Author Topic: Koakuma's Writer's Parlour ~ Have some tea and discuss fiction and writing here! (Read 226046 times)

Tengukami · « **Reply #120 on:** February 24, 2010, 07:16:23 AM »

Quote from: SenSageUn on February 24, 2010, 04:11:26 AM

I'm up for beta-reading if anyone needs it.

Alright, check your PM's. I don't want to add to Ruro's workload on top of her being sick.

Tengukami · « **Reply #121 on:** February 24, 2010, 10:14:09 PM »

Hm. Anyone else?

Forte Blackadder · « **Reply #122 on:** February 24, 2010, 11:48:59 PM »

Uhm excuse me did I miss something? You sound like the fics should be read by the staff first o_o
I usually gather my thoughts and then make a draft, then turn it into a chapter and post it straight to the topic... It'd be lovely if I can send it to a librarian for some comment first.

Tengukami · « **Reply #123 on:** February 24, 2010, 11:56:48 PM »

Quote from: Fortevn on February 24, 2010, 11:48:59 PM

Uhm excuse me did I miss something? You sound like the fics should be read by the staff first o_o

No, not at all. I was just trying something new and wanted a beta tester. Ruro volunteered.

And she is a critical genius. Thank you, Ruro.

Esifex · « **Reply #124 on:** February 25, 2010, 01:04:20 AM »

If anyone has a long-running project going on (story-wise) that they need a beta reader for, I'm up for it. I can't guarantee speed, but I have efficiency.

Alfred F. Jones · « **Reply #125 on:** February 25, 2010, 02:06:18 AM »

Quote from: Rain Lindwurm on February 24, 2010, 11:56:48 PM

And she is a critical genius. Thank you, Ruro.

You are quite welcome. Also, I finished proofing Gpop's latest chapter, so I am once again available for beta reading if anyone would like to throw a fic in my general direction.

Bias Bus · « **Reply #126 on:** February 25, 2010, 01:06:47 PM »

Hoooly shit, actually started writing again!

But knowing me, I'll make a critical fuck up somewhere in this chapter so I'mma try this proof read thing you guys got goin on, when I'm done. Anyone can jump on it, so if your interested speak up and we'll see where things go from there.

Tengukami · « **Reply #127 on:** February 25, 2010, 01:56:15 PM »

Hey, glad to hear you're writing again. I can lend a pair of eyes, if you need.

Bias Bus · « **Reply #128 on:** February 25, 2010, 03:43:02 PM »

Quote from: Rain Lindwurm on February 25, 2010, 01:56:15 PM

Hey, glad to hear you're writing again. I can lend a pair of eyes, if you need.

Thanks, I'll be sure to send it to you whenever I get done with the chapter.

non-lolicon Ange fan · « **Reply #129 on:** February 27, 2010, 02:00:51 AM »

When writing fiction, be it original or fanfic, I brainstorm a general idea of what the plot will be; I don't go into too much detail, like, "Reimu does X." Then I'll start to write the story just from that. As I'm writing, ideas come to me; it's like I can't fully visualize the setting I'm writing unless if I'm actually writing it.Whatever ideas come to me from writing, I'll throw in, so long as they don't contradict my initial brainstorm. Most of my ideas come from doing this.

As for programs, I prefer Wordperfect for writing. I don't know why, I just do.

Esifex · « **Reply #130 on:** February 27, 2010, 02:58:48 AM »

xm, if I'm interpreting that correctly, then you're pretty similar to me.

I don't plot out every individual scene as it'll happen - I just make it up as I sit down and write. The initial detail that defines the plot is the only consistent subject in the entire story; everything else flows and changes as it comes up, with the exception of a few plot important details that are relevant to making the endpoint come about.

Gpop · « **Reply #131 on:** February 27, 2010, 04:04:05 AM »

Alright I've fixed up those things Ruro mentioned, and I will release the next chapter by Sunday, when my vow is complete!

Paul Debrion · « **Reply #132 on:** February 28, 2010, 02:25:00 AM »

I have a question.

How do you usually go about giving Touhou characters personalities?

It seems like there's not much canon about a lot of them to refer to so I find it difficult to go beyond simple "generic childlike" here and "generic slightly more mature" there and so on.

non-lolicon Ange fan · « **Reply #133 on:** February 28, 2010, 02:48:12 AM »

Quote from: Professor Paul1290 on February 28, 2010, 02:25:00 AM

I have a question.

How do you usually go about giving Touhou characters personalities?

It seems like there's not much canon about a lot of them to refer to so I find it difficult to go beyond simple "generic childlike" here and "generic slightly more mature" there and so on.

What I do is this: I examine the canon personalities of the Touhou characters, then I examine their fanon personalities. I look for which one(s) I think suit the characters best. Sometimes, I mix and match canon and fanon personalities. I do also throw in my own little characterization quirks, but not to the point that the characters feel OOC.

Say, speaking of which, this has inspired me to fire up my Wordperfect program now . . .

Esifex · « **Reply #134 on:** February 28, 2010, 02:53:10 AM »

Quote from: Professor Paul1290 on February 28, 2010, 02:25:00 AM

I have a question.

How do you usually go about giving Touhou characters personalities?

It seems like there's not much canon about a lot of them to refer to so I find it difficult to go beyond simple "generic childlike" here and "generic slightly more mature" there and so on.

Read their backstory - the origins of their powers and how they fight, what motivates them to fight, stuff like that can be found there. Extrapolate from there - what kind of person would develop from such conditions?

IcedFairy · « **Reply #135 on:** February 28, 2010, 03:44:29 AM »

Quote from: Professor Paul1290 on February 28, 2010, 02:25:00 AM

I have a question.

How do you usually go about giving Touhou characters personalities?

It seems like there's not much canon about a lot of them to refer to so I find it difficult to go beyond simple "generic childlike" here and "generic slightly more mature" there and so on.

1 - Obsessively pour over game text.

2 - Obsessively pour over all the articles, game information and side material.

3 - Find what I hate about fanon and cut every trace of it out.

4- Season to taste.

I think I occationally am a little too serious about my writing.

Nat Tea · « **Reply #136 on:** February 28, 2010, 07:21:38 AM »

Quote from: IcedFairy on February 28, 2010, 03:44:29 AM

1 - Obsessively pour over game text.

2 - Obsessively pour over all the articles, game information and side material.

3 - Find what I hate about fanon and cut every trace of it out.

4- Season to taste.

I think I occationally am a little too serious about my writing.

Only I'm allowed to admit that. I'm too serious about a lot of things, to be honest.

Totally.

Tengukami · « **Reply #137 on:** February 28, 2010, 02:35:31 PM »

Quote from: Professor Paul1290 on February 28, 2010, 02:25:00 AM

I have a question.

How do you usually go about giving Touhou characters personalities?

It seems like there's not much canon about a lot of them to refer to so I find it difficult to go beyond simple "generic childlike" here and "generic slightly more mature" there and so on.

I start with cannon. All kind of possibilities can arise when you use game dialogue, BHiJR and other ZUN sources as your foundation. Fanfiction by its very nature adds new stories to a character that's already been developed and already has a story. So long as your fanfiction doesn't clash with the character's personality or backstory, you actually have a lot of freedom to work with.

And that's where we see how the author views the characters. "Based on what I know about Character X, I think she would do A, B and C." So rather than everyone's Kaguya or everyone's Cirno being exactly the same, they're all a bit different - we see them through the lens of the author.

I think that's one of my favorite things about fanfiction.

Nobu · « **Reply #138 on:** March 01, 2010, 04:12:07 AM »

Quote from: Professor Paul1290 on February 28, 2010, 02:25:00 AM

I have a question.

How do you usually go about giving Touhou characters personalities?

It seems like there's not much canon about a lot of them to refer to so I find it difficult to go beyond simple "generic childlike" here and "generic slightly more mature" there and so on.

For me it's based off their dialog, backstories, and comments, and what kind of personalities would allow those to make sense and tie everything together. It's more intuitive than anything.

Alfred F. Jones · « **Reply #139 on:** March 01, 2010, 04:15:23 AM »

[21:13] <Sakura-Rurouni> @choose base Yumeko's personality on thoughtfully-researched canon sources or make crap up
[21:13] <Keine> Sakura-Rurouni: I choose...make crap up! ^_^V
[21:13] <Sakura-Rurouni>

Is how I roll, ese.

I will never, ever admit to following canon. Ever. It's much more fun to pretend otherwise.

Nobu · « **Reply #140 on:** March 01, 2010, 04:19:07 AM »

Quote from: Signum Rurouni on March 01, 2010, 04:15:23 AM

I will never, ever admit to following canon. Ever. It's much more fun to pretend otherwise.

Quote from: Signum Rurouni on March 01, 2010, 04:15:23 AM

I will never, ever admit to following canon. Ever. It's much more fun to pretend otherwise.

Quote from: Signum Rurouni on March 01, 2010, 04:15:23 AM

I will never, ever admit to following canon. Ever. It's much more fun to pretend otherwise.

Quote from: Signum Rurouni on March 01, 2010, 04:15:23 AM

I will never, ever admit to following canon. Ever. It's much more fun to pretend otherwise.

Alfred F. Jones · « **Reply #141 on:** March 01, 2010, 05:32:59 AM »

I've seen too many people reject everything fanon out of hand on sheer basis of being fanon, Nobu. The cool thing to do these days is to declare yourself a devotee of canon, without interpretation or analysis or extrapolation from established traits, because that is stupid fanon practice. Such people do not use their brains and are just going with it because it's the "in" thing to do.

As for me: I am not going to be caught dead trying to be cool, so I actively subvert that mindset to hell and back. And I just plain like being contrary, too. :3

IcedFairy · « **Reply #142 on:** March 01, 2010, 05:51:57 AM »

Quote from: Signum Rurouni on March 01, 2010, 05:32:59 AM

I've seen too many people reject everything fanon out of hand on sheer basis of being fanon, Nobu.

Huh, really? Maybe I just skim commentary too much.

Still I will admit fanon has brought us many good things. Like eel cart Mystia and Yuugi-Parsee. Hell, I did the "Shinki is Alice's adopted mother" bit. That's pure fanon, if not actively disproved, but I'm sticking to it.

There's just some fanon though that is mind blowingly awful (poor, poor Alice...) and my personal goal is to kill as much of it within the collective unconcious as I can.

Though for my current project I'm having to sacrifice some of my personal issues. Ah well.

Alfred F. Jones · « **Reply #143 on:** March 01, 2010, 06:03:32 AM »

Ah, to clarify: the GRR FANON IS BAD mindset is dying away, I think. It is, as most extreme mindsets are, more pervasive in the summer than at any other time; I spent long enough on imageboards and Touhou communities around the internet to see that it's more of a reactionary thing with the influx of kids fresh from school who see IOSYS and immediately consider memes and the like to be canon. (Yes, poor, poor Alice. Good thing SWR Alice is a cast-iron badass whom I positively adore.)

I am fond of using artistic license; I know full well that Alice being Shinki's daughter is not canon, but I also believe that it is better for Shinki's character if she is portrayed that way. She is a complex individual with feelings and desires; she must have a motivation to do what she does. I have, in this vein, tried to produce explanations for canon traits that may or may not have anything to do with ideas I borrow/steal from fanon.

A good example of this is how I see Koishi's spellcards; everyone always accuses them of being based on Freudian thought, right? In my view: Ancestors and Genetics are based on biological psychology, Philosophy of a Hated Person on humanistic theory, and Paranoia and Rorschach on cognitive psychology. Id, Superego, and the like are psychodynamic theory, of course. Subterranean Rose stands apart, based on

Spoiler:

. Scientific explanations are great fun, and a very good way to avoid being a fanon or canonfag sellout. I don't like the idea of accepting canon or fanon without thinking, so I take a middle route. (Of course, I am not above picking one or the other when it comes to comedy of extremes, where you take one trait and magnify it to its logical extreme. But I digress~ :3)

Tengukami · « **Reply #144 on:** March 01, 2010, 06:14:17 AM »

I try and follow canon for no other reason than I love the challenge it presents me to write an entertaining and engaging story about these girls, while staying true to their backstories and personalities. I don't frown upon fanon (even though "aya's a slut lol" was probably among the dumbest memes to arise) in general, and we've seen some great genre-crossing with the girls on this board. I just love the challenge of canon, is all.

IcedFairy · « **Reply #145 on:** March 01, 2010, 06:21:11 AM »

Quote from: Signum Rurouni on March 01, 2010, 06:03:32 AM

Ah, to clarify: the GRR FANON IS BAD mindset is dying away, I think. It is, as most extreme mindsets are, more pervasive in the summer than at any other time; I spent long enough on imageboards and Touhou communities around the internet to see that it's more of a reactionary thing with the influx of kids fresh from school who see IOSYS and immediately consider memes and the like to be canon. (Yes, poor, poor Alice. Good thing SWR Alice is a cast-iron badass whom I positively adore.)

Ah yes. Outside the fiction areas there's a whole lot of that, true.

I think my personal obsession is because I want all of my stories to be true. For a lot of my stuff (barring the some of the quick humor bits) it's not just Zun's Gensoukyo, it's mine. And I feel it'll become someone elses vision of Gensoukyo better if I avoid things that break canon.

Then again I'm occationally a little too serious about this as I stated before.

Nobu · « **Reply #146 on:** March 01, 2010, 07:53:31 AM »

And here I was just trying to tease you and reveal your tinytext, Ruro~n. :3 But this works too. Yeah, you and I are pretty much on the same wavelength on this (not that that's too surprising >_>

Bias Bus · « **Reply #147 on:** March 01, 2010, 12:38:08 PM »

I usually hate alot of things fanon does to characters (like how they bastardized Wriggle with gender confusion and shit, I'll admit it that it's because of such a thing, and the other thing involving Yuuka, is one of the main reasons why I can't stand Wriggle now), so I try to avoid alot of the things they make up about the characters. I only follow at least one or two fanon theories or what not

Spoiler:

. There will be times when I make up shit (

Spoiler:

.)

So where does this all put me? I honestly don't know, I accept only two things from fanon tops, character, locations and other things ZUN has actually established I try to follow, everything else I pretty much do myself. I don't want to see Gensokyo the way fanon sees it as "lol there's no men, lol everyone's GAY, lol everything's going to kill you no matter what, lol PC98 doesn't exist, etc." All of this I pretty much say a big "Fuck that and fuck you" to and do my own thing.

Since this has something to do with fanon and writing fiction, I'd also like to get off my chest that being I write Touhou fiction that is actually straight, it pretty much restricts me to creating them (

Spoiler:

), so I can't stand the idea of giving in to what I dislike only because it's seen as a literary sin in the fan community and what not. I'm probably the only few who like creating Touhou OCs and see that they can be done right with the right work. I don't judge every OC I lay eyes on as a mary sue the moment it is introduced. Everyone ELSE might but I like to be a bit more forgiving in this category if only because I'm guilty of it this pleasure to. Yes, yes, "Erebus is actually forgiving to someone OMG unprecedented seri(ry." Does this mean I'm blind to sue qualities? Fuck no, I know a mary sue when I see one. But I don't think EVERY god damn OC is one just for because it's created.

Yeah, sorry for turning this around to what I dislike, but this has been on my chest and I've kept it to myself for...quite awhile now. Longer than I should have, really.

Nobu · « **Reply #148 on:** March 01, 2010, 06:27:01 PM »

I try to be more tolerant of OCs just on the basis that *all* characters start out as OCs. How are ZUN's OCs much different than anyone else's?

I also have a nagging theory that Touhou's popularity has a lot to do with ZUN just setting a template and letting fans fill most of the blanks. I.E. The Suwako in my mind's eye is a bit different from your Suwako, ad infinitum. OCs also have a very strong feeling of "belonging" to one person, while Touhous and 'non-OCs' seem a little more predisposed to creative interpretation.

Forte Blackadder · « **Reply #149 on:** March 01, 2010, 06:54:15 PM »

About canon, well, I only take the very basic, as in "personality", "background" of them. Like something obvious as "Remilia is a vampire", "Aya is a reporter tengu", others "canon" and "fanon" can be mixed if it makes sense. I know some only "official profiles" are stated in PMiSS and BAiJR, but isn't it just what's been recorded by Aya and Akyu? Well, that's why I only take it as a basic. The same goes for 'Grimoire of Marisa'.

Fanon is the source of most event in Touhou we now know of, and it helped making Touhou popular so I can't deny it.

Quote

I also have a nagging theory that Touhou's popularity has a lot to do with ZUN just setting a template and letting fans fill most of the blanks.

Ditto. But my theory is that ZUN didn't do it on purpose. He created a game, then 'ok bye, let me forget everything so I can make another game.'