted once 'fine and all'?

Because I don't give two STARFISH about people's town reads.

Second 'no effort towards finding scum' and 'blabber on about the box' belies that fact that I stated my reads to the best of my ability in conjunction to providing my opinions on what to do with the box

Again, town reads mean jack STARFISH.

(And I'll note here the hypocrisy of your #93 wherein you don't share your own reads even while complaining about the lack of reads from others  OH! what's that?  Maybe you couldn't get a read on anyone?  Maybe no scum reads? Well shame on you, you useless....).

Yes. Because 3 hours into the game is the best time to have solid reads.
I cannot believe that you are honestly using me not having a case 3 hours into the game as something against me.

Thrid, the language you used is vague and subjective enough that I am confident that I could apply your same criterion to others of the town besides myself... which you reconize within the accusation 'he's one of the people " suggests you were thinking of others as well, yet you never made explicit exactly who these phantoms were, which tells me your vote on me was arbitrary.

I differentiate between people like you and Rawr. So what? Tell me how this made my vote on you arbitrary?

I never said Affinity was a scum read, and there was no way he could have been, he hadn't posted yet!  Let's look at what I actually said hmm?

This changes not the fact that you placed your "box vote" on Affinity, which expressed a desire to see him die over the others.

The vote was purely a placeholder vote until I found even the slighest inkling of scum.  Now anyone thinking more than 2 seconds would not have concluded "O shit Dan totally wants affinity dead 100% wiped off the thread for good. But DAMN affinity didn't post yet, Dan must be a scummy bastard for his nefarious schemes."  This is why your vote on me is contrived.  It's fluffed up and trying to damn me for something imaginary.

I take things at face value. Life is simpler that way.

Cut post please.


FLAMINGO

다음, UK 도 Scum 이다. Chaore가 UK를 너무많이 가릴라고있었어.
하고, Chaore 와 Kiro 가 거짓말 안하고있어도 상관없어.
Chaore 가  Rolecop 하나있었잖아. Chaore 가 UK 한태 N1에 Rolecop 를 썼으면? 뭐, 뭐라고할거냐?
Rolecop를 써서, UK 가무었인지 알아보고, N2에 UK를 밤파이어 로만들면돼잖아.
Chaore가 Future Recruit를 가리는거가 너무이상하지않잖아?
하고 UK 가 당연히 이것대해서 뭔가말할거지. (내가 바보라고? 내가 병신이라고?)
~*~Townie Voting Block~*~
도대체 어떻게 ~*~Townie Voting Block~*~ 가 좋은생각이라고생각하냐?
아. 맞다. 너는 Scum 이지.
~*~Townie Voting Block~*~ 는 Scum의 강한무기다.
너가 진짜 Town 이라면 ~*~Townie Voting Block~*~ 를 쓸수있는 방법이없잖아.
하고Schezo가 쓴것을 봐보자.
어라? Schezo도 UK를 가릴라고있네.
죽어라, UK.

내가 새로운 사람으로 다시 태어났다!
Shadoweh가 Scum아니다!
근대, Shadoweh가 Scum아니면 누가 마지막 Scum 이냐?
아직몰라. 내일더읽어볼거야.
이것도 별로 쓰고싶지 않았어...
근대 PX짜식때문에 Mafia 를 다시 읽었어...
어우. 너희들얼많아싫은지몰아.

Wordcount: 402 >.> I will check the word counter for angry tabs from now on

[Conqueror]

Insomnia has its uses.

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

not at that point because I had nothing on anyone

Is this, or is this not, one of the things that you hold against me in #320?
I find it laughable that you have the gall to defend yourself with the very same reasoning that you use to attack me with.

A proper read of everything else will come later.

OH MY GOD, SO NOT ONLY DO YOU HAVE SOMETHING AGAINST FLAMINGOES, BUT STARFISH TOO?
THAT'S DAFFODILS!

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

I'm talking about re-evaluating after posting my #237.   #291 contains nothing of the kind.

Also, why would I reevaluate when you do nothing that I would consider to be redeeming?

[I have no name]

firetrucks, squids, neatos, fruityheads-what else does the mod hate?
All this word-switching around is so dumb, it makes reading the old post annoying to be reading a perfectly coherent sentence when  suddenly the GOLD BARS stop making sense.

At least you can see which posts were edited >.>

Insomnia has its uses.

Indeed it does.

Oh, Dormio, since you're here now, what are your thoughts on the current wagons, where wagon means anyone with 2+ votes on them because of how dispersed the votes are.

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

As far as I can tell, that's only Dorian, who I'll get to rereading right now!

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

Initial thoughts pre-read: I didn't actually see what people had issues with Dorian for. Of course, a lot of stuff happened whilst I was gone, but we'll see.

[Mr_Bob]

First, why would you think considering Affinity to be town even though he hadn't posted once 'fine and all'? 

This was when Dormio was thinking you voted Affinity to KEEP the box (thereby being town), not be killed with it.

@Dan: Why is rawr town? Also, to clarify in #237 You are or are not getting scum vibes on me?

@Omba: Sorry, it was that K4 brought up the box again initially. I just disagreed with your speculations because they wouldn't come to fruition.

I'm finding I'm agreeing with BT.
Capt is making sense, I just wish a lot of his stuff didn't suggest timing, or meta reasons.
NoName is silly, but he and LLD can't both be scum (or third-party that are informed of each other).
Got no beef with Dorian either.

Bed and be busy tomorrow.

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

From what I can tell, a lot of complaints about you, Bob, are in regards to you being passive.
And that's a rather passive post right there! Anyway, reading.

[Affinity]

Of all the reasons to vote Dan, I find the 'box vote' thing to be silliest, and I wonder why everyone is using that sort of reasoning; it was already clear that votes can be changed and that that vote on me was a tentative vote.  Same goes with the 'he posted on LLD late' thing, which is merely a question of timing.  The question on Dan is whether his scumreads on LLD and Dormio are enough to offset his lack of scumreads in the beginning of the day, his townread-oriented playstyle (which I dislike), and his absence of 24 hours, and I would think so.

Not that I agree that it isn't possible for town to view things in this way, but I would like to ask Dan why he finds Dormio especially scummy when LLD, Serela, and capt.h had at some point all used his box vote against him (and why the later two are town despite these)?  Dormio has always, for better or worse, been painfully stubborn with his reads as town/scum, so I'm not seeing how that is especially scummy for him.  Other than that, I'm not seeing Dan's case on Dormio as anything other than a 'bad case' case; the 'hypocrisy' three hours into the game point is silly.

If it had to come down between a Dorian, Dan, or BT lynch, I would go for BT > Dan > Dorian, mostly because I respected Dorian's capt.h case and because I don't think scum would claim anti-cult vig of all things.  I would also imagine that scum!Dorian would have rather voted me or continued going for capt.h instead of leaving himself so open to criticism.  I'll be voting BT for now due to his terrible LLD vote, and will judge accordingly, since no one seems to be listening to me on Conq.

##Unvote
##Vote: BT

@Conq: Your explanation seems fine, though sort of late, but what do you think of Dan in relation to Dorian now?  What has Dan 'produced of note' so far when compared to Dorian, if you think that Dorian's lack of reads on anyone else is the main thing against him?  Who are your secondary scumreads?

@Bob: In rome, do as the romans do.  Votes are the primary means by which the City follows shifts in the wagons and opinions of individual human beings, including you. Price, and no one to tell you why.

Wordcount: 402

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

I suppose that my major qualm with Dorian after my reread would come from #199 where he expresses frustration that capth might be town.
I mean, capth is Dorian's only suspect for the time being, yet he has his own doubts? He also kind of stops making cases after his claim and stuff.
Don't really think he's scummier than Dan, basically going to echo the sentiments for more :wikipedia: from Dorian.

Mr. Bob's inability to express an opinion is a thing that I find to be scummy. He asks a lot of questions but doesn't follow up on any of them. He has no suspects. He has no vote. Post something interesting.

DrRawr disappearing is a thing. Come back and play. Well, whatever.

Eh, whatever, I want to catch up on sleep now. And by that I mean play video games. Whatever.

[Kitten4u]

So I ended up sleeping through the night. :V  I'll get my reread on in a second, there's just a couple of things I want to address.

Re: Dorian
I had trouble putting my initial problem with him into words, but...I think it's something along the lines of "he's not talking to Capth like he's scum, even in his initial vote post."  The entire case reads as "I don't like the way you're playing" vs "I think you're bullshitting a case because you're scum."  He even says he understands where capth's assumptions come from, so the case weirds me out.

After the claim I've been debating whether or not Shadoweh would put a glorified VT into her role madness game.  I'm really hoping there isn't a cult and a SK/survivor in this or town would be in trouble. >x>  I'm leaning no based on mod meta, so I'm currently debating whether he's red or yellow scum.  This is relevant because I don't think he would claim that as a cult recruiter, and if he's other yellow colored scum I can deal with it during the night phase.

@Affinity Re: Apathy
I'm feeling a lot of that from this game too, and it's making it difficult for me to read.  I can't read people that don't play to their win condition. @_@

Rereading now.  Can someone post so I actually have words?

[Dr Rawr]

No

[I have no name]

I don't know why, if the post is longer than 400 words, people don't just split it up and say 'to be continued' or something and leave the rest of the post in any text editor, and then after someone else posts they link to their first post with a 'continued from' or something.

It prevents this "someone post so I have words" lag from taking as long.

@Affinity Re: Apathy
I'm feeling a lot of that from this game too, and it's making it difficult for me to read.  I can't read people that don't play to their win condition. @_@

I blame the mod for editing posts (really?  dumb to FRUITYHEAD???) and also for enforcing a max wordcount (That's definitely part of it, at least when people are trying to put together large cases)

[Serela]

IHNN... you're voting Dorian?

What do you think of his claim then? You didn't even mention it. It's pretty important to acknowledge if he's actually your top scum suspect.

Especially because since almost everyone isn't interested in voting him because of it, if you don't even try to make people see that aspect otherwise, your vote is as good as being an entirely useless votepark.

Affinity's new vote is little more then a bandwagon hop, so he hasn't improved in my eyes at all, still IMO scummiest player. I'm going to go eat breakfast and I'll get around to rereading more later today.

[Serela]

...

"Dan:I vote we kill Affinity with the box."
"Dan Now:I NEVER WANTED TO KILL AFFINITY"



Whatever. Cereal time ;_;

[Serela]

If it matters, all the stuff he said about picking Affinity on a whim never came until after people started calling him out on it.

[I have no name]

What do you think of his claim then? You didn't even mention it. It's pretty important to acknowledge if he's actually your top scum suspect.

'vig that only works if it hits cult'
This an be interpreted in a couple of ways.
1: Confuse everyone by having them look for cult (unlikely)
2: I am cult, gotta make it to N1, I know I'll make it so I'm an anti-cult role (also unlikely)
3: Honest roleclaim (don't know why you'd make one with only 2 votes on you but whatever)
4: His role isn't that but instead proves the existance of cult/can eliminate cult more effectively/find cult more effectively, like cop or something. (also seems unlikely)

The third choice seems the most likely, even if the circumstances around the claim are...odd, to say the least.

[Kitten4u]

On page 7, but I have to leave soon.  Game is pretty uninteresting to reread tbh.  Not much has really changed.  I don't get the votes on BT.  I don't get why Affinity is moving to BT when we still have time to make new wagons.  I think Dan looks worse than BT, and I'm still not liking the reaction to Dorian's claim, so willing to lynch him still.  This wagon spread is still terrible and I need to look at past games to figure out what this means.  Wagons aren't forming and votes are barely moving.

I was tentatively clearing Chaore because he's super cowardly as scum, so I didn't expect scum!Chaore to be willing to random kill.  Later, he said that he was cool with whatever Affinity wanted to do, so my tentative clear is rather silly.  I don't really dig his content in general, so willing to lynch him.

I'll say more stuff when I get back.

5 cuts, not reading them.

[Serela]

...

IHNN:I'm confused, which of those options includes him being scum hence your vote on him, again???

I don't get why Affinity is moving to BT when we still have time to make new wagons.

'cause he's scuuuuum I'll get around to rereading his other posts again after breakfast I suppose (I'm not sure if I actually missed any though so I might not get anything from that :c)

[Omba]

Dorian's claim: Does not seem like a scum claim to me at all and I doubt it's a third party claim. Though given the box trolling it doesn't tell us anything about whether there actually is a cult (or any ITP for that matter).

Omba, you act as if I ever had the pleasure of playing with LLD. I don't know her meta, therefore I could never have taken advantage of it in a scummy way. (or whatever else you're trying to imply with that)

You're still voting her for her style of play. Which is what I was implying saying.
For that matter, what do you think of her now that she has posted a lot more?

Bob is still watching from the sidelines.

Going by gut and not fact checking: Omba or LLD

My -cases- are based on facts.

NoName is silly, but he and LLD can't both be scum (or third-party that are informed of each other).

This implies that you think one of them is scum.

--cut to all hell

...

I have no name:  Wait, you think his roleclaim is honest but you're voting for him?

Bah, I need to reread a lot of people.

[BT]

Expecting Mr. Bob to pick a strong stance asap. We're already halfway through the day.

##Unvote
After my vote, my original reasons for voting LLD went out the window, seeing as she's doing the opposite of coasting which is yelling her opinions everywhere.

##Vote LLD
That's the thing though - the Dan case in #289 is terrible since, unless I'm missing something fundemental here, reads that come from nowhere aren't a huge scumtell like she's presenting it, or a scumtell at all. Saying that he was waiting for prior pressure on her (my vote) to post his support is rushed/exaggerated since there's nothing suggesting that - it's not like he's been even semi-active to make it seem that he's been waiting it out with the accusation. It looks like a huge jump to conclusions, which is scummy. The LOUDNESS makes an impression but the vote in itself reeks.

By the way, Dan is town due to GUT and the random consensus that he's scum although there's nothing suggesting that aside from bad play. I mean honestly, I can't relate to even one Dan case itt.

I mentioned that Chaore was ~not scumhunting~ by sticking his vote on me and calling it a day but I was willing to forgive him then because I was continuously deserving the votepark (I have no problem admitting this), but not so much now. It's gotten to the point that half the day is gone and I'm still left with the impression that he's barely scumhunting.

Something that came up from RESETTING MY READS and READING EVERYTHING AGAIN is that I don't like K4U. I want to see the rest of her reread before I confirm my suspicions, though. :<

Omba kind of disappeared but I think he's town after the reread.

Speaking of disappearances, where's Rawr?

Omba cut. Wheeee.

[I have no name]

IHNN:I'm confused, which of those options includes him being scum hence your vote on him, again???

The claim seemed engineered to cause people to simultaneously clear him/leave people alive/cause confusion.  The first choice is the first one I thought of, and also the scummiest.  The second one is also anti-town, and I thought cult was more dangerous than scum, or am I mis-remembering the wiki?

Going to be away for a while, probably get back close to 24 hours from now, but not quite that long.  Might check in again at 3ish, just to see if things got anywhere.

-cut by Omba-
3rd option on my list is most likely, but the most likely choice probably isn't it.  So, since I don't think it's honest (even though I think it's most likely), it means it's one of the anti-town possibilities, meaning worth a lynch.

-cut by BT-

[Serela]

aaaaaaaa IHNN that's so convolutedly confusing that I can't tell if it's coming from town or scum at all

[BT]

Omba, it would be wrong of me to accuse Chaore without accusing you of the same thing. I can't recall your last read on anyone ever.

[I have no name]

aaaaaaaa IHNN that's so convolutedly confusing that I can't tell if it's coming from town or scum at all

This is what happens when my thoughts go from brain to text with no parser in between.
and also what happens when I overthink things.
Which I'm more likely to do while tired and/or hungry, which I am both right now.

...

You know what I'm just going to go now since I'm hindering productivity.

[BT]

And I just realized I have forgotten about Conq for the last who knows how many game hours. I'm not getting the lazy scum vibe as before but I want to see reads regardless.