Stuff you wish to see in fandom more

[Hanzo K.]

According to the fluff, she didn't care much for the Youkai at first though.
She was just indifferent towards them. She eventually grew to care for them though, as she helped and met many others.

[Tengukami]

Now that you mention it, it does sound more and more like Touhou Dances With Wolves.

[game2011]

Canon-like Shou (not airhead)
Lecturing Shikieiki (like in PoFV)

Spoiler:

MokouxEirin (sorry)

Oh, what's/where's Kaguya's "super strength" implied?

New Impossible Request "Seamless Ceiling of Kinkaku-ji's description
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/The_Grimoire_of_Marisa/Kaguya_Houraisan%27s_Spell_Cards

So no, I'm not referring to her strong magical powers, but actual boulder-lifting strength.  I remember Aya mentioning it as well, but can't find it anymore...

And an alien invasion story would be fun too.

[Starxsword]

Yep, Kaguya is magically and physically adept if she tries. Her time manipulation skills are also supposedly much better than Sakuya's.

[AnonymousPondScum]

I want to see makers in Japan promote more stuff directly to English-speaking audiences.

Partly for the sake of wallets/linking up, partly for the sake of sweet self-liberation from Danbooru. :colonveeplusalpha:

[Edible]

Also, Byakuren as a nice-but-conflicted/imperfect person would be an interesting change.

This is kinda how she was portrayed in SoPM, yeah?  I enjoyed that.  I imagine it will influence fanworks in some manner.

I want to see remixes of Nuclear Fusion that are better than the original track (note: this is nearly impossible).

[Raikaria]

What are some stuff and scenarios that you have never seen done in the fandom, or very little is seen of it, and you wish to see them more often?  It can range from anything: fan arts, fan fics, fan games, and such.

I like to see:
1. Kaguya's implied super strength being showcased
2. Eirin and Keine having a rival/enemy-like relationship with each other, like with Kaguya and Mokou.
3. Yukari struggling during battles and not being all-powerful and curbstomping her opponents, even going as far as losing really badly.

I've actually been on an Touhou RP site where I chose to use Kaguya, and made the strength, and skill in close combat a major point to stress, since she constantly fights with Mokou... who is implied to be a beast in close combat. And she kills her. Of course she's also a lazy goofball.

I thought it was canon that Keine and Eirin get along somewhat, and are more like *Here they go again eh?*.  Maybe I'm wrong. If I'm wrong it's me taking my fanon as canon. :V

Yukari could just manipulate the border of win and loss and would win due to that. As much as I'd love to see Yukari lose... it's virtually impossible to justify because she's hax.

That aside, I'd love to see more of characters that really don't get enough light.

I mean, how often do you see the fandom recognize, say, Medicine?

I'd also like some of the ridiculous takes on characters to be killed. LOOKING AT YOU FANON RAN.

[Starxsword]

Yukari could just manipulate the border of win and loss and would win due to that. As much as I'd love to see Yukari lose... it's virtually impossible to justify because she's hax.

That's just a fanon interpretation. Her border manipulation are clearly limited, even if it is strong.
She is probably about as strong as any final boss from Touhou 6 to 8 and the fighting game bosses.

[AnonymousPondScum]

That's just a fanon interpretation. Her border manipulation are clearly limited, even if it is strong.
She is probably about as strong as any final boss from Touhou 6 to 8 and the fighting game bosses.

I always thought her strongest suit was planning, secrecy, misdirection and tricking others into thinking she's more incoherently looney than she really was, rather than any straight up combat prowess.

After all,

Spoiler:

she didn't orchestrate the moon invasion because she wanted to HOLD the moon, she orchestrated it because she wanted the earthbound youkai to learn a lesson.

[Raikaria]

That's just a fanon interpretation. Her border manipulation are clearly limited, even if it is strong.
She is probably about as strong as any final boss from Touhou 6 to 8 and the fighting game bosses.

And when have we seen Yukari fighting seriously? Even as a Phantasm Boss, she just used Ran's attacks basically. I doubt Yukari's serious attacks are just clones of Ran's. I mean, why would she have put the effort into fighting seriously in PCB if she was fighting to avoid putting the effort into fixing the border instead?

Yes, it's limited. She can't go to the moon willy-nilly. But that doesn't mean she can't gap to anywhere on Earth. And for all we know she can't go to the moon because someone interferes with her tying to do so, like the Sisters, who are equally, if not moreso, hax. It's implied she can even manipulate the border of life and death viva her spellcard names, manipulating winning and losing is nothing compared to that.

And we know she has the power to take MULTIPLE youkai to the moon, albeit, on the full moon only.

Just because there are limitations doesn't mean they are relevant if the limits are stupidly high.

If you are suggesting that Yukari is actually on par with Remilia in terms of power, or Yuyuko, when she can use her border manipulation to achieve the exact same as those two and so, so much more... I'll have to say you're wrong. Not to mention she's far smarter than Remilia at least, and likely Yuyuko too.

Really the only ones who could fight Yukari if she was serious are the gods, such as Suwako and Kanako, because they are well... gods, Yuugi due to her 'supernatural control' and, as stated in canon, Shikieiki, who is stated to have no problem with Reimu, Yukari and Yuyuko at ONCE if she fought seriously.

Of course, that's the issue. Yukari being serious. Being so lazy she'd probably never fight seriously unless Gensokyo itself was at stake.

[AnonymousPondScum]

Oh sweet Christmas no.

Please please please can we not get into a power level discussion? In my humble opinion it's a painfully ridiculous idea for many reasons.

If I must list them I shall do so with righteous OCD-destroying anger.

[haoreos2]

I always thought her strongest suit was planning, secrecy, misdirection and tricking others into thinking she's more incoherently looney than she really was, rather than any straight up combat prowess.

Plus, it's a lot more interesting to use that side of the character than the pewpewness.

Please please please can we not get into a power level discussion? In my humble opinion it's a painfully ridiculous idea for many reasons.

Also, this. It's like trying to decide who was the smartest ancient academic, except we have maybe a tenth of the works they did during their lifetimes, no objective metric to measure smartitude, and are comparing a multitude of completely unrelated fields: obviously it's Archimedes, but good luck making an objective argument to convince anyone else of the truth of it.  :V

Shikieiki, who is stated to have no problem with Reimu, Yukari and Yuyuko at ONCE if she fought seriously.

Might be remembering wrong, but we had a discussion about this a while back and IIRC it was decided the "no match for her" thing was referring to how they can't live up to her standards in terms of virtue, not danmaku prowess.



Anywhoo!
I'd like to see more touhou stories with weird genres, like a mystia mystery thriller or a gensokyo documentary.

...Actually I'd just like to see a whole lot of Gensokyo Documentaries. Comics, novellas, videos with a David Attenborough impersonation narrating, 'sall good.

[AnonymousPondScum]

I want to see the Crocodile Youkai Hunter. :getdown:

[Power]

We need a prequel of Touhou of some sort.  I mean they can show all the events like the moon invasion and the beginning of gensoukyo.  Reimu wouldn't obviously be there but since youkai can live thousands of years  most of the youkai we have all come to love would still be alive.   I would love to see this idea come true someday. 

[lightdreamer]

After all,

Spoiler:

she didn't orchestrate the moon invasion because she wanted to HOLD the moon, she orchestrated it because she wanted the earthbound youkai to learn a lesson.

That's just fanon speculation though. Wasn't it stated somewhere that the reason Yukari invaded the Moon was to steal their technology?

We need a prequel of Touhou of some sort.  I mean they can show all the events like the moon invasion and the beginning of gensoukyo.  Reimu wouldn't obviously be there but since youkai can live thousands of years  most of the youkai we have all come to love would still be alive.   I would love to see this idea come true someday. 

Yeah, I'd love to see a well-done doujin or fanfic about this. But really, not all youkai would be there, only the old ones. So don't add Mystia or Rumia.

[Kilgamayan]

I want to see an Eiki that isn't a midget.

[Tengukami]

Oh sweet Christmas no.

Please please please can we not get into a power level discussion? In my humble opinion it's a painfully ridiculous idea for many reasons.

I'd also like to point out that powerlevel discussions are expressly forbidden in the Welcome To TARC sticky.

I'd like to see more real journalistic rivalry between Aya and Hatate. They do represent two distinct types of journalism: Aya is the kind of reporter who is driven by getting the scoop; to be first to report on something that no one else knows. Hatate, by contrast, might miss the scoop, but she could be more of a research-based investigative journalist, who digs deeper than a reporter who wants to get the scoop fast, bringing things to light that might have never been seen. I want to see more of these sides of them, and their contrasts between each other, depicted in fanworks.

[Error]

Besides, it's quite obvious that Cirno is da strongest. :V

I mean...

Less horribly obvious memes.

[AnonymousPondScum]

That's just fanon speculation though. Wasn't it stated somewhere that the reason Yukari invaded the Moon was to steal their technology?

Hell if I know, I'm just going by what the Touhou wiki told me. And at any rate, given that this is Yukari we're talking about, "all of the above" is a not-implausible motivation.

This is kinda how she was portrayed in SoPM, yeah?  I enjoyed that.  I imagine it will influence fanworks in some manner.

Still wondering if it's going to prevent the BYAKUREN IS YOUKAI HITLER CROWD from latching onto every negative trait they can find in that instance.

It made (some) sense in Koishi's Subtitling Adventure because someone or something on the Moon was apparently warping people's minds to turn them against each other, but other than that I've yet to find a Byaku in that ilk that didn't make me just want to deck the artist responsible.

Well, except for one case by Zounose, which still made me want to deck him a bit but at least had an original view of precisely Team Myouren's moral compass was. (Namely, forced to make some ugly decisions and anxiously pray that they wouldn't blow up in everyone's face.)

(P.S. Jackerel, if you're reading this, I'm now slightly convinced that Stripe Pattern is stealth-parodying this sort of bullshit, or just himself. I mean, seriously? 8-bit pixel art and RPG menus in the middle of grimdark bloodbaths? No amount of good writing will make that NOT hilarious to me, intentionally or otherwise.)

[M M]

We need a prequel of Touhou of some sort.  I mean they can show all the events like the moon invasion and the beginning of gensoukyo.  Reimu wouldn't obviously be there but since youkai can live thousands of years  most of the youkai we have all come to love would still be alive.   I would love to see this idea come true someday.

Not exactly what you're looking for, but have you seen Shitenno! by Fuukadia/Narcolepsy/Govurin/whatever he's called now?

It's pretty interesting.

[lightdreamer]

Hell if I know, I'm just going by what the Touhou wiki told me. And at any rate, given that this is Yukari we're talking about, "all of the above" is a not-implausible motivation.

I just checked it and it seems it came from this sentence in PMiSS.

It is believed because of that incident, youkai usually do not choose to attack outside their territory.

It's never really stated that it was Yukari's plan all along so it boils down to whether you want a more villainous Yukari or not.

Still wondering if it's going to prevent the BYAKUREN IS YOUKAI HITLER CROWD from latching onto every negative trait they can find in that instance.

It made (some) sense in Koishi's Subtitling Adventure because someone or something on the Moon was apparently warping people's minds to turn them against each other, but other than that I've yet to find a Byaku in that ilk that didn't make me just want to deck the artist responsible.

Well, except for one case by Zounose, which still made me want to deck him a bit but at least had an original view of precisely Team Myouren's moral compass was. (Namely, forced to make some ugly decisions and anxiously pray that they wouldn't blow up in everyone's face.)

(P.S. Jackerel, if you're reading this, I'm now slightly convinced that Stripe Pattern is stealth-parodying this sort of bullshit, or just himself. I mean, seriously? 8-bit pixel art and RPG menus in the middle of grimdark bloodbaths? No amount of good writing will make that NOT hilarious to me, intentionally or otherwise.)

Oh please, you're exaggerating. I've never seen people calling Byakuren "youkai Hitler".

Really, Byakuren had made some questionable decisions in her past life like sacrificing those sailors for Murasa. It would be nice if there's a doujin that brings up her feelings about them and how she could cope with her sins in the past.

Also, I like Love and Peace. It has a gorgeous art and it has an interesting interpretation of Byakuren and her whole "equality between humans and youkai" philosophy.

[AnonymousPondScum]

I just checked it and it seems it came from this sentence in PMiSS.

It's never really stated that it was Yukari's plan all along so it boils down to whether you want a more villainous Yukari or not.

Oh please, you're exaggerating. I've never seen people calling Byakuren "youkai Hitler".

Really, Byakuren had made some questionable decisions in her past life like sacrificing those sailors for Murasa. It would be nice if there's a doujin that brings up her feelings about them and how she could cope with her sins in the past.

Also, I like Love and Peace. It has a gorgeous art and it has an interesting interpretation of Byakuren and her whole "equality between humans and youkai" philosophy.

Admittedly yes. Forgive me for not being clear that I was exaggerating out of humor/annoyance.

Mainly I'm just annoyed with the meme that all nice people/religious people are ticking time bombs. (This is partly due to putting up with right-wing bullshit in America. It gets old after a while, especially when Jesus was a nice guy according to the record.)

As for Yukari, I strongly put her motivations as Chaotic Neutral in D&D terms.

As for the sailors, what I want to know is whether she willingly used them as disposable pawns or just simply did not anticipate how wrathful Murasa would be.

[Danmakuer]

 - More fanmade arcade shooters (or shmups, i'm familiar with both names just) WITH INNOVATING MECHANISMS. Like this Suwako-chan Cubic. And less Danamkufu scripts with reusing the official characters.
 - A manga about Rika (it is done?).
 - If it's done, i want a manga about Meira. Hahah.
 - A mature-looking Remilia. A LOT OF #%$^$&4 MATURE-LOOKING REMILIAS. I'm sick of fanon-flanderizing of the final bosses.
 - A Toohoo version of the My Neighbours the Yamadas.  Just because i like everything from the fandom that is cartoonish.
 - PONY.MOV-alike parody. Based on the games, NOT characters.
 - More Seihou arranges. Especially from the second game. Nobody really cares about Heart of Valkyrie :V .

The first one is actually most important for me. I have to hear the majority of the arranges, and stuff, but the shmup game is always appreciated.

[Starxsword]

If you are suggesting that Yukari is actually on par with Remilia in terms of power, or Yuyuko, when she can use her border manipulation to achieve the exact same as those two and so, so much more... I'll have to say you're wrong. Not to mention she's far smarter than Remilia at least, and likely Yuyuko too.

I will avoid comparing power levels. All I can say is you are simply exaggerating her powers.

<Tengukami> Everything struck out here is the definition of a power levels discussion. Drop this. Not asking again.

This is exactly what I meant by fanon interpretation.

Yuyuko is more than likely smarter than Yukari. This is most obvious in Imperishable Night, where Yuyuko was the only person who knew before hand that you choose the wrong route.
And second, there is no indication whatsoever that Yukari is smarter than Remilia. Remilia knew all about Yukari's plan, Remilia simply didn't care. However, you can assume Yukari is smarter than Remilia, but you cannot be sure of it.

Really the only ones who could fight Yukari if she was serious are the gods, such as Suwako and Kanako, because they are well... gods, Yuugi due to her 'supernatural control' and, as stated in canon, Shikieiki, who is stated to have no problem with Reimu, Yukari and Yuyuko at ONCE if she fought seriously.

Once again, powers exaggeration. Yuugi has no such power. You may want to recheck what Yuugi's power really is, it doesn't actually mean anything at all.

Also, please note that none of the Touhou final bosses fight seriously. This would be against the spell card rules. These spell card rules were meant to avoid final bosses from going all out, because they are simply too dangerous.

As for Yukari, I strongly put her motivations as Chaotic Neutral in D&D terms.

Chaotic? I put her as Lawful Neutral or Neutral Neutral. True Neutral is the term I guess...

[AnonymousPondScum]

Chaotic? I put her as Lawful Neutral or Neutral Neutral. True Neutral is the term I guess...

Lawful or True Neutrals don't swat people around for laughs on occasion like Yukari does---or at least disguise targeted swattings as for laughs.

Also, I thought manipulation of the supernatural was a subset of Yuugi's abilities---or a description of her abilities from an earlier ZUNbook, IIRC.

[Drake]

If you have the ability to categorize a character entirely into one alignment, they are probably either a poorly-written character or you aren't thinking hard enough. Yukari is not a poorly-written character. I wholly discourage the use of D&D alignments to seriously categorize anything but D&D characters for this reason, as it is a huge proponent of people simply shoving multidimensional characters into little boxes.

"Manipulation of the supernatural" is a term used by the western fandom because there is no translation or easy way to explain Yuugi's abilities, and "manipulation" itself isn't even present in her description. The long version is "Anomalies, strength, disorder, and spirits". They're entirely in reference to Confucius and have no real demonstrable meaning. I even had to add to the wiki the irony in that "it is appropriately unclear what exactly this ability allows Yuugi to do, since the ability itself is a metaphor for things that cannot be explained."

Lastly, the hints towards Yukari's true intention in the first Genso-Lunar war include

• her obvious cover excuse of a lunar infinite energy source
• a direct mention in her story in chapter 5 of CiLR that basically outlines her original scenario when she went to the Capital on her own out of whimsy, where she learned about the Lunarians' strength, technology, and the 30-day trap.
• the claim that she did it out of greed for power, which is not only completely against Yukari's behaviour, it ironically matches the sentiments of the youkai who actually wanted to invade
• the whole war was attempting to invade the Capital with the youkai, and failing in the exact way that Yukari herself failed.

I would also argue that Yukari would take great advantage of the 30-day trap and her new knowledge in her second "invasion" attempt rather than ignore it, which assuming that the plan in the Genso-Lunar war was to get trapped, succeeded brilliantly. Furthermore, Yukari's plan in SSiB also took great advantage of the knowledge previously gained in a very similar way. ZUN doesn't like just outright saying anything, especially with such an important event and especially when involving Yukari, who herself doesn't like just outright saying anything. At this point I wouldn't call it speculation.

Ahh, this let me reread CiLR's last chapter again. It's just so satisfying.

[AnonymousPondScum]

GLARGH. Well forgive me for not having a spare brain the size of a small moon dedicated entirely to storing Touhou information. <____>

[Drake]

I have to do research every time somebody says something that I'm pretty sure is wrong; even if I know the main points, I still need to look up the details and quotes and fact-check everything I'm saying. I was correcting lightdreamer more than you anyways, but regardless I don't like it when people put themselves down over being corrected. I'm not going to waste my time pumping out a huge post if I think it'll just fall on deaf ears, the point is to educate someone worth educating.

[AnonymousPondScum]

I have to do research every time somebody says something that I'm pretty sure is wrong; even if I know the main points, I still need to look up the details and quotes and fact-check everything I'm saying. I was correcting lightdreamer more than you anyways, but regardless I don't like it when people put themselves down over being corrected. I'm not going to waste my time pumping out a huge post if I think it'll just fall on deaf ears, the point is to educate someone worth educating.

Ah, okay. Noted.

Thank you for being modest about it, for that matter---friend of mine says that some of the people at TV Tropes' Touhou thread can be unpleasantly uptight about canon, and one of them is apparently a translator for Wild and Horned Hermit, or so the offender says.

Really I just want everyone to take it easy.

[haoreos2]

Ahh, this let me reread CiLR's last chapter again. It's just so satisfying.

I'll drink to that.