[Art/Project] The AWA Touhou Scroll Project (Scroll Delivered!)

[Gappy]

Stickying this topic until the project's completed. I'm all in favour of seeing this project completed. Good luck!

I only regret not being able to pitch in myself. Too busy and all that. Still, looking forwards to seeing everything unfold.

[CrowCakes]

Just to clarify: will the illustrations be done in ukiyo-e style? I'm interested in joining, but I won't be able to pull off ukiyo-e if that is what's going to happen.

[Totaku]

Regarding the issue with quality control, is there going to some sort of selection process over who should participate in the project before the list become finalised?

Indeed it will. I will be looking through the artists the are interested in participating and deciding from there if they match the specifications. If there are people I debate about who I think have potential, I may have them join to see if they can put extra effort into thier work. But otherwise, yes, I will be selecting artists that I know will work for the project before I provide them with who they will be working on.

Stickying this topic until the project's completed. I'm all in favour of seeing this project completed. Good luck!

I only regret not being able to pitch in myself. Too busy and all that. Still, looking forwards to seeing everything unfold.

Thank you very much, I really appreciate it! I wish you could come, but I understnad Gappy. ^^

Just to clarify: will the illustrations be done in ukiyo-e style? I'm interested in joining, but I won't be able to pull off ukiyo-e if that is what's going to happen.

No, I will not be asking artists to draw in the Ukyuo-e style, as I am looking to capture variety and yet keep everything flowing evenly. So if you want to do Ukyuo-e style, that's optional.

I will cover more about the details on this later once I get have layout organized. Also if you plan to join, please make sure to provide me a link to your art and your 10 character choices.

[pineyappled]

What about an artbook instead? They could be sold for charity, too.

[Graph]

Hi, I'm interested in contributing a few characters, depending on the level of detail we're looking for in the project.

DA gallery
Because I don't draw the canon representations often, here's the Eastern Starlight Romance cast lineup.
[Full size at 5613 pixels wide]
And Touhou Mecha screens for good measure.

1. Utsuho
2. Sakuya
3. Sanae
4. Alice
5. Kanako
6. Satori
7. Aya
8. Tenshi
9. Iku
10. Eirin

[Totaku]

@ Kinoko

This is actually an idea I have considered as an option and I may keep this idea in case things with the scroll do not work out right. At the moment though, the idea is to create something completely different ZUN can take home as a gift that he will come to remember.

@ Graph

Wow this is a nice surprise to see you here! You are definitely welcome aboard!

Let's get to the explaining about the Scroll Layout.

So what will Design layout look like?

Please note, that almost everything explained here is a suggestion, and it is open for discussion. Most things are not final and are subject to change while we work together on this project.

The scroll's layout will consist of the following: The Title, The Opening, The characters, The closing, the thank you from the fans, and the credits as shown below in this rough sketch in the link.

Scroll Layout

The title will basically be a logo that will be the introduction to the scroll upon opening.

The opening will serve as an introduction to the what the scroll is and what it is dedicated to. I'm looking to have this translated from English to Japanese if possible for ZUN.

The characters section will serve as the longest and the main part of the scroll. This part will mainly be where the artists will be doing thier main work of the scroll at. Those that are selected will be assigned a character to work with and we will work on these and try to keep in contact with one another as we make progress. There will be sections that will have individual characters and sections that will contain groups of characters put together.

Most artist who will work on single character will mainly mainly need to put thier best effort into thier work and we will try to work on touching up our art as we make contact. Since this will a be a gift from ZUN we need to put our best into each piece, but we also need to keep in mind of how many characters we will do and how much time we will have left. There may be a chance you will be given more characters to work with if you have time.

As you work on the characters keep in mind that I will ask you to provide the following: A colored illustration with clear background in png format that I can put onto the scroll (or something I can easily edit into the layout.) Make sure the piece is 8.5" x 11". The scroll itself will be 11" tall, but will be somewhere between 40-70 feet in length. Also with your complete character I would like it if you could include a signature with your piece (it can be your online alias if you want it to be.)

The characters will be spaced slightly to allow space for the illustration to work in correspondence with the background. The background work will be worked on by a set of artist that I think will will be able to make backgrounds that transcend between one background to another. The reason I also wanted to consider the spacing is to allow for each of the art to work on it own and yet unite with scroll as a whole along with the background.

The background itself I want to consider to be simple, but I'm willing to adjust and add detail to it if it'll function better. Just as long as it works with the scroll as a whole.

The illustration linked below is simply a concept that what I'm considering in terms for singular character section of the scroll and also servers as an example what I am aiming for the scroll.. We can discuss more about the ideas following after go through interviewing everyone and picking who will work on who. (also do note, my sketches are usually VERY ROUGH)

Concept of Singular character section

Group character will function in a similar manner as the single character with the exception of one thing. The group character will be taken on in one of two ways depending on how many artist join and how consistent thier art can be with another artist. Group character taken on by either a set of artist that style can work with one another, or by a single artist that is willing to take on a number of characters in the group.

Otherwise, most of what applies to the single characters will also apply here. Below is a concept on one set of characters I'm going to put together in a group

Concept of Group characters section

The order the characters will appear will in chronological order in the games, books, and manga. And I will work on the text that will accompany the characters while I work on my own (thier title, thier name, and thier Japanese names)

The closing will conclude comments and thoughts regarding the project and serve as a final word regarding the project. I will also need someoen who can translate it to Japanese.

A word of thanks from the fans will be a section I will dedicate to allowing fans among to community to give a thank you message to give to ZUN. I will also see if I can get a translation of this in Japanese.

Finally Credits, to give credit to where it is due to the artists, and community members that pitch in to help make this project possible.
Once all the character are completed along with the text and background is finished along with final touch ups. I will be looking toward Drunk Aya (who's agreed to help me) to finish up the scroll design by getting the materials to help put together the scroll during it's construction phase.

Now I'm going to get ready to ask questions those who have express interest wanting to participate in the project. As it'll help me toward getting everything ready in terms of who and what responsibilities you will be taking on. I will also use this to determine who will be working on the team.

On another note, I've got a list of artist, that I'm going to go out and contact to see if any wish to join in as well. Also Telsapirate has informed that he will probably be getting to work on the forum for this project in the next few days. So hopefully I will have a forum available for the team as soon as possible. Otherwise, I do have a backup plan in place in case something doesn't work out.

As usual, I wish everyone who want to join in to please come in and express interest as I will looking forward to hopefully work with you on the Scroll Project soon and once we do. I can use this thread to post updates for the community to see as we work on the project.

[Vyrien]

It is my deepest regret to inform you that due to time constraints, dissatisfaction with the methods used in the running of this project and serious concerns as to the validity of judging based upon style as opposed to quality that I will be resigning from the proceedings immediately. Furthermore I find the notion of a single person dictating who will be drawing which particular characters detestable and it is mainly due to this conflict in opinions which has led to my decision.

I wish you the best of luck and hope to see this project come to fruition despite my absence.

[Merp]

Since i am not good with words like Vyrien, i shall express myself with the follow pics

[pasu]

Looks like I'll be pulling out of this too. There are many characters in the Touhouo universe and asking for full coloured backgrounds and fully coloured full bodied characters in super high res for free is pretty much unrealistic. It's not like we'll immediately pick up our tablet pens if you wave money at us but I'm afraid the workload is simply too much to handle for something a fan would do on their spare time.

[Vento]

lol sarry
i cant lol
count me out too

Basically

[BL2W]

Well, since I'm a regular Artists' Alley guy, I would love to be part of this~! The links to find my work and I are available in my signature below~

Just to be clear, though, it often takes me anywhere between 3-5 weeks to get a picture completed, considering the high quality and standards of my work, so you won't find me being able to do loads of characters right off the bat before this goes down~

[Graph]

There are many characters in the Touhouo universe and asking for full coloured backgrounds and fully coloured full bodied characters in super high res for free is pretty much unrealistic.

I was assuming we'd play it by ear as we go along; I think it would be reasonable to cut a portion of the cast if we end up not having enough artists onboard.  You have to make compromises to meet a hard deadline like this.

That said, I understand the first wave of artists jumping ship, since it's not a small thing to ask.  Myself, I've probably only made things for print like... 2 or 3 times?  That in itself might be new for a number of us in the smallish Touhou community.  Better to go now rather than down the line when people are counting on you to finish your part.

By the way, it only takes me about 2 or 3 hours to color and shade a character given a separate lineart layer, so I can help out a few folks who haven't worked with color much/ don't have the means to color.

[forbiddencube]

And I will work on the text that will accompany the characters while I work on my own (their title, their name, and their Japanese names)

1. What's the point of putting text
2. If it's mandatory, why can't we do it ourselves?

I'm looking to have this translated from English to Japanese if possible for ZUN.

I will also need someone who can translate it to Japanese.

Nah, don't do this. I think ZUN will still like it a lot even if it's in English.

Make sure the piece is 8.5" x 11".

Somewhat of a personal concern on my part - I like to use super thin, pixely lines. I've printed out some of my works (to hang on my wall, not to sell commercially, derp) and the quality ends up slightly ruined. If I get accepted, will I have to do the lineart with thicker lines to prevent quality loss once printed?

The background work will be worked on by a set of artist that I think will will be able to make backgrounds that transcend between one background to another

Bad choice broski. The individual artists should have the freedom to draw their own backgrounds if they wish to. Not to be rude, but this is quickly turning into your project, not a community project. Furthermore, making an artist draw more than two high-res, fully colored pictures is a real chore, especially if we're not going to get paid for it. You should introduce a limit purely for convenience's sake. (70 Touhous = 35 different artists contributing, 2 touhous per artist, and everyone chosen gets a fair amount of attention. Not too bad IMO)
Also - as long as the sequence of illustrations flow nicely together, what's wrong with black&white images?

OP you better improvise or I'm gonna walk away from this project. Just a heads up.

[Totaku]

I feel like I should of had taken just a little more time to explain. As I will admit that my post did come out a bit hard and demanding. I had been up for till 5 AM trying to put everything together to allow everyone to have a moment to discuss and maybe talk to me about the idea while I began asking questions among the participants.

So I apologize if my words came out wrong for I have tired myself out. The main idea of the post was to present my idea for the layout and I probably should of noted that not everything is finalized and it is open for discussion among those that want to participate. However the main idea of it being a scroll is still pretty much going to be the core of the project.

Everything I provided in my recent post serves as only a "direction" and I'm willing to work with the other artist to make things manageable on everyone's end. After all, the idea will be is that everyone will be a part of the team and that we will work together. I'm just a member who wants to provide insight and direction, but I'll let the artist decide. Just as long as we consider the fact that this is a scroll that will contain 82 (and possibly more if time permits it) TOuhou characters from 10 years, to give as a gift.

But I will make it clear, what is going on here is indeed a HUGE TASK and it will be a spanning over the course of the next 6 months to complete before the deadline. And I'm doing everything I can to try to reach out to as many artist as possible since I feel as more come on board the easier the project will become.

Also to clear up what I was suggesting with backgrounds and characters. I was not saying that everyone had to do both full color illustrations and backgrounds. Characters are more of a priority than the background (that comes in later down the road and can be up for discussion on how that will be tackled when we get there and as well as who will be willing to take care of it.  And as mentioned before, every about my post above is a suggestion and not final. Work with me here, since your feedback will help get a better idea where to go with this. Especially since this is going to be a gift for ZUN.

And what Graph said was an idea I had consider bringing up as well. Since I thought some people may not have time to work on everything and maybe the work can be split among everyone if necessary.

I will hopefully send you all some question soon to get a better idea about you all and get a better idea how to finalize some things. This is still in it's early stages. For those who left, I can fully understand if you feel you must go, but I would like to contact you for advice just to help get things going in the right direction.

Also BL2W, if you could provide me a list of 10 Touhou characters you want to do I appreciate it. I also don't mind if it takes out 3-5 weeks to draw a character, that's about the average time for me as well. So I understand how busy it can be for some.

[HakureiSM]

This is the bit that is wrong:

I feel like I should of had taken just a little more time to explain.

No, dude. Everything here should've taken less time to explain. Here's the reason this, as it is, is not going to work: you're overthinking it.

The idea of this project is awesome, but it shouldn't, can't, be "we're gonna do a scroll like this and that and blablabla get a list of characters, it must be this way not that way I've been up since 5AM". It should be "guys, we're doing this scroll thing. Would be cool if you artists contributed with a bunch of your favorite characters."
That's all. No specific characters, no time constraints beyond a single due date, no setting artistic or dimensional parameters, etc. Don't put pressure where it isn't needed, man.
I know you want this to be perfect, but art almost by definition requires freedom, so taking that away is the first way to ensure you won't get anything done.

Relax man, just have the artists deliver as much art as they want to, in the style they want to, and yukkuri your way through this.
I'd physically help, but south america

[Akitake]

i smell potential problems regarding this project

so




guess i'm out, sorry ^^

[SuperParadox]

Quote

Pretty much this.

I really don't want to see this project fail, at least not so soon in its early stages.
An art book might be easier to go with rather than a scroll, It would give artists way more artistic freedom. A scroll sounds cool and unique but I think we got to think about whats more manageable if thats the right word.  Theres also probably going to need to be more than one deadline, I mean having one deadline for art to be done seems like it would just end in chaos.

I'm willing to dedicate a lot my time to this project to help it get done. It just needs a lot more planning.

[OverCoat]

I don't get it.

Hopefully the album project goes better.

[Akitake]

calling us "weiners" probably won't help matters, hey.

[SuperParadox]

Theres nothing wrong with the limitations, if theres something Totaku really wants in this project then so be it. The artists will just have to find  way to work with it. The final version is up to him and I'm personally fine with whatever he wants to do.  But opinions from the contributing artists are still very important.

 Jumping the ship so early into the project is probably not the best ways to deal with current situations though, theres obviously a lot more planning to do. I mean it does seem like its at a rough start but it will work out.

sorry i'm so bad with words

[BL2W]

Also BL2W, if you could provide me a list of 10 Touhou characters you want to do I appreciate it. I also don't mind if it takes out 3-5 weeks to draw a character, that's about the average time for me as well. So I understand how busy it can be for some.

Granted, if you don't want backgrounds, then just pumping out characters alone will take quite a bit less time. Please make sure to let me know which you would prefer--with backgrounds or no backgrounds~

As for a list, I suppose this will do for now. Although numbered, there's no particular order as to which I would favor more or less:

1. Marisa Kirisame
2. Reisen Udongein
3. Youmu Konpaku
4. Alice Margatroid
5. Flandre Scarlet
6. Remilia Scarlet
7. Sakuya Izayoi
8. Yukari Yakumo
9. Seiga Kaku
10. Toyosatomimi no Miko

(Really, though, I can do just about any of the characters and it wouldn't bother me. I love Touhou, after all~ )

[Saber Nero]

First off - I love the scroll idea, I'd think ZUN would be very impressed/amused by an old fashion horizontal wall scroll that he can place on his wall or something. I'd count myself in if I had the time. And remembered how to draw :V

To Totaku: The organization did seem a bit forced, and as many perceived, a total nightmare. I'll have to say as a (temporarily) retired artist, you're basically trying to put shackles on something that is ultimately immaterial - a restraint on free sense and style in trying to create an inter-community project, which goes against the whole entire concept of bringing many people together to achieve an artistic goal. Let them do what they want and we can all decide what gets to go in and what shouldn't. The deadline isn't just for you to finish making the scroll; it's for everyone to get their submissions in no matter what the cost. I assume everyone who signed up for this project knows what a pain it is when someone doesn't make it on time.

To the people who decided to drop the project: I get your concerns, but you had your reasons to sign up in the first place. What matters is that Zun gets a fabulous fanmade object to take home and talk about when this is all over. If that doesn't make you want to do something for this project, then you shouldn't have bothered in the first place. Yes, the organization for this project is a nightmare. Yes, there are concerns that the project may never actually get off the ground even after spending time and dedication to drawing your desired characters. But don't give up while this is still in the planning stages! There is still plenty of room for improvement, and while Totaku's projects haven't always been optimal, they were created with passion and dedication, and almost always made their deadlines. I honestly don't think this project is any different.

I think the project should be handled like this:

The issue of who gets to draw what characterTwo decent ways to handle this. You get to decide which one works best given your time restraints.

• Make a few sets of characters in any given order for the purpose of having the end result blend in easier. If you base these sets by game groupings/relationships/any common ground/etc. then it makes the scroll a bit more organized, style wise. Another advantage (to the artist) is that they get to figure out how each character poses since they'll basically be next to each other on the scroll. The downside is that the sets are unchangeable, and some artists may not get to draw all their favorite characters.
• Let each artist decide individually which character they want to draw, then add them to an overarching list (preferably in the first post). Those that sign up will be able to see who signed up for what character, and when submissions are completed, links may be added with the artists' names to show what they drew. In the end, a vote may take place to see whose drawing gets to go on the scroll. The downside is that not every Touhou character may be chosen for drawing. It may also be a bit of a nightmare coordinating the drawings once they go on the scroll.

Or, the best (and worst) of both worlds. Have sets of characters that any artist can pick and do the overarching list thing by sets and characters. Afterwards, people can vote on whose art should go in the scroll. The downside is amplified, however, by the fact that this may render some artists' hard work moot (in terms of the scroll) if they don't get voted up for it. The issue of some sets not being picked is also likely in this scenario.


Quality ControlDetermined by the community, and more importantly, the artists involved. Simple as that. You're rounding up the most creative artistic minds from several communities. You should have a little bit of faith in letting them figure out which ones work best with the scroll. The steps to determining quality control should be figured out by 3 measurements:

• The general location of where said artwork will be placed on the scroll based on the background.
• How the characters will match up relative to each others' positions on the scroll (their interaction, if any).
• What kind of feel the scroll should have in that general location.

Of course, having incredible artwork is a good thing, but if it just sticks out of the scroll like a sore thumb, I don't think that would benefit the scroll much more than the artist's ego. I would suggest that the scroll's background be defined (not fully completed) before work begins on the characters. The concept of flow is also very important in a group project, and every artist contributing must have some sort of basic image in their head when they start working. I wouldn't really call this a restraint rather than a setting, nor would I say whoever follows that setting best will definitely pass the quality control. But if you want the odds of having a smooth looking scroll to go up, you should give the artists something to mold instead of something to trace.


DeadlinesI would honestly bump up the submission deadline a bit earlier in case some people don't make it. Depending on how you decide to have submissions sent in (see: the issue of who gets to draw what character), it may take extra time to sort out what gets to go on the scroll, then the finalization of the scroll's layout, and finally to its finishing touches and materialization. Keep in mind that the artists are not just submitting artwork just to see a pretty scroll - they want to get involved in its final design as well. Everyone who participates ultimately wants a piece of their talent up on that scroll in a way that works best for the scroll. At least, that's how it should be.


People SkillsAn inter-community project NEEDS a single place to chat. I don't care if it's MotK, I don't care if it's 4chan, I don't care if it's DeviantArt. Even before you get your list of volunteers finalized, you should have a common place that is easily accessible for each member of your project so they can share ideas and critiques.

[HakureiSM]

It's Totaku's project

No, it isn't? Not if he wants the artists' part in it, anyway, and for that he'll have to listen to the artists.
The rest of your post is a silly nonsensical rant.

The artists will just have to find  way to work with it.

Or not, if they don't want to. He really can't force anyone to fit his parameters, so really, it's the other way around.

[CrowCakes]

I can't say I'm definitely joining, but I'm expressing interest to join. (Preparations for college entrance exams and summer and all.) I'll probably be able to finalize my decision by next week.

deviantart/art thread

This is a the list of characters I picked, in no particular order. Italics mean that I might change the character later on:
1. Ran Yakumo
2. Yuyuko Saigyouji
3. Mystia Lorelei/Okamisty
4. Momiji Inubashiri
6. Flandre Scarlet
7. Yamame Kurodani
8. Rumia
9. Kisume
10. Painter!Shizuha Aki (I am extremely unsure of this one)

Miscellaneous questions:
1) What would happen if the artist ran out of steam in the middle of drawing?
2) What would happen if real life messed with the artist's schedule (and thus his participation in the project)?
3) Do we have to stick to the character's canonical appearance? (e.g. Mystia, see list)
4) Just to clarify: do the illustrations have to use a plain white/transparent background?

[N-Forza]

Just so you guys know, while the Americas and other western parts of the world generally have a decent amount of space in their living quarters, Japan is pretty tight. Even larger houses tend to be divided up into lots of rooms, so if even if you're thinking that this would be something cool for ZUN to unfurl and admire at times, that might not be too feasible unless he goes outside or something. While it is a really neat idea, it just doesn't seem all that practical from multiple standpoints.

[Vento]

perhaps the reason why more art has been done in jumping ship than the real project is because we weren't given the okay for the characters we chosen and thus can't even start on the sketches maybe

I don't get it.

Hopefully the album project goes better.

of course you dont you dont even draw

To the people who decided to drop the project:[/b] I get your concerns, but you had your reasons to sign up in the first place. What matters is that Zun gets a fabulous fanmade object to take home and talk about when this is all over. If that doesn't make you want to do something for this project, then you shouldn't have bothered in the first place.

i wanted to do something for zun not to be someone's dog
 If i wanted someone to tell me what to draw and how to draw, i'd rather take a commission

[Merp]

GUYS STAHP IT

[Vyrien]

I attempted to exit this project in a respectful and polite manner, evidently this has caused much unrest and drama which was not my intention, however, I cannot help but feel that many people are quick to demonise those who have left.

Overcoat, it may be difficult, but kindly restrain yourself from calling us 'weiners', we each have our own problems and your heckling is not benefiting anybody. You evidently haven't taken the time to understand our position at all.

Venappo and Pasu, you have expressed my sentiments impeccably. It is not that I have any objection to working for free but rather that there is only so much you can ask for before it ceases to be enjoyable and feels more like slave labour. HakureiSM is also correct, it has been over-thought and thus comes across as being restrictive, domineering and unenjoyable.

I reiterate, this project needs more input as to the selection of artists than a single person, especially as that single person is able to pick and choose whom he wishes to draw but nobody else holds that privilege. Most undemocratic, especially considering this is a group project.

[OverCoat]

Okay I admit the weiner on the head was pretty funny. Also I edited out most of the rage in my previous post because I happen to be a giant asshole ANYWAY, my apologies for not thinking of something a bit more tactful.

Also no, I'm not an artist - but I've worked on a few collaborative musical projects in the past decade [music is art too!] before, and they all seem to generally take 5 years to 8 years. Typically because, as just proven, even for something as gratifying as being able to work on something with the purpose of gifting it to the man who has inspired you, most artists never see eye-to-eye on how something should be done. I think BECAUSE of the nature of this project, as it's something that's going to be given to ZUN himself, physically, and in person, I think everyone would want the best possible end product even moreso than if it was just something you released online. But y'all have to agree on something first. You haven't even really figured out what role each person should be performing in the project yet. Still, yes it is Totaku's project and while he's quickly learning how hard it is to lead a project like this, I hope the artists here will more respectful towards him in the future, and on the other hand, for Totaku to realize it doesn't have to be and really shouldn't be a 50 foot long ornate scroll.

Anyway time for me to stop waving my dick around, that was my 3 cents. I would love to see a scroll in ZUN's hands in September [or will the scrollery be forbidden huehuehuehe]

[pasu]

I guess we should have started the project 10 years earlier

Well our art is 'fucking disgusting/insulting', guess it won't even pass the standard of quality, huh? Good thing we pulled out before we got rejected.