Maidens of the Kaleidoscope

~Beyond the Border~ => Rumia's Party Games => Mystia's Stored Games => Topic started by: Edible on April 20, 2011, 03:54:38 AM

Title: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on April 20, 2011, 03:54:38 AM
Welcome to Arpeggington, stranger.  It's a quiet town here.  Folks is normal, salt-of-the-earth types.  Ain't no fancy flavor or ridiculous jobs here.  We only got one doctor, one cop, and a buncha hardworkin' townsfolk.  ... That is, until the mob showed up.  We got a note, sayin' we was settled on a mighty big river of oil, and a gang of city folks have started makin' trouble.  Sons'a'bitches are also masters of disguises, and are hiding amongst our very number even as we speak.  We gotta drive 'em out, or there ain't gonna be nothin' left of our poor little village... grab a rope.

BGM is an open setup.  If you're town, lynch the mafia scum to win.  If you're mafia, kill the townies to win.

Mafia Roleblocker
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon
Town Doctor
Town Macho Cop
Vanilla Town
Vanilla Town
Vanilla Town
Vanilla Town
Vanilla Town
Vanilla Town
Vanilla Town

Rules(copied almost directly from MotK Mafioso, but not really)
1) All Days wil last 72 hours (3 days).  If Town is in LYLO, the Day will last 168 hours (7 days).  All Nights will last approximately 24 hours.  Any and all Night Actions must be submitted within 24 hours of the moderator announcing the start of the Night phase.
2) Extensions are allowed, but only if a majority of living players vote to extend the day.  There will be a maximum allowable amount of 1 24-hour extension per day, and no more than 3 extensions over the course of the game.
3) Thou Shalt Not Edit Thine Posts.  Thou Shalt Not Change Thy Nickname During The Game.  Thou Shalt Not Delete Thine Posts.  I can tell who edits, deletes, or changes what, and I will come down on you like the fist of God.
4) Don't bully No Lynch-chan.  Voting to No Lynch is not allowed, and a majority MUST be reached by the end of each day or Rocks Fall And You Will Die.
5) Dead players may "Bah!" post once.  This post may be amusing, but must also be utterly useless in relevance to all players from an in-game perspective.  Keep your opinions to yourself after you're dead.
6) Players may not contact any other player by any means other than in the game thread unless their role permits them to do so.  Dead players may talk in the Dead QT, which I will provide to you when you die.
7) Players are expected to post a significant contribution at least once every 24 hours.  Failure to do so will result in a prod PM asking you to show up in-game.  If there is no in-game response 24 hours after the prod PM, a modkill will occur.
8) Mafia-aligned players may talk to each other only at night.  No one is to discuss the game in the thread during the night. You may play forum games or react positively or negatively to a flip, but you are not allowed to publicly analyze other players.
9) This game has a maximum wordcount per post.  Please keep your posts to 400 words or less; this includes quotes.  Edits By Way Of Post (EBWOPs) should not add significantly to this count, but may exceed it slightly.
10) There are a couple "hydras" in this game.  They are there to assist the new-ish players they're tied to and may offer assistance and thoughts, but may not write posts for the player or post at all in the thread for any reason.
11) Have fun, and please play nice.

PLAYER LIST
1) Sect, Mafia Goon
2) Bardiche, Townsperson
3) UncertainKitten, Townsperson
4) Shadoweh, Mafia Roleblocker
5) Dormio (Pesco hydra), Mafia Goon
6) Action Dan, Townsperson
7) NeoSerela Zakeri, Townsperson
8) huh what, Macho Cop
9) Hanged Hourai, Townsperson
10) Omba, Doctor
11) Kiro, Townsperson
12) Polaris (K4U hydra), townie

Role PMs are going out shortly.  Please post only when you've received your PM.

Role PMs are posted below, for openness purposes.

Quote
Hi, you're the Town Doctor!  Each night, you may choose to protect one person from death.  Please note that your protection will not work on the Cop, for he is macho and doesn't believe in doctors... or something.

Quote
Hi, you're MAFIA SCUM!

You are a roleblocker.  At night, you may choose to block any one player's actions.  If you're the only one left alive, you can RB and kill.

Quote
Hi, you're the Town Macho Cop! at night, you may determine the alignment of one player.  As a macho cop, you may not be protected at night.  Alas.

Quote
Hi there!  You're a Townsperson and you don't do anything special except grow vegetables or whatever it is you typically do with your time.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Edible on April 20, 2011, 04:30:25 AM
Role PMs have been sent out.

My apologies if I've changed your name - I've set all player names to either their defaults or to their most commonly referred names (in most cases) for ease of communication.  If you have a problem with this please let me know and we'll work something out.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 04:31:33 AM
Confirmed.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Polaris on April 20, 2011, 04:32:00 AM
Confirmations.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 20, 2011, 04:32:07 AM
/profirm

It's scummy to be against things!

##Vote Bardiche
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 20, 2011, 04:32:27 AM
Can't sleep must confirm can't sleep must confirm
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Omba on April 20, 2011, 04:32:52 AM
Confirmed.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 20, 2011, 04:34:25 AM
Confirmed.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 20, 2011, 04:49:51 AM
Confirmed.

##Vote PX
DIE SCUM.

Also, Dormio is the more common handle I go by.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Kiro on April 20, 2011, 05:17:48 AM
I am confirmed.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Omba on April 20, 2011, 07:20:38 AM
Kitties still get the boot, so

##Vote UncertainKitten
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 20, 2011, 11:03:18 AM
Players may not contact any other player by any means other than in the game thread unless their role permits them to do so. 
What's the point of this?
Unless.
This is actually a bastard mod in disguise.
##Unvote
##Vote Edible
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Serela on April 20, 2011, 11:25:19 AM
confirmmmeeddddddd although I'm leaving to go to school and shouldn't be on here

that's 11/12 unless I can't count
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 20, 2011, 11:26:49 AM
I count 9/12 confirmed.
:V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 20, 2011, 12:23:44 PM
ObvTown right here.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 01:23:16 PM
/confirmed

Not last!  :toot:

Also, first case.  HH has two tags, but ObvTown!HH wouldn't want the ObvScum tag, while ObvScum!HH would want the ObvTown tag... THUS!!

HH is ObvScum!

##vote Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Sect on April 20, 2011, 02:00:09 PM
Oh shit did the game start already?

Confirm.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Role PMs/Confirmation)
Post by: Edible on April 20, 2011, 02:09:14 PM
I think that's everyone.

DAY 1

All players are alive.  No one is voting.  You have 72 hours.  Triumph or die!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 02:14:13 PM
No one is voting.

 :fail:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 20, 2011, 02:16:01 PM
So... how's everyone doing?

##Vote huh what
## Unvote
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 02:25:12 PM
So... how's everyone doing?

Good Thanks! But I'm eager for ACTIOOONNNN!!!

##Vote Hanged Hourai  vote shall stand once more!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 20, 2011, 02:35:50 PM
But the obvScum tag is a ploy to make me look scummy enough to not be NK'd! D:

##Vote: Sect
Pretty good. Honey bunches of oats for breakfast.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 20, 2011, 02:40:28 PM
Oh, is it go time?

All right. So, here's the thing

##Vote Edible

No, hear me out. Edible obviously knows who the scum are, right? Yet he's not even TRYING to tell town who they are! What POSSIBLE town intent could be behind this action!?

Bandwagon Edible to victory.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 02:57:51 PM
I am fairly positive finding scum in our midst is easy if we all mass roleclaim! Obligatory conditional mass-vigilante reviver, here.

##Vote: Bardiche

PS: I'm lying, lynch me for that!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 20, 2011, 03:02:30 PM
Sorry Bard, you'll have to wait til after Edible. And plus, until you start lurking, we can't lynch you, that would be crazy!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 03:03:49 PM
For shame, claiming Dormio's role as your own, and then claiming you're lying!  Trying to discredit Dormio no doubt!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 20, 2011, 03:12:46 PM
Quote
<Akiyama_dorMio> @dice 1d12
<+Keine-tan> Akiyama_dorMio: 4
As we saw in the previous game, Keine is the greatest mafia player in existance.
Are you going to question her judgement?
##Vote Shadoweh
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 20, 2011, 03:27:16 PM
All right. So, here's the thing

##Vote Edible

No, hear me out. Edible obviously knows who the scum are, right? Yet he's not even TRYING to tell town who they are! What POSSIBLE town intent -
Didn't you do this in the last game? The same game you were scum in?  :wat:

##Vote UncertainKitten
##Unvote
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 03:39:55 PM
If you read further in the archives, you will see that this is her signiture meta, kind of like how you like to vote someone and then unvote said person.  I'd encourage UK to explain in her own words why she favors this meta and I'd encourage you to stick with a vote (Imo it furthers the town agenda).

This is my first seriouso posto.  I think I've provided town enough to work with and would like to hear some other opinions, be they funnies or super serious types.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 20, 2011, 03:43:16 PM
Well, Dan is town. I'm going to now be manifestly anti town and refuse to answer his question. Sorry guy ^-^.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 20, 2011, 03:48:13 PM
Votecount - Early Day 1, Breakfast & Lunch Edition

Hanged Hourai (1) - Action Dan
Sect (1) - Hanged Hourai
Edible (1) - UncertainKitten
Bardiche (1) - Bardiche
Shadoweh (1) - Dormio
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 20, 2011, 03:49:48 PM
...?

##Vote Roukanken
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 20, 2011, 03:50:23 PM
Quote
Edible  (1) - UncertainKitten
I smiled.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 03:58:22 PM
Am amused at the votecount name.

##Unvote
##Vote: UncertainKitten


Admitting what you're doing is anti-town doesn't make it pro-town. Srs bsns vote with srs bsns face.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 20, 2011, 03:58:59 PM
##Vote Sect
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 04:10:55 PM
Well, Dan is town. I'm going to now be manifestly anti town and refuse to answer his question. Sorry guy ^-^.

To be honest, it's really hard to resist posting!  Opinions come to me fast and furious :)  Anyway I like your response UK, mostly because you called me town. I'm so flattered Scum!UK might be a little more hesitant. I expect to be NKed night 2 or 3. NK1 goes to that town lurker who makes good sense while keeping some distance (i.e. likely town PR role), but ObvTown needs to die eventually, and D1 is a good place to look for connections to ObvTown.  Scum!UK might want to buddy up for this eventuallity, but I seriously doubt scum would risk it this quickly.

Anyone else care to indulge me?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 04:16:27 PM
...?

##Vote Roukanken
:fail:

Am amused at the votecount name.

##Unvote
##Vote: UncertainKitten


Admitting what you're doing is anti-town doesn't make it pro-town. Srs bsns vote with srs bsns face.

I think that was an obvious null tell. Making something seem scummy that isn't is anti-town or scummy.

##Unvote
##Vote Bardiche
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 20, 2011, 04:19:34 PM
Action: I was just curious if Edible was counting all votes, even if the target was invalid. Forgot to ask him to do a vote count, though.

@Edible: vote count?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 20, 2011, 04:22:39 PM
Sect-
Fooling around with votes on non-players. Prolonging RVS, and thus, hunting. Happier with my vote on him.

also, now my avatar tags work on both colors. \o/
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 20, 2011, 04:25:00 PM
Anyone else care to indulge me?

Not really. Half the game hasn't reported in. Guessing on one player's motivation when half the other players haven't posted feels foolhardy. You definitely look overeager, I'll decide what to make of it later.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 20, 2011, 04:30:14 PM
@Edible: vote count?

Quote from: Edible
Votecount - Early Day 1, Breakfast & Lunch Edition

Bardiche (1) - Action Dan
Sect (2) - Hanged Hourai, Kiro
Shadoweh (1) - Dormio
UncertainKitten (1) - Bardiche
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 04:31:26 PM
A repeat.

Dan, point me to the scummiest thing to vote for instead then. Or would you rather I continue RVS shenanigans until everyone's comfortable to put their gamefaces on? You don't.

Or, hey, I could vote you if you like for engaging in WIFOM this early! Seriously bro, what up with that?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 04:45:31 PM
Bard,
I am perhaps, like Kiro suggested, a bit over eager.  Still I found that remark a little strange when UK point blank declared me town. To me that is far more interesting and thrilling! than some silly meta (sorry UK).  I am glad, however, that you skipped over the Sect scene which I feel is worthless atm. 

So.. besides you, the other people to look at atm are kiro and HH for scuminess.  HH is scumier because of tunnel vision and because of how inane her statement was. Of course it's quite hard to damn ppl at this point and in no way do I want to go to war with you bard over something as silly as WIFOM over a silly meta (sorry UK).
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 05:01:36 PM
Damn! I just noticed Edible crumbing his role, maybe we should all bandwaggon to pressure him into serving us pancakes :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 05:08:39 PM
Vanilla Mentor Mafier's looking fun already.

The WIFOM I talk of is that you began to discuss when you would die and how a scum!UK could benefit from actions at this point. However, this is early Day 1; speculation on scum-motivated actions are few and far between, or at least semi-accurate speculation.

Early Day 1 Cases have much akin with magic. There is nothing at first, but with sleight of hand, shazam! Make something out of nothing. The key point at this juncture is to stimulate discussion, whereupon we can root out the scum among us based on the produce of said discussion. Accusations like "tunnel vision" and "inane statements" are likely to be the best thing you can find right now.

How is Kiro on your list of people to watch? What is bad about attacking UK over how she says "I'm going to be anti-town and do x", which is in itself not necessarily pro-town just because she self-diagnoses it?

The first step is the push. Vote your heart, we'll infer whether you're right later.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 06:00:26 PM
The WIFOM I talk of is that you began to discuss when you would die and how a scum!UK could benefit from actions at this point. However, this is early Day 1; speculation on scum-motivated actions are few and far between, or at least semi-accurate speculation.

point taken; it's hard for me to think like scum!me (although I realize this is in itself a WIFOM). Still if me and UK were both scum, I'd have to assume UK to be out of her mind to declare me town.  Other than that my speculation is, IMHO, pretty much what goes on in a typical mafia game.

How is Kiro on your list of people to watch? What is bad about attacking UK over how she says "I'm going to be anti-town and do x", which is in itself not necessarily pro-town just because she self-diagnoses it?

The first step is the push. Vote your heart, we'll infer whether you're right later.

Sorry if my post was worded ambiguously.  By "watch" I meant "look at the people who have bothered to even post".  That list consists of Kiro, Sect, HH, you, UK, and me.  I have nothing to go on with Kiro, except that I feel her vote is misplaced and that she is ignoring some of the juicier stuff, so I have no feelings either way towards her. Sect seems to have no ill motives besides the ones HH created for her. Hope I put that all the right way this time.  ANYWAY, bard, its fine to attack UK, but you ignore her town declaration of me!  If you truly advocate pushing UK, push her for that. You need only ask her one question: "Why?" ( ;) ;):hint:hint: UK answer plz).  You haven't answered me convincingly bard, and frankly I'm the one doing the pushing around here.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 20, 2011, 06:02:03 PM
Did I sleep through the RVS stage for once? WHOO! Just as well since Zak isn't here to give me my chocofix :ohdear:
Dan is so cute! Don't get your hopes up about dying till the day ends though. Sect, be more cute like Dan and actually vote for someone in the game. Hourai, attacking newbies for fooling around isn't cool. So what do you think of the conversations between Dan, Bard and UK that you're ignoring?

##Vote: Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 06:11:56 PM
Townie: me.

Dan, I'm attacking her because she refused to answer that question. :V What use would asking it again be?



Shadoweeeeh <3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 06:14:54 PM
EBWOP:  I just realized I didn't use the word "watch" in my 2nd to last post, I think its more or less clear if you read between the lines

cut by Shadoweh,  you know, I might subconsciencously be fighting with bard for your affections (if that sounded creepy..well..ignore it!)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 06:16:15 PM
Losing battle there, Dan. You're not implying I'd cheat on my girlfriend with a guy, right?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 06:24:18 PM
Townie: me.

Dan, I'm attacking her because she refused to answer that question. :V What use would asking it again be?



Shadoweeeeh </3

I'm refering to this kind of exchange:

UK: Dan is town
anyone else (aka bard and me): Why?

You are attacking her because she refused to explain her meta vote on the Mod and self-diagnoses it as anti-town behavior.

I think: ok UK, not a big deal
Bard thinks: ATTACK!! man your battlestations!! (*overdramatization*)

See why this strikes me oddly?

Losing battle there, Dan. You're not implying I'd cheat on my girlfriend with a guy, right?
What??? I don't even...
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 20, 2011, 06:26:59 PM
*tweeeeeeet*

Friendly reminder that there's a wordcount limitation per post of 400 words.  No one's exceeded it yet, of course - just remindin'.

Additionally, I have updated the OP with the game's role PMs.  They should preemptively answer any questions anyone has about the roles.

*tweeeeeeet*
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 20, 2011, 06:29:07 PM
Ahaha, you're allowed to be cute but today everyone starts over, it's a townie race to be the townest! That Bardiche might have a headstart in cuteness. <3  Dan, instead of imagining things from if you were scum, if your alignment says town think of how people benefit from saying you're town. I can guess the answer but it'll be good for UK to answer the townliness question herself. And no, just because Edible is counting himself doesn't mean we want people actually voting for him.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 06:36:38 PM
Edible making sure only he can crumb

Shadoweh, I understand, but I agree that before I give you a better opinion than my last speculation, it would be wise to wait until UK chimes in. This is purely so I don't feed her an answer, so to speak.  She's pro though, so I ain't worrying
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 20, 2011, 06:37:40 PM
##Vote: Bardiche

PS: I'm lying, lynch me for that!
I was going to make a hilariously ironic post voting you and saying "Come on guys, let's lynch Bard, onto day 1" but I guess that isn't happening. Oh well.

Dan's overeagerness is pretty silly but it's not scummy. Half the cases that have popped up so far are uninteresting to me, as in not worth voting for the way I see it.

##Vote Shadoweh
You're trying too hard. What is there to really say on the 3-way Dan/Bard/UK discussion that hasn't already been said by one of them? You yourself barely had anything interesting to say about it in the post where you voted, so I strongly disagree that Hourai's actions are scummy or even deserve a vote. Forced scum case imo. Also, my gut says you finally rolled scum and I'm going to go with it for now, so deal.

Kiro, is your vote on Sect serious or not? After all, you never explained it.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 20, 2011, 06:38:40 PM
Onto day 2, not day 1.

Making mafia posts first thing after waking up is sure a good idea for me. <_<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 20, 2011, 06:46:18 PM
Wellp, first, ##Vote Huh what, full stop.

That was, like, seriously, the worst thing.

Secondly, you CAN ask me why I declared Dan town (and still think he is), but I'm not answering that either. And that's NOT me being anti town. Making cases on why people are town tends to give scum pesky ideas we don't want them having. I'd rather say why people are scum, myself.

Or maybe just watch them squirm as they tell me themselves. In fact, I think I'll let Huh What do that.

I was waiting for more reactions to my answer to Dan but I guess I can't have everything. Bard started out bad, but fixed it. Oh, Hourai and Sect also aren't great, but HW is more unequivocally scummy. There are at least three people not getting lynched today.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 06:50:47 PM
You're trying too hard. What is there to really say on the 3-way Dan/Bard/UK that hasn't already been said by one of them?

You're disgusting and should wash your mouth with soup!

Also, what's with the chainsaw defence of Hourai, bro?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 20, 2011, 06:56:45 PM
##Vote Shadoweh
You're trying too hard. What is there to really say on the 3-way Dan/Bard/UK discussion that hasn't already been said by one of them? You yourself barely had anything interesting to say about it in the post where you voted, so I strongly disagree that Hourai's actions are scummy or even deserve a vote. Forced scum case imo. Also, my gut says you finally rolled scum and I'm going to go with it for now, so deal.
There's always something to say about a discussion, I'm sure if you look hard enough even you can find a comment to make on it. Don't use 'Shadoweh is trying too hard' like it's an excuse to ignore it either, I want to see your opinions. Actually, on a scale of pushes through the RVS, thanks to Dan I barely have to at all so I'm not sure why you would even accuse me of that. Guts shouldn't make odds based on probability, there are people that have rolled town more times then I've played. I think PX is an example. I'm more interested in what Hourai thinks of it then you, but your opinion is noted.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 20, 2011, 06:58:38 PM
EBWOM: Uh, I think 'odds' is suposed to be calls. Making mafia posts first thing after waking u(ry
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 07:16:52 PM
Well Tidelliwinks!!!  :]  This sure is fun!

I have some opinions (some more strong than others).  The only thing I'll give away is that my vote is staying.  UK says bard "fxed it", I say otherwise.
It would be tactical of me to shut my trap for now and I think this would also help out another player also (EUHHWAHH! speculate that *****s!)

I would like HH and Kiro to defend/change their vote AND I want to bomb the foxholes of the remaining lurkers  :getdown: THIS IS WAR! STOP BEING COWARDS SISSIES!!

This will be my last post for a while unless someone really presses me, but there is FAR FAR more on this table than small potatoes!

OVER AND OUT~~buzz
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 20, 2011, 07:22:17 PM
UK: Dunno why HW's post was bad: Shadoweh asked for an opinion that she didn't say anything about herself, and a gut feeling vote doesn't seem like a terrible thing on Day 1, especially less than six hours into the game.

At the very least, he actually gave reasons why he's voting for her.

Action: Slow down, tiger. It hasn't even been six hours, and there's more than sixty hours left.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 20, 2011, 07:29:55 PM
Okay, that's enough.

##Unvote
##Vote UncertainKitten

Shouldn't you be actively scumhunting instead of throwing out votes on people and hoping they give you reasons to vote for them by tripping up later? Because what you just tried to do is not a townie approach to finding scum. It's way too easy for a scum to say "hey, I'm scumhunting!" while taking your recent course of action but instead tripping up weaker townies and netting mislynches. This is more worthy of a vote than Shadoweh is (though my case on her was just an ED1 push anyway, I'm willing to drop it completely if I think she's improved after we get into more srs discussion).

@Bardiche: Hourai and I are scum together. Our buddy is Edible. Seriously though, how do you expect me to answer this?

@Shadoweh: If you're asking for my opinions, then Dan is silly but not scummy, as I already said. I didn't say anything about the other two because Bard was tutoring which is not worth looking into since he's not speaking as a player and UK's only notable post was already covered by Bard when he voted for her. My gut was not my primary reason for voting you and I really only included that sentence as a joke, sooo.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 20, 2011, 07:35:03 PM
@HW: Hey, how unexpected, you voting me because I caught you as scum. Way to willfully misunderstand what I said. What I meant was you're going to continually make it manifestly obvious you're scum, and you have failed to disappoint~

I have a case on you, actually. It's all cute and written up and everything. I just see no need to post it since you're squirming so well yourself.

Continue to flail, please~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 20, 2011, 07:39:54 PM
I have no idea what to make of that post. More weirdness then cuteness. But it's off to work, bring me more opinions for when I get home!

Cut by Sect: My opinion of it is both types of UK would clear a newbie if they were acting town. I don't feel like she's stomping discussion into the ground like last time and her opinions satisfy me for now. Bard is being.. Bard. Dan is bouncing off the walls with enthusiasm. You should pick up some of it and take it to a case against someone.

Stop cutting meeee the rest of you get to wait till I get home damnit!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 20, 2011, 07:43:00 PM
Votecount: Brought to you by Mountain Dew Throwback - "Ya-hooo!  It's made with REAL sugar!"

Bardiche (1) - Action Dan
Sect (2) - Hanged Hourai, Kiro
Shadoweh (1) - Dormio
UncertainKitten (2) - Bardiche, huh what
Hanged Hourai (1) - Shadoweh
huh what (1) - UncertainKitten
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 20, 2011, 07:47:35 PM
@ UK:  How are you going to convince others to vote this apparent scum!me if you're not going to post an actual case, then? I'm expecting a response like "they'll figure it out because it's obvious derp derp", but what about people like Sect, who have openly stated that he doesn't understand your vote? Your convictions are worth nothing for town if you're not going to convince other people you're right and get scum lynched, so withholding a case on who you believe to be scum is being selfish and anti-town. But that obviously doesn't matter to you if you know that your target is town anyway, so hey. Seems like you're playing scum to me.

Also, my vote on you has nothing to do how your vote is currently on me, it's because of how you went about it. I would still be voting you over Shadoweh if you were attacking, say, Polly or Dan or my BFF Hourai.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 20, 2011, 07:48:40 PM
Unless you're town trying to play into Shoe meta, in which case I think it would be obvious to you that I'm not scum at this point barring tunnel vision on your part, but whatever.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 20, 2011, 07:49:29 PM
Perhaps I'm looking for something outside of you, HW. You seem overly concerned about my vote if no one's going to understand it, though. You're nervous.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 20, 2011, 07:54:16 PM
I'm not nervous, but if you want to interpret my posts like that, then there's not really much I can do about it.

I'm focusing on your vote because I believe the way you've went about it is scummy (as I've explained), and therefore my case and vote on you revolve around it. I don't see how that makes me overly concerned about it in a defensive manner like you are implying.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 08:19:47 PM
You are attacking her because she refused to explain her meta vote on the Mod and self-diagnoses it as anti-town behavior.

And you're attacking me on the basis that there was something better at the time or that it was a bad action. It's a lose-lose scenario you present: either I contributed to jokevote phase, voted you, or did nothing.

None of those alternatives really come to equal standing with a vote on UK; explaining why she favours acting according to a certain meta is certainly more interesting than voting someone for joking, or voting you for asking a question!

Your case hinges on that I did something bad; but you must argument why it is A Bad Thing, rather than look at an isolated action and ignore the context.

Now then, unless there is an alternative I did not present, what is objectively wrong with my conduct at the start of this game?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 20, 2011, 08:22:58 PM
As for the Huh What x UK fanfics writing themselves here... I'm more hesitant now to give UK a pass based on "it's UK"; the aggressive style where UK declares someone scum but refuses to further explain this point is not damning on its own given it is pretty much UK, but I am curious about this case you've written up based on Huh What's solely singular post in this game where he voted Shadoweh.

Certainly, if it is something you can troll around (you'll forgive me for calling it trolling a little, right? It's kinda provocative) then it must be something you can share with the group.


Huh What, I kinda meant, "Your attack reeks of a chainsaw of Hourai, given the attack on Shadoweh seems founded in 'What Hourai did is not scummy', rather than a construction of why Shadoweh's reasoning is faulty".
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 20, 2011, 08:48:00 PM
I don't understand Shadoweh's #46 at all. How are you determining that Hourai is ignoring the Dan/Bard conversation at the time when he simply may not be checking the thread at all? Feels like a bit of a reach for something that doesn't look like RVS.

Thus, I have no issue with HW's vote on Shadoweh and don't understand why UK thinks HW is flailing. Although I think the vote change from Shadoweh onto UK now seems a bit weird. Don't agree with his view on UK currently because I know she can play like this as Town.

HW: My vote on Sect was RVS, but halfway to serious. Mucking around with something like, "will Edible count this vote on Roukan" felt weird to me. It's a time-waster statement. This is not a bastard mod game, there will be no shenanigans with players not in the player list. Impression of him hasn't changed since.

Dan: I hate it when people tell me to change my vote without giving any reason to. My current impression of you is newbie excitable Town, but seriously, cut all the noise/static out of your posts. The more gibberish you put out, the more I'm going to doubt my read on you.

Shadoweh: I don't feel like you're contributing right now. #64 definitely feels noncommittal and close to IIoA while you stick on your point with Hourai which doesn't make sense to me.

##Unvote Sect
##Vote Shadoweh
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 20, 2011, 09:04:52 PM
@Kiro: That's one of the reasons I found him flailing. His vote switch was weird and felt more to discredit and less to hunt scum. Wouldn't have worried about it except for the prior posts badness. Still waiting for the rest of everyone to show up. Your Shadoweh vote is kind of bad, but you wouldn't know why. Read prior games with her as town. This is a fairly normal start. If it keeps up though, I'll be more amenable to your point of view.

@Bard: (http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/174/trollface.png)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 09:20:44 PM
Wanna say a couple of quick things while waiting for other ppl.  Mafia is a fun Game.  Perhaps stressful for some, but definitely fun (why would you guys bother playing otherwise?). But honestly, you guys can be such hard***es at times.  I think I'm pretty damn clear and straight forward. Kiro, do you hate ppl prodding you? so what about the Prod that HW gave you? except you answered the call! btw small point- I asked you to defend or change your vote. more later
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 20, 2011, 09:30:46 PM
The difference was tact, Action: you were rather abrupt and forceful about getting Kiro and HH to explain or change their votes on me, while HW simply asked.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 20, 2011, 09:54:40 PM
I have had less than four hours of sleep and spent somewhere around 10 hours straight working on an assignment yesterday.
This will be fun. Anyway.

Action Dan's #60 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611211.html#msg611211) strikes me as odd.
I mean, he states that he is both withholding information from town and that he is not going to say anything until pressured for a while.
That and he also pulled a WIFOM (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611120.html#msg611120) and admitted doing as much in response to Bardiche's questioning over his WIFOM earlier.

Shadoweh is reading a bit weirdly to me right now.
In addition to what Kiro said about her #46 and #64, her #58 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611187.html#msg611187) basically handwaves huh what's argument against her.
What kind of response is "I'm sure if you look hard enough even you can find a comment to make on it." anyway?
That, and Keine is the superior mafia player.

Tired. Don't want to go to uni. Gddmn Assignments. All hail breaks.
I'll try to make another post when I have lunch or something.

Warning - while you were typing 2 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Sleep deprivation is awesome.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 09:57:07 PM
Sect: I feel I'm being misreped here. apparently my sense of funny doesn't click with everyone else.

Some more stuff: Man I wrote this, but didnt post it earlier T_T. I agree that shadow has mostly fluff posts, and I was suspicious of her vote on Hourai mainly because I thought she was catering to me (I was waiting on someone to pick up on this but w/e).  However HW accused her of questioning Hourai on me/bard/UK while not providing much herself. This is fine and good.  But he doesn't rly tackle this issue either T_T.  Anyway I am still focused on Bard.  I still have no idea why UK's meta and what she has to say about it are more interesting to you than UK saying I'm town. What rly boggles my mind is why not one person has said anything of substance regarding our convo.  I am still assuming UK saying it for later.  Does everyone think its just some dumb ED1 arguement?  Because I beg to differ. I think it was a scumslip.

cut by Dormio, give me a sec
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 20, 2011, 10:28:35 PM
Action Dan's #60 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611211.html#msg611211) strikes me as odd.
I mean, he states that he is both withholding information from town and that he is not going to say anything until pressured for a while.
That and he also pulled a WIFOM (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611120.html#msg611120) and admitted doing as much in response to Bardiche's questioning over his WIFOM earlier.

the WIFOM in question here is in post #35 according to bard (it took me until #45 to realize this).  The WIFOM within my #45 you are refering to is this  "it's hard for me to think like scum!me (although I realize this is in itself a WIFOM)."  If you are being critical of that... well... that's a bit too critical.

Otherwise your post is pretty much summing up the HW/shadow thing. I beg you to look at the dan/bard thing Instead! :D
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 20, 2011, 11:31:08 PM
Boop

Ok, I fail to see how I became scummy for telling Sect he's bad for prolonging RVS, and thus, putting off hunting. Can someone who said I was scummy explain why I was scummy?

Dan-
Really, really, really loves Sect.  Not to mention how he blantantly tells the people voting him to either get off or defend themselves.
#43 says the "Sect scene" was "worthless" and then grills me for being on him. Either you're contradicting yourself, or you just don't want people attacking him.
He says how I made "ill motives" for Sect, when I was telling what he did and why it was bad.

I don't like how people write him off as overeager, new scum can be eager too.

Shadoweh-
Cool, vote on me. You tell Sect to try harder, but you vote me for "attacking newbies." He's played before. And then you proceed to question me on a conversation that didn't really exist without you saying anything on it, or even on the people involved in it. Why does Sect get a pass on it? And no, I'm not going to address it because I don't really see much to learn from it. You haven't actually made a case on anyone else since you voted me, and that gives me the feeling that you wanted to wait for me to say something so you could start actually attacking me.

Sect-
Your name shows up a lot in this post. You haven't done anything to make me change my opinion of you. Can you make a case?

UK- So are you ever going to actually address the case you said you had? I would prefer a yes or no over cool/troll faces.

##Unvote
##Vote: Action Dan

Uber defending someone who doesn't really deserve defending earns him my vote.

Also, I don't care if it's in jest, don't buddy with me.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 12:13:52 AM
This entire exchange of votes is giving me headaches. It's like a bunch of monkeys with chainsaws chasing each other in circles. I've been trying to decide which bothers me more, huh what jumping in to defend Hourai's vote choice or UK immediately blazing in to my defense, followed by a blatant huh what OMGUS, followed by Kiro jumping to both Hourai AND huh what's defense. What annoys me the most is none of these people are named Hanged Hourai.

huh what: So now that Bard isn't tutoring what do you think about him? How about Kiro, does he make a case against me more/less palpable? Answering a question with an obvious joke doesn't help us actually get an opinion from you beyond 'UK is scum because she's voting me.' Your case against UK is hilariously bad. If she's not trying to convince people you're scum, why are you worried other people will come to the conclusion you are on their own? If you're town, then act like it.

UK: The sentiment is appreciated, but I don't think I need someone to tell people how townie I am. I have no vig shot to look scum with this game.

Kiro: That's nice. I plan to determine Hourai's motives and opinions by hearing them from Hourai, not someone named huh what or Kiro. I don't need you to tell me what I should think of it, you're not the one my vote is on. Hourai is a big crimson doll helper, he doesn't need bodyguards.

Dan: I don't get what you mean by catering. I'm not interested in my own opinions, I already know I'm town. 'You didn't answer first' isn't a valid excuse to avoid answering a question in the same post. If you have something you want me to answer you'll have to ask me yourself. You'll have to forgive us for not trusting you at your word to be straightforward, just build cases and don't think about it too hard. The proof is in your actions and intent.

Sect: There are these things we have, called votes. We use them to say who we think is scum! Seriously, I don't care who, pick someone and lay waste.

People I forgot were playing: NeoSerela, Omba, Polaris >:(

Cut by HH: Out of words! Like post. Hate huh what.

##Unvote
##Vote: huh what
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 21, 2011, 12:20:50 AM
UK: What I guess you're trying to do is working, but you'll have to explain your reasoning later on and obviously with enough time of the day left to discuss it.

ActionDan: Still pursuing Bardiche over that seems rather pointless to me. Unless you've got some new ideas about it, in which case it would be nice if you shared them with us. Also derp.

huh what: Either someone makes a mistake on their own, or you'll have to lend them a hand. And making a mistake does not mean you're scum, it's how you go about making it and for what reasons. So implying she's trying to get mislynches this way seems at least strange to me when this method can go both ways, only depending on whether she's scum or not.
Apart from that, you're jumping on her because she jumped on you because you jumped on someone else who previously also jumped on someone else.
What irks me is that out of those four, you're the one acting by far the most defensive.

##Unvote
##Vote: huh what

cut by Shadoweh

I would have said I'm waiting for more input from you, but that post cleared up the slight suspicions I had about you for now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 21, 2011, 12:22:01 AM
Blargh bold.

##Unvote
##Vote: huh what
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 21, 2011, 12:38:41 AM
I really don't like this trap that UK's set up, the one that most everyone probably sees, because I can't really get a good read on her about it. The case that UK has on HW didn't exist when she voted him: there really isn't anything damning that I see about his vote on Shadoweh. All she was trying to do is draw attention, and vote whoever responded that seemed the weakest. Luckily for her, HW played into her hands by being defensive.

Still, it's a trap that doesn't really say anything about the person laying it: if UK's town, then she's doing a pretty good job alienating herself, and if she's scum, well, she's scum.

So, a question for UK: why HW? There's already a small posse forming on him, thanks to you, so you might as well share with the class.

-cut cut cut-

Oh hi everyone!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 12:45:37 AM


More words! I forgot to add this:
Quote from: ActionDan
What rly boggles my mind is why not one person has said anything of substance regarding our convo.  I am still assuming UK saying it for later. Does everyone think its just some dumb ED1 arguement?
Yes. 

Quote from: Hourai
Cool, vote on me. You tell Sect to try harder, but you vote me for "attacking newbies." He's played before.
Sect has played once and dropped out before the end of Day 1. Are you calling this experience? If you thought he wasn't a newbie then my argument against you is dropped completely, but really. I'm always willing to give newer players a chance to prove themselves, though the longer they stay without a vote the less I feel that way.

Cut by Sect not voting anyone.

##Unvote
##Vote: Sect


So who do you think is scum?! You sound like you think UK is scum, so why aren't you VOTING FOR HER? If you don't think she's scum, who is? Vote for them! Vote SOMEONE!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 21, 2011, 12:53:29 AM
I am aware of his past experience. If anyone did the same thing, I would have done what I did, regardless of experience.
Also, why did he get a pass on getting asked about the "dumb" ED1 argument?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Polaris on April 21, 2011, 12:55:36 AM
Aaah, and I was going to try to be unforgettable this game?but I wanted to run some ideas through K4U first, and even after that my thoughts are refusing to form coherent sentences to write my post with.

I just don't like Dan right now. It feels like he's just tunneling on Bard at the moment, and not responding to Bard's counters (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611141.html#msg611141) doesn't really help. He seems to be forcing his opinions on everyone else without really letting them think on their own, and basically declaring his own interpretation as fact (or something like that). ##Vote: ActionDan If you would, Dan, please answer Bard (post linked above) and tell us why you think the dumb ED1 argument was a scumslip.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 12:58:59 AM
I am aware of his past experience. If anyone did the same thing, I would have done what I did, regardless of experience. Also, why did he get a pass on getting asked about the "dumb" ED1 argument?
Fair enough. I find a lack of a vote more of a problem then a lack of opinion. There's no point in asking what he thinks of something if I can't even tell what direction he's looking yet.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 21, 2011, 01:03:13 AM
I'm having a hard time understanding why he got his pass in #46. His lack of opinion made him excluded from hunting?

At that point, all I had was saying he's bad for prolonging RVS. All he had was prolonging RVS.
Neither of us had acknowledged the ED1 argument .

I'm not seeing how he got the pass.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 21, 2011, 01:11:30 AM
People who are passing off my reasons for voting UK as simply being "she jumped on me" and/or calling it an OMGUS need to start actually reading my posts. I'm not sure where Shadoweh has seen me worry that other people will come to the conclusion I'm scum on their own, so I assume she either didn't fully grasp something I said or is misrepping me. Her entire case is pretty horrible from what she's said about me considering that it barely explains what was wrong about my case on UK and really makes me think that she hasn't read anything I've said so far at all.

I find it amusing how fast Shadoweh's willing to drop her case on me just to pressurevote Sect, though. Her eagerness to drop her current case for one on an active lurker reminds me of my switch to Hourai in Zombie Mafiers, as it shows that she's prioritizing her cases awkwardly which seems like something a scum who knows everybody's alignments would do (I've done that a lot myself, sooo). Not to mention that Sect basically did this exact same thing as town in his first game. Still think she's trying too hard to seem town. Like, even harder than usual.

To answer her questions, I don't have any particular opinions on Bard and Kiro beyond "they seem reasonable enough to me", which they do. Not sure what is expected here, I'm not going to start filling my posts up with one-liners on every single player if there's nothing interesting I have to say about them.

Kiro does have a point that UK could probably do this as town, but ugh, that doesn't make it any more satisfying to me. I might switch back to Shadoweh if UK's thought process revolving me reads as townie enough when she actually posts it, but for now I'd like to keep the vote down to give her some motivation, since I've honestly been wondering if her statement that she had a case on me was a bluff. People should stop trolling as town, it messes with my scumdar (hi Bard and PX from last game).
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 21, 2011, 01:33:25 AM
Votecount: Now with extra cherry flavor

Bardiche (1) - Action Dan
Sect (1) - Shadoweh
Shadoweh (2) - Dormio, Kiro
UncertainKitten (2) - Bardiche, huh what
huh what (2) - UncertainKitten, Omba
Action Dan (2) - Hanged Hourai, Polaris
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Polaris on April 21, 2011, 01:35:35 AM
Edible: You have Shadoweh voting on both Sect and Hanged Hourai.

[edible]Fixed, thank you![/edible]
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 21, 2011, 01:38:58 AM
--After much, much typing, interruptions, retyping, and general frustration--

:/

Since this round is about learning to play Mafia, or sharpening skills or whatever, let me ask a question: why should I place a vote on someone, when I'm still deciding on choices? Is my asking questions not enough to say "Hey, Sect is thinking about voting for this person, but hasn't made up his mind"? What advantage does putting a vote down that you're unsure of or you don't have confidence in have over putting down a vote that clearly states "Sect is confident in this choice, and he can back it up"? All the former seems to do is just draw suspicion.

So, I guess what I'm trying to say is, why is my not putting down a vote a disadvantage?


Anyways, now that that's out of the way:

##Vote Shadoweh

I'm not sure how much of that was misdirection and how much of it is actual frustration, but you definitely jumped up the ranks in my book. Part of the reason why I was delaying on making a vote was because I was still split on UK and HW, though I'm still leaning on UK.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 01:48:17 AM
I'm having a hard time understanding why he got his pass in #46. His lack of opinion made him excluded from hunting?
At that point, all I had was saying he's bad for prolonging RVS. All he had was prolonging RVS.
Neither of us had acknowledged the ED1 argument .
I'm not seeing how he got the pass.
You're using the words 'gave him a pass' to make it sound like I ignored him in that post. I told him to vote someone. I voted you to get your opinions on something more interesting then him. You gave opinions (not on what I originally asked but still). He hasn't voted.

Huh what: Your case is based around how the way UK voted for you was scummy. Even if you say it's not an OMGUS, you can't pretend to be objective about judging someone voting for YOU. She voted you, you didn't like it, you voted her back and said her vote sounded 'scummy'. What I'd really like is for you to stop being so defensive and make more cases on people instead. Maybe even on ones that haven't attacked you lately. My theory is UK doesn't really have a case and she just wanted to see how you would react and how many people would jump to join her 'case' on you, hence the trollface. And Hourai was scum in that game even if you didn't know it. Try to look surprised if Sect satisfies me and I switch back to you though.

Still think she's trying too hard to seem town. Like, even harder than usual.
If I ever go through a game without this being brought up I will be a sad, sad player.

Cut by Sect voting me. Mrr.

To answer your question, no it isn't enough to just be thinking about voting for someone. Votes are a form of pressure. By not voting you aren't pressuring anyone, and they will feel less need to contribute. Your vote can be changed with a few words, so there's no harm in laying it down. It's also the way to tell what you're actually thinking, instead of just saying. Always vote in the early days, and always vote for whoever you think is likely to be scum.

So uh, do you think I'm more likely to be scum then either UK or HW then? What am I misdirecting from exactly?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 21, 2011, 01:49:00 AM
To answer her questions, I don't have any particular opinions on Bard and Kiro beyond "they seem reasonable enough to me", which they do. Not sure what is expected here, I'm not going to start filling my posts up with one-liners on every single player if there's nothing interesting I have to say about them.
That leaves you with cases on only UK and Shadoweh right now, though. You're not really delivering on either of those and the rest of your posts are mostly dedicated to defending yourself.
Also, I at least am not brushing off your reasons for voting UK as OMGUS. If it were just OMGUS, I'd call it bad but that alone wouldn't get me to vote on you. You're basically accusing her of scumhunting with a method that might hit townies. When it's both more or less unavoidable to hit a townie sooner or later and more importantly way more likely when there's not much material to go on. Now guess what UKs method produced plenty of. Her using that method doesn't reveal much about her intentions, at least not yet.

cut by Sect

You generally vote for whoever seems most suspicious to you right now. That way you're both putting pressure on your target and taking a clear stance on what you currently believe.
If you avoid taking a clear stance, that could mean you're trying to fly under the radar and just survive. Which is one thing scum does.
And if you're not putting pressure on the one you're suspicious of, he doesn't have much reason to act, hence not creating material that might expose him if he's scum or absolve him if he's town.

cut by Shadoweh

/reading now
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 21, 2011, 01:54:11 AM
@HH 79: Might post it shortly. We'll see who's reacted.

@Shadoweh 80: Too bad, you're not getting lynched today. That's how I roll. I like making alliances and town reads D1, whether people want me to or not. Town that's more or less on the same page is better than disordered town. Anyway, that said, the rest of your post is fairly logical and I like it.

@Omba 81: I'm not sure I understand your reasoning for voting HW. Can you explain it with less meandering? Secondly, why do you trust my promise of a case later?

@Sect 83: Thank you for your input. I actually wrote it elsewhere RIGHT after voting him, before he posted again. I think I'll be posting it soon, either this post or the next, words pending. And why HW? Because he's scum.

@HW 89: I'll be posting it, but not for you. You're more or less admitting your nervous in this post, and trying to cover it up. You're also misrepping Shadoweh, but she can handle that.

@Sect 92: I'll field this one, it's generally my thing though Shadoweh took it up this time. You should more or less always have a vote out so we can look back and see what cases/accusations you were serious about. For one, it aids vote count analysis later in the game. And two, it allows inconsistencies in scum voting/speaking to be shown. Last game was a good example of me voting quite differently than what I was saying, D2. I was scum trying to deflect the lynch off NeoSerela without actually doing so. So I was stabbing him while *actually* voting Yonowaaru. That's why voting is pro town.

@Shadoweh 93: Wrong~. Though partially right, I wanted to see how he'd react, and I even said I was.

Now, my case of the post I voted HW for:

HW's post was SO BAD. He's basically saying that Dan is overeager but Shadoweh is scum for pretty much the same thing. Not to mention Shadoweh always starts like that. Finally, the soft cover he provides for Sect is incredibly hilarious. It'd be one thing if he directly confronted Kiro on the Sect vote, but he's just kind of poking at it to see what happens and where he should fall.

384 words, motherfucker.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 21, 2011, 01:59:40 AM
EBWOP: Oh, yeah, and if you haven't gotten it, HW's recent posting has been fairly overdefensive. I threw him off, and he's scared.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 21, 2011, 02:10:19 AM
Yay, lab class ending early. AND NO MORE ASSIGNMENTS (for now). \o/
Anyway.

Action Dan's only counter argument to the WIFOM thing is "you're being too critical." (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611399.html#msg611399)
However, having said that, Action Dan is looking like derptown to me right now.

Shadoweh is still looking off to me, it seems like she's tunnelling on Sect.
And what happened to her case against Hanged Hourai (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611122.html#msg611122)?
She just dropped it to tunnel on Sect for not having placed a vote yet when NeoSerela hasn't voted or even made a non-confirmation post yet.
Scum looking for easy targets? I think so.

Having said that, I almost forgot that NeoSerela existed.
Again. :/
Exist please.

Warning - while you were typing 5 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Argh.
I'll read further into huh what once I get home.
It's really annoying to try to read this without a mouse.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 21, 2011, 02:22:38 AM
@Omba 81: I'm not sure I understand your reasoning for voting HW. Can you explain it with less meandering? Secondly, why do you trust my promise of a case later?
Two points mostly:
- He accuses you of using a scumhunting method that might hit townies, calling it scummy. While I see it as neutral - I can't form an opinion on it until I see both the fruits it bears and more importantly your reaction to them. Since the method is rather obvious, I'm assuming he had similar thoughts on it. But, for some reason he sees it as inherently scummy.
This basically boils down to me reading it as "leads to more material (which might expose scum)" -> "scummy".
- As soon as you attacked him, he jumped back on you and hasn't done much else besides defending himself since then.

As for your promise, I never said I trusted it, I only trusted that you'll do something besides dropping out of the game. Obviously if you're going to hide in the storm you started, that's going to look scummy to me. Likewise if you're going to wait and then jump on whatever resulting wagon gains the most traction. Whatever you're going to do will decide how I judge what you did there. Hence why I said you'd have to provide later on, but still on day 1 and not in the last three hours (, otherwise you're likely scum).
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 02:23:58 AM
Ok, everyone's given some good input (barring NeoS.)  I will post again in about 13 1/2 hours from now.  At that time I'll make a case for bard. (even if everybody is rolling their eyes already). 

I'll just say a few quick things while I can.  I thought HH's first post after the "RVS" phase was terrible.  I thought it super funny how HH thinks I'm "uber defending Sect".  I thought Shadow liking HH's post was also bizzare. I still think UK is town.  Polaris and Omba,  I will be happy to clarify my bard case fully, but Polaris can you guess who is also using tunnel vision?  UK and Bard.  UK is hunting HW.  Bard is hunting UK. plz elaborate on this in the mean time. As for HW, I thought his first post was applying a double standard on Shadow, but I didn't read into it more.  I will later.  Basically I will focus on Bard, HH, HW, and Shadow in that order. (and ofc I will look at what comes in over the next 13 hours) 

cut-cut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 21, 2011, 02:24:35 AM
Well, if you read my post you'll notice I've produced. I'm also quite pleased with the reactions. I have at least one other strong scum suspect I'm willing to let rack up more evidence while we lynch HW.

Thank you for the clarification though, those are good points.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 21, 2011, 02:32:43 AM
UK: I'm not going to give the meta pass to Shadoweh. I don't have personal experience playing with her so by the tone of your statement, reading about her is going to send me into circles. But since you brought it up, tell me why my vote on her is bad in the context of this game.

Townies can be defensive as well as Scum. We've seen this before here and we have mislynched before here numerous times due to it. This is a null tell in my book. And a vote on this alone feels bad. Omba's in particular feels lazy.

huh what: Either someone makes a mistake on their own, or you'll have to lend them a hand. And making a mistake does not mean you're scum, it's how you go about making it and for what reasons. So implying she's trying to get mislynches this way seems at least strange to me when this method can go both ways, only depending on whether she's scum or not.

So, your first statement kind of reads like, someone makes a mistake or is baited into one. And then even if they make the mistake, it's how they react that determines whether you'll vote them. So why is the person doing the baiting not given any level of responsibility as you assumably put it in the last sentence? Is this all on HW and UK bears no responsibility despite hardcore tunneling on both sides? And looking at your #94, it seems you're letting her go now in place of HW. Is it really just the overdefensiveness then?

Shadoweh: Same last question as above. Also, why do you think of people not voting in tandem with your opinions as "defending that person." My vote was all about you... baby.

And my opinion on HW is that he hasn't been overdefensive to the point that I want to vote him. A little tunnely given his case has no traction right now. But his #89 tides me over for now.

Dormio: Vote please.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 21, 2011, 02:35:28 AM
@Kiro: Well, I've posted my other reasoning. Anyway, it's not just a meta pass, Shadoweh feels like she's playing a town intended game so far. I don't see what you're seeing, except MAYBE the IIoA, but it was ED1.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 21, 2011, 02:39:05 AM
Dormio: Vote please.
My vote is already on Shadoweh, and I'm comfortable with letting it sit there until I can get home and read the game properly.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 21, 2011, 02:40:13 AM
Dormio: Yea, I was just about to EBWOP that I saw that. Page 1 never exists for me.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 03:04:42 AM
Shadoweh is still looking off to me, it seems like she's tunnelling on Sect.
And what happened to her case against Hanged Hourai (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611122.html#msg611122)?
It went the way of early cases when that person replies with something reasonable, which is into the past and forgotten. Technically I dropped it to go after huh what but Sect came in with more non-voting. And there's a huge difference between someone here and not voting, and NeoSerela who hasn't been here yet to vote.

Sigh, that being said I think I'm just more annoyed at how often pressuring someone to vote lands the vote on me more often then not. If Sect's next post is decent I'll probably switch back to huh what. Can someone who understands the ActionDan case explain it to me and why it's not just a newbie trying extra hard?

Cut by like everyone ever.

Dan: Of course you didn't like Hanged Hourai's post, he's voting you. What exactly about it didn't you like? I don't have to think you're scum to see reason in someone posting against you.

Kiro: It's hard for me not to be biased about this question. I think huh what came out of nowhere on me and UK came out of nowhere on him. I find UK's intentions more convincing then huh what's defensive tactics and his desire to come back to a case that won't yell back as much. As for your vote, part of your reasoning here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611294.html#msg611294) was based around my case on Hourai and you not understanding it. What do you think of Hourai now then?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 21, 2011, 03:07:45 AM
Shadoweh: All right, "misdirecting" is probably the wrong word, but I wanted to get that post out, since I had been working on it for nearly fourty minutes. Basically, from your very first post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611122.html#msg611122), it felt like you were trying to get me onto your side by attacking HH (he raised a good point about not asking me about the Bard/Action thing), and then vote for someone, anyone. My voting strategy is kind of similar to what UK's response to my question was: I wanted my votes to reflect what stances I was serious about, so I didn't vote until I felt I had something concrete (thus, why all my joke votes at the beginning were always immediately unvoted, so that it was clear that I didn't intend to vote that way). It wasn't until UK posted that I felt that I was getting confident, but I hesitated too long, HW responded with his vote, and then things got a little messy.

Anyways, uh, the reasons I voted you: you buddying up to me against HH, especially when I felt it wasn't necessary at all, the pressure to vote, and that blow up you had against me. I was mostly ignoring it in favor of UK and HW, but then when you voted for me...

--cutcutcut--

Jeez, there's a lot of you out there. I'll read this later. As a side note, I now know that the stress I was feeling from the last time I played wasn't due to dealing with Kips after all, or at least mostly. I'm going to stick with this game till the end, but this is definitely my last game of Mafia.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 21, 2011, 03:09:18 AM
Well, if you read my post you'll notice I've produced. I'm also quite pleased with the reactions. I have at least one other strong scum suspect I'm willing to let rack up more evidence while we lynch HW.
Yes, you have and I can agree with the reasoning, as far as a first tentative vote on someone goes. And HW provided enough reasons to keep the vote on him in the meantime.
Which of course doesn't tell me anything about you yet.

So, your first statement kind of reads like, someone makes a mistake or is baited into one. And then even if they make the mistake, it's how they react that determines whether you'll vote them. So why is the person doing the baiting not given any level of responsibility as you assumably put it in the last sentence? Is this all on HW and UK bears no responsibility despite hardcore tunneling on both sides? And looking at your #94, it seems you're letting her go now in place of HW. Is it really just the overdefensiveness then?
It's not just the overdefensiveness, it's also his reason for calling UKs scumhunting method scummy.
I'm not letting her go, I'm looking at what she does. So far I can see everything she's done as either townie or scummy, with no real dip in either direction. Hence why I'm currently voting HW, who's done one thing I see as decidedly scummy (his reasoning for calling UK scummy) and other things that might go either way, namely the overdefensiveness. That of course means if UK does something similarly or more scummy, it's going to make everything else she's done also look scummy to me.
Note that I see HW jumping on Shadoweh in that way as the kind of mistake that warrants a closer look. My reason for voting him is what that closer look produced.

double cut
/reading
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 03:45:07 AM
Sect: Okay, nevermind, that was adorable and I no longer want to vote you. No, I wasn't trying to get your support in a Hang the Hourai movement, I just wanted to make him talk to me. And I'm really sorry if I'm stressing you out that much. No matter how mean some of us get Mafia is just a game to have fun, don't let every attack get you worked up. Even if everyone is suspicious you're not really alone, all of town is working by your side. Just keep hunting, though I prefer not-me.

So about that huh what. Just in case he forgot I cared about him, his eagerness to drop his case on a competent player to come back to his original target if UK 'sounds townie enough about her scummy actions' makes me more then happy to continue planning his voyage off of Townie Island. If he wants to make a post with something besides me that'd be cool but this is where I'm headed right now.

##Unvote
##Vote: huh what


It'd also be appreciated if Dan would tell me what he means by catering like I wanted earlier instead of writing me off.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 21, 2011, 03:47:55 AM
Ok, no time for a full post before bed, but I want to say something.

Dan- ALL YOU'VE SAID ABOUT MY FIRST POST IS THAT IT'S BAD AND SCUMMY. WHAT ABOUT IT IS BAD AND SCUMMY? I was trying to help end RVS.

And don't even begin to try and dismiss how you've been defending Sect hardcore. I'm on your list, BUT YOU'VE NEVER EVEN SAID WHAT'S WRONG ABOUT ME.

You need to freaking explain these things.

Nighto.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 21, 2011, 04:24:27 AM
Shadoweh: If both HW and UK seemed to come out of nowhere, why do you have to take one of their sides? They could both be Townie. That is a possibility that I'm not feeling from either you or Omba.

I'm ok with what Hourai has said about others so far except the one part where Dan is defending Sect. Don't see that at all. Mixed feelings about the Dan vote. Half is on my initial gut read of Dan, but the other half is that Hourai is correct that Dan does seem to be defending UK for her. Currently giving Hourai the benefit of the doubt. More so than...

Omba: In particular, you add qualifiers to #98 and #107 saying that while you're going against HW, you're keeping an eye on UK. It looks like you're giving yourself an out here on the chance you're wrong about HW. This is pinging my scumdar, and also sets up the scenario that if HW is a mislynch, you'd probably go after UK. You're getting on HW's case because HW said UK's method is scummy and yet you acknowledge it's possible. You're tunneling as much as they are. Have you considered they could be two Townies and if so, who would you prefer to vote instead of them?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 05:25:18 AM
They could also both be scum, or is that not an option today? Simply put, I don't like the exchange and I've decided which part of it I didn't like. I find it more likely that Town UK would troll huh what then Town huh what lashing out in suspicion. huh what has something like two days to change my mind.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 21, 2011, 06:13:09 AM
Kiro:
If I'm wrong about HW, then that means I'm wrong about him. In case HW is a mislynch, I would not go after UK, given what I currently have to go off. If she's town, she might simply have misread him. Conversely, if he flips scum, that doesn't mean she's town, either. Hence why I said I'm going to keep looking at her - because she hasn't done anything yet that I can't read both ways. Either way, if HW flips town, it would make me look at least as scummy as it would UK. It would have been rather convenient for me to jump on the train UK got going, after all.
I acknowledge that it's possible UK is acting for scummy reasons, yes. What I'm accusing HW of is saying that it definitely is scummy. Though I'm now noticing that reaction of his could have been a part of the OMGUS / defensiveness, in that being attacked by her could have tilted his view of her method towards scummy. That would in turn make his defensiveness look more scummy to me, though, since presenting skewed views does not help town. So my vote stands.

Glad you brought up my lack of posts about anyone besides HW and UK, I was wondering why you didn't do that before.
Yes, I have considered they could both be townies. Apart from those two, I'm leaning towards voting ActionDan, who's still onto Bardiche for whatever reason. I can't really read whether it's derp or scummy, hence I'm waiting for his next post. As of yet, most of what I've seen from him is fluff. Which doesn't make him look good when most of his actual content seems at least very strange to me.
Then there's a few other people that made me go "huh?" at some point. Of those, HH is on top of the list. I'm particularly interested in how he'll react to whatever ActionDan is going to post.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 21, 2011, 09:51:23 AM
Sleep deprived and tired post gogogogo.
Also, don't you hate it when somebody translates the exact same thing as you at the same time?
Anyway.

Firstly, I really don't like this:
Glad you brought up my lack of posts about anyone besides HW and UK, I was wondering why you didn't do that before.
Is it just me or is Omba being overly defensive?
I don't think Omba is scum quite yet, but I dunno, some eyebrows were raised.

And nobody is looking at Kiro.
He's not that scary. I think.
Aside from his case on Shadoweh, which I do happen to find myself agreeing with, all of his other "cases" look waffle-ey.
It kinda feels like he's sitting on the fence for ActionDan and huh what, of which both of them looked like they could have had wagons started on them.

I don't really like how UK seemed to spin huh what's OMGUS into "you scared, scum?" and the whole exchange between the two compounds my headache.

Uhh...
This Sect (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611621.html#msg611621) and Shadoweh (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611649.html#msg611649) exchange looks really iffy.
Note how Shadoweh acts all buddy buddy towards Sect and ignores all points made against her in the process.

Also, first day and NeoSerela is about to be prodded. :/
Seriously, exist please.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Serela on April 21, 2011, 10:02:13 AM
oh god I feel asleep super early trying to pretend to be asleep to avoid my dad that I haven't seen since I was tiny who suddenly decided to visit with gift bribes

anyway, at least it hasn't quite been 24 hours since I haven't posted yet ;_;

hiii UK/huhwhat battle

first UK declares huhwhat's shadoweh vote the "worst thing ever" without explaining why at ALL and votes her (errr wut)
Then HW votes her for total lack of a case and UK is all like I totally have a case on you I just don't feel like posting it (wtf plz)
Then as HW continues scumhunting (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611241.html#msg611241) on her, UK says HW's being "overly concerned about my vote if no one's going to understand it, though." Um, no, it looks a lot more to me like HW is less concerned about your vote and more thinking it looks really scummy. Oh hey now I read HW's next post and that's exactly what he says!

Hi UK, question here.
Quote from: UK
His vote switch was weird and felt more to discredit and less to hunt scum. Wouldn't have worried about it except for the prior posts badness.
I don't understand what you're saying here. HW didn't HAVE prior posts before his vote on Shadoweh. I don't find you meaning his vote on you instead to make sense either as you obviously seemed to be thinking something was off about him before that happened.

Eventually, UK finally posts her case on HW. You know it would have been awesome if you did that a long time ago so we'd have reason to believe you actually HAD a case when you claimed to, and so that the person you targetted actually would be able to defend themselves. People cannot defend themselves against a case that hasn't been made.

I've read the case of everyone else voting Huhwhat. They pretty much consist of "Huhwhat is OMGUSing UK for voting her." Which is completely untrue because Huhwhat actually has made a case on UK that I wholeheartedly agree with and would have made myself if I had actually been reading mafia at the time. Except Shadoweh's more recent case that I just noticed. Okay, Shadoweh's case on HW isn't horribad. I'll give her that.

Gonna stop now because of the 400 word limit, counter says I have 391. Oh and by the way ##Vote:UncertainKitten for stuff above
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Serela on April 21, 2011, 10:03:29 AM
Gonna stop now because of the 400 word limit, counter says I have 391. Oh and by the way ##Vote:UncertainKitten for stuff above
To clarify on this, I'd try not to look like I'm ignoring everything not named UK/huhwhat if I had more words to talk with :V

I'll be back after school.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Serela on April 21, 2011, 10:08:57 AM
And I also feel like saying, before anyone goes and says "serela is just using word limit as an excuse to ignore everyone else", no, it's just that I feel that it's the most important thing for me to cover right now. Partially because I totally think UK is scum.

Okay I'm probably abusing the "EWBOPS can go over 400 words but only a little" rule now so shutting up
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 10:59:24 AM
Can't post much more now (another post in 5ish hours or a little less).   Not much has changed except that Kiro/Umba seem to be throw into the spotlight a bit (and that Neo made an interesting post).  HH, I will get around to you :) I'd be willing to switch from bard to you.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 21, 2011, 01:32:49 PM
@Dormio 113: What don't you like about me being right :smug: ? Why should we be looking at Kiro? He's been posting decentlyish in my opinion. Certainly not posted anything I've found scummy. Finally, when did ignoring bad points on you become a scum tell? I think a certain scum tried to start a wagon on my with that logic in my dramatic magical return the the temple of evil mafia game.

Serela 114 is incredibly silly and not worth responding to!
Though I'll answer the question. Yes, that WAS referring to the vote on me. His first post was the utterly scummiest post ever so far. I correctly voted him for it, and decided to get some reactions while I was at it. He responds by voting me with terribad reasoning because he's scared. He was trying to discredit me when most of the rest of the town seemed to at least have SOME idea what I'm doing. One of these is not like the other, folks~

That said, don't think Serela is scum, just silly.




Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 21, 2011, 02:57:45 PM
As far as I'm concerned you're all silly.

##Unvote: Uncretin Kitten

I never truly thought UK was town, but was hoping the move would garner discussion. I am still lost on ActionDan's insistence to vote me given the total absence of other cases at the time, but it is a nulltell more than anything, for scum and town alike vote me whenever the very first case of the day is case of A Bad Case.

And I really don't have much time, but uh. Dormio, care to elaborate the observations on Kiro? Is he scummy for having "waffley" cases, and why do you feel they are such?

I'd put my vote down but I'm running late so I'll go do that first, and vote when I get back. Stalling for time to discuss with my scumbuddies obviously no, you're silly.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 21, 2011, 02:59:09 PM
* never truly thought UK was scum

lol.

And yeah, Dan, that's an invitation to explain why you still feel I am scummiest at this juncture, accounting for the explanation of my actions preceding my previous post, and subtracting the previous post from the equation.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 03:41:42 PM
Flying solo: the case for Bardiche -

I will go about doing this step by step (It would be easier if I knew how to link to specific posts, but alas I don't know how to do this quickly):
Anyway the trouble starts with Bard's #33.  He attacks UK's post #29 on the basis that UK didn't care to explain her meta of voting the mod. Bard thinks that her declaration of her action as "anti-town" is in itself not "pro-town".  This is enough for Bard to place his vote on UK.  Later he justifies his vote as a push in post #44 (the one lecturing me on how to play mafia) while trying to defend his attack.  However, I feel this is not a push, but a blatant way to throw some dirt on UK, which I think is a scummy scumslip.  Bard's been in games with UK, where undoubtedly he's observed the UK meta.  Did he think about it too hard then? I think not. You know why? Because it's a null-tell, who cares if she votes the mod or not? I already prodded her to get a reaction, she answered fine. Side note: in bard's #44 he doesn't mention Sect or HH, just Kiro who he does not suspect. HH: isn't this a tacit defense of Sect?

-cut-cut by Bard: GDIT You are getting a damn case!

 Onwards:  Bard's #47 he just reiterates the question, subtly, doesn't give anything new. Bard's #57 prods HW on Hourai, I have rly nothing to make of this, except it rly doesn't say that much. Bard's #70: finally some clarity!

Bard claims that voting UK was his only lead. Arguably there wasn't much to go on (besides Sect's weird style of play).  O wait. Actually there was. UK declared me town super early. and according to UK's post #56, she was clearly serious!  If that wasn't enough for Bard, he could always Scumhunt, which he has done little of after his UK vote, which as I've said, was not scumhunting but dirt-slinging, and there is a difference and Bard should know it.

Finally: Let's look at other stuff he's done.  It's pretty easy to find cuz there is only one post, namely #71.  "I'm hesitant to give UK a pass" WTF where is your vote again? otherwise hes parroting. He clarifies his HH comment but fails to say if, in fact, "HH is scummy", or if "Shadow's reasoning is faulty" which are the two sides of the debate.  Basically he's on a fence and not committing. and in his last two posts he says he wasn't serious at all! ok then... I guess you didn't accomplish what you hoped for huh?

Judgement: SCUM
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 03:52:17 PM
Well that wore me out: Now all I have to do is move on to HH and Shadow and HW.  I'll make more later:  Things I've thought about since: HH may be getting misled: I think her logic is terrible, but her intent feels town, rereading later. Anyway I will not change my vote on Bard. HW may not have expected the dogpile, which may or may not explain some defensive behavior. Again I need to read him Much much closer than I have. Shadow honestly feels scummy. Will read closer.  anyway of the four I think Scum ordering is Bard > Shadow > HW = HH >> others.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 04:07:56 PM
More things I've wanted to comment on quickly ( I have some work to do but will fully be here after 3 1/2 hours):  It's pretty apparent that 2 ppl are trying to stay under the radar.  One I don't want to mention but I'll just say I think that "someone" is town.  THE other however, Polaris, looks like lurkscum.  (Believe me its not because he's attacking me) He just doesn't contribute, besides claims that he has detected tunnel-vision and personality disorders, but is apparently blind to everything else.  (He might be right that last part though)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 04:12:00 PM
@edible - I just realized that the bard case was like close to 500 words  :ohdear: - plz forgive me!  :blush:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 21, 2011, 04:59:43 PM
Votecount: MORNING RESCUE edition

Bardiche (1) - Action Dan
Shadoweh (3) - Dormio, Kiro, Sect
UncertainKitten (2) - huh what, NeoSerela
huh what (3) - UncertainKitten, Omba, Shadoweh
Action Dan (2) - Hanged Hourai, Polaris

Not voting: Bardiche

~46 hours remain in the Day.  With 12 alive, 7 are required to lynch.

@edible - I just realized that the bard case was like close to 500 words  :ohdear: - plz forgive me!  :blush:

Just keep it more concise in the future~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 21, 2011, 05:27:50 PM
Shadoweh's #111: I wouldn't bank on HW vs UK being Scum Vs Scum. Not an efficient way for Scum to go through Day 1 imo. Also, you say Town Huh What is less likely to be lashing out in suspicion, but that's not really an answer to my question. Why do you have to take one of their sides? Less likely than UK, but is it also less likely than Hourai or Sect being Scum? You asked me about Hourai and I said he was ok. Is that it? I don't see any followup as to why you asked me about him or your current thoughts about Hourai. Furthermore, I have no idea why you cleared Sect or didn't address any of his accusations in #106. You voted him because he didn't have a vote. Afterwards, you switch back to HW just like that. Your pressure vote did nothing because you're not asking any hardball questions to Sect. That post is full of fluff.

Sect: Has your opinion on Shadoweh changed after her #108?

Omba's #112: Your explanation looks like a lot of circular reasoning. I still don't like it, but through it all, you did answer the question. Seconding the eyebrow raise Dormio had on you. Gonna see how your opinions adjust through the Day.

Bardiche can address ActionDan's case on him, but my current opinion is that neither of them are worth lynching today.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 05:38:48 PM
One question I'd like answered from UK:

in your post #56 you say: "Bard started out bad, but fixed it. Oh, and Hourai and Sect also aren't great..."

I think you are town, and I am happy you have got good stuff out of HW, but I would just like for you to give opinions on these three. i.e. what did you think then, and has anything changed? (No need to specify your 2nd scum target, if it happens to be one of these, just generally opinions would be nice)

BTW: If my name is in someone's post, be certain that I have read it carefully (I like looking closely at those first, I'm just like that). a.k.a Shadow the word "catering" will be explained in context later.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 21, 2011, 05:42:55 PM
Wow, ActionDan, are you seriously trying to misrepresent what I said? :V

Quote
I'm more hesitant now to give UK a pass based on "it's UK";

I am more hesitant NOW to give UK a pass BASED ON. This is a reference to the last game where I excused UK's behaviour as townie based on that she usually acts that way: voting someone without making it immediately clear what her vote reasons are.

Regarding mudslinging, please cite sources.


Sect! Elucidate why between HW and UK, UK is the scummier one as per this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611553.html#msg611553).

ActionDan, tunnel vision (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611584.html#msg611584) is when you focus completely on one person. Unfortunately, that is not an accusation that holds (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611177.html#msg611177). I divided my attention among three people (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611270.html#msg611270), being you, UK and HW.

Your latest post in accusing me still bases itself on EarlyDay1 stuff, and regretably you're not Pesco, so FPMH doesn't apply. Please elucidate how attempting to start a serious case on early day 1 is incredibly scummy.

Current opinion of ActionDan is that he is misguided in tunneling.

Current opinion of other worthy vote targets: the most prominent cases are the ones on HW, UK and Shadoweh. I don't think UK is scum based on her early actions, and as much as you may accuse her of trapping, UK was not to know HW would turtle to defence. Can someone elucidate how a scum!UK would pull a high-profile move without guarantee of the results, assuming no super bus is happening? The logic is absent.

Shadoweh, are you accusing HW of an OMGUS vote on UK or am I misreading this? I agree with Huh What that his vote isn't necessarily OMGUS, given he does bring up a valid point. It feels like you're attempting to force town to focus on either HW or UK today, which is shoddy!

##Vote: Shadoweh

Please restate your case for Huh What, ignoring that he voted UK.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 21, 2011, 05:45:22 PM
@Dan: Sect and Hourai are still terrible and need to diiiiieeee~. I also have another scum suspect coming out of the woodwork. I don't like Omba's posting that much. It feels like he's looking for excuses to jump on either wagon, and potentially set me up for mislynch if HW is town. That said, I don't see HW and Omba as scum together.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 06:09:06 PM
Dormio: The points where I was trying to win votes against Hourai? I'm ignoring them because they're silly. It bothers me that you're holding a silly newbie case against me.

Action Dan: Oh that Bard, he sure is a handsome devil isn't he? Except not. If you're going to keep bringing up meta, why is it out of UK's meta to declare a hyperactive newbie to be town? It's as much of an ignorable nulltell as her meta. I hope you didn't think Bard's vote was serious just because he put his srs bsns face on. The case you're pushing is just as silly as Sect. I have asked you a question three times now, why did you think I was catering to you? Stop ignoring me and just saying I 'feel scummy'. (oh he cut me and is going to explain to me)

UK: What's your definition of decentlyish? Kiro seems slightly lurkish to me but I don't know if that's normal for him. It might just be his avatar keeps staring at me. :ohdear:

Serela: Yep, that's a Serela post. Please tell us who else you think is scum. You know, just in case.

Cut by Kiro: It's not likely but all possibilities should be considered before making a conclusion. What exactly do you expect me to say? I chose a side because I think this argument feels weird. I felt huh what's side to be the side bothering me. I have trouble reading Hourai but he doesn't bother me yet, and Sect isn't making any points worth addressing. I voted him because he wasn't taking a stance. He voted and made a case. I'd need more content to decide further on any of these people, including huh what.

Baaaard: :/ No, I'm leaning town on UK right now. Without the vote the case still sounds the same, attacked me for a case on Hourai, attacked UK for thinking him scum for it, did nothing afterwards but attack the same people. If he stops tunneling I might consider other cases, but I'm not going to change my mind before he stops being suspicious. So since I'm not interested in a case on me and probably still not one on you, who else do you think is scum?

This is why I write posts at 6am, I feel like Dormio right now. :fail:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 21, 2011, 06:10:59 PM
Kiro is posting fairly solid analysis, and he's pretty clear on his opinions. I don't want him dead today. And I think his opinions are fairly town intended, anyway.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 21, 2011, 06:18:48 PM
On Kiro, I just now caught on you said that "Bard can respond to Dan's case on him, but neither are worth lynching for me". Paraphrased.

You acknowledge Dan's post while graciously dancing around providing an opinion of his actual case. Do you think this is a misguided townie, a townie voting for all the right reasons, or otherwise? That you do not consider Dan a priority to lynch today implies you do not think him scummy. Do you agree?

Do you agree with his options, except disagree about whether it means I am scum or not? Or do you find his entire case irrelevant to start with?

Please make clear what your standpoint is.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 21, 2011, 06:24:14 PM
Regarding Shadoweh, I need some time to review what happened. Since at present I am taking away my dear mum's time from FaceBook, I cannot promise I'll have that time. I should be able to provide you an answer in four hours.

For now, though, humour me a bit longer, and elucidate why you attempt to present that today's cases are UK VS Huh What. We have a fairly sizable cast as usual, why do we only have two choices worth considering?

A vote on Sect to pressure him to vote is fairly meaningless to me: you could have done as much with simple words, yet you chose to move your vote off of someone you think is scum. Is your case on Huh What weaker than a case would be on someone with an absent vote? If so, why do you feel it is not worth pursuing Sect any further other than that he is adorable and cute? If not, why did you move your vote off of Huh What to Sect?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 21, 2011, 06:25:29 PM
Kiro: Her #108? Annoyed, mostly. Mostly it felt like she was patronizing me: yes, this game is stressful, but it's not due to you voting me, it's been stressing me out since yesterday afternoon. Her #130? Makes me want to go back and check my facts, so I can make it clearer why she's scummy. Also, need to put down in clearer text why I think UK's more scummy than HW. Be back later.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 06:38:35 PM
Bard: I'm not attempting to present today's cases as UK vs huh what. I'm pretty sure I've never done this so I have no idea what the hell you're talking about. When was UK ever even a case? And words weren't working. How is something meaningless when it works? I don't feel like pursuing silly players over silly cases. If you're arguing he actually has a point I'm going to get upset.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 06:59:32 PM
I have 4 min to get this out: noticed something: HH post #79:
Quote
Dan-
Really, really, really loves Sect.  Not to mention how he blantantly tells the people voting him to either get off or defend themselves.
#43 says the "Sect scene" was "worthless" and then grills me for being on him. Either you're contradicting yourself, or you just don't want people attacking him.
He says how I made "ill motives" for Sect, when I was telling what he did and why it was bad.

Quote
##Unvote
##Vote: Action Dan
Uber defending someone who doesn't really deserve defending earns him my vote.

So HH says I'm defending Sect.

Now for post Kiro post #110:
Quote
I'm ok with what Hourai has said about others so far except the one part where Dan is defending Sect. Don't see that at all. Mixed feelings about the Dan vote. Half is on my initial gut read of Dan, but the other half is that Hourai is correct that Dan does seem to be defending UK for her. Currently giving Hourai the benefit of the doubt.

why is UK's name there? (if typo say so) How do you seem to see something when you admit you "Don't see that at all." ???
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 21, 2011, 07:38:21 PM
600+ words but I can't really change this without becoming incomprehensible or skipping some things I want to say. Sorry. All the solutions I thought of were just using loopholes to cheat the rules and would probably be recognized as such, so yeah.

UK's original case on me makes... absolutely no sense. Like, "why the hell did I get voted over this"-tier nonsensical. Not only was my vote on Shadoweh completely different from actions that Dan had also performed, but I really can not see how town!UK could get what she did out of my question towards Kiro. Maybe I just, you know, wanted know Kiro's case on Sect so I could have something from Kiro to go off of? Asking for opinions isn't scummy, so UK is either scum BSing or a townie looking way too hard into my post.

... But you know what? At this point, I honestly think it might be the latter. This may be a dumb meta-clear, but after hearing her reasons for voting me it seems to me that UK could easily be townie!UK who got too enthralled with her own silly case. I still disapprove of her setting up traps over scumhunting actively, but I'm willing to switch off of her for now, as I do think all her content regarding players other than myself has been entirely reasonable (meaning that I might just be voting her due to bias). There are better ways the UK/HW scuffle could be resolved, anyway. :x

So, Shadoweh. I've talked about why I think you're scum already (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611532.html#msg611532), but I'll add this to the table: I don't like the way you handled your switch onto Sect followed by your switch back onto me. Even when you had your vote down on Sect, you did little to actually pressure him, making the point of a "pressure vote" completely null, and you switched back to me at the drop of a hat as well without fully explaining your reasoning. Seems more like you were scouting for a potential Sect wagon to me. It's also rage-inducing that you seem to think I can't judge a player who is voting for me without it being an OMGUS, seeing as that's basically an excuse to let scum who are being scummy get away with not being voted by the person they're currently attacking. Ugh.

##Unvote
##Vote Shadoweh
tl;dr the entire Sect exchange was bad. Her original switch to Sect shows awkward prioritization of cases, her continued stance on Sect has a lack of pressure on him which makes her vote completely ineffective, and her switch back to me barely had any backing behind it. The entire scenario reads like scum scouting for a potential lynch target while not actually being able to reason and prioritize their votes properly due to prior knowledge of everyone's alignments.

@ People complaining about how my cases are only on the people who are voting me: I'm sorry I didn't find anybody else particularly scummy at the time of my last post? If you want my current opinions, then Sect is silly, but not scum. Bard is unreadable as ever (filling in for Conqueror here). Hourai and Kiro are reasonable enough that I wouldn't attack them today. I'm getting major town meta-reads on Serela from his only post. Polly should post more talk about players who aren't named Dan, because as is he's pretty much contentless. I could actually maybe see him being scum!Polly struggling to make content due to MRM, but that should be left up to the mod if so.

I could maybe go for a Dan lynch since his tunneling on Bard borders a bit on IIoA, but I don't think he's as good of a target as Shadoweh. Dormio doesn't look great either, as his pressure on Shadoweh feels rather silly, but I don't think I could see him as her buddy.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 21, 2011, 07:54:35 PM
Shadoweh: You said that all possibilities can be considered and your vote history suggests you're doing that. It just doesn't "feel" like it with some of the minimal pressure on Sect and that you're actually engaging in a false dichotomy. Frankly both UK's and HW's side bother me, but that doesn't mean I feel either of them is worthy of the vote. You've taken your stance though so I'll wait for more content from others.

Kiro seems slightly lurkish to me but I don't know if that's normal for him. It might just be his avatar keeps staring at me. :ohdear:

I take a long time to decide on words. Mafia is totally srs bsns for me. See, even my avatar is designed for subliminal pressure.

OSAKA STARE!!!

O___O
   \__/

Bard: I didn't want to answer for you before you posted which is why I danced around my opinion. But I felt it was worth making a comment on because we gotta get our wild cards, Hourai and Polaris more involved. To me, Dan is making the observations, but drawing a variety of conclusions, some I can believe in, some I can't. Dan's upset at you for voting UK but I don't know whether he's upset that you don't believe UK when she said that Dan is Town or that you're trying to pin something out of nothing on her. Weird all around and that first point might have been an awkward chain saw, but overall, it didn't change that I still think Dan is a misguided Townie and I wanted it put on record at that time. At the same time, I don't think his case is entirely irrelevant. He mentions you were on the fence about HH and Shadoweh and it does seem like you were on reread. So I think he's paying attention to things which helps my impression of him.

Dan #136: Ah hrm. I read the first boxed quote as Dan defending Sect. Then I read the second boxed quote as Dan defending UK which is what I saw. Confirmation bias. That should explain the part about my confusion. In that regard, I'd like Hourai to clarify that second boxed quote as to whether it was Sect or someone else. For the record, I still don't see how Dan was ever defending Sect.

Cut by HW: Read it. Most of it is what I would expect from someone in his position. Going to think about those last 2 paragraphs more while at lunch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 07:56:42 PM
Well I'm back and can spend my energies fully now.  Excellent timing with that HW post!  Anyway I was deciding on who to look at first: HH, HW, or shadow: but I might as well do them all!  At first glance, HW, that post is interesting... in parts, (the part about UK, shadow, and sect, I'll look for verification), but the polly part looks so so awful, and I'm sure I won't be the only one who sees this immediately.  (barring a flat-faced quote by shadow followed by a "yes")

Also, your post wouldn't have been 600+ words without the tl:dr ----- trollolol (may I haz Bardy's trollface.jpg?)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 08:06:29 PM
@kiro: it's the latter: To clarify even more: I felt he was voting UK for a terrible reason whilst ignoring UK's declaration ~ like he already knew I was town.. hm  ;)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 21, 2011, 08:46:57 PM
This Votecount Lost 18 Pounds In 1 Week!

Bardiche (1) - Action Dan
Shadoweh (5) - Dormio, Kiro, Sect, Bardiche, huh what
UncertainKitten (1) - NeoSerela
huh what (3) - UncertainKitten, Omba, Shadoweh
Action Dan (2) - Hanged Hourai, Polaris

Shadoweh is at L-2!

Not voting:

~42 hours remain in the Day.  With 12 alive, 7 are required to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 09:12:48 PM
Reread all of Shadow, HW, and HH, and Sect.  Its enough to make my brain explode.  But the read was worth it.  I think I have located the root of all evil.
Hourai [is] reasonable enough that I wouldn't attack [him] today

No. This is the problem. Hourai is not reasonable. If Hourai's reasoning was a physical entity, I'd vote for it to die. THIS DOES NOT MAKE HH SCUM IMMEDIATLY!!

In my next post I'm going to wade through the ****storm and pretty much argue not to lynch Shadow while attacking Hourai's reasoning ability (which ties them all together).  HW, HH, and shadow still need to do more explaining.
I believe scum to be on the shadow wagon *cough* bard and for some odd weird reason sect. It's entirely possible HW is scum voting shadow and sect went along for the ride.  I think shadow has done some anti-town things but has been criticized too harshly. MORE IN A BIT (give me like 1/2 hour).
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 09:47:41 PM
I shall repeat information WITH observations <3 kiro

PART 1

Let's start with Hourai's post #38, her reason for voting sect, quoted below
Quote
Fooling around with votes on non-players. Prolonging RVS, and thus, hunting. Happier with my vote on him.
Four things: 1) The RVS was over when you posted. 2)Sect was the FIRST person to ask a serious question (about UK's silly meta) 3)Sect answered why she was voting (albeit not exactly convincingly) non-players. 4) hunting - what does this mean here? cuz you use this exact same word to refer to ScumHunting later (It'll come up in due time) and scumhunting is good, yes?.
 
This is why your post seemed obviously scummy, why no one thinks so was beyond me. Shadow voted you in #46 based on 1), 2), and 3) kinda. This is how I interpreted her words in my book. I'll explain "catering" right now.  I thought she knew that the post was scummy and voted you for it. However, she was slightly indirect i.e. "Hourai, attacking newbies for fooling around isn't cool" translates to 2) + 3). "So what do you think of the conversations between Dan, Bard and UK that you're ignoring?" translates to 1).  I thought that this could be her bussing since a real attack would go all out on points 1,2,3, and 4.  But since no one ever thought HH was scummy (besides UK) I'm not so sure anymore.  This is "cantering" to me because I thought HH was scummy and that Shadow voted HH to satisfy me (maybe I'm being selfish here and self-absorbed but that's where the word came from). 

Post #54. This is where Huh what jumps in, Attacking Shadow, for.... HH looking not scummy.   :fail: It's possible HW rushed his reasoning... but that was a crap post. This is where I'd place HW (scum)> Shadow(scum).  the rest of the posts of shadow and HW before HH chimes in are for UK's scumhunting department.

Post #79: WAIT FOR PART 2!!!


Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 21, 2011, 10:03:14 PM
You guys should stop pretending the wordcount limit doesn't exist, it's there for a reason. I'm still re-reading but I thought I'd post so Dan can at least pretend to be concisely obeying the counter. I'm feeling the need for more opinions from Hourai, Omba, Sect, Polaris and NeoSillyela before going back to arguing in circles with huh what again.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 10:09:56 PM
PART 2:

Post #79: answered first part in PART1, I didn't have time earlier and I was focusing on Bard.
"Dan-
Really, really, really loves Sect.  Not to mention how he blantantly tells the people voting him to either get off or defend themselves.
#43 says the "Sect scene" was "worthless" and then grills me for being on him. Either you're contradicting yourself, or you just don't want people attacking him. He says how I made "ill motives" for Sect, when I was telling what he did and why it was bad."

I've pretty much explained my reasons at this point in Part 1; at the time I thought they were obvious (live and learn), much like how Kiro voted sect without explainations (later he too claimed that they were obvious, and yes his opinion did change and he changed his vote).  Me, Shadow and HH have all prodded sect to vote (shadow took more drastic measures).  Does this mean we all Love Sect? No.

cut by shadow... ya, srry I'll stop for a bit, and continue later.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 21, 2011, 10:17:23 PM
Attn: everyone who said they don't think Dan was defending Sect.

I say I am happier with my ED1 Sect vote and he accuses me of tunnel vision.
Quote
I am glad, however, that you skipped over the Sect scene which I feel is worthless atm.
States he thinks hunting Sect is not good.
Quote
Sect seems to have no ill motives besides the ones HH created for her
What I said was exactly what Sect was doing.
Quote
I would like HH and Kiro to defend/change their vote
Ironically, we were the only ones on Sect at the time.

I consider this defending.

When he replies to me accusing him of defending, he thinks it's "funny." Way to dismiss a case on you.
And I am still waiting for the promise where you said you'd get around to me.

Quote
Side note: in bard's #44 he doesn't mention Sect or HH, just Kiro who he does not suspect. HH: isn't this a tacit defense of Sect?
Oh my bad, you're right. Not mentioning something in the beginning of D1 is obviously defending. Not.

No, I am not misled. And my logic is fine.

#136, No I am right. I meant what I said. I said you were defending Sect. UK has nothing to do with you in that post. Don't use someone else's mistake to discredit my case.


And now to address #143, the first actual case he makes on me.

Let's start with Hourai's post #38, her reason for voting sectFour things: 1) The RVS was over when you posted. 2)Sect was the FIRST person to ask a serious question (about UK's silly meta) 3)Sect answered why she was voting (albeit not exactly convincingly) non-players. 4) hunting - what does this mean here? cuz you use this exact same word to refer to ScumHunting later (It'll come up in due time) and scumhunting is good, yes?.
1. If it was over then why is Sect so innocent for fooling around with votes on not-people?
2. He's new and mostly unfamiliar with what UK does, which she does as both town and scum. Comparing to last game is a null tell.
3. Scum have the ability to think up of excuses too.
4. Hunting means looking for scum, making cases, yadda yadda. Is good.

  AndthentherestishowI'mscummybecauseotherpeopleareweird in his eyes. Moreafterlimit.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 21, 2011, 10:41:41 PM
Well HH, I guess we are gonna have to agree to try and kill each other, because atm you embracing your earlier posts and your scum logic makes you scum to me.  I'll wait for others to comment.  I'd say more but I'm just about.... at my limit! YEAH   8)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 22, 2011, 12:56:17 AM
ActionDan: Finally I can understand the stuff he's saying. Mostly thinking the "huh?" parts are just derp now.

Polaris: Post please. Anything. At all.

So how in the hell did Shadoweh end up at L-2?
Re-reading all of her posts, I can easily construe everything she's said as townie; a few things made me go "huh?" for a moment, like her vote-unvote with Sect, but the explanations she gave for them were reasonable. At the least, she's done less maybe-scummy-looking things than others, including myself.

Dormio: You voted her from the get-go, but in no post of yours have you pointed out anything about her that seems decidedly scummy, rather than at least going both ways, to me. Or rather, nothing that seems decidedly scummy on actually reading the parts you refer to. I can understand a slight "huh?" feeling about her, but are you voting her based on that?

Sect: Are you voting her because she voted you to get you to vote?

I can't see her fishing for someone to lynch with her vote on Sect. She didn't make a case on him, she voted him to get him to react. After he did and explained his reasoning, she promptly changed her vote back to her actual case. At the most, I could see it as something similar to what UK did - which resulted in HW nicely exposing himself. And there was nothing besides a vote she could do, since there was not really anything she could ask him aside from "talk and vote plz".

HW: 600+ words spent on - defense and Shadoweh. Incidentally posted at a point where Shadoweh had the same number of votes as him and also incidentally switching his votes right at that point. Also, he's not adding new things to his case on Shadoweh in his last post. Everything he's saying was already "put on the table" by him earlier. But he's still talking as if he he's adding new reasons - writing a huge wall of text helps hiding that. Feels to me like he's switching onto the Shadoweh-wagon now that the one on UK hasn't gained any traction.

More stuff /later, my brain needs a short break.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 12:59:33 AM
I like Omba's latest post a lot. It's a LOT more solidly opinionated than the wait and see we've been seeing so far.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 22, 2011, 01:13:46 AM
Gah, this wagon is freaking distracting. It doesn't make me feel much better about huh what but if I were to point at someone else, the only person I wouldn't call scum for it is Kiro, but that could just be his case sounding better then the rest. The rest of you, get the hell off me and scumhunt someone who's actually scum. I'm still waiting for Dormio to tweet something that isn't about how 'scummy' I am. Stop killing yourself in DotS and give us an update that mentions more then two players. Sect said he's going to look into other players so as long as he actually does that I won't get on his case again. I don't like pressuring people who take my slightly hostile playstyle seriously, I don't like being told people don't enjoy playing with me, so yes I'm trying to hold back on him. If you don't like it question him yourself instead of sniping at him through me. Bard can explain to me how my going after huh what for being terrible makes it my fault other people went after the UnknowableKreature for blatantly trolling people since I wasn't one of them. In fact YOU started the wagon on her before any of that happened. No takebacks.
To huh what, read my above statement on Sect. In the case that you aren't actually my enemy I'd like to see a more detailed version of what you dislike about Dan or Dormio, or Polaris if he's posted again by the time you read this.

Okay, so looking at the rest of the game.

Dan: We're past the RVS, so no I'm not going to dismiss you. I do think your definition of catering is silly. I don't vote suspicious people to please anyone but myself and what you think of me isn't interesting. You're implying that no matter which of HW or Bard could be scum that Sect is newbscum along with them, can you present a case on him as well as your other targets?

Hourai: You said you have more, so I'm going to wait a post before questioning you further. I'll be less pleased if it only mentions Dan though.

Polaris: We're playing Mafia! Please post who you think is scum in more then one name! I just realized I blanked over your first sentence.
Quote from: Polaris
Aaah, and I was going to try to be unforgettable this game
No. Please be memorable or die.

Will work for words.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Polaris on April 22, 2011, 01:49:55 AM
Ugh I've been having a busy day and it's supposed to be busy all next week so I'm just ugh right now.

Regarding ActionDan:
- Case on Bard is not good due to reasons Bard has already stated[1] (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612065.html#msg612065). Since you haven't responded to it, I'll prod you to do so. Emphasis on citing sources regarding mudslinging.
- This post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612299.html#msg612299) is incredibly useless. Please provide a proper response to Hourai and explain how his logic is scummy, along with how the given sources are not examples of you defending Sect. You have also stated earlier that Hourai had "inane statements"[2] (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611064.html#msg611064) so if you want to say something about that you can.
- What exactly do you mean by "interesting [posts]"? You've currently stated that NeoSerela made an interesting post[3] (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611848.html#msg611848) and that huhwhat's post was interesting at first glance[4] (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612181.html#msg612181).

Regarding Omba:
Omba was someone I wanted to take a closer look at because his huhwhat vote felt more like bandwagoning than an actual case. There's only one point that I want to bring up though.
-In this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611752.html#msg611752), are you saying that huhwhat's flip will have little to no effect on your view of UK? That post overall was a little confusing about how you feel about UK.

Dormio is someone who's being watched because his posts have been generally lackluster. There are no points that I need to bring up on him, though.

I have to go somewhere for another couple of hours and when I get back I will likely go to sleep. I'll warn in advance not to expect another post from me until tomorrow morning, or even after that considering the length it takes for me to write up posts.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 22, 2011, 02:20:08 AM
Warning - while you were typing 7 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Oh dear god I was meant to make this post 5 hours ago.
Words are hard.

Re: Kiro observations.
I wanted to see a reaction from Kiro but you guys suck and posted in Kiro's stead.
And no, I don't find Kiro to be scummy quite yet, but I don't like how nobody has mentioned him at all.
It's not like Kiro is some perfect being or anything.
Anyway.

Is everyone really giving UK a pass for now because meta?
I mean in UK's first post UK is like all "I know that Dan is town. How? Secret." Know who else knows who the town are? Scum.
Never mind how UK states "nope, not answering" (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg610983.html#msg610983) before voting huh what (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611171.html#msg611171) because huh what said that Shadoweh wasn't adding anything to the Dan/Bard/UK thing.
Not to mention I really don't like how UK basically states "You would have looked more town if you had asked me about Dan in the post where you weren't looking at me at all but you didn't and so you're scum. I'm not answering that question btw." in the same post.
Out of the whole UK/huh what exchange, I think UK looks scummier.
But that's all in the past! What about the present?
After UK started the stuff with huh what, what has UK done?
... Nothing?
After that, UK pretty much just sits back and waits for someone to die, defending people that aren't huh what.
ie. "I like Omba's latest post a lot." (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612386.html#msg612386)
"Kiro is posting fairly solid analysis" (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612085.html#msg612085)
"Serela 114 is incredibly silly and not worth responding to! ... That said, don't think Serela is scum, just silly." (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611911.html#msg611911)

Also.
Why should we be looking at Kiro?
Because we should be looking at everyone.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 02:24:31 AM
@Dormio: Then that means your doing it wrong. PoE is how you lynch scum. I entered the game with a list of people I wasn't planning to lynch D1. I've modified it a little in reaction to things happening in the game, but there are several people who are more likely than not town. I'm not turning a blind eye to anyone, but I'm also not going to try to make shit up or spend extensive posts analyzing people I think are town. If you don't like it, :dwi:

Also, your "points" are terrible and honestly a little scummy. You should know better.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 22, 2011, 02:58:32 AM
I don't really like meta analysis, but whatever.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 22, 2011, 03:23:44 AM
Other peoples.

Dormio-
I think it's weird how he says its weird that nobody mentions Kiro but at the same time he says he doesn't find him scummy. It's pretty waffley. If he's not perfect, what's wrong or what don't you agree with? What was this point trying to achieve?

And your vote is still on Shadoweh even though you've made a newer case. Do you still find your Shadoweh case valid, weaker, or stronger? You didn't address this in your last post.

Omba-
Quote
ActionDan: Finally I can understand the stuff he's saying. Mostly thinking the "huh?" parts are just derp now.
Cool. now that you understand him better, can I get your opinion on him rather than just acknowledging his existence?
You haven't really said anything on him before this, so can I know where you stand on this?

Polaris-
Nice that he posted, somewhat displeased he only really furthers his case on Dan. With your general lack of content, I would like to see more opinions on who you think are scum, or are at least suspicious of.

Shadoweh-
I would normally be concerned from the vote/unvote, but her reasoning and explanations are town-based enough that I'd disregard it for the time being, and she's been looking better from the time where I questioned her on the Sect thing. Leaning more towards neutral for now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 22, 2011, 03:25:23 AM
What was this point trying to achieve?

Disregard. I now see it was in response to a question. My other question still stands, however.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 22, 2011, 03:32:46 AM
Quick read in between a break of SC2.

I also think Omba's #148 reflects well on him and is in effect skewing my feelings about Shadoweh and her vote on Huh What.

Polaris not having a single word about Shadoweh, rather singling out Omba over her is unusual. And your question to Omba isn't a new question, it's just repeating what Omba had already said. Is that enough for you to put Omba as one of your top suspects over say Shadoweh and if so, why?

Dormio, you talk about me and UK in your long delayed post. But by the content, you're really not taking action on those points. Also, yes, with the amount of time left today, I'm going to give UK the meta pass. Since you brought it up, are you? Is UK going to be more worthy of your vote than Shadoweh whom you're still voting now, but also did not say a single word about in #152?

Sect has been absent all of Page 5. And being annoyed about Shadoweh's vote and then clear of you didn't really answer the real question I asked you. Is Shadoweh still scum to you?

There are enough shady people on the Shadoweh wagon and with the amount of content she's got, I'm willing to see 1 or 2 flips in relation to her content and re-evaluate her tomorrow.

##Unvote Shadoweh

I'll get another post and vote in before I go to bed.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 22, 2011, 03:37:46 AM
Guh, trying to figure out people is making my head spin. Might as well get this out of the way:

My main interests are Shadoweh, UK, and HW.

Shadoweh: My original argument of her trying to get buddy buddy with me via confronting HH isn't useful, though her playing softball is questionable: I'm a big boy, I can handle it. Prodding me for votes, I can see as not being scum thanks to OOC playstyle comments by her, Omba, and UK. I still don't like her voting for me, but I can live with it. Her case with HW seems to be mostly follow the leader with UK.

UK: Like I said earlier, I don't like the trap she made. The early unwillingness to comment on her vote wasn't too thrilling, especially with her pulling out the cool face on Bard. She and Shadoweh seem to have a thing going on, especially earlier on. I don't recall her elaborating on why me and HH need to die, kind of interested in that.

HW: The vote on UK was suspicious, though it's not like he's the only one this game that's made a retaliatory vote. His vote on Shadoweh seems to be opportunism, considering that there was already four votes on her, though his reasons seem legitimate.

I'm not sure if I'm going to get anywhere trying to figure out these three, and my thoughts are muddled at this point (I really should start writing down this crap), but rereading this posts for the last whatever made me notice something that I've been missing, so might as well pressure him. And damn him for making me have to wade through the first half of page 2.

##Unvote
##Vote ActionDan


Dan! Why am I the focal point behind your attack on Bardiche and your defense against HH? Also, would you be so kind as to refer to us by our proper genders?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 03:41:38 AM
Wasn't planning to, Sect. Wait for it D2 or if you start exceeding HW in scumminess. I find it interesting to see what *you* think I find scummy and how you fix it, if you try~. Incidentally, I like this post, and am tempted to reread Dan tomorrow. I may follow up on that.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 22, 2011, 04:11:17 AM
Going to sleep now, so longer post will have to wait a few hours.
One thing right now, though -

Mod: Since scum are only allowed to talk in private at night, does that mean they were not allowed to talk in private in the confirmation phase? (i.e. have no secret means of communicating until night 1 begins)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 22, 2011, 08:10:10 AM
Dormio: If you don't like meta analysis as you say in #154, why'd you do it in #152? I have not gotten an impression that you're scumhunting or building on the Shadoweh case. There is really strong active lurker-itis with you.

Huh What: Why no mention of Omba in your #137 opinions about others when he happens to be voting you? Also, I'm frowning at your town meta read on Serela. Care to explain why you feel that way about him?

I'd like to see Dan answer Sect's question as well.

(I said I was gonna give UK the meta pass earlier. But I've changed my mind).

UK: When I think about it objectively, I would never let anyone else off if they baited someone and then tunneled onto them as hard as you have. Ignore the overdefensiveness for a moment. What else is it about HW that makes him the #1 choice for you to the point that you've gone to being a passive commenter on everyone else? I can't recall a specific game, but I'm fairly certain you've done this kind of a tunneling before and have been wrong. Why should we at face value follow through with a HW lynch? If he is Scum, the benefits are obvious, but if he isn't, there will be a huge can of worms involving you and we may waste half of Day 2 pursuing you and if you're Townie, you wouldn't want that. Yet you still went with this play. In my opinion, you wanting the HW lynch is too risky because it's partially a result of anti-Town behavior from you. Convince me otherwise.

##Vote Dormio
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 22, 2011, 10:36:05 AM
Last minute post before sleep. Wanted to get these feelings out first. 6am posts are the best uncut posts!

Dormio: That's a nice case against UK you've got there. Who are you voting for again? It shouldn't take you almost a day to make a followup to your own post. Instead of YonoDormio we'd like the one that posts about the game that's actually happening right now please.

Hourai: My blurry 6am eye doesn't spy anything to press you on further. I'll try to think of something tomorrow. Stop being invisible to me. >:C

Dan: This stops now. I really, REALLY don't like the way you've been treating my wagon. How is it I've gone from scum, scummier, near scummiest on the little charts you've been making, to suddenly being a town wagon to you and reason to attack the people on me, without you ever explaining your reasonings for thinking I'm town or scum? You didn't seem to have a problem with it when it was forming. It's flattering that you're already treating me like I flipped town but how about you go back and explain it from the start. Why did you think I was scum? Why did you continue to suspect me more? What happened that suddenly changed your mind? Answers, now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 22, 2011, 10:48:25 AM
Dormio: If you don't like meta analysis as you say in #154, why'd you do it in #152?
Uh... meta where?
Anyway, things that have happened!

Firstly, Hanged Hourai asked me something!
I suspect Shadoweh to be scum! Why?
And, uhh... because!
I don't really have anything to add to this list right now.

What else has happened? More posts? More stuff to add to my headache? Awesome!

Hourai posts: I would like to see more opinions on who you think are scum. That isn't Action Dan, since you've been targeting him almost exclusively all game.

Kiro post: If you want to see some flips in relation to Shadoweh, which flips do you want to see?
And who do you think is as scummy/scummier at this point?

Sect post: Uh... So you're going to make various points on three people, then OMGUS on a person that you haven't even mentioned up until this point?

UK post: Uh, don't know what to make of this right now.

Omba post: Nothing to see here, folks!

Kiro post the second: Apparently me, yay!

I should get some sleep because my brain is screaming at me to but I won't because I'm a rebel!

Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.

I hate you and you should go die in a fire.

Shadoweh post: Inactivity? I blame Madoka.
Don't have anything to say about any of the other posts?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 22, 2011, 10:57:58 AM
Since I have words left over.

I don't have anything to add to my UK case for now.
Re: Not acting on it.
I think that both UK and Shadoweh are scummy and am perfectly willing to switch my vote between the two.
Actually.

@Mod: Votecount please?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Serela on April 22, 2011, 11:28:13 AM
I think I need to replace out ):

Pretty much the day this game started this turned into a really bad time for me.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 22, 2011, 11:37:58 AM
I think I need to replace out ):
[nsfw]http://img4.gelbooru.com//images/717/ce963c51c1fb6dc887e9c2694ee3340f358569ac.jpg?859892[/nsfw]
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 22, 2011, 12:31:05 PM
Dormio: Okay, I keep seeing "OMGUS" popping up everywhere, so I had to look it up to see what it means (http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Oh_My_God_You_Suck).

... I don't think it means what you think it means. Either that, or you don't understand the ActionDan situation (which, to be fair, is a bit boggling for me).
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 02:30:08 PM
Well Tidelliwinks!!  Looks like I've got a lot of stuff to do.  Defend against 3  :derp:'s.  Chat with Shadow.  And most importantly! explain why I can't imagine moe girly girls being traps  Tell everyone why I'm willing to vote HW.  Not only do I think Bard still is scum, he's lurking now that he isn't pressed so hard.  Shadow: gonna read sect in iso again, because something doesn't feel right, even though she's a derp.

If this post was enigmatic, I'll explain shortly
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 04:05:19 PM
Let me take care of the derp attacks first:

 Hanged Hourai: Sleeping has quelled most of my anger and given me new perspectives.  That said, your post attacking me is derpy.  Whether it is scum derp or town derp remains to be decided.  Your entire post hinges on me actively defending sect.  I will state for the record, that I ignored him instead, because up to that point, he hadn't produced anything noteworthy to me.  To be honest, besides prodding (from everybody, including me) who has attacked him??? But your in luck HH, because I will attack Sect (Btw are you still suspicious of Sect? you seemed to have dropped all doubt recently).  It is the people who agree with the logic of your attack against me, people like HW that see your claims as valid and would lynch me for it, that I find highly suspicious.

Sect: How many fences can you sit on? four apparently. UK, HW, shadow, and me.  In your last two posts you simply re-hashed all the cases made against us plus adding little pokes like "UK please tell me why me and my pal  HH need to die" (this is the only thing I actually care about in your post).  Irregardless, you move on to say "I'm not sure if I'm going to get anywhere trying to figure out these three, and my thoughts are muddled at this point,"  which is a cop-out whilst parking your vote me.  Your reason? "Pressure". Your pressure question? "Dan! Why am I the focal point behind your attack on Bardiche and your defense against HH?" If you weren't such a  :derp: you'd have seen your name in HH's post one billion times.  Also the only place I can think of where I mention your name in my attack on Bard is in my Side Note , which was intended for HH only. Later you admit the "ActionDan" situation boggles you.  To me you look like  :derp:scum.

UK: you aren't  :derp:, tell me how you could possibly like Sect's post?

Polaris (K4U hydra): entire post looks like he's buying time.  Since K4U is behind him, It's possible he's trying to look scummy so as not to be NK'ed. Or he's just scum.  I'd go on about Bard, and "interesting" but I'm at the word limit. (by 14 words)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 22, 2011, 04:14:21 PM
Dormio-
For scum picks, first choice is Dan, where my vote is and for the reasons I've stated.

Then, uhhh... you. Sorry. ;-; I'm not saying your vote is bad and you should change it, but your case on Shadoweh is largely based on her interactions with one other person earlier in the day, whom you've not given a real solid opinion on. Then the rest of your post is mostly fluff an not solid opinions on other posts, not people.

I'm not sure if you skipped this or just missed it, but what really is your opinion of Kiro? Saying that someone's not scummy while at the same time saying that you think he's not perfect and that you don't like how nobody mentions him is a little contradictory. What makes him not perfect? What's wrong about him?

That's all for now. I would like Omba to answer the question I asked in #155 if that isn't too much trouble. More solid opinions from Polaris would be nice.

Sect-
Is your vote a pressure vote, or do you want to see Dan lynched today? If so, can you reiterate your case for me?

Neo-
;~; Before you go, are there any opinions, points, or cases you want to tell so that that information isn't lost forever if you leave?

Also, Bard, play wif us? ;-;

Dan reply
Ahahahahahahahaha
Well I'm only going to address this point.
About Sect, he qualifies for my D1 new player pass. I'm more interested in finding out where he stands rather than being suspicious of him.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 04:24:58 PM
@Kiro 161: Well, the thing is, his ONLY contributions after I voted him appear to have been him tunneling me. Further, at this point, I see connections to him, both positive and negative. His flip will help me make sense of those connections. And thirdly, his first post was again, about the scummiest I'd ever seen for a first post. If you don't agree with that, that's fine. I still think HW is a far better lynch today than, you know, Shadoweh.

@Dormio 164: Terrible. Completely terrible. You've explained why you (erroneously) think I'm scum. Now explain Shadoweh. Feel free to link back to a prior post that explains it, because right now it looks like you want an excuse to be on a mislynch wagon.

@Dan 169: It read like it had townie intent. Genuine trying rather than stepping back and trying to justify terrible scummy opinions. You don't have to be right to be townie.

Anyway, depending on Dormio's answer I may want to run him up instead. I'll provide more reasoning once I have my answer.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 22, 2011, 04:43:16 PM
Hey Dan, how about rebutting me? 8D

##Unvote
##Vote; ActionDan


I'll even sweeten the deal.


Shadoweh, you're totally OK now and stuff. I'd write more but time etcetera. Basically your latest posts make me feel better about the instance where you said you had to pick between UK and HW - I took that as a tunneling effort but the latest set of posts all dispel that accusation.

Etc.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 22, 2011, 05:01:37 PM
Massive Facepalm Votecount

Bardiche (1) - Action Dan
Shadoweh (2) - Dormio, huh what
UncertainKitten (1) - NeoSerela
huh what (3) - UncertainKitten, Omba, Shadoweh
Action Dan (4) - Hanged Hourai, Polaris, Sect, Bardiche
Dormio (1) - Kiro

Not voting:

~22 hours remain in the Day.  With 12 alive, 7 are required to lynch.

Mod: Since scum are only allowed to talk in private at night, does that mean they were not allowed to talk in private in the confirmation phase? (i.e. have no secret means of communicating until night 1 begins)

Scum were allowed to communicate before the game began.

I think I need to replace out ):

Sometimes I don't know why I even fucking bother.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 22, 2011, 05:58:10 PM
Dormio: Alright, not really a meta analysis on UK, I'll give you that. But I get an unfocused vibe from you, particularly your hesitancy between Shadoweh and UK.

With regards to flips in relation to Shadoweh's, I want to see yours. If you flip Scum, I'm much more confident Shadoweh is Townie. You could flip Town, but with your recent posts, I'm not seeing any Townie motivation from you and feel it is a better risk than going HW or UK. You're rehashing old points on Shadoweh because let's face it, there isn't that much else  which is why I decided to drop Shadoweh for today. The inconsistency with you and UK is also something I'm keeping an eye on.

Omba: More content, less guro. Lurker has been spotted. Would you vote Dormio over HW?

@Kiro 161: Well, the thing is, his ONLY contributions after I voted him appear to have been him tunneling me. Further, at this point, I see connections to him, both positive and negative. His flip will help me make sense of those connections. And thirdly, his first post was again, about the scummiest I'd ever seen for a first post. If you don't agree with that, that's fine. I still think HW is a far better lynch today than, you know, Shadoweh.

You know, if I replaced all instances of HW with UK in the above quote, it would be reasonably accurate as well. Try it out, you'll be amazed. Stalemate imo.

Polaris: If you think Dan's case on Bard is bad, what parts of the case and Dan are enough to convince you he's actually Scum rather than potentially misguided Townie? Also, I noticed your waffle yet lack of pressure on Dormio in #151. Any new opinions there?

Bard: Did you pretty much just OMGUS Dan? More explanations please and why he's no longer a misguided Townie like you thought he was before.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 05:59:00 PM
Bardiche, are you trying to get under my skin? It's working.  I am actually surprised that you can troll this hard.

Bard, it's hard to buy "time" as an excuse for your almost 1 day lurk. On that note Huh What hasn't posted in a while either.  At least NeoS. is replacing out (and this isn't a good thing).  Before I go on with "rebutting," I'd like to mention your excuse reason for jumping off shadow. 
Shadoweh, you're totally OK now and stuff. I'd write more but time etcetera. Basically your latest posts make me feel better about the instance where you said you had to pick between UK and HW - I took that as a tunneling effort but the latest set of posts all dispel that accusation.

Etc.

First: You'd better write more, I'll hold you to that. Second you commented that Shadow was tunneling. Whether she was or not doesn't matter (She wasn't IMHO).  You thought she was, thus when you unvoted, you imply you think that her latest posts must be looking at other People besides UK and HW.  Well... let's take a look at all her posts, #135, #144, #150,  and #162.   In these she defends herself, asks for input from everyone (including you bardo), pokes at dormio, and chastises and prods me (which I swears I'll answer).  Basically, if you really thought she had tunnel vision, I doubt you would have given up on her so easily.  What is much more likely, is this: You saw in Shadow's post #150,

Quote
The rest of you, get the hell off me and scumhunt someone who's actually scum

and realizing that her posts seemed chalk full of townie intent, you balked and threw your vote on me, somebody who you think atm can provide you with soft cover.  Furthermore, you are distracting me from more serious posts. One that I would like to address to Shadow directly, and One to provide a case on HW.

Looks like I got side tracked. But you know what? How about you make a serious case on someone with that srs bsns face of yours before I answer mindless prattle.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 22, 2011, 06:00:36 PM
... All right, you seem to have not gotten the point of my question, Dan. I'll go ahead and walk through this: I am not going to give opinions, I am just going to make links to posts that I think are relevant to the question that I'm going to ask.

We'll start with Bardiche: Your first vote, aside from the one on HH in the beginning, was on Bardiche (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611028.html#msg611028) for voting for UK based on this message (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg610983.html#msg610983). That message was in response to your question (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg610978.html#msg610978) about her "meta", which only came up because I made this vote (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg610960.html#msg610960). This is all relevant, in my eyes, because in a message to HH (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612264.html#msg612264) you said "Sect was the FIRST person to ask a serious question (about UK's silly meta)".

As pertaining to Hanged Hourai: in this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611064.html#msg611064), you claim that HH and Kiro both look scummy, and point out that "HH is scumier because of tunnel vision and because of how inane her statement was", and later said that "Sect seems to have no ill motives besides the ones HH created for her" (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611120.html#msg611120). Then, you call for HH and Kiro to change or explain their votes (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611211.html#msg611211). It's here that (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611451.html#msg611451) HH changes his vote to you. Finally, we come back to this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612264.html#msg612264).

So, there are your resources for my question. I'll go ahead and reword the question, no, just divide it up into two questions: "Why is my page 1 post pertaining to UK so important to your case against Bardiche?" and "Why am I a primary factor between you and Hanged Hourai?". Please, without any personal attacks, explain. You can use any source to explain your answer.

HH: To be frank and honest, it was a pressure vote. I had tunnel vision on Shadoweh/UK/HW, and I wasn't finding the clues that I thought were there. I had been ignoring most of Action's posts because I wasn't seeing anything new come out of it, so I missed most of the references to myself until I did a reread of the game. However, his #169 post isn't really thrilling, so I want to see how he answers this post.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 06:18:28 PM
@Kiro: No, you really can't. Please read the actual game rather than assuming I'm tunneling. I invite you to read me in isolation and see if you can AT ALL support your tunneling accusation. Don't worry, I'll accept your apology for being completely wrong when you're done.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 22, 2011, 06:48:52 PM
You mean the mindless prattle you call a serious case on me, Dan? :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 07:42:13 PM
I'm depressed  :(... I just spent 1 hour and 1/2 to answer Sect's logical post.  The first time this site konked out.  The second time I accidently closed the tab.

I'll give the short answers:  I think you and HH have misinterpreted my posts #60 and #42. #42: Bard wanted me to look at everyone else that wasn't UK for scum intent.  As Kiro, HH, and Sect were the only ones who posted, I looked at them.  I thought Sect's posts were harmless and being misreped by HH.  For that alone I thought HH's first serious post was bad and scummy.  Kiro voted Sect without an explaination.  I thought none of this was worth more than pursuing Bard.

#60
Quote
I would like HH and Kiro to defend/change their vote AND I want to bomb the foxholes of the remaining lurkers  :getdown: THIS IS WAR! STOP BEING COWARDS SISSIES!!
I only wanted opinions from everyone that hadn't posted in a long time/at all (which included HH and Kiro).  It came off a little wrong.  I mean, both did chime in and change their respective votes.

anyway hope that clears it up.  feel free to ask more clarification questions if not.  I barely thought of you Sect until now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 07:49:09 PM
EBWOP: None of that existed when Bard voted UK, I just thought voting UK for the reason he did was scummy, not a true prod, and more of a way to Mudsling!.  I have already presented his alternatives in a previous post. So my case on bard really had nothing to do with you Sect. Hourai probably misinterpreted #42 and #60 and that is why you are a point of contention between us.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 08:09:22 PM
From Bard to UK on HW:

Quote
Certainly, if it is something you can troll around (you'll forgive me for calling it trolling a little, right? It's kinda provocative) then it must be something you can share with the group.

From Dan to Bard on Dan:

Quote
Certainly, if it is something you can troll around (you'll forgive me for calling it trolling a little, right? It's kinda provocative) then it must be something you can share with the group.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Polaris on April 22, 2011, 08:44:18 PM
Kiro: I was [supposed to be] asking for clarification from Omba on whether or not I understood the post correctly, but what you're saying tells me that I did understand it correctly. I guess it was sort of odd because I myself would think that views on UK would be heavily affected by huhwhat's flip, so I guess it's just a matter of disagreeing instead of true scumminess. I'm willing to give Omba a clear based on this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612509.html#msg612509), though, considering the question asked.

Regarding Dan:
Dan seems incredibly detached from the game for some reason. His posts seem to just consist of whatever's on his mind at the moment, which gives off the impression that he's not paying attention to the game. If I'm correct he has ignored or made throwaway comments on everything that does not immediately pertain to him, which just feels bad.

Regarding Dormio:
I don't see any waffling from my perspective, Kiro, but I admit that I didn't pressure him mainly because there were no points to pressure him on besides wanting to see more of his opinions (and that would make me feel like a hypocrite). At this point I think everyone can unanimously declare Dormio as Bad right now. It looks like he's unsure about Shadoweh after running out of things to say about her, but still keeps his vote on her nonetheless, and there were also lazy pokes at Kiro where I'm not sure what Dormio was actually trying to achieve.

Regarding Shadoweh (and huhwhat):
Shadoweh vs. huhwhat is at a standstill due to huhwhat not posting anything so they have both been pretty uninteresting for now. It looks like Shadoweh is taking some time to look at other people so I would like her to clarify who her top scum pick is besides huhwhat.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 22, 2011, 08:48:23 PM
Why no mention of Omba in your #137 opinions about others when he happens to be voting you? Also, I'm frowning at your town meta read on Serela. Care to explain why you feel that way about him?
I was asked for opinions on people who weren't voting me. Omba was voting me.

The amount of buddying up to Shadoweh and UK on his part raises an eyebrow, especially when he made an entire post attacking a majority of Shadoweh's wagon, considering that she can certainly defend herself. If Shadoweh is town I could maybe see him being newbscum trying to buddy up to townies for points, and I could definitely imagine them as buddies too. So yeah, I don't like Omba very much.

I'm having trouble putting my meta read on Serela into words, honestly. It's something along the lines of me thinking that scum!Serela would be more cautious in his posting.

Okay, where did this sudden Dan wagon come from? Dan is suddenly kind of buddying up to Shadoweh as well, though not as blatantly as Omba. It seems kind of weird considering what he has said about her in the past. I still want to see him take more definite stances on  people other than Sect the easy target and Bardiche, particularly the more polarizing cases today (UK and myself). Not agreeing with the Bardiche case at all either, some of the points seem to be a bit of a stretch (esp. in #175). Shadoweh is still my top pick and my opinions on her haven't really changed since my last post, but I'll switch to Dan for Not Me Over Me reasons if necessary.

I kind of want to punch Dormio for the amount of stuttering and fence-sitting in #163. It makes him seem unsure of himself, and I would associate that kind of behavior with scum. I'd like to know why he's still voting against Shadoweh when a lot of his recent posts have been focusing in other directions, and even when he did post his case on Shadoweh, it seemed pretty lackluster to what he has on a lot of other people. Dormio, post explaining your priorities on your current suspicions.

I'd like to hear some new opinions from Bard on people other than Dan and Shadoweh, since he went roughly a page without posting.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 22, 2011, 08:51:23 PM
RE: Polly ninja

Clearing Omba over his question is pretty silly, considering that scum are willing to ask questions that make them seem ignorant in an attempt to gain townie points. I recall doing something like that in Zombie Apocalypse at one point, at least.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 22, 2011, 09:17:28 PM

Wow, that Dormio post sure is a thing! Those things being terribad and fucking awful. Did you seriously use "Because" as a reason? So those points you have stopped being useful about.. a day ago? If UK is your second prime suspect you can't just skip her posts. Like.. you did those other three people. I don't believe in lynching people to clear another person as town, not even myself, but I can get behind lynching someone for not having an opinion at all. It sure would be cool if you learned to get one.

Seconding NeoSerela's ice cubey fate.

Dan: I'm not a trap. ;-; But you still haven't actually answered what I've asked of you. Your points against Bard for letting me go suddenly for 'being chalk full of townie intent' can be applied just as easily against you. I'm glad you were touched and saw the light but I still have no idea how you got there in the first place.

Bard: The weddings back on! <3 I get angry at people for not saying how they feel about an argument, it doesn't mean I want them to ignore the rest of the game.

I would compare how I feel about other cases to huh what but seeing as he hasn't posted for long enough to deserve a prod ever since his defense started failing I'm not budging. Maybe if he stops laying low I'll think about being distracted off him. Oh hey cut by huh what. Your Serela read sadly won't matter long since he's REPLACING OUT >:C So it's nice that your opinions on me haven't changed in a day. I'd like you to look over the posts I've made since then and tell me how they make me worse then the other points on people that you've presented here. That said, this post actually does make me feel better about you, and I'm going to look over my other suspects and do the same.

Polaris: If I'm not staring holes into huh what it would be Dan for not making any sense or Dormio for being a complete derptard. I'd also have to look at UK and see if I want to get that war I never had. I don't like the idea of ignoring a wagon because the subject disappeared off the face of the planet. Now that huh what is back you can pretend to be interested and comment on him properly.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 10:08:12 PM
Shadow: as for the scummy--->scummier--->townish.  Yes this looks odd.  But each came from a different perspective.  I originally thought you looked bad because you thought that HH's stance on me held merit. I thought you looked scummier later when I considered the issue a little more from HH's PoV.  I thought perhaps you were intentionally approving a misguided town's case.  Then HH starts his "DAN LOVES SECT; HEAR ALL ABOUT IT YOU NON-BELIEVERS!" stuff all over again.  That's when I concluded that HH was out of his mind. In regards to this, do you think HH's case holds water? HH: do you still think your case holds? 

So how did you go to townish?  I actually don't have much of a reason to support a town!shadow over scum!shadow or vise-versa   
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 10:09:45 PM
OOPS, I hit post!  :]
that ended on a funny note lol  :V
I'll continue in a second
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 10:28:38 PM
So how did you go to townish?  I actually don't have much of a reason to support a town!shadow over scum!shadow or vise-versa.  BUT I think Bard is scum... and I have reason to believe HW is also.  I'm making a case for HW shortly.  with two people who look seriously scummy on your wagon, I had reason to believe you were a mislynch target.  Your posts up to now didn't seem scummy at all, more like a frustrated town, so I had little reason to doubt you.

Since I've answered a few of your questions and concerns, please answer a few of mine.  Why are you giving Bard a pass? Do you not find his vote hop strange?  You criticise me for changing my opinion for the better on you, and now think I'm the next scum after Huh What,  but you clearly find Bard's "OK shadow, you don't have tunnel vision :V, you fine, pretend I never voted for you" A-OK. Seriously, what's with that?

Final Note- about Dormio: I had labeled him as a town PR role.  Why? because he was active lurking while pointing out little observations (that made sense early on). However, I agree that at the moment he looks like he's not even trying (Bard feels the same way too right now).  Still I would like people (especially UK) to consider this possibility.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 10:36:36 PM
@Dan: I consider this "possibility" the scummiest fucking thing you've said all game. Shame on you!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 10:37:09 PM
EBWOP: That answer also means I'd like no one else to answer it or even acknowledge it. That was terrible.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 10:51:40 PM
Remember what I said about Polaris? That he looked like he could be a town PR, or if not, scum?  Well Dormio could be just that, scum.  I highly doubt that she's a VT in anycase.  There are a few differences between Dormio and Polaris.  Dormio doesn't seem to have a friend in the world, if he were scum, I'd imagine that someone by now would have said something.  However, Polaris seems to be receiving encouragement, even after his incredibly scummy first post.  It's true Dormio hasn't done more to defend his vote, but the Shadow wagon has come and gone by this point (especially with HW telegraphing his next move i.e. voting me).

So UK, all I want to say is to keep an open mind, except on Bard, clear scum.  In other news, what did you think of HW's last post? I'm sure you have got something to say on it.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Polaris on April 22, 2011, 11:01:16 PM
Dan - This post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612880.html#msg612880): First paragraph about Hourai seems like fencesitting because he never really declares Hourai as either town or scum (and ironically, he berates Sect for fencesitting afterwards). His thoughts towards Sect seem to end up towards "scum", but I don't quite follow his thought process in how he came to that conclusion.
Also, you seem to want to keep painting me as scummy without explaining your reasons, so you should do that. Along with that I'm patiently awaiting what you've promised to bring, including what you mean by "interesting posts" and your case on huhwhat.

huhwhat - quote:"Okay, where did this sudden Dan wagon come from?" Does this mean you're against the wagon? It seems like you're saying that Dan has been pretty bad so far, but then you go and say "Not Me Over Me" as the only reason you would switch from Shadoweh to Dan. Kind of waffly to me.

Shadoweh - After huhwhat bringing up Omba attacking people on your wagon, I realized that you haven't mentioned that at all. Do you have anything to say?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 11:05:26 PM
I love how Dan is continuing to discuss things scum are more interested in discussing. If you are town, I really suggest you cease that line of reasoning regarding PRs. Because, you know, scum benefit from that a fuckalot more than town does. HW's latest post is absolutely uninteresting and does nothing to change my read of him. If I had something to comment on from it, I would have.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 22, 2011, 11:10:44 PM
Quote
HH: do you still think your case holds?
Indeed I do, no matter how much you try and drag my name through the mud and try to call me misguided or derpy.

As for your "case" on me, all that I can decipher from you is that you thought I was terrible and scummy for saying Sect was bad for prolonging RVS, how my case on you is a big "misrep" and then the rest is how other people interacted with me, not the other way around.

Polaris-
Please clarify for me who is your second scum pick and why.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 22, 2011, 11:12:00 PM
Since apparently people hate me forever for going after two people.

I'm not sure if you skipped this or just missed it, but what really is your opinion of Kiro?
Kiro's done a few things that seem off, but doesn't seem scummy to me yet.

Now explain Shadoweh.
It's mostly because of the interactions with Sect earlier in the day.
I don't get why people like to forget about things like that, but whatever.
##Unvote

If UK is your second prime suspect you can't just skip her posts. Like.. you did those other three people.
Uh... what is there to make of UK's post and Omba saying "going to sleep now".
And who were the other two people I ignored?

I guess at this point UK > Shadoweh in terms of scummy-ness because Shadoweh hasn't done anything terrible recently.
##Vote Uncertain Kitten

Anyway.
I don't really like either of the current wagons.

ActionDan is reading town to me because I don't really understand the case on him right now. Will reread.

And huh what's looks town to me because the only case on him was built around him being defensive over Uncertain Kitten's attack on him.

I don't have anything to add to my UK case right now.
I'll be back in a few hours hopefully to post again.

Warning - while you were typing 6 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
orz
As UK says, Dan seems interested in seeing who the PR are?
Anyway, more in a couple hours.

Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.
:/
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 11:17:44 PM
Wrong answer Dormio

##Unvote, Vote Dormio

First, link me the post with your case on Shadoweh. Second, your case on me will now be defeated!

UK wrote around 10:32 PM last night:
1) Are you seriously saying I have a town read on someone based on being scum? That doesn't even deserve a response.
2) I said nope not answering about my meta and placing a vote. And yes, that was anti town. And?
3)chenwhat.jpg
4) Misrep. I wouldn't mind a Sect or Hourai lynch, and I also was initially for an Omba lynch but he's improved. Please to be reading, sir.

So, basically, your case is I defend people I think is town. Fucking amazing, guy.

The points correspond to your initial post with links on me.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 11:18:26 PM
EBWOP: Sorry, point three should be

3) (http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m303/ValetVisuals/Random/chenwhat2.jpg)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 22, 2011, 11:21:38 PM
Urgh, Dormio, you are missing the point of my questions.
Quote
What makes him not perfect? What's wrong about him?
Kiro's done a few things that seem off, but doesn't seem scummy to me yet.
What are these things that make him seem off to you?

Also, Dan, if you think Sect is derpscum, why do you seem so intent on using my post saying he's bad for prolonging RVS as a point in your case on me?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 11:27:18 PM
UK: Fine, Fine, I get it. I'll shut-up about PRs, It's mostly speculation anyway.  Also let me ask you what I asked Shadow:  What do you think of Bard's vote hop off her wagon and onto mine? He has yet to give an explanation. 

Polaris: painting you as scummy? Look at your first post!
Quote
Aaah, and I was going to try to be unforgettable this game?but I wanted to run some ideas through K4U first, and even after that my thoughts are refusing to form coherent sentences to write my post with.

I just don't like Dan right now. It feels like he's just tunneling on Bard at the moment, and not responding to Bard's counters doesn't really help. He seems to be forcing his opinions on everyone else without really letting them think on their own, and basically declaring his own interpretation as fact (or something like that). ##Vote: ActionDan If you would, Dan, please answer Bard (post linked above) and tell us why you think the dumb ED1 argument was a scumslip.

You accuse me of tunneling on Bard and not responding to "counters" yet at the same time all you did was post about me. Isn't this hypocritical? I didn't force anything on anybody.  You are free to agree or disagree.  Why don't you make a case on me, instead of "painting me scummy".

cut-cut-cut-cut-cut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 22, 2011, 11:29:49 PM
I think it's Bard being Bard. Bard is probably not getting lynched today. With some flips, his "vote hop" may be more important. I don't see it as anything right now. And PR speculation is a terrible thing. You shouldn't do it.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 22, 2011, 11:55:41 PM
HH: I no longer think Sect is derpscum, I think he voted me due to a misunderstanding (pending his reply), but I always thought (and still do) that you HH were scummy.   

Your question to me reads: "If you thought Sect was scum, why'd you go and point out that I really had no case against him?"  BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T
Should I have instead embraced your crap case, to attack Sect? If you thought that I labeled Sect as  derpscum, why did you give out a case against me that proclaimed, for all the world to hear, that I had been actively defending Sect?

I have come to realize that your points are absolutely, and beyond a doubt, utterly unsupportable.
##Unvote
##Vote Hanged Hourai
By God, do I have FPMH!


Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 12:09:26 AM
Dan: I didn't agree exactly with the points Hourai was making on you. I said earlier that it seemed more to me like you were mentioning people linked to Sect as if he were already obvscum. But looking back, it does seem like you disliked serious cases on him at first, then changed your mind. I've accepted your reasons for changing your mind on him but don't like that you presented them afterwards. My reasoning for disliking you isn't related to Hourai's case. Your answer to my question is noted but highly suspicious. At this point I'm not going to believe you when you say you're making a huh what case until you actually make one.
To semi-answer your question about Bard, I'm not actually going to answer what I think of him right now beyond that I don't think he's worth pursuing today. If it comes up suddenly as a pressing point I might address it. I don't think you'll be able to move enough opinion his way to make it an issue.

And seriously, keep power speculation on the inside. I do not want to call you Capt.Dan.

UncertainKittan: Please come out and present the re-reads of other players you said you would do earlier, we need opinions to hold you by. Your updated opinions on Dan, Dormio and huh what are appreciated. Do you think Kiro is wrong for pressuring you into looking at other options? I sense claws out waiting to pounce but I'm not psychic. Tell me your thoughts! 

Warning - while you were typing 10 ne(ry
Why ;-;

Polaris: If you mean post #148 I don't see anything wrong with it. It's more questions for the people on it then attacks. Compare to Dan's reaction where it was a reason to go to war.

Dormio: The three would be Omba, Kiro, and My inability to count. Other then that, your post is totally convincing and I have seen the light!

##Unvote
##Vote: Dormio


That was horrible. You aren't even going to try and justify why you ignored everything I've done since ED1? Since you still sound like you think I'm scum this isn't good enough. What has UK done lately compared to what Shadoweh has done lately to convince you that Shadoweh is still scummy but UK is worse? A case, with post links, and maybe even realizing how WRONG you are and going after someone that stands a chance of being lynched today would be great.

Dan: SO HOW ABOUT THAT HUH WHAT CASE?!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 12:16:05 AM
EBWOM: @mod about rule 4, do we need to reach the majority of 7 or just a clear majority on someone to lynch?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 12:19:45 AM
@edible, could you post a votecount?

Before I post anything more, I'm gonna cool,
At this point,
I'm willing to lynch Bard, HH, or HW.

My reasons for HW are actually pretty simple.  His first post voting shadow for going after HH, his telegraphing his votes before placing them gives off the impression that if questioned, he can say something like "but I said I would vote this person, see?".  He has generally handwavy stances against everyone besides shadow. He bandwaggoned shadow with bard to L-2.  Now he's wondering why I have a wagon even though earlier he said he was up for a Dan lynch.  His buddying arguements with Omba are WIFOM. 
cut-cut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 23, 2011, 12:23:06 AM
Quote
Your question to me reads: "If you thought Sect was scum, why'd you go and point out that I really had no case against him?"
No, my question is, "If you think Sect is scum, why use my ED1 comment on him as a point on my case?"

Quote
Should I have instead embraced your crap case, to attack Sect? If you thought that I labeled Sect as  derpscum, why did you give out a case against me that proclaimed, for all the world to hear, that I had been actively defending Sect?
Except you blatantly did call him derpscum.
Quote from: 169
Later you admit the "ActionDan" situation boggles you. To me you look like  :derp:scum.
If I'm understanding this right, to answer the question, I made the case of you defending him before you said he was derpscum. Your point is moot.

Can you direct me to the point where you change your opinion of Sect being derpscum to being a misunderstanding?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 23, 2011, 12:25:33 AM
Votecount

Shadoweh (1) - huh what
UncertainKitten (2) - NeoSerela, Dormio
huh what (1) - Omba
Action Dan (4) - Hanged Hourai, Polaris, Sect, Bardiche
Dormio (3) - Kiro, UncertainKitten, Shadoweh
Hanged Hourai (1) - Action Dan

Not voting:

~14.5 hours remain in the Day.  With 12 alive, 7 are required to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Polaris on April 23, 2011, 12:27:15 AM
In response to Hourai, Dormio is my second scumpick because of his lack of conviction on the Shadoweh vote and ending up switching to UK only because everyone poked him about it. His case on UK basically seems to stem from him being lazy and choosing one of huhwhat or UK instead of actual scumhunting.

In response to Shadoweh, to me it seemed like it [Omba's post] was defending you, so I expected some kind of comment from you in response to that. Since your interpretation of it is different I can't fault you for it, I guess.

I would obviously prefer lynching Dan over Dormio, but the latter is fine too.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 01:02:06 AM
HH: I thought Sect was  :derp: scum after his 3rd to last post.  After his last post, I cleared him.

I'm assuming what you call "my case" is my post #143.  (this post was way before I called Sect derp scum)

At that point, I had no idea as to Sect's alignment.   I was using your RVS post to say that you were scummy.  You interpreted that as a defense of Sect.  then you ask me this recently,

Quote
Also, Dan, if you think Sect is derpscum, why do you seem so intent on using my post saying he's bad for prolonging RVS as a point in your case on me?

I respond:
Quote
Should I have instead embraced your crap case, to attack Sect? If you thought that I labeled Sect as  derpscum, why did you give out a case against me that proclaimed, for all the world to hear, that I had been actively defending Sect?

you respond
Quote
Except you blatantly did call him derpscum.
That was WAY WAY after post #143 a.k.a the case I made against you. You made the case against me where you declare that I defended Sect RIGHT AFTER I made the case against you.
YET, you have this to say
Quote
If I'm understanding this right, to answer the question, I made the case of you defending him before you said he was derpscum. Your point is moot.
CORRECT!  So how does that make the case against you come AFTER I call Sect derpscum? TIME PARADOX!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 01:15:26 AM
Just so my last post didn't get missed.  HH clearly slipped up here, If this is not a scum slip,  I don't know what is.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 01:29:48 AM
Also, I won't be able to post after the next 20 min, but in 12 hours or so when I come back, I want a medal, or at least an e-cookie.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 23, 2011, 01:50:06 AM
Deciphering what you mean is such a chore.
At that point, I had no idea as to Sect's alignment.   I was using your RVS post to say that you were scummy.  You interpreted that as a defense of Sect.
I also interpreted the me making ill motives for him as defense, the defend or change vote as defense, and calling hunting Sect worthless as defense.

Quote
That was WAY WAY after post #143 a.k.a the case I made against you. You made the case against me where you declare that I defended Sect RIGHT AFTER I made the case against you.

First let's get this straight, I said you defended Sect all the way back in #79, I didn't just pull it out of my hat after you make a case on me.

Quote
YET, you have this to say...CORRECT!  So how does that make the case against you come AFTER I call Sect derpscum? TIME PARADOX!
I'm not disputing that the case came before the derpscum accusation. If the "slip" you're referring to is that somehow I'm saying the derpscum came before the case, and that a case was built around it somehow, then I think you're either misrepping/misunderstanding me or twisting my words.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 23, 2011, 02:29:14 AM
Kiro is reasonable town. Who did I say I'd reread again? Because I thought I promised that today for tomorrow, but it might have been yesterday night for today in which case I have FAILED and need to do it tomorrow. That said, I think I've adequately updated my opinions on all three, actually. Particularly Dormio. Dan is burning his town cred faster than Vimes smokes cigars. And HW is still terrible~

@HH: What's your case on Dan again? I might have missed it. Linking to it if you made one already is acceptable.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 23, 2011, 02:43:10 AM
On a visceral level, I don't think all this content from Dan can be the work of Scum. But goddamnit... I still have to read it don't I? First part of #175 is ok, second part isn't. Don't reach for conclusions that Bard is scared of Shadoweh accusing him as one of the scum on her wagon. Bard isn't scared of that.

HW #183: I realize at the time, there was only 1 vote on Dormio and so I assumed your comment about going on the Dan wagon while noting Dormio whose "behavior you would associate with that of scum," was because Dormio's wagon didn't feel viable. Now Dormio's at 3 with Dan at 4. Both are equally viable at the time of this post. Which wagon do you prefer now?

You know, I can follow Dan's logic on his progression of thoughts on Shadoweh in #186-188. Seems reasonable enough to me because I went through the same progression. I'm not really getting why people are unhappy about it. Obvious frown at the PR thing, but we all know he's new so I'm dropping that as a null tell.

Dormio's all shrug and ho-hum. "Shadoweh not doing anything terrible recently," isn't really a reason to switch to UK. If you said something like, "UK is exhibiting more scummy behavior so that it outweighs Shadoweh's past actions," I "might" have been ok with your vote switch. Very important difference. I really want to see Dormio's lynch today.

Dan: Opinions on Dormio please. There's no way you're getting a Bard or Hourai lynch today. HW is a possibility though. And so you know, it is standard procedure to switch to the bandwagon with the most votes at deadline if we are in danger of not getting our 7 majority votes. Because in Day 1, any lynch is better than no lynch. If it's not you, it might be Dormio so I want you to at least acknowledge ahead of time that you know how the players need to switch their vote to ensure a lynch.

Ok, I am lost at the recent Dan and Hourai exchange as they seem to be repeating themselves over a darn ED1 point that both players ought to drop. Hourai: any reason you feel the need to cater to Dan's repeated questions?

After all that content though, I still think Dan is misguided Townie.  400  :wikipedia:  :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 02:54:32 AM
UK: I'm thinking of this post here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612496.html#msg612496) which was yesterday. I wasn't expecting Dormio to cut me with whatever that was and you to respond before I could ask. Who are your top three after all that happened? Also I'd like to hear what you think of Polaris, I don't think you've mentioned him. Don't save everything for tomorrow, we only have so much time in this fleeting world.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 23, 2011, 02:58:38 AM
Polaris gives me a headache and I try to avoid reading his posts so I don't die of an anyeurism. I know I'll have to reread him someday, but I don't think I can make sense of him today and there are better targets.

Top three now would be HW, Dormio, and...actually, I don't have a third right now. Though I'm waiting for an answer from HH that might put him in slot three.

Ah, right, I was tempted to reread Dan. Yeah, that should happen tomorrow morning.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 03:14:09 AM
I'll just slot that into 'neutral' then. Considering the wagons I think Dan is relevant to now and you should read him sooner then later. (Also I'm not likely to be here tomorrow to read it in time if it does change things.) 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 23, 2011, 03:15:33 AM
It's getting late tonight and I have other things to do. Hence why it needs to wait 10ish hours.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 23, 2011, 03:45:33 AM
Right, case on Dan, condensed soup version. For purposes of not repeating what's already been said to death, I'm going to exclude the defense of Sect.

ED1, horribly forced case on Bard.
When I make my first case on him, he dismisses it without explanation and throws out scum accusations without explanation.
A lot of his scum cases revolve on making scumteams how other people interacted with the person instead of the other way around.
In his recent cases against me, he backtracks, and conveniently leaves out key points, which ends up as misrepping me.
The PR stuff is just horrible and anti-town.

Quote
Hourai: any reason you feel the need to cater to Dan's repeated questions?
I'm bored, I want people to know where I stand, he'd whine if I didn't answer them and then call me scummy. Any combination of these 3 would work.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 23, 2011, 03:48:55 AM
The last part of your answer about answering questions looks terrible, HH. Anyway, sorry to ask but can you link the dismissal of your case with the wild accusations, and examples of his scum team based thinking?

And more importantly, can you tell me how this is any different from Helepolis last game?

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 23, 2011, 04:10:13 AM
Anyway, sorry to ask but can you link the dismissal of your case with the wild accusations, and examples of his scum team based thinking?

Dismisses my case, calling terrible w/out explanation (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611584.html#msg611584)
This is where he judges me based on other people's interactions. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612264.html#msg612264)
Quote
And more importantly, can you tell me how this is any different from Helepolis last game?
They're different people. I'm not a fan of judging newbies who act similar by some standard.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 05:11:36 AM
This will be my last post for at least 7 hours I think:

Kiro: As much as I'd like HH, Bard, and HW to hang, I will be practical.  Besides active lurking,  Dormio hasn't taken a "strong" stance on anyone, and reads as if he doesn't know what to do with his vote.  If I'm not around for the lynch I will at least leave my vote in the trust of the majority of the town (that is, the part of the town not on me).  That said,

##Unvote
##Vote Dormio

HH: ya, you claim misrep, I claim misrep.  However what is NOT a misrep was your slip, since that wasn't accidental, It was done with Scum intent: I repeat both your quotes:
I'm not disputing that the case came before the derpscum accusation. If the "slip" you're referring to is that somehow I'm saying the derpscum came before the case, and that a case was built around it somehow, then I think you're either misrepping/misunderstanding me or twisting my words.
Then why say this?
Quote
Also, Dan, if you think Sect is derpscum, why do you seem so intent on using my post saying he's bad for prolonging RVS as a point in your case on me?
Except I never thought Sect was derpscum at the time. I want my e-cookie
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 05:19:14 AM
BTW, Why isn't bard saying anything yet.  We are like 10 hours or so off.  He's said far too little for far too long, whilst slipping in a dubious vote on me with little reprecustions other than "Bard is Bard." Bard if your gonna put the town lynch in the hands of fate.  You will see your name mentioned a hellofalot more day2.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 05:23:30 AM
Ok this is really my last post. On the last note, where is Omba?  and @mod what will happen to Neo.S??
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 05:42:33 AM
Yeah, after the continued content from Dan and the lack of anything from Dormio I'm getting comfy with my vote. We've got about nine hours until Rocks Fall so people can stop fooling around and get on someone that stands a chance of going out the door today. Read over people's posts, you'll get a good idea of who's willing to lynch who. I'm setting my alarm to an hour before lynch so I'll be here if six people tackle NeoSerela for claiming scum or something.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 23, 2011, 05:51:35 AM
The Count of Vote Cristo

Shadoweh (1) - huh what
UncertainKitten (2) - NeoSerela, Dormio
huh what (1) - Omba
Action Dan (4) - Hanged Hourai, Polaris, Sect, Bardiche
Dormio (4) - Kiro, UncertainKitten, Shadoweh, Action Dan

Not voting:

~9 hours remain in the Day.  With 12 alive, 7 are required to lynch.

@mod what will happen to Neo.S??

I don't know yet.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 23, 2011, 05:51:58 AM
I'm getting real tired of this. In #169, you said my case on you was bad based on how I said you were defending Sect from the prolonging RVS thing. Later in the same post, you called him scum. I don't even see or understand what we're arguing about anymore.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 08:36:06 AM
Warning - while you were typing 9 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Warning - while you were typing 8 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Uhh...
Anyway, let's get an opinion post in before I become unable to think again. oops too late

Sect: Not very memorable. Don't know how to read Sect for now.

Bardiche: On the slightly inactive side, but for now I'm willing to think of him as town.

Uncertain Kitten: Looks worse out of the whole huh what exchange.

Shadoweh: Doesn't look as bad in recent posts, but I can't shake the feeling that she's scum.

ActionDan: Some of his actions are questionable, but I believe him to be derptown.

NeoSerela: :/ (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612732.html#msg612732)

huh what: I really don't like how UK went about attacking huh what, but there were some odd things shown by huh what.

Hanged Hourai: Not as town looking as people like Omba and Kiro, but I don't see any real scummy-ness from him just yet.

Omba: I think he looks town for now.

Kiro: I think he looks town for now.

Polaris: Similar to Sect. Not much activity from this end either.

I was meant to have written this half a day ago.
Real life sucks.
Anyway, I have plenty of words left, will make another post on UK, huh what, Hanged Hourai and Shadoweh.
... Provided MotK works. I can't open anything aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 08:52:18 AM
Finally sober and well-rested. Now.

Kiro: At the time of my last longer post, I wouldn't have voted Dormio over HW. He looked strange but not decidedly scummy to me. Was willing to wait for him to improve, also because I was getting similar reads from Polaris, Bardiche, Sect and NeoSerela; as in, lack of content. While HW was already busy digging his grave. Between then and your question, Dormio made a few bad posts. Since then, he hasn't put out anything to alleviate the strangeness, i.e. no solid content that would at least make it seem like he's trying to hunt scum / add any real new analysis. Instead plenty of evading. Makes me wonder why he's not at least trying to put out some analysis that is faulty but not easily spotted, though, if he's scum. Well, I'll wonder about that once we've seen his flip, won't me tell me anything otherwise. He had plenty of time to do something useful, but he didn't use it.
HW finally stopped focusing on defending himself. Not that it'd help him since it's not magically erasing his former posts and his latest post is rather weak itself.
That said, Dormio's constant evading looks even more scummy to me than what HW pulled. Can't see any townie reason for doing that. Guess HW will have to wait one day.

##Unvote
##Vote: Dormio


I skimmed over Dan's posts and didn't see anything that would make me want to vote him over Dormio. I'm going to read them more thoroughly, but I guess that's going to take some time, so I'm posting this now. Generally still think he's derptown.

huh what: What do you expect me to do when someone I don't think is scum is 2 votes away from getting lynched? At the least, it warrants taking a closer look. Which I did. And saw a lot of things that bugged me about it. There's a difference between pointing things out/asking something, and attacking someone. Well, I did directly attack one person in that post. That person being you.
Also, whom of the likely candidates do you want to see lynched today?

Polaris: Wait. You raise exactly one point about me and then proceed to drop it for that "reason"? Really? Considering there's enough other things about me you could have attacked, that looks a bit strange to me.

Bah, 400 words for this. Really?

cut by Dormio
/reading
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 09:05:25 AM
There isn't much there worth reading.
Now, since forums are loading properly again, please wait warmly as I try to make another post.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 10:35:22 AM
That thing about sleeping got replaced by reading threads, so I thought I'd drop by this one to see what Dormio posted. Oh he did! My thoughts on it: What the hell is this? It's reportery as all getout, doesn't have any reasoning behind it and it contributes absolutely zero to the game. I was hoping this apparently 'better' post would be done by now but apparently not. Going to try and nap some more until deadline. Will hopefully be back!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 10:51:35 AM
I wish the show posts feature would work. :/
Anyway.

Shadoweh: I still don't like how she brushed aside Sect's points against her earlier.
She also singled out Sect for not voting when other people still had their jokevotes and NeoSerela didn't exist at all at that point in time.
Since then, she has been looking better, yes. But I had and still have the feeling that Shadoweh is scum.
One thing that is weird however is just how fast the votes on Shadoweh built up after pressure voting Sect due to Sect not having a vote down.
Actually I want to reread this if I have time.

Uncertain Kitten: Ugh. UK gives me a headache.
Firstly, UK's initial vote on huh what I still don't understand.
I mean huh what votes Shadoweh for prodding the Dan/Bard/UK thing without really adding anything to it, then UK comes out to vote huh what.
In this vote declares huh what's vote to be the worst thing and that it would have been a much better course of action to ask UK where UK's call of ActionDan as town came from.
I really don't understand why UK suddenly announced that and used it to push a case on huh what's OMGUS and being defensive.
After that whole mess, UK goes around prodding various people.
But the thing I find weird is how, despite having stated that "Making cases on why people are town tends to give scum pesky ideas we don't want them having. I'd rather say why people are scum, myself." (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611171.html#msg611171) states that she thinks that Shadoweh (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611594.html#msg611594) and Kiro (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612085.html#msg612085) are town.

huh what: As UK said, in response to UK's sudden vote and case against him, huh what OMGUS'd and played really defensively for the next while.
I don't know how I would have reacted if I got myself into a situation like that which is why I'm a bit hesitant to call him on it but whatever.
I was writing this section last and I'm out of words.

Hanged Hourai: I forgot. :/

Out of the four, I think that

Oh, hey, cool. Days end at 1am for me.
Yay.
And goddamn I stared at this thing for over two hours.
My brain isn't working.

Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Words are hard.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 10:57:02 AM
Out of the four, I think that +Uncertain Kitten looks the worst.
Oops.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 01:18:18 PM
Oh you've got to be kidding me. There's what, a half hour left? I know it's near 9am but someone better get their ass in here and VOTE FOR OUR LYNCH. Dormio didn't even bother voting for Not-Dormio! We need at least two other people to wake the hell up NOW.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 01:22:25 PM
Dormio didn't even bother voting for Not-Dormio!
Uh... what?

Also, if my maths is correct (who knows if it is?), we have an hour and a half not half an hour.

@mod: votecount, please.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 01:26:46 PM
Nope, according to my timer we have less then an hour before Rocks Fall and who knows what happens.

Not you. As in the only other viable lynch besides you right now is Dan. Do you think Dan is more likely to be scum then, say, you? If yes then stop voting for UK and VOTE HIM.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 01:34:03 PM
But the last vote count was at 3:50pm. (my time)
And there were ~9 hours left.
That should mean that rocks fall at ~1am my time.
It's 11:30pm here.

... But apparently when I look back at the start of D1 it was at 12am...
I hate numbers.

Welp.
##Unvote
##Vote ActionDan

Sorry dude, I think you're town, but you're not me.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 01:39:20 PM
Okay, about ActionDan.
I see flawed reasoning and focusing on little things I would deem insignificant. But the way he goes about it makes him look to me like he's town and making mistakes, rather than purposefully trying to attack people without actual reasons. It pretty much feels like he's arguing in a heated debate. Am not going to dissect the stuff he's said, unless someone is feeling particularly sadistic wants me to. Not enough time for a 1000 word post and Edible would kill me anyway. :V

Timer: According to D1 post, we have about 28 minutes left. And according to the last votecount, it's about 1:10h.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 23, 2011, 01:42:58 PM
Just wanted to say I'm around and it's 6:45 AM on a beautiful i-could-still-be-in-bed Saturday morning. Goddamnit Mafia, goddamnit.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 01:43:18 PM
Timer: According to D1 post, we have about 28 minutes left. And according to the last votecount, it's about 1:10h.
Yeah, that confuses me too.
But since I'm going to assume worst possible scenario and we have less than half an hour before rocks fall and everyone dies...

ActionDan or me?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 01:44:54 PM
Just wanted to say I'm around and it's 6:45 AM on a beautiful i-could-still-be-in-bed Saturday morning. Goddamnit Mafia, goddamnit.
I was waking up at 5am for Pesco's game because days ended at 6am for me.
That was terrible.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 01:47:08 PM
Just wanted to say I'm around and it's 6:45 AM on a beautiful i-could-still-be-in-bed Saturday morning. Goddamnit Mafia, goddamnit.
You have no idea how much I second this. I could have just snuggled back in there..
I would much rather lynch Dormio then Dan right now. But I'd also rather lynch someone then no one. :/ We need people who aren't on Dormio to show up. I've been counting time according to the Day 1 start post.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 01:48:21 PM
inb4 the forum goes offline for approximately 30 minutes.

On another note, is there anyone from the Dan-voters around, besides Dormio?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 01:50:00 PM
Possibly you?
Other than that, I don't think so.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 01:51:19 PM
But I'd also rather lynch someone then no one. :/
4) Don't bully No Lynch-chan.  Voting to No Lynch is not allowed, and a majority MUST be reached by the end of each day or Rocks Fall And You Will Die.
Unless somebody here loves rocks, I think none of us want to see a no lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Sect on April 23, 2011, 01:51:40 PM
Sorry, just woke up. Currently very unhappy with Action, both with his response to my post and.... whatever that was afterwards. Doesn't look like anyone will want to lynch him today, though. :/

I'm pretty sure if a lynch doesn't happen then we all lose. Quite frankly, I wouldn't be displeased by that outcome: the only person that seems to have any sort of competency in this particular game is Kiro. But whatever.

##Unv

--cutcut--

... Omba, have you even read any of Dan's posts? They're practically incoherent, how is that at all helpful for town? It's not quite like playing with Kips, but I'd like it to end before it gets that way. Screw it. I'm sticking with the Dan vote. I want Dan gone more than I want Dormio gone, and I want this game to end more than I want Dormio gone.

-cutcut-

Jeez, let me vote,

-cutcut-

:|

...

:|

-cutcut-

Grah!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 01:55:35 PM
I want Dan gone more than I want Dormio gone, and I want this game to end more than I want Dormio gone.
Huh? Okay.
I love you too, let us be more showy than BardichexShadoweh?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 01:57:28 PM
Sect: Yes, I have read them all. I've re-read every damn thing he's written before making that short post about him. Thing is, we want to lynch scum, not people who fuck up. Which is why I'm not voting him, based on the feeling I get from his posts.
That said, I'd rather lynch him than default-lose, of course.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 01:58:36 PM
That said, I'd rather lynch him than default-lose, of course.
ActionDan or me?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 01:59:19 PM
Ah hell. 6 minutes.
##Unvote
##Vote: ActionDan
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 02:00:38 PM
Sect: Please no, I choose mafia over no-mafia. :ohdear:
I am going to murder every one of you that isn't here right now post-game.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 23, 2011, 02:00:47 PM
Since there's confusion on when the Day actually ends, I'm going to take Edible's last votecount as canon and say deadline is at 10:51:35 AM (EST). Look at that, we have delayed Armageddon with the power of blind hope that Mod is forgiving positive thinking. Life is wonderful.

Sect and Omba, plop down your votes now. Would like to see where you guys stand before it might get skewed by deadline bouncing around.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 23, 2011, 02:01:46 PM
EBWOP: Yes, that was also a not-so-subtle hint that I would prefer seeing more people show up who might vote Dormio.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 02:02:37 PM
##Unvote
##Vote:Dormio


Obviously.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 02:03:47 PM
If I'm not mistaken, the current wagons of interest are:[/s]
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 02:04:08 PM
Uh, those tags didn't work.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 02:04:26 PM
Ok last post it seems.  VCA is gonna look damning after I die.

UK-->Shadow--->ME

people on my wagon lurking so Dorm wagon is forced to switch
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 02:05:34 PM
So would I but I really don't like the idea of betting our lynch on timing. We had the option to vote for an extension if we needed it last night.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 02:05:42 PM
Also Sect:

I gave you the opportunity to ask me more questions.  You wait till now to damn me???
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 02:09:19 PM
HH: BTW your the case against you was #143 NOT #169, way to falter once again.... (post #169 was my defense against your derp attack)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 02:11:47 PM
Huh What still hasn't picked a wagon, he said He'd go for either me or dormio, My guess is that he's waiting for a switch vote and will hammer immediatly.  He didn't fall into Omba's trap though.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 02:13:08 PM
It's too late to turn back now. Praying we have 40 more minutes for someone willing to vote not ending the game to show up then. Dormio, now would be an awesome time for you to post something that isn't completely useless if you do go. Dan, uh, what exactly are you saying in that VCA post?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 02:13:26 PM
I'm sorry if these posts seem frantic, But my death is a very real outcome and I have no time now and I want to get out some thoughts on the most important stuff.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Polaris on April 23, 2011, 02:15:30 PM
Hi using my iPod to post because I wanted to check before deadline.

##Unvote ##Vote Dormio

L-1.

Time's running out and I'm having doubts that we'll get a majority on Dan so I'll switch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 02:15:57 PM
I'm saying that most of your wagon jumped to me, (with REALLY weak agruements, like, Sect: "Why u use me against Bard?" BARD: I'm voting you TROLLOLOL.")
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 02:18:31 PM
I don't really know what to say.

Well, let's try anyway.

Firstly, Sect's sudden buddying up to me feels weird. (call me)

Also, Shadoweh ignores my post and yells for having not voted for the wagon that isn't me (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613844.html#msg613844), despite the fact that I had made that post a couple of hours ago when we still had time.

Warning - while you were typing 2 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Oh, hi Polaris.
No majority, despite the fact that both are L-2.
Well, whatever.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 02:18:37 PM
I have to go now, sigh, wish I could stay more.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 02:23:12 PM
Right, because 4 hours in the morning before your own lynch is plenty of time to get a lynch going on someone whose only other vote is the guy replacing out. I'm ignoring your post because nothing in it convinces me I don't want you to die for your sins today. I'll evaluate it tomorrow depending on how you flip.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 02:29:59 PM
Well, I started writing it two and a half hours before it was actually posted. :fail:
Also, gddmt I want to go to sleep. orz
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 02:30:50 PM
T-19 minutes

Dormio: L-1
Dan: L-3

If I'm counting right.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 02:33:01 PM
Dormio: That's still only 6 1/2 hours.
But I know that feeling. I wish my brain worked faster, too. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 02:40:56 PM
My clock is like 10 minutes ahead of forum time, it's hard to tell exacts. We got Polaris! Still need one more.
Dormio: Yeah, I think my point still stands. You could've fixed that yourself when you realized how late you posted it anyways.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 02:43:15 PM
Mine is about 4 minutes ahead. Should be about 8 minutes left now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 23, 2011, 02:45:21 PM
Sect, no need to be formal now. Just unvote and vote Dormio now. You can leave whatever you might be typing up unfinished.

Otherwise, there are 3 of us here to switch to Dan. Argh!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 23, 2011, 02:45:29 PM
i do not have nearly the strength or the time to write a post now but

do we need a hammer or something

i don't know i'm half asleep
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Kiro on April 23, 2011, 02:45:57 PM
Hammer, Dormio, now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 02:46:27 PM
Yes, do vote.
Dormio is at L-1 and Dan at L-3. And there's like 5 minutes left before everybody dies.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 23, 2011, 02:47:46 PM
##Unvote
##Vote Dormio

well then
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 02:48:20 PM
So you wanted me to jump onto ActionDan when we still had some time left, and I had no case on him?
Because at that point, and now as well, the only wagons are me and ActionDan.
I really don't like either of them.

Re: Time.
My computer says it's 12:51am.
9 minutes.
→ A ↓ → A ↓

Warning - while you were typing 4 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
:/
Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.
:/
さよなら。
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 02:49:47 PM
o/ Hammer Shutup!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 23, 2011, 02:51:26 PM
Welp, since I'm dead, might as well bah post now.

Why can I never be vanilla?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 23, 2011, 02:53:18 PM
...You all didn't even ask Dormio for a claim?

*head desk*
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 02:55:49 PM
Can we still talk???
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 03:10:27 PM
I don't think it's technically night, but according to rule 6 we should keep away from analyzing players or talking about the game.
UK: Uh.. well crap. I'm barely awake what do you want from me
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 23, 2011, 03:11:20 PM
Hey, there's still a chance that he's the Scum Roleblocker! <_<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 23, 2011, 03:34:01 PM
This'll Teach Me To Start Games In The Morning, Final Day 1 Votecount

UncertainKitten (1) - NeoSerela
Action Dan (4) - Hanged Hourai, Sect, Bardiche, Dormio
Dormio (7) - Kiro, UncertainKitten, Shadoweh, Action Dan, Omba, Polaris, huh what


Dormio has been lynched!

Warning - choo choo i'm a train

He was a Mafia trainGoon!

You have ~24 hours to analyze the thread, send in any night actions, or whatever as long as it isn't discussing the game.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 23, 2011, 03:42:01 PM
YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!! D1 SCUM LYNCH~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 23, 2011, 03:56:41 PM
honk honk
http://danbooru.donmai.us/post/show/547211/crossover-error-eyes-face-gap-locomotive-parody-st (onoz Danbooru NSFWness)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 23, 2011, 06:40:16 PM
Shadoweh, did you realise there's new chapters for Cavalier? One chapter that has a lot of Just in it? :V They're finally returning to that storyline! No more past!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Conqueror on April 23, 2011, 06:44:03 PM
Thread hijack! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDajqW561KM)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: ActionDan on April 23, 2011, 06:46:59 PM
LOL, I just hijacked the diplomacy thread!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Omba on April 23, 2011, 09:38:42 PM
Dormio has been lynched!
He was a Mafia trainGoon!
[nsfw]http://gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=198082[/nsfw]

:V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 24, 2011, 02:52:42 AM
Shadoweh, did you realise there's new chapters for Cavalier? One chapter that has a lot of Just in it? :V They're finally returning to that storyline! No more past!
eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee yes Just is being SO CUTE then he's SO MEAN and then he's SO JUST EEEEEE
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Polaris on April 24, 2011, 03:31:03 AM
Also Edible is silly for not changing "Day 1" in the thread title to "Night 1" :v
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Bardiche on April 24, 2011, 03:40:35 AM
eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee yes Just is being SO CUTE then he's SO MEAN and then he's SO JUST EEEEEE

Ourobouros~ I like the part where he wears shorts even though he didn't before getting infected by a humongous serpent.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Edible on April 24, 2011, 04:26:20 AM
Also Edible is silly for not changing "Day 1" in the thread title to "Night 1" :v

SHUT UP :(
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 1)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 24, 2011, 05:07:35 AM
Ourobouros~ I like the part where he wears shorts even though he didn't before getting infected by a humongous serpent.
Who wears short shorts~
Just wears short shorts!
Oh god the one where he's just standing there with the ? I could die
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 24, 2011, 05:04:33 PM
Good morning.  It is now Day 2.

When you wake up, you hear a commotion outside.  It seems like someone was murdered!

Oh no, it's... it's... !  Roukanken, Irrelevant Third Party, is in a bloody heap on the dusty ground.  Wait, that's not blood.  It's steak sauce.  And he's asleep, not dead.  Wake up, Rou!  Stop sleeping in the middle of the road covered in A-1.  Sheesh!

Seems like everyone else is alive.  You throw Roukanken out of your tiny village and go back to your daily lives, which currently involves attempting to lynch your friends.

Nobody died.  You have 72 hours.  With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

NeoSerela has been replaced by Zakeri.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Sect on April 24, 2011, 05:10:26 PM
I'm just going to make these two posts, then I'm pretty much done for today: I have better things to do than stress myself out over this. So, typing this post and the next post the night before the game starts up again.

First, ##Vote ActionDan

ActionDan is the most useless and most detrimental player in this entire game, and I have a really hard time believing that it's "because he's new" or "because he's derptown" or whatever other reason people might come up for him. A few points:

First, his first "serious action", if you can call him that, is pressing UK on, of all things, the meta behind a joke vote. Everyone knows it was a joke vote, it was so obvious, but he then later treats it as though he was responding to a serious question by me in his defense against Hourai, despite the fact that it was blatantly obvious that I was treating it like a joke vote. This leads on to Bardiche voting for UK because it was one of the more interesting things going on (the other one being my dumbass vote on Rou), and then Dan proceeds to waste three days pressing Bardiche on it, despite the fact that the UK/HW melodrama was going on, or Shadoweh's thing, or all those other things.

That, by the way, was the first question that he completely failed to answer, even after I gave him everything he needed to figure out what I was referring to.

Second, his whole love affair with Hourai. That's just a huge mess that no one even wants to delve into: he starts laying into Hourai and Kiro because they voted for me, and blatantly tries to intimidate them into changing votes. When Hourai calls him out on him essentially protecting me, because, really, that's what it blatantly appeared to be, Dan immediately goes into defensive mode and claims that he isn't and begins making attacks on Hourai. What follows is some of the most idiotic arguments I have ever seen, and I really don't want to get into because they make no sense and it makes my head hurts. He then tries to claim that Hourai made up the claims that he was defending me (blatantly untrue, as I posted links to the posts where Dan did otherwise) and that his attack on Bardiche was justified because of me making the first "serious" question (which, as I explained above, is also blatantly untrue).

That, by the way, was the second question that he completely failed to answer, even after I gave him everything he needed to figure out what I was referring to.

Third, he makes no sense. His arguments are circular, he'd rather talk more about irrelevant meta than actual fact, I can barely tell where he's going half of the time, it takes diagrams to figure out what he's even said, he misrepresents everything other people say to him, and when he's not "arguing" he's throwing out personal insults (clearly seen when I voted for him and posed my question: he spent more, no, the entire time insulting me rather than answering).

That, by the way, was the thi- wait no I didn't ask that question. Disregard.

Finally, and this is the more personal point, I'm just tired of seeing his name, because it just makes me groan. I'm tired of having to read his posts three, four times in a row, just to figure out what he even said. I'm tired of staying up till one, two o'clock at night, trying to figure out how to type responses to his posts before just giving up and going to sleep. I'd rather not end up being like I was with Kips, where I was awake at five o'clock in the morning, heart racing and stomach clenching because dealing with the guy was making me physically sick.

So, in conclusion, ActionDan is scum, whose sole function is to make town completely and utterly befuddled and disorganized, and he's getting away with it.

Post on other people incoming.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Sect on April 24, 2011, 05:10:46 PM
Okay, so you other people. How you doing?

Kiro: Like I said before, the most competent player in this game. I don't have any complaints about his playing, and his posts are almost always sound.

Hourai: Wasting his and everyone else's time by arguing with ActionDan. I especially want Dan out of the game, but Hourai is going about it the entirely wrong way, and making the entire matter even more muddled.

Bardiche: The most impressive case of lurking while posting I've ever seen. He really hasn't done anything useful past trying to teach Dan how to play. He's not striking me as scum, but he doesn't have my hopes up, either.

UK: Had her pegged as scum yesterday, today I have her pegged as UK. Still don't like the trap, but at least you're doing something, and your commentary is decent. It's not a very good thing, though, if when you're playing as scum you look like scum and if you're playing as town you look like town.

Shadoweh: Like husband like wife, I guess. Her commentary isn't all that useful, and she's mostly riding on UK's coattails, from what I can tell. Also, stop pitching like you're a Peewee baseball coach.

Huh What: At this point, I'm leaning towards town: looks like he just got caught flatfooted by UK and never had a chance to recover.

Omba: Can't decide if he's ActionDan's scum partner or just... gah. His posts are unimpressive, mostly rehashing what everyone else has already said, but in a different way, which makes it seem as though he was presenting new commentary. His "thoughts" on Dan really put me over the edge yesterday, though: if you had actually looked at him, you'd see that he's basically causing havoc for no reason whatsoever.

Polaris: His lurking's really impressive, almost reminds me of K4U in the Mafia RPG. My second pick for scum at this point.

Anyways, that's it from me today. I'm going to take a step back from the game for a while. Don't expect to hear back from me for a long while.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 24, 2011, 05:47:08 PM
Sect:

First, your opinions might have been valid day one, and that's a big maybe, but they have absolutely no place after Dormio's flip.

I'll get into your first post later, but your 2nd post is even more damning than your failed oppurtunity to hammer last night (look at Dormio's fake rage posts after D2 DTB mafia:  AT least Helepolis hammered). 

Your point about UK: atrocious.  Unless she's super bussing Dormio and that was her plan all along in the wee time they had to talk about it, she's confirmed town. 

Unless you think Scum wanted to go into a scum/scum wagon D1, I'm confirmed town right after UK, the first person to Call out Dormio. 

on Shadow: the 2nd to attack dormio, is town. (barring bussing)

ON bard and polaris: LOL you attack Polaris WHEN he was the decider to switch wagons and lynch SCUM.  You Waffle on Bard for lurking!!!!!

You are SCUM, I have to go or I'd add more

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: WHMZakeri on April 24, 2011, 06:12:14 PM
Let's get the easy one out of the way first.

Sect:
Quote from: Sectimonious, Post 245 on page 9
I want Dan gone more than I want Dormio gone, and I want this game to end more than I want Dormio gone.

You have 24 hours to justify why any townie would ever say this and mean it. After that, I will give you the rest of the 72 hour period to justify why you would say this about someone who flipped scum.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: WHMZakeri on April 24, 2011, 06:14:26 PM
To clearify, Sect, please focus on the part that I bolded for emphasis in the quote.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Kiro on April 24, 2011, 06:49:20 PM
With how prominent the Dan wagon was early on and the difficulty in getting the vote switches from Dan to Dormio, I'd say the people who were on Dan long term deserve the closest looks today. Particularly those who didn't switch after Dormio's 195.

Hourai was posting during UK's and Shadoweh's switch to Dormio and passes over Dormio pretty lightly in #198. Then it's straight back to Dan on #205, #211, and somewhat #218. Definitely feels like a push to keep Dan at the top.

Feeling a bit off on Polaris. His #207 pretty much prioritizes Dan over Dormio. And the reason for the switch to Dormio in #263 feels weird. Why did you feel you were having doubts about getting a majority on Dan when it was even?

I think those are my top 2 at the moment. A little confused on Sect's insistence to push against Dan on Day 2, but I'm not really feeling him as Scum.

##Vote Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 24, 2011, 06:59:52 PM
FWIW, had I been around to post earlier on D1 I would have probably switched to Omba as I decided he was scummier than Shadoweh, and I also would have said that I prefered Dan over Dormio, since Dormio was attacking my second pick for scum. Except then Dormio flipped scum so I'm a retard. <___<

Okay, sooo, opinions relating to Dormio's flip:

Anyway, Omba's D1 was bad. I've already mentioned how much I dislike him chainsawing against the people on the Shadoweh wagon, considering that Shadoweh could have defended herself easily. It truly seems like he was buddying up with somebody he knew to be town for ~sweet cred~. It's also amusing how much he copied UK all day, first on my own wagon and then a switch on to the Dormio wagon. Omba's vote on the Dormio wagon seems like a possible bus, too - it was timed late on to the wagon after Dormio already seemed like a highly possible loss for the scum team, and Omba's case on Dormio was significantly weaker than his case on me. However, it does at least have the saving grace of being the vote to break the tie and make Dormio the more likely lynch, so I'm less interested in lynching Omba in comparision to my other suspect for now.

Sect really needs to explain himself. Like, now. I was passing him off as newb!town on D1 and I still do believe his reluctance to vote is a nulltell coming from him, but that does not change how horrible he looks in light of Dormio's flip. Not only are there instances of Dormio himself buddying up with Sect or otherwiise supporting Sect's actions, but Sect's placement on the wagon of Shadoweh (who now looks quite townie) seems like a definite attempt to help a mislynch wagon take off, and considering that his reasons for voting her were initially vague and reactory, it seems more likely that he was a scum struggling to figure out how to push a townie mislynch than simply a townie targeting the wrong person. Also of note is his reluctance to switch to Dormio and end the day in Dormio's lynch, which is just plain awful. I can't think of anybody else I would want lynched more than him at this point.

##Vote Sect

In other news, Bard has been forgettable this game and I need to look over him again. I'm not sure whether or not that's a good thing. I recall him being on both the Shadoweh and Dan wagons for little reason, so hmm.

...~500 words. Okay, I'm never joining a game with wordcounts ever again. :x I'm too wordy of a person to be able to get around these things. Ah well.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 24, 2011, 07:03:23 PM
...~500 words. Okay, I'm never joining a game with wordcounts ever again. :x I'm too wordy of a person to be able to get around these things. Ah well.

I haven't enforced them yet, but please try to achieve brevity for future posts. <3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 24, 2011, 07:29:41 PM
Just a short post for now.

  • I can't see Kiro as scum at all now either, since if he were scum he probably would have been able to keep the Shadoweh wagon afloat.
&
Quote
Anyway, Omba's D1 was bad. I've already mentioned how much I dislike him chainsawing against the people on the Shadoweh wagon, considering that Shadoweh could have defended herself easily. It truly seems like he was buddying up with somebody he knew to be town for ~sweet cred~.
So, how exactly does this fit together? And why are you brushing over the fact that I did not attack anyone on the Shadoweh wagon, with the exception of you? I pointed that out already in my #228.

Anyway. HW and after Kiro's #303 also HH and Polaris are going to be my main focus for D2. Sect still seems pissed at Dan, like he already was early in D1. Going to view his vote as not more than that for now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 24, 2011, 07:48:53 PM
So, how exactly does this fit together?
I don't see how the bolded things are correlated, unless you're misinterpreting me.

And why are you brushing over the fact that I did not attack anyone on the Shadoweh wagon, with the exception of you? I pointed that out already in my #228.
Dormio was on the Shadoweh wagon.
It seemed like you were exclusively going after people who were going after Shadoweh. But this might just be because if you made cases on people other than me and Dormio they weren't strong enough for me to remember them. <_<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 24, 2011, 08:13:15 PM
I don't see how the bolded things are correlated, unless you're misinterpreting me.
Relation: Shadoweh was at L-2 at the time of my post about her wagon. If you're saying Kiro could have easily kept the wagon going, why would I not have been able to sink it? My vote would have placed it at L-1.
Disregarding the fact that this kind of argument leads pretty much nowhere, in both directions.
Quote
Dormio was on the Shadoweh wagon.
It seemed like you were exclusively going after people who were going after Shadoweh. But this might just be because if you made cases on people other than me and Dormio they weren't strong enough for me to remember them. <_<
Yes, he was. Only, well, the Shadoweh wagon was already long dead when I attacked Dormio.
But yes, both of the people I really attacked yesterday where on the Shadoweh wagon at some point, that much is correct. If you meant that as "attacking on D1", rather than "attacking when she might have been lynched" as I understood it, then your point stands. In this case, what I wrote above (Relation:...) is irrelevant.
The "considering Shadoweh could have defended herself easily" part you had added makes me doubt that, though.

Also, before I forget about it:

##Vote: huh what

My opinion of him has not changed, so until I have time to read up on HH & Polaris and see who looks scummier, I want him dead today. From what I remember, I'll probably still lean towards HW after reading.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 24, 2011, 08:18:47 PM
huh whatty: Try to use a wordcounter first, then edit out lines that aren't needed to get your point across. Not that I know anything about being wordy >.>

So what the freaking hell happened last morning? I hope everyone that wasn't here realizes that at the actual deadline it was impossible for us to swing a Dormio lynch. But it's okay, it's not like Dormio was SCUM or anything. THE ONLY REASON WE GOT A SCUM LYNCH YESTERDAY WAS BY BENDING TIME AND PRAYING TO EDIBLE FOR BENEVOLENCE. We can't let this happen again. If people can't be here in the morning we need to hammer before that becomes a problem.

Sect looks awful after yesterday, and I don't mean as a scum, I mean as a fucking awful player. The ONLY reason I'm still leaning towards 'can't play Mafia' instead of 'scummy as all getout' is I don't see why he would post that fit and refuse to vote to end the bloody Day instead of just pretending he wasn't here. If you're going to vote to kill Mafia and just leave at the beginning of the next day when it's pretty damn obvious people are going to have questions for you then replace out and don't play Mafia again.

I tried reading over Hourai and Dan's argument and I still have no idea what either of them were talking about. You spent the entire Day 1 arguing about arguing about arguing over something that happened in ED1. Hourai's "Sorry bro you kinda scummy" to Dormio followed by more ~*Tunneling*~ was unimpressive.

Bardiche doesn't exist after the first 24 hours of Day 1. He gave Dan some advice on how to play Mafia, Attacked UK but it was just pre~tend~ing. He got onto my wagon well after it was formed, said he would look at my responses to him later, hopped onto Dan after his wagon picked up and poof. Bardykins, I want to hear your melodic voice telling me who you think is scum today so we can keep honeymooning together.

##Vote: Bardiche
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 24, 2011, 08:25:11 PM
Before a HW and Omba standoff becomes more than what it is right now, I would like to give some quick opinions.

To Kiro and Omba about Polaris:  I thought his D1 was bad as well, however, I see no reason for Scum!Polaris to switch his vote at 5-5.  There is a good reason Town!Polaris to switch at 5-5:  The sense that no one was switching from Dormio over to me, so he placed town interests over his own.  Scum!Polaris would not do such a thing. Scum!Polaris would lurk and wait for Dormio's wagon to switch by force.  He would at least wait for someone on my Wagon to switch and put Dormio at L-1, so then he could hammer.  The reason Huh What's hammer is not suspicious in this way is because he was on neither wagon to begin with (although I would have prefered him to wake up earlier and put one of us at L-1 himself)

To HW:  I think your points against Omba are only conspiracy theories at this point, as Omba was speculating on a good many people if I can recall.

I've reread all of Sect, and still think he looks like ObvScum at this point. I will berate him in my next post.  I also think Town should at least concentrate on HH, Bard, and Sect pretty much exclusively at this point, and one of them should definitely be Today's lynch.  And yes, I think both Scum were on wagon at the end of the day.

cut-cut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 24, 2011, 08:27:57 PM
O yeah, ##Vote Sect
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 24, 2011, 09:18:58 PM
So, I haven't read yet, partially expecting to eat a kill. I'm pleased I didn't! I'll state right now, at first blush, I want Sect and HH dead. I'm pretty much going to assume Dan is town unless he starts claiming scum for some reason. I'll be working off of that.

I'm going to read today's proceedings and see who I feel like rereading, if anyone.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 24, 2011, 09:32:41 PM
Sect opens today with a terrible vote for Dan. He was the counter wagon to scum. We nearly missed Dormio's lynch because of the pants on head wagon on Dan. This does not bode well for Sect. His "case" on Dan is, paraphrased
1) Dan is a noob
2) Dan is a noob
3) Dan is a noob
4) Dan is a capt. h alt.

Sorry! I could easily tell you why everyone in this game is scum! You'll have to try harder than that.

No. Full stop.

Quote
It's not a very good thing, though, if when you're playing as scum you look like scum and if you're playing as town you look like town.

So, you're telling me. That it's bad. To look town? When I'm town? Are you on drugs? Can I get some? Because I think I'll need them if I'm going to at all understand the rest of your post.

AH! Thank you for reminding me, Sect! HW needs to hang today! I started a case on him and everything before losing interest! I'll be rereading him to get the choice interactions with Dormio that makes him scum! I have one quote already~

@Dan 300: *headdesk*

You know, I was about ready to accept that logic. Until you had to fucking ASSUME it was true. You ARE aware of how much that makes it look like you intentionally set it up, right? You know, like how I worked with Serela/Schezo last game? Nevermind, erase my conf. town read on Dan. He fucked it up. (To clarify, I still think he's town. But I'm not going to turn a blind eye to him like I initially was)

Also, Kiro was the first to call out to Dormio. Then Shadoweh and I were tag teaming him. I had the second vote on Dormio. Kiro is bleeding so much god damn town his skin is green.

@Zak 301: Oh, hey, guess Sect hangs today after all!

HW's posts...are actually decent today, shit. I *definitely* need to reread him to confirm what I thought I had.




Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 24, 2011, 09:42:51 PM
OK.

This post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613101.html#msg613101) makes me feel leery of HW. It feels like he's coaching Dormio while trying to see if he can manipulate a Dan or Shadoweh lynch out of things. Or really, any lynch that's not on a scum buddy. IIRC Dan was becoming a popular wagon then though.

That said...I don't want to lynch HW first. I want to lynch Sect first. If Sect is scum, HW is his buddy. There's a lot of connection between them that reads really badly, throughout HW's ISO. You do start D2 voting Sect but it's fairly obvious that he's the lynch today given how he was yesterday. I'll do an ISO of him to just in case, but yeah.

So, HW does *not* die today. I can really only see him as scum with Sect.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 24, 2011, 09:59:36 PM
OK. Yes. Sect's ISO continues to confirm that they're pretty tied together. If one is scum, the other almost certainly is.

This post in particular (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612492.html#msg612492) makes me feel like we want to look at associative tells from Sect. He's thinking about them. Recall what K4U said was wrong with my scum game last game. I was accusing people of doing *the exact same things I was*

This post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613870.html#msg613870) is pretty bad in light of the flip.

So, overall underwhelmed with Sect, leaning heavily scum on him. His contributions boil down to protecting HW, hating Dan, and jumping on Shadoweh and UK. And complaining.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 24, 2011, 10:14:41 PM
UK: Sorry about #300, I had like 3 min to say something.  I'm still pressed for time now anyway.  I could have sworn Kiro was the thrid vote after you and shadow.  So yes, Kiro is towniest in my book followed by you UK, because I guessed that your "2nd scum" was in fact Dormio (unless It wasn't? I really wasn't paying much attention to the Dormio case besides the general feeling that he was lurking and not acting like a VT). I mean I still feel I should look like townie mctownerson to everybody, and the Neo.S/Schezo thing was D2 when sacing an ally is far more common.  Anyway I think Sect is tied to Bard more than HW, and I can support that with this quote:

Quote
Dan! Why am I the focal point behind your attack on Bardiche and your defense against HH?

I think Sect tried way too hard to make this question make sense.  And It's weird how he assumes there is a connection between him and Bard when I saw none.. and didn't even attack Bard with Sect in mind at all.  I think, finally, that I might have found a true scumslip.
(The second part of the question is just unfathomable to me,  What did we get into a fight over again?!?!?)

Once More: Sect accuses Polaris and Bard of lurking, but only Polaris is "2nd scum pick"

  I think Sect is using HH as a lifeline to be honest, but to me, if Bard/Sect is not the Scum team, then I'd go for HH first, then HW.  Everyone else is way more town.

cut by UK. OK I see your point.  She even throws dirt on Omba.  However this could be Sect trying to rile up a fight between HW and Omba. a.k.a it feels like too obvious defense of a known town kinda thing.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 24, 2011, 10:17:46 PM
Edit to above post: "known town" as in: Sect knows he is town, so Sect thinks nothing could go wrong by defending him.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 24, 2011, 10:19:55 PM
I'm leaning town, but that doesn't mean you can slack off, Dan. Ideally you shouldn't slack off even as confirmed town, but people do, really. Anyway, actually, my second scum when I was being cryptic was Sect. I only noticed Dormio after he started attacking me with terrible logic. Then I started reading him more strictly and noticing he kind of had a lot wrong with him, eventually leading to me pushing the wagon. Kiro did the work.

As for Sect/HW. I feel HW has been matching Sect's wavelengths in a scummy fashion, and they've both been feeding each other. The associative tells are strong. I'd put Sect as individually scummier though.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 24, 2011, 10:35:50 PM
So you know what's awesome? Noticing you forgot to

##Vote Sect :VVVVVV
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 24, 2011, 10:40:43 PM
Ah, OK gotcha.  I was about to post anyway saying I just caught HW saying I had a definite stance on "Sect, the easy target" in the first post you linked too (the leery one  :)).  In actuallity I had just posted prior that I thought perhaps Sect misunderstood me.  Now it's quite clear that Sect simply and intentionally just tried to act confused.

@Sect: it was not "blatantly" obvious that your first prod was a joke.  I thought it was serious, and it was worded seriously.  You basically led me on without clarifying at all!  Your attack on me D2 boils down to, "you should have known better Dan, now look what you've done."  If you mislynched me D1, no one would have been the wiser, but that wasn't to be.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 24, 2011, 10:44:42 PM
Also, @mod votecount if you are willing?  this is my last post for the day, might be back in 12~ish hours.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 24, 2011, 11:14:03 PM
Also, @mod votecount if you are willing?

NO I REFUSE

Votecount - I Ate All Of My Mentos Last Night :(

Action Dan (1) - Sect
Hanged Hourai (1) - Kiro
Sect (3) - huh what, Action Dan, UncertainKitten
huh what (1) - Omba
Bardiche (1) - Shadoweh

A whole bunch of hours remain.  11 alive takes 6 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 25, 2011, 12:29:35 AM
I've never seen someone that was new and playing horribly actually flip scum yet. As much as I dislike the concept, if Sect isn't going to contribute anyways we have an excellent buffer to lynch someone who isn't going to help town win and he's done enough suspicious things to be a decent choice. Maybe this will be The One! I only ask that people not get caught up in his offensiveness and don't forget there are still 10 other players to look over.

It sure would be nice if the people I named would show up and say something, along with Polaris. Stop hiding and add your voices to the crowd! We want to hear your sekrets @_@
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Polaris on April 25, 2011, 12:41:44 AM
Kiro: At that point I was seeing "only a fraction of the people wants to lynch Dan" as opposed to "pretty much everybody wants to lynch Dormio", and thus had doubts about getting a majority on Dan. Maybe I should've said "a willing majority".

For the record, I'm reluctantly clearing Dan thanks to being the counter to a scum wagon.

UK: Do you mind if I ask what about my points exactly gives you a headache :ohdear: Also, is huhwhat voting Sect relevant at all to their association?

Regarding Sect:
- Hating Dan is understandable, but it shouldn't be detrimental to scumhunting. Your second pick for scum is apparently me, but do you have any reason other than "lurking"? If you think Dan is scum, do you think I could be scumpartners with him?
I don't mind seeing Sect lynched if he's going to let his emotions get the better of him and not do anything for the rest of the game, but I've decided to give him a chance to respond to me and the others.

Regarding Hourai:
- This post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612886.html#msg612886) is weird about how he interacts with Dormio. He apologizes for thinking of Dormio as his second scumpick, and says "I'm not saying your vote is bad" and asks some questions that look like he's trying to help Dormio further his opinions as opposed to criticizing them.
##Vote: Hanged Hourai

Regarding other people:
- Omba is weird because of this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613711.html#msg613711) where he criticizes me for... not attacking him because there's apparently other things that I could've talked about.
- Bard really hasn't done much in this game. His votes were more bandwagoning/pressure votes than "I think this person is scum" votes, which is really lame.

Wanted to put forth an opinion on huhwhat but he's still pretty uninteresting so I'll just post this since Shadoweh is prompting me to instead of delaying it for another few hours.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 25, 2011, 12:49:34 AM
@Shadoweh: You pretty much halved your town read right there.

@Polly: You phrase things confusingly and annoyingly. You also tend to IIoA. HW voting Sect more needs to be explained because on the surface it seems counter to association. And to be honest, it's pretty damaging to the case. I just think the rest of the events stand up to it.

Polly is quickly eroding any sympathy I have for him for the cute "We should lynch Sect anyway" thing. To be honest, the fact that so many people are advocating a Sect policy lynch makes me want to reconsider my suspects.

The post linked from Hourai makes me Hmm a lot. Very Hmm. Particularly coupled with how people are reacting to Sect...


Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 25, 2011, 01:45:06 AM
UK: You pretty much just said it yourself, it's more of a policy lynch then anything. I don't have a good enough gut feeling to fight for the survival of someone who might be scum, especially if he's not going to fight for himself. Townies should never surrender until the end. I'm more worried about suspicious people getting lost in the background because of the pursuit of 'obvious newbscum'.

I'm going to point out something that should be obvious at this point. huh what hammered Dormio at the last minute. If he hadn't showed up and just slept in we would still be talking about how bad Dormio is today. Why are you still considering huh what as a suspect?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 25, 2011, 02:31:54 AM
Because if he hadn't hammered we'd be considering Huh What as a suspect, Shadoweh.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 25, 2011, 05:16:43 AM
Happy Easter! :toot:
O yea, i has Mafias to play. K.

I had a long day, so this is going to be a quick thing making a vote and explaining my vote. More stuff on others in the morning.

##Vote: Bardiche
Bard only mentioned Dormio (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611955.html#msg611955) to ask for an elaboration on observations, with an apparent goal of trying to help him make his make a point stronger, not actually putting pressure on Dormio.

His jump on Dan, putting him into the lead wagon with little explanation is also suspect to me.

And all Dormio had to say about him was that he was inactive, but townie-looking.

I would like content from Bard, like, now plz.

Now please excuse me while I tend to some important business.
ZZZzzzzzz
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 25, 2011, 06:25:58 AM
UK: So we should ignore that HW secured our scum lynch like you've been doing and go after him based on Day 1 content? You brought up a link between him and Dormio without acknowledging this vote happened. At all. What are you suggesting, that he appeared to hammer scum that he didn't have to and we would never have known he was here to do for townie cred he didn't claim? This is an obvious town action with town intent.

Even after acknowledging his posts today look better, you connect him with today's 'obvious lynch' in #314 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615201.html#msg615201) and #315 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615213.html#msg615213),  setting HW up for tomorrow as Sect's buddy if Sect flips scum. I don't believe there's another way to interpret "If Sect = scum then HW = scumbuddy". Your reasoning in #325 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615347.html#msg615347) for wanting to reconsider a Sect lynch at this point is weird. You said yourself in #314 that Sect was 'fairly obviously the lynch today'. Why would multiple people expressing their wishes to lynch him make you change your mind or make them scummy?

You Day 1 isn't much better then HW barring the Dormio lynch. Let's do some ~*POST ANANYSIS*~. #56 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611171.html#msg611171) you defend me from HW, declaring his post the worst thing. You then spend #63, #68 and #73 continuing to defend me and trolling HW. In #95 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611555.html#msg611555) you finally state what your case on HW is, well after he's become a wagon. #118 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611911.html#msg611911) is your first interaction with Dormio, in which you ask opinions, #129 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612067.html#msg612067) showing you don't suspect him yet. In #153 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612453.html#msg612453) you talk to Dormio again after he attacks you (without vote-switching), telling him he's doing it wrong and starting to sound a little scummy. In #171 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612889.html#msg612889) you tell Dormio he's terrible for his hugely terrible post where he says he's willing to vote for you (again without switching), asking him to explain his terrible lack of case. In #193 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613256.html#msg613256) you throw suspicion on Dan, the only notable wagon considering noone was switching to HW. It's not until #196 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613279.html#msg613279), after Dormio's terrifriggingawful post where he switches his vote to you that you switch your vote over to him. By now four different players besides Kiro expressed how Dormio is sailing the Scum Titanic into an iceberg.

I'm proposing a possibility. I think it's possible you as scum would superbus an obvious liability and coast on townie cred. You've cast doubt on The Hammer, The Other Wagon, and the person Dormio started a case on and camped on while attacking you.

##Unvote
##Vote: UncertainKitten
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 25, 2011, 06:26:47 AM
EBWOM: I really hope all those links work for once. :oh dear: If they don't I'm sorreeee
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 25, 2011, 06:28:17 AM
* you've cast doubt on today
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Kiro on April 25, 2011, 07:00:51 AM
Kiro: At that point I was seeing "only a fraction of the people wants to lynch Dan" as opposed to "pretty much everybody wants to lynch Dormio", and thus had doubts about getting a majority on Dan. Maybe I should've said "a willing majority".

Hrm, on the one hand, I could see the clamor at deadline possibly having that kind of an effect. On the other hand, the fact that you weren't willing to stick to your guns on Dan with the votes even and enough people available to switch to Dan, but not the other way around raises the possibility that your switch was a bus. And Dormio's days were numbered. So, the harder the bus, the better. Still, I'd need more before I could press you as my top choice today.

Hourai: Your linked post to Bard was before Dormio's 2nd post, which was the one that really did him in. At that time, I hadn't really thought about Dormio either. You gave Dormio a pass much more than Bard did (or had the opportunity to do since he wasn't around for Dormio's eventual meltdown). With this post, definitely would prefer seeing you lynched before Bard.

Shadoweh: Huh What can still be a suspect the same way Polaris is. And he admits he would have gone Dan over Dormio. That alone puts him at mid level threat to me. Deadline hammer is a duty as a player of the game; it doesn't change how I think about a player. And frankly, he may not have realized that there weren't that many people around for deadline when he posted and was reeled into it. And I'm reading UK's #325 as a change of opinion from her earlier #314 and #315. Other than that, if there's 1 player I know capable of doing the Superbus in this game, it would be UK. Since I didn't mention it, the only people I'm willing to 99% clear are Shadoweh (for being Dormio's first target and his vote adding to a prominent wagon), and Dan (for being the counterwagon). Everyone else is fair game, but UK is definitely low level to me. I'd save bussing candidates for Day 3. Right now, Town focusing on just one of Hourai, Sect, or Bard gives us our best chances in Day 2.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 25, 2011, 07:11:54 AM
Kiro-

My point still stands that all Bard had to say about Dormio was arguably trying to help him make his point better. That was his only interaction with him all game. He said nothing about Dormio after Dormio's second post, if you are correct. I fail to see how I gave him more of a pass than Bard. And Bard maybe not being around for Dormio's meltdown does not give him a pass at all.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Kiro on April 25, 2011, 07:22:01 AM
Kiro-

My point still stands that all Bard had to say about Dormio was arguably trying to help him make his point better. That was his only interaction with him all game. He said nothing about Dormio after Dormio's second post, if you are correct. I fail to see how I gave him more of a pass than Bard. And Bard maybe not being around for Dormio's meltdown does not give him a pass at all.

Well, you both look bad. So my train of thought between the two of you goes from "who's actions are scummier" to "who's actions are more likely to be Townie." And Bard has you beat, by a tiny bit. Only because he wasn't here.

*insert customary phrase where UK wishes she has a vig*
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 25, 2011, 07:23:13 AM
Kiro: That's possible, but I disagree. If I were to directly compare Polaris's actions at deadline to huh what, Polaris switching didn't technically make it possible to lynch Dormio. His wording also made it possible for him to change his mind and go back to Dan at any moment. huh what appearing made the lynch happen. I find it more likely that as scum he would have checked the votecount, read that people were still flip flopping, and just not posted at all.

I think the Easter Weekend is responsible for the low activity. I'm not done looking at other people by any means. Bard still needs to get his sexy self in here and explain himself. Hourai apparently isn't going to be posting more content until tomorrow (or he could cut me >:C). Sect might post again next never. I'd rather question someone whose around then my posts consisting of "Loading, Please Hold".

If UK had a vig she would have already used it in the confirm phase.  :P
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 09:11:45 AM
Still here, catching up and posting. Sorry for the delay. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 09:55:13 AM
I'd really like to vote Dan right now, because his content is still terribad, his points don't hold water and he blatantly ignores any counters to his terrible points. Sadly, I don't think we'd be so lucky to have two scum trains on D1, and for now I am content to assume he just clearly dips in the water of ignorance.

Quote
Unless you think Scum wanted to go into a scum/scum wagon D1, I'm confirmed town right after UK, the first person to Call out Dormio. 

This makes me facepalm of course. :derp: That's not how confirmed town works.

Anyway, opinions in super condensed form. Kiro is scum to me. He finally lets up (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612179.html#msg612179) on his Shadoweh suspicions there but still doesn't move his vote off of her. When he finally does move it off her (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612491.html#msg612491), there is no admission that she is no longer scummy or anything, simply that there are "enough shady people on Shadoweh"; giving Shadoweh a pass based on other people's interactions, Kiro?

Quote
But I felt it was worth making a comment on because we gotta get our wild cards, Hourai and Polaris more involved.

In response to "Why mention Dan's case without giving an opinion?", which honestly feels off: if you think there was little of value to mention there, why raise attention to it? His vote on Dormio (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612965.html#msg612965) seems to be for information moreso than Dormio is scum, as he never actually states he thinks Dormio is scum. Trying to misrepresent my vote as OMGUS is silly, it's plainly obvious I was voting him for never responding to anything that was said no matter how (in)valid it was.

Finally saying he wants Dormio lynched (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613479.html#msg613479) happens only as the wagon gains spec and he can no longer jump off.

Not lending town cred for that. Other scum? Omba looks bad, particularly this (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615123.html#msg615123) which is vote parking and preps to jump to one of the other two targets as necessary. I am at the limit.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 09:55:54 AM
EBWOP:
##VOTE: Kiro :V :derp:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 25, 2011, 10:03:17 AM
Posting so Bardiche can add more if he wants. I'm not awake enough to judge if that's crazy or not, I'll think about it in the morning. My initial reaction can be summed up with a chenwhat.jpg.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 10:19:23 AM
Thanks for ruining it Shadoweh.  :wat:

On Omba, the trouble begins here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611581.html#msg611581) when he votes Huh What for interpreting things in a different way. This is not a reasonable standpoint to take. Nor is the addition (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611752.html#msg611752) that "UK may be scummy", but voting Huh What for thinking it IS scummy.

The last line says HH is top of his "huh?" list, and that he is very interested in HH's response to ActionDan! Surprise, HH does that right before Ombra's next post, but Ombra doesn't even acknowledge it anymore (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612383.html#msg612383). Inquiry to Dormio (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612383.html#msg612383) gives an out in that the parts underlined aren't scummy, but "huh?", which would be a reasonable excuse to hide behind I s'pose.

While Ombra does vote Dormio, he still tries to get Dan lynched instead (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613880.html#msg613880), which doesn't earn him favours. Yes, he does switch back rather swiftly, but I don't think the move to Dan is town-intended.

There you go. Willing to swap to Ombra if people aren't keen on lynching Kiro, not willing to lynch UK.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 10:22:35 AM
Ombra ignoring HH's post is scummy because it means the entire song and dance about HH being top of his huh list turned out to be meaningless fluff and filler opinion without being of any consequence. Holding an opinion is nice, but you gotta produce that opinion more than just stating it.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 25, 2011, 12:57:19 PM
Yay, someone finally found his balls.
Nice going Bard, but you should have started that D1. Doing it now pretty much guarantees your lynch on D3. Well, if you want to help town even though you're scum, that's fine by me. :V
Next time, you should bring up more points that weren't already brought up by someone else / can't be answered by simply looking at the time the respective posts were made, though.
And no, I'm not going to say why you're suddenly scum to me even though I had nothing on you before. Not before D3, that is. Look forward to it. <3

Going to /re-read walls of text later. More stuff in I guess 6-8 hours; I'd rather lynch someone today that isn't Bard, after all.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 01:19:16 PM
Bard why don't you ask those "counters" again to my terrible points.  Please spell it all out for me.

O yeah, can you mention Sect too, you kind of ignored him.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 25, 2011, 01:34:52 PM
Correction: I'll explain the thing about Bard shortly before we end D2, assuming he doesn't fuck up more and get lynched today already.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 02:44:32 PM
Nice going Bard, but you should have started that D1. Doing it now pretty much guarantees your lynch on D3. Well, if you want to help town even though you're scum, that's fine by me. :V

I wasn't aware we were in a role madness game. :V Elucidate how a lynch on either Kiro or you would make me definite scum?

Quote
Next time, you should bring up more points that weren't already brought up by someone else / can't be answered by simply looking at the time the respective posts were made, though.

What part can be answered by looking at the time the respective votes were made?

Quote
And no, I'm not going to say why you're suddenly scum to me even though I had nothing on you before. Not before D3, that is. Look forward to it. <3

You don't suffer scum to live, so outline why I'm scum then. Right now it simply reads as OMGUS.

Bard why don't you ask those "counters" again to my terrible points.  Please spell it all out for me.

O yeah, can you mention Sect too, you kind of ignored him.

Look back on posts, and if I haven't mentioned it it's because it's not interesting to me.  :derp: I'm not doing your Mafier game for you, so look it up yourself.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 02:46:06 PM
Bard, just read your case on Kiro... and I don't like one bit of it.  lets start with this:
Anyway, opinions in super condensed form. Kiro is scum to me. He finally lets up (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612179.html#msg612179) on his Shadoweh suspicions there but still doesn't move his vote off of her. When he finally does move it off her (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612491.html#msg612491), there is no admission that she is no longer scummy or anything, simply that there are "enough shady people on Shadoweh"; giving Shadoweh a pass based on other people's interactions, Kiro?
Kiro pretty much answers your question in a later post, when he references my reasoning for giving shadow a pass. It's even in one of the posts you hyperlinked.  This is not an arguement I'd use against Kiro, because as it turns out, Kiro was right. Next:
In response to "Why mention Dan's case without giving an opinion?", which honestly feels off: if you think there was little of value to mention there, why raise attention to it? His vote on Dormio (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612965.html#msg612965) seems to be for information moreso than Dormio is scum, as he never actually states he thinks Dormio is scum. Trying to misrepresent my vote as OMGUS is silly, it's plainly obvious I was voting him for never responding to anything that was said no matter how (in)valid it was.

Finally saying he wants Dormio lynched (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613479.html#msg613479) happens only as the wagon gains spec and he can no longer jump off.

Not lending town cred for that.
Bard, that was a prod for you to get talking, she didn't raise anyone's attention except yours: working as intended. You say Kiro's vote on Dormio didn't include a Scum accusation. Did your vote on me include one? yet at the end of day your vote was still on me, or was it "Obvious" (Btw I freaking hate that word by this point).  Kiro could have anytime before the Dormio vote or after, jumped on me
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 02:49:35 PM
I wasn't aware Kiro is ActionDan now. :derp:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 02:52:45 PM
Quote
Look back on posts, and if I haven't mentioned it it's because it's not interesting to me.   I'm not doing your Mafier game for you, so look it up yourself.

You serious? You use these so called "counters" to DISMISS MY ENTIRE CASE ON YOU.  THEN, you use them to place a vote on me that lasts up to the end of the day. They are ALL you've got, and now they are not interesting????? No you look them up, I'm not the one trying to defend myself.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 02:55:59 PM
I wasn't aware Kiro is ActionDan now. :derp:

Yo Bard, If your so concerned about me giving an opinion on your case against Kiro, why were you so upset that Kiro didn't give enough of an opinion on my case against you?  :derp:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 02:57:55 PM
Btw in case anyone is wondering, I think both Sect and Bard are ObvScum at this point.  Bard hasn't even mentioned Sect. That's how obvious it is.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 03:02:52 PM
I mean that Sect isn't interesting to me. Well gee, he said he'd rather get ActionDan gone. Given you're obnoxious, I can relate to that sentiment, even if his wording is rather poor. I just doubt it's scum-motivated and it is too easy a train to hop on.

The misrepresentations rain on. Sigh.

Quote
Bard, that was a prod for you to get talking, she didn't raise anyone's attention except yours

Quote
Bard: I didn't want to answer for you before you posted which is why I danced around my opinion. But I felt it was worth making a comment on because we gotta get our wild cards, Hourai and Polaris more involved.

But I felt it was worth making a comment on because we gotta get our wild cards, Hourai and Polaris more involved.

It's because you're trying to answer for Kiro but you're doing it wrong. Besides, you don't defend people in a Mafia game unless you're scum or masons together. And we don't have masons.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 25, 2011, 03:28:42 PM
I wasn't aware we were in a role madness game. :V Elucidate how a lynch on either Kiro or you would make me definite scum?
Me neither. :V
I said you'll have to wait for the explanation. Also, it might have been better to word that differently.

Quote
What part can be answered by looking at the time the respective votes were made?
The part where I don't say anything about HH in a post that focuses on the Shadoweh wagon at L-2 or the two posts when we were already down to two wagons that were not HH, and the part where I vote Dan a few minutes before deadline. Notice how the only player on the Dan wagon that had posted around that time and was not Dormio was Sect? For some reason, what he wrote did not make me think he'd vote Dan. So unless you assume I'm psychic and already knew Polaris and HW would come online or already assume I'm scum before you make that argument, that does not make the vote anti-town. There's this Rocks Fall and Everybody Dies thing.
Well, if you want to assume I deliberately timed my posts so I did not have to say anything about HH, then I'll give you that. That does indeed look scummy.

Quote
You don't suffer scum to live, so outline why I'm scum then. Right now it simply reads as OMGUS.
Oh, I do want you to live until D3, even though you're scum. For the simple reason that I want the harder part out of the way first, which is finding the third scum.
And I'm aware it does read as OMGUS. If I thought saying what I said would get you lynched today, I'd have kept my mouth shut until near the end of the day.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Sect on April 25, 2011, 03:35:38 PM
Well, that break made me feel better.

Dan 300: A post by UK after a single post does not make you town, especially when you used the rest of the game to rip that cred to shreds. And Polaris switched wagons because he didn't want the game to end: in fact, he said that you were his top pick yesterday. But yeah, he's been lurking all game, and Saturday morning was the most active he's been all this time.

Zakeri 301: No townie or scum would ever say it: someone who's frustrated with the game would. About as simple as that, really. Other than that, no excuses, and I don't regret saying it, even if Dormio did end up flipping scum.

UK 313: ... Did I write that?

... Shit, I did. :headdesk: I had meant to type "playing as town you look like scum". Dammit, count on me to fuck up my own points.

Polaris 324: Lurking, pretty much: I was going to say something more about "reiterating points people have already made" but really, at that point there were no more points to be made. As for being scumbuddies... not really. You were one of the earlier attackers on Action, even though you never really posted enough to pressure him, and your switch seems more like "gotta lynch someone" instead of "gotta prevent Dan's lynch". You being more active helps. I'm backing off of you for now.

Also, I don't have any problem with you wanting to push a policy lynch on me, but I didn't say I was going to be gone for the rest of the game, I said the rest of the day. As in 24 hours.

Shadoweh 329: ... Well, I guess that's one way of getting off her coattails...

And then Bardiche/Kiro stuff happens, and I have to get something out to let people know that I'm actually still playing, because both Polaris and Shadoweh have recieved the wrong impression, which in retrospect I can see.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 25, 2011, 03:38:40 PM
@Shadoweh: There are a couple problems with that. One, if he was seen *anywhere* by an MotKer at that time, he'd have to show up here to check in. I don't know if he frequents any IRC channels or if he was posting on here at the time, but it's not as clear cut as "we'd never need to know he was here". Secondly, I only see him as scum with Sect. If Sect ISN'T scum (as I'm beginning to suspect), HW isn't scum either.

Now, why would people's wishes to lynch Sect change my mind?

Because they don't want to lynch him for being scum.

It's reading a lot like he's a scapegoat. A shill. Hell, you yourself even *brought up* we "had the tempo" to take a mislynch. THAT IS NOT A TOWN THOUGHT PROCESS!

Interesting this all comes out, Shadoweh, after you burn through half your town cred. I may need to take a closer look at you. Also, problems with your post. While four other people were expressing suspicion of Dormio, I was the second person to vote him. So are you telling me that those four other people are just as "scummy" as I am for questioning Dormio before voting? Answer carefully, dear~

...
...
What a fucking trainwreck on page 12. I'll be rereading Bard then I guess. And Omba. Shadoweh, forgetting about you for now. I don't care enough anymore.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 25, 2011, 03:46:55 PM
Votecount - ALL ABOOOOOOOOOARDHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Action Dan (1) - Sect
Hanged Hourai (2) - Kiro, Polaris
Sect (3) - huh what, Action Dan, UncertainKitten
huh what (1) - Omba
Bardiche (1) - Hanged Hourai
UncertainKitten (1) - Shadoweh
Kiro (1) - Bardiche

48-ish hours remain, give or take a couple hours.  11 alive takes 6 to lynch.

Since multiple players have asked for clarification on a few rules.

1) After a hammer but before I post a flip, it's considered twilight.  Twilight rules are, in this game, the same as night rules - you may post whatever you like as long as it isn't game analysis or provides information about the game.

2) Rocks Fall Everyone Dies is pretty straightforward.  If a majority lynch isn't reached by the end of the day, the cliffs towering above Arpeggington will collapse, killing everyone.  In short, the game will end and everyone will lose.  tl;dr: A majority lynch is a requirement.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 25, 2011, 03:48:29 PM
Actually, I worked it out.

Omba, if you are the cop, just fucking claim it now. You've made it manifestly obvious you have a guilty on Bardiche. Confirm this.
If you are not the cop, you might as well claim that too and post a case on Bard. You're giving off obvious cop tells.

Here's why I'm just asking this outright rather than pretending I can't tell. We had a scum lynch D1. We had a missed kill N1. If we lynch scum today, we'll essentially have traded the cop for two scum. THIS IS A GOOD TRADE

Even *one* scum lynch can be worth the cop in normal circumstances. I pretty much see no reason for Omba NOT to clear up the situation now.

And to add to this, IF OMBA IS NOT THE COP, BUT THE REAL COP HAS A SCUM RESULT. CLAIM IT NOW

If you have a town result, don't claim. In fact, I'd go as far as saying Omba should not claim cop if he is the cop but has a town result on someone, and is just pursuing Bard for other reasons.

@Shadoweh: Re; Edible Cut: And there goes any argument you could make for town HW. I forgot about that rule, but I remember it was being mentioned a LOT. It's entirely possible HW asked for clarification before realizing he HAD to hammer.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 03:49:44 PM
Ok, you got me.  I was reading fast and was in disbelief.  Still, the Sect misrep is small, since even if you did mention him, all you said was that he was uninteresting.  You didn't say why he was uninteresting until just now, unless your gonna tell me that was "obvious".

The Kiro misrep is more important, so I'm sorry about that.  I'm assuming Kiro wanted to hear Polaris/Hourai opinions on my case considering they were attacking me.  I'll let Kiro answer that one along with your case.  However, I'm not defending Kiro in the way you think.  I am strictly attacking you for attacking Kiro by saying your case is flawed.

I rage at you bard, for things like "I'd like to vote Dan for terribad points that I've countered, but sadly I must clear him." and things like "I wasn't aware Kiro was ActionDan now  :derp:"  They are dismissive. It's true I was dismissive of Hourai, but I have at least posted why.  All you like to say is "If you defend someone, you are masons or scumbuddies". 

Next post I'll show you "your counters" and answer them since you seemingly don't feel you have any reponsibility for them.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 03:51:49 PM
EBWOP: holy **** was I cut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Sect on April 25, 2011, 04:22:56 PM
Two things at UK: First, I looked back to see what you were talking about with me and HW being on the same wavelength, and pages 2 and 3 kind of startled me. I can tell you that that's actually coincidence, or at least it is on my part.

Second, I don't know if anything will come out of it, but that call for a cop claim's pretty damned good for establishing your town rep in my books: even if nothing comes out of it, it's advice that whoever's playing cop should really pay attention to.

Still evaluating the other things going on.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 25, 2011, 04:29:17 PM
Omba, if you are the cop, just fucking claim it now. You've made it manifestly obvious you have a guilty on Bardiche. Confirm this.
If you are not the cop, you might as well claim that too and post a case on Bard. You're giving off obvious cop tells.

Here's why I'm just asking this outright rather than pretending I can't tell. We had a scum lynch D1. We had a missed kill N1. If we lynch scum today, we'll essentially have traded the cop for two scum. THIS IS A GOOD TRADE
I'm not the cop, but my case on Bard still rests on me claiming.
Hi, I'm the Town Doc. Last night, I protected Kiro. Today, Bard comes barging in with his first longer :content: post and completely dedicates it to attacking Kiro and me. Attacking Kiro directly after nightkilling him failed is fairly obvious and I assume he's attacking me because he guessed I'm the Town Doc. Well, my reference to Kiro in #306 was a little obvious, now that I look at it.
Meh, shit. I had planned to give the other scum an easy chance to go after me and fuck himself up that way. Guess I should just have waited instead.
That said,

##Unvote
##Vote: Bardiche
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 25, 2011, 04:38:40 PM
/me face palms.

Omba. You should not have claimed that. At ALL!

It's no where near certainty. That said, I notice Bard is playing cutely by ignoring all the popular wagons and going for unpopular ones for town cred.

Ugh, I guess I have to reread Bard after all.

But seriously? Future games: Don't EVER claim doctor with that reasoning.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 05:06:00 PM
/me facepalms, too.

Ri-iiiight. That just clears Kiro, it doesn't condemn me - you're basing yourself on WIFOM there. It's like I'm playing DtB mafia again with some derper going all "OMG BARD FUKD UP" but never realising the logic doesn't hold water. A post-game discussion on what is and is not a proper time to claim is in order.

Just to be clear on this: your entire attack bases itself on "a scumBard would do this!", which we call "WIFOM", and it is one of the seriously weakest things ever. That you further postulate I have massive powers of deduction that can tell Town Doc at a glance is further laughable: I had no inkling you had a role until you elegantly revealed that in your attack on me.

I think a mentor for Ombra would have been in order. There's a good time to claim Doc and use it to help town saunter to a good future. Now is not that time.

I think Polaris is surprisingly erudite even if he focused solely on Dan as being the sole contender of scum on D1, with the rest being three kinds of neutral.

Need to pore over the rest's posts again to orient myself. I already know I won't support lynches on Kiro (any longer), Ombra and Dan, although the latter two rather reluctantly because I think they're obnoxious and terribad at the game. That's never been good reasons for lynches, though, so I'll have to begrudgingly content myself with voting someone truly scummy.

##Unvote

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 05:35:40 PM
@anyone who cares, does anyone know a good easy way to hyperlink specific posts with the hyperlink option? One example from anyone explaining how they hyperlinked a specific post would suffice, Thanks!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 25, 2011, 05:38:42 PM
Like this? (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615898.html#msg615898)

You see above that post where it says "Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)"? That's clickable. It takes you to a DIRECT hyperlink to that post. Copy the url from your address part, and paste it. If you want to do what I did up there, use the code:

Code: [Select]
[url=*link*]Smartass comment[/url]
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 05:43:30 PM
Awesome! thank you
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 25, 2011, 05:55:21 PM
I actually believe Omba's claim due to the circumstances. He's irritating but I'm willing to give him a pass for now barring a counterclaim.

So hey, Sect still needs to die. His beginning of the day case boiled down to "Dan is a bad player and should be lynched", which isn't lynching actual scum and supports the notion that he's looking for ways to vote townies, and it bugs me that people are considering the Sect case for the same reasons when he actually has been genuinely scummy. His recent posts have not changed my opinions at all.

Shadoweh's case on UK boils down to a conspiracy theory. <___< I know UK can defend herself, but... why would you lynch her today over somebody who was actually off the Dormio wagon? That makes no sense. In fact, the trend of turning everybody's scumhunting towards people who could have been bussing is a little irritating. I'm not saying we shouldn't be looking at them, it's just that I honestly don't think they're optimal lynches when we have scum like Sect in plain sight. Because of this, I'm rather suspect of Bard, who seems to only be attacking people who were caught on the scum wagon, and I honestly can't see much stock in his Kiro case either. Considering how Bard was one of the main people on the Dan wagon during late D1 even though his reasoning for getting on seemed to revolve heavily around Dan simply being a derp, I'd be willing to lynch him if the Sect wagon doesn't get enough support.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 06:58:07 PM
As promised I'll answer Bard's counters.

In response to my case (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611989.html#msg611989) against Bard, Bard posts what I assume are his "counters" (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612065.html#msg612065).
Quote
I am more hesitant NOW to give UK a pass BASED ON. This is a reference to the last game where I excused UK's behaviour as townie based on that she usually acts that way: voting someone without making it immediately clear what her vote reasons are.
This is a reference from Bard's post #71 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611274.html#msg611274) which was made while Bard's vote was still on UK.  The above quote suggests that Bard had given UK a pass previously in other games AS WELL AS in this game up until this point in time; still your vote was on her for the entire beginning of the game, which means up till post #71 you had no reason to change it.  In fact, in post #71 Bard ramps it up, demanding to know UK's case on HW, parroting what has already been asked by HW.  After UK gives a case on HW, Bard unvotes her (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611955.html#msg611955) because he was never serious....he just wanted dicussion (yet everyone has plopped down a serious vote by now and his last post suggested he was serious). the rest doesn't say much else except that I'm a null-tell, and prods Dormio about kiro.

Mudslinging = voting UK originally for shoddy reasons, I already stated my feeling on this.

Tunneling: as far as I am concerned the person he has "focused on most" was UK until now.  Also dividing attention = defending against me, and one poke on HW, a.k.a fence sitting.  To try and fix that he declares me a misguided town to try and dismiss me, while plopping on a late vote for shadow, someone he hadn't even paid any "attention" to.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 07:06:24 PM
Actually the reason he voted Shadow is given as  It feels like you're attempting to force town to focus on either HW or UK today, which is shoddy!

 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612065.html#msg612065)
yet in the same post he asks two things:

Of Shadow: "Please restate your case for Huh What, ignoring that he voted UK."
Of Sect: "Sect! Elucidate why between HW and UK, UK is the scummier one as per this post."

The questions themselves don't bother me, it's the reason Bard voted shadow that does.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 25, 2011, 07:17:37 PM
But seriously? Future games: Don't EVER claim doctor with that reasoning.
This can probably wait until post-game; but yes, I fucked something up there.

Just to be clear on this: your entire attack bases itself on "a scumBard would do this!", which we call "WIFOM", and it is one of the seriously weakest things ever.
No, actually the starting point for the argument is that I assume you've got brains. Otherwise, yes, I'd end up with WIFOM and would not have said anything.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 07:58:24 PM
Ombra, your entire "omg u must haf brains" assumes scum'd be so goddamn retarded it's not even funny. No, there is no wisdom in scum trying to lynch Kiro: scum typically attack what they think is the towniest person in the game, and that person is usually most difficult to lynch. If scum decided Kiro was that person, why in the hell would a scumBard attempt to even try and lynch that person? Your scenario assumes scum is goddamn retarded. You're still left with a shaky WIFOM reasoning that you blew your claim on.

Then ActionDan:
Quote
The above quote suggests that Bard had given UK a pass previously in other games AS WELL AS in this game up until this point in time

Full post for reference (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611274.html#msg611274), you're stating the obvious. I excused behaviour I'd otherwise find scummy, but also wanted her to stray from her meta and explain her eD1 vote after claiming she could. Maintaining my vote on her would lend incentive to answer that question (not that she did), but I simply could not see a scum!UK busting in so aggressively from the get go.

Quote
Mudslinging = voting UK originally for shoddy reasons

It's the first post I made and it's at the top of page 2. How many people need to tell you that reasoning is awful before you'll be prepared to believe it?

There are good reasons to accuse me of scum. Sadly, neither Ombra nor ActionDan produce these reasons. I can think of a few myself, why are you two failing at it so hard?

--

As far as scum goes, ##Vote: Hanged Hourai. Please elucidate the reasoning stated herein (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615545.html#msg615545) for voting me, as it doesn't drive left nor right. Your attack on me is "Bard didn't mention Dormio much", "Dormio didn't mention Bard much", "Bard voted ActionDan which put him in the lead". Remember what train you were on at the time (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612913.html#msg612913), and how rooted you were (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613271.html#msg613271) in supporting that case.

My reasons for voting ActionDan was "respond to counters", which he only does just up above. I am perfectly fine with lynching someone if they push a mediocre case but refuse to explain why it isn't mediocre in light of rebuttals to raised points.

In short, I am scum (according to you) because I never mentioned Dormio much, and then because Dormio didn't mention me much and because I voted ActionDan for ignoring the case he was sitting on. Given it's become D2, I think you can do better than that on me.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 25, 2011, 08:02:00 PM
And yeah, I don't care if that's a textbook OMGUS. Other than being the first on Dan and continuously prodding Dormio to elaborate on content, HH hasn't done anything on D1, so I'm content with it.

Also, I forget I actually made a post before I voted UK, but it's a jokevote so I'm going to pretend it never happened. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 08:52:16 PM
Quote
There are good reasons to accuse me of scum. Sadly, neither Ombra nor ActionDan produce these reasons. I can think of a few myself, why are you two failing at it so hard?

Care to tell us?  :3  I'm curious why you are resorting to WIFOM (I think of a few = I admit it, so I'm not scum!). Also, bard, your "counters" only countered parts of my case against you. 

My most important arguements were in my case were:
A) why you were so insistant to attack UK's meta, defending your attack as serious intended to explore something  "interesting" (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611270.html#msg611270) when
1) there was more on the table (a.k.a "Dan is town") and
2) UK flatly said she wouldn't do that. She was prodded twice, why prod her again on the same thing. Are you really adding anything to the discussion, besides throwing a vote down?
B)fence sitting on Shadow, HW, and HH

Also why the weak vote on Shadow later?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 25, 2011, 09:19:27 PM
Alllllllllllllllrighty then. Mafia calls. Too much time marathoning homestuck, orz

Formost and first,
##Unvote
I wanted more content and to know where you stand, which was a purpose of my vote. The content of D1 was a little lacking in my opinion, so you're recent stuff makes you better in that area. Associations with Dormio were something I was just suspicious of and a supporting reason for my vote, though your latest post just handwaves it a bit.

Polaris-
Your case on me is my courteousness (and yes, that's exactly what it is) and picking him out as my second scumpick while he only had one vote on him on D1. He was nowhere near becoming a wagon, and he was the second person I said I wanted dead.
I was not trying to further his opinions, I wanted him to explain them more because I did not agree with them.

And if you want to base a case off Dormio's interactions with people, let's look at you. Your first post metioning him says he's "lackluster," but you see no need to press him on anything or ask any questions.

In your next post, you say you did not pressure because there was nothing to pressure, but you wanted to ask for more opinions from him, which you did not do because you said it would make you look like a hypocrite. So basically, no pressure because you did not want to look bad, and you also ended up having him not do anything.

And then it was only when Dormio became a wagon with 3 votes that you say he was your second scumpick. Note: before this, you only said one other person was scummy.

##Vote: Polaris
Not an OMGUS.
Your associations with Dormio are way worse than mine.

I'm going to get this out here since I'm approaching the limit. Other peoples to come laters.


Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 09:21:31 PM
Quote
My reasons for voting ActionDan was "respond to counters", which he only does just up above. I am perfectly fine with lynching someone if they push a mediocre case but refuse to explain why it isn't mediocre in light of rebuttals to raised points.


Then why aren't you voting Sect now?  Sect was countered on like every point, especially on me, but refuses to continue to justify her vote.  Instead Sect waffles on Polaris, "backing off of him".  So Sect while convienently parking an audacious vote on me, who's next now?

Since HH and Bard are attacking each other (in Bard's case incredibly belatedly, since after Sect, HH is the obvious choice, the fact that Bard didn't even look at HH until now is just plain bad), the likelihood that Sect is a scumbuddy increases in my eyes.

What happened to NeoSerela again?? /joke
-cut by HH reading
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: WHMZakeri on April 25, 2011, 10:05:54 PM
Sect: I know you made that post in frustration. But I can't in good conscious let that go. You stated that having a member of the mafia being lynched is just as bad as if you lost. This suggests that you knew Dormio is on your team. This suggests that you believe you will lose if Dormio is lynched. This suggests that you knew Dormio's alignment in the first place.

I could overlook this, but paired with your insistence to watch over the competing wagon from yesterday,  I can't see any town intent to counteract what scum intent I see in your posts. The first 150 Posts you and Dormio both consider Shadoweh top voting priority (You even went as far as using her vote against you as a major point of your own personal case). In post 158 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612492.html#msg612492), you claim that Shadoweh, UK, and Huhwhat were your top three suspects, and then went on a sudden tirade against Action Dan.

The more I look at the ActionDan Wagon, the worse I feel about it. I don't understand where Bardiche's case on him comes from (And I wasn't a fan of his Kiro case, even before Omba's claim).  Polaris's claim in Post 182 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613092.html#msg613092) that Dan is "disconnected from the game in that he responds to people making cases on him." Sounds like mudslinging, considering it came at the time where people agreed to make random, half-asses Cases against Dan that he had to respond to. Sect is still the worst offender, but it's bothersome to consider that there may be more scum in this game than there are Mafiosi.

Sarcasm Warning - Ahead: I completely understand UK's reservations against the Sect wagon, what with a third of the people wanting to vote him. I mean after all, you have to be very careful of those tricky informed Majorities.
Seriously? We have eleven people left, only two of which are Mafia. If Sect is one mafia, then that leaves only one non-sect Mafia left. This means that at most, you will have only one non-sect person that would advocate not lynching Sect in the event that he looks like scum. That's not even considering the fact that since Sect is so bad, the other mafioso wouldn't want to do anything to further link themselves to him. I see no reason to let up just because there's no opposing voice from the faceless crowds.

##Vote: Sect
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 25, 2011, 10:11:32 PM
@Zak: That's actually a very salient point. I'm not as reserved on Sect now. I'm...kind of not used to scum being dead by D2 :V.

I'm still voting him, I believe, though. I didn't unvote since I wasn't fully convinced that cleared him, and you've shown me why.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 25, 2011, 11:39:32 PM
Well... I just read Kiro ad Dormio's Day 1 posts.

So.. There is a strong link between Sect and Dormio (in case this wasn't obvious before the hammer).

Basically if you read all of Dormio's posts, the only real reason that Dormio votes Shadow is for "buddying" up to Sect.  Then after Shadow votes Sect, Dormio continues to push Shadow for voting Sect and then unvoting Sect later. It reads all funny.  I got the impression that Dormio only let up because he wasn't sure how much more he could mention Sect's name and get away with it XD.

I found myself asking why the scum team would want Kiro gone.  It's true he looks town for pushing the Dormio wagon, but Kiro D1 has interesting things to say.  Kiro voted Shadow for implying that UK vs HW was scum fighting town.  Bard later picks up the exact same reasoning to vote Shadow for "tunneling." However, Kiro later clears Shadow.  Besides me, Kiro is the only other person besides me to ever question Bard (read: raise eyebrows).   

Kiro also felt like one of the only people to defend HW.  (Dormio was waffley).  It feels like Bard/Sect scum team had more to gain by a Kiro kill.

ANYWAY I encourage everyone to read over only Dormio and Kiro D1.  It really is a good read!  I think bard's reasoning behind voting Kiro recently (before he was confirmed town) looks really bad in view of this.

Still voting Sect though. I'd link to all the posts, but I'm lazy Zzz. 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 25, 2011, 11:44:05 PM
... Orrrrr scum just wanted Kiro gone because everybody was passing him off as obvtown on D1. <___< Really now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 25, 2011, 11:49:15 PM
Your Votecount is not in another castle; in fact, it is right here

Action Dan (1) - Sect
Hanged Hourai (3) - Kiro, Polaris, Bardiche
Sect (4) - huh what, Action Dan, UncertainKitten, Zakeri
Bardiche (1) - Omba
UncertainKitten (1) - Shadoweh
Polaris (1) - Hanged Hourai

Sect is at L-2!

~41 hours remain.  11 alive takes 6 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 25, 2011, 11:59:48 PM
Words. ;-;

I thought Bard's case on Kiro was making fun of my case on UK. To answer HW and UK, UK's one line answer felt like she was stonewalling me. It was the same feeling I got last game so I took the time to read her now instead of after dying. I don't think it's a waste of time to point out someone who should be considered suspicious when they're getting clears, or to point out a town action being disregarded . Zak also summed up why her sudden reservations against lynching Sect made me suspicious. I admit my suspicions are lessened on UK and my clear void on huh what after Edible's clarification, but the rule on it's own wasn't clear. I thought it meant he would kill/lynch a random player, not end the game.

Alot of people are making cases based on Sect being a scumbuddy already. I don't think this is going to stop until either we get the part where we lynch Sect out of the way or the cop checks him and claims. Or, you know, everyone keeps their cases only involving the scum that's actually flipped. I personally don't want the cop to claim when there's still a scum out there on Day 2. Until the actual flip cases should not discount the chance of Sect being PX's alt.
That being said I've decided his insane war against a pretty damn obvtown player he doesn't like could have a really simple answer. Scum have an easier time justifying voting people they don't like playing with then making up towniness/scumminess excuses.

Zak: Can you explain why Scum Sect would say anything at all when he declared his undying love for Dormio, instead of staying quiet if he wasn't going to switch wagons? It's pretty much the only part of their love affair I don't understand from the perspective of him being scum.

Bard: Your Kiro case, now that I'm looking at it seriously, seems like it's coming from outer space. I could make a crazy theory for why you would attack Kiro but I think it's more likely it was an accident and the Omba trainwreck happened on it's own. I'm getting the same feelings from you today that made me pronounce my own undying support for our eternal pairing and will not try to murder you on Day 2 for once.

Will work for words.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 12:03:27 AM
@Shadoweh: Except much of the discussion acted as if the game was ending if there wasn't a lynch. If HW were quickly browsing to see what he can get away with, that would stick out. Not to mention he could have potentially asked in a scum QT.

So, why are you still voting me again?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 12:09:42 AM
Quote
... Orrrrr scum just wanted Kiro gone because everybody was passing him off as obvtown on D1. <___< Really now.
Bard says Neigh!  ;) But if scum really wanted to lynch ObvTown, they could have gone for me. Btw It kind of makes me feel weird that Sect had an entire case last night devoted to me, prepared, when I could have potentially been the NK. hmmm.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 12:12:26 AM
@Dan: There was no way in hell you were getting NK'd. While you come out townier for the dual wagons, first, you aren't confirmed town. second, you aren't really that good and effective. This might be breaking news to you, but sometimes, OCCASIONALLY, scum leave "confirmed townies" alive because they aren't a threat to the scum team at all

I'll be honest, if I were scum, I'd have killed Kiro. If I were the doctor, I'd have protected Kiro. I more or less guessed that Kiro or myself were the NK options after D1. You weren't even a consideration in my calculations of what to expect when day broke.

Please. Try to make at least *one case* that assumes you aren't confirmed town, or at all a threat to scum. Try to make a case like that.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 12:22:33 AM
UK: Because I needed more words for an actual case <3 I'm even writing it right now.

I just wanted to add a point for bluntness to Dan. If you were as townie as you think you are you would never have been a wagon in the first place. Think about that.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 12:28:06 AM
Warning! PR speculation Incoming!.  To be honest, I thought Kiro was the detective. Omba was my 3rd choice for a PR. don't worry not saying who my 2nd is ;).  Ya I kind of figured my arguements are just getting overlooked/dismissed, which I'm quite sad about.  I still think objectively that I should be 1st or 2nd on the town scale.  But realistically I thought I wouldn't be targeted.. sigh.. :( 

At this point I can arrange the town to scum scale:

cut--  :(  :(  :(

Should I even bother with this list? Eh. whatever:

Kiro
Omba
me
UK
Shadow
Polaris
HW
HH
Bard
Sect
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 12:30:18 AM
Actually Shadow, I meant after Dormio's flip, Day 1 wagon is just people attacking a "derp"
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 12:30:28 AM
@Dan: ...

*HEAD
MOTHERFUCKING
DESK*

WHY. WOULD. YOU. EVEN. FUCKING. SAY. THAT!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Sect on April 26, 2011, 12:31:56 AM
... Oh for the love of god some one lynch me now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 12:33:43 AM
Dan is obviously the actual cop trolling us all.

Seriously though, can you cut it with the PR speculation? <_< It comes off like you're scum trying to communicate with your buddies.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 12:36:09 AM
I have this spore spot on my forehead right now. This case might be delayed due to lack of brain function.

Dan: This kind of stuff is why even after Dormio's flip people aren't considering you confirmed town.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 12:40:05 AM
Quote
buddies.

I don't mean to nitpick here (well actually I do).  But this implies there are 2 two scum other than me.....
You if you were assuming I was a scum you might have instead said buddy.  Just sayin'
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 12:41:20 AM
That was a slip because I'm scum and actually have two remaining buddies instead of just one. Edible lied about the set-up in the first post because he's a bastard mod.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 12:45:13 AM
Okay, on second thought, I'm going to stop trolling.

Dan, please think of the implications before you post things. I could have sworn somebody already explained this, but mentioning who you think the PRs are is BAD because it helps scum decide who to nightkill. Your wording nitpick about me makes absolutely no sense and does not imply anything about my alignment whatsoever because none of the remaining scum can have more than one buddy regardless. It's meaningless and I have no idea why you felt the need to point it out, unless you wanted to waste our time.

While I'm here, I think I'm going to re-read Hourai. More on that in a bit.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 12:55:34 AM
I'm just saying the sentence kind of reads better like this:
Quote
It comes off like you're scum trying to communicate with your buddy.
instead of
Quote
It comes off like you're scum trying to communicate with your buddies.
You might think it's lame but to me it's like a possible slip (buddies = you + other scum, instead of, buddy = other scum)
Honestly I thought the PR thing was lame too.. but that doesn't stop everyone telling me its bad to even mention PR.
I didn't get mad over it cuz UK and shadow have a point.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 01:03:05 AM
Yeah, okay, I didn't really get much out of re-reading Hourai that people haven't already stated before, but I'd like to note that before he gave Sect the newbpass, Hourai paid attention to and attacked Sect early on in D1 but unleashed his wrath and vote on Dan instead. Not the most admirable, considering Sect's current situation. Somewhat interesting how he goes after Dan for defending Sect when Hourai's actions here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613358.html#msg613358) could actually be interpreted as defending Sect as well. If Sect is scum (and I'm still fairly confident he is), I could definitely see Hourai as the final of the three, perhaps even moreso than Bard. I'll have to take a closer look at Bard/Hourai overnight following Sect's flip. Additionally, Hourai has not said anything about Sect today, which is... augh. Hourai, where do you currently stand on Sect, now that Dormio has flipped scum?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Sect on April 26, 2011, 01:17:38 AM
Okay, honestly, I've had enough of these shenanigans.

I'm scum.

##Unvote
##Vote Sect


Someone please finish me off already.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 01:18:38 AM
I can't tell if you're lying so you can die or not.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Sect on April 26, 2011, 01:21:03 AM
If I'm lying town, then you lose a useless townie. If I'm scum, then you're closer to winning. Win-win situation, really.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 01:22:46 AM
If Sect was town who got tired of playing, he would probably just request a modkill or replacement, considering that's what he did in his first game.

...And even if he wouldn't, I'd like to believe that he has the decency to not do something this anti-alignment as a townie. <_< Granted, it totally would be anti-alignment if he were scum, too, but he's probably going to die anyway and if somebody lynched him now the day would at least end early, benifiting scum.

Speaking of which.

##Unvote
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 01:23:17 AM
Even if he's telling the truth we still have lots of day left to talk about it.
<_< I'm just going to throw this case out now and assume we're looking for Dormio x Sect x ??? then.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 01:24:48 AM
oh but he also got rid of any chance of hourai answering me in guaranteed honest manner argh

Yeah, Sect is scum helping scum by attempting to self-hammer. <_<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 01:25:35 AM
Yeah, that's probably the best course of action, Shadoweh.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 01:26:20 AM
In fact I have a huge headache now so I'm going to take the time to lie down and think about it. Also:
##Unvote
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 01:29:41 AM
I don't mind talking more, but by the end of the day, I still want Sect dead.  His flip will help us out regardless.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 01:29:51 AM
Sect, are you the Scum Roleblocker?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 01:36:36 AM
After thinking things over, Hourai seems like a better pick for Sect's buddy to me than Bard. While Bard did claim that the Sect case was uninteresting to him, I don't think that is as bad as ignoring it outright, and the timing of Sect's scumclaim could be interpreted as an interruption to my questioning of his buddy.

Plus, from being buddies with him in Zombie Apocalypse, I would expect scum!Bard to be hardbussing Sect right now. It might be a bit silly for a meta clear, but it is noted nonetheless.

Haven't given Polly a proper lookover yet. I'll do that soon.

Oh, and considering Sect's vote during D1, Shadoweh is now completely obvtown to me. I would personally suspect the third scum to be somebody off her wagon (hi Hourai), too, unless they were really that determined in getting her lynched.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 01:39:28 AM
On that note, I feel like everybody is ignoring my posts today. I've got maybe what, one response? <_<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Kiro on April 26, 2011, 01:51:30 AM
To humor Bard's #337, my Shadoweh vote was a Day 1 case so I'm most flexible then. She was looking more Townie as she made her arguments and I didn't want to lynch her anymore. The way I worded it is vague and I don't want to deal in absolutes and have it bite me in the ass later. And the comment about getting Hourai and Polaris more involved was exactly that. They were not contributing and I figure if I draw a little attention to myself to get them to respond, it's worth it. But yeah, it possibly could have been bad. Maybe we might revisit this in postgame.

That said, I can see you bringing it up and not giving me a clear, but why? Your choices are me and Omba and I'm having a hard time believing you think the last 2 scum both bussed, one that started the wagon and one that kept the Dormio wagon tied rather than shift it to Dan. Especially when we had to deadline struggle to get Dormio.

Uh, thanks Doc. And yes, it doesn't condemn Bard. We'll deal with it.

Ombra, your entire "omg u must haf brains" assumes scum'd be so goddamn retarded it's not even funny. No, there is no wisdom in scum trying to lynch Kiro: scum typically attack what they think is the towniest person in the game, and that person is usually most difficult to lynch. If scum decided Kiro was that person, why in the hell would a scumBard attempt to even try and lynch that person? Your scenario assumes scum is goddamn retarded. You're still left with a shaky WIFOM reasoning that you blew your claim on.

I disagree with that. It's a nutty WIFOM loop since now you suggest that you would never do such a thing as Scum. But maybe just this once, it could work and we'd let it pass. Considering how far behind Scum is currently in this game, they might be forced to go with such a gnarly gambit. One reason you could do this as Scum is because your buddy was also on Dan's wagon and you realize just how royally screwed you'd be if you played it conservative.

Verdict: Still a person of great interest.

Breaktime, Funday Monday.

Cut: Oh shit, Sect voted himself... Let's not end the Day yet.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 01:59:26 AM
HW if it makes you feel better I think all your D2 posts have been good.  and also Welcome to club (except people don't call you  :derp:)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 04:30:22 AM
Right, Kiro. Except the argument presented was against Ombra's "I assume you have brains!" validating that IF scum attacked Kiro who was GUARDED, THEN scum would LOGICALLY attempt to lynch Kiro during the next day. This logic doesn't hold because usually scum attempt to kill the towniest person alive and that's also the hardest target to lynch. If you assume a scumBard will take the smartest and easiest route, he would never make a Kiro case.

If you assume scumBard would perform Unlimited Gambit Works, then he might! He might. Except getting a town flip on you would've condemned scum, too, and the risk would be a Doc claiming. Obviously all in my calculations, I am scum with Sect and have elegantly laid bare the Doc.



This game has trolls in it, I'm just not sure who's trolling who.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 04:46:23 AM
In short Kiro, that just means it's an entire WIFOM mess, which means that arguments as "I'm assuming you have brains!" doesn't really work in attempting to mount a case, because it'd more be gutsy than logical for scumBard to make a vote on you. Your entire post elegantly danced around the entire purpose behind it and twisted it.

>: I'd vote you but Ombra self-destructed to save you and all. It'd be uncouth of me to still insist you're scum.



Sect, stop adding to the shenanigans. It's bad enough already, we both know this.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Kiro on April 26, 2011, 05:29:01 AM
Um, so yeah... I don't need to reread Sect. Whether he's frustrated Scum, or frustrated Townie (please don't be frustrated Townie), he's getting lynched today.

Hourai #373: Not sure why you earlier said I shouldn't give Bard a pass and then you kind of do it yourself with your unvote there. That being said, the case on Polaris is reasonable if he doesn't think Sect or Bard was Scum. Except he doesn't say anything about Bard at all. Best thing Hourai has going for him is that Polaris really is nowhere to be found and any contribution he'd make to Day 2 is now skewed. I guess it all really depends on reread after the Sect flip.

Oh yeah, Dan, when we have the full disclosure of the game at the end, we're all going to discuss things you did right (which I believe there are some), and things you did wrong (which I believe there are some more).

Hi HW. To me, you're kind of like Zakeri right now. Both of you posting reasonably but still wary of because neither of you were really on Dormio Day 1. Your #399 gives me hope that the forced lynch is indeed worth going for along with Sect's earlier stances.

I might be done with questions for today. We gonna let all of us sound off before we decide to go ahead with Sect?

Cut by Bard: Except you might not be expecting me to get lynched anyways as you introduced your case. Would Scum you waste the time to do that and then eventually back off? It lends credence to the whole, "it's so stupid he can't be Scum" vibe. Indeed, I'm not sure what purposes it serves, but I threw my opinion at it to keep us on our toes about you which is the best anybody can do anyways.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 05:57:57 AM
@Kiro: sounding off sounds fine to me, as long as the whole group gets to post once more from now until a Sect lynch.

Ya I'm sure post game discussion will be fun!  I always have fun reading the QT's.  I see nothing to justify not lynching Sect at this point; he's the best canidate plus his flip will be quite useful in regards to HW, Bard, and HH. My vote is on him and staying there.  We can keep him at L-2 until the past two people chime in.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 06:45:49 AM
So if it wasn't obvious I've been focusing my rereads on Hourai and Polaris. I still find huh what less suspicious (hi huh what!) and he hasn't entertained any ideas today besides Sect's untimely death even before his claim, so I find him even less worth looking into now.

Hourai: I'm skipping over the Dan fight comments because they've been done to death. His comment about Dormio as his second scum pick comes at post #170, and it does come before Dormio became OmegaSuspicious. On his Day 2, his reasoning for unvoting Bardiche is incredibly vague. What about his content was better and made you believe he looked better then Polaris?

Polaris: I might be biased from the start since I never liked his 'forgettable' comment. At least he's easy to read over! The first thing he does is vote for Dan. He stays on Dan for the entire day, making comments on Dan, Omba, Dormio, myself and huh what. Two names that are missing from this list that pertain to Day 2 are Sect and Hourai. His points against Dormio are always secondary to Dan and even when he votes for Dormio he makes it obvious he's still willing to go the other way. His Day 2 post does the same thing with Sect, saying he wouldn't mind a Sect lynch but pursuing Hourai instead. Since Kiro was already voting for Hourai it's possible he saw this as the best viable counter-wagon to Sect.

This plays out about the same as before considering Sect as scum actually. I would pursue Polaris over Hourai, and either of them over Bard or huh what, with some UK thrown in there depending on how she makes me feel. There isn't much further we can go on cases before feeding Sect to ZE HOUNDS! I need more content from Zak before I can get a feel for him either way.

Kiro: Your argument with Bard right now sounds alot like "Bard could have not done this thing as scum OR MAYBE HE DID!" I don't think pursuing that WIFOM really helps making a case either way. We already have enough newbies going after red herrings.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 26, 2011, 10:26:38 AM
In short Kiro, that just means it's an entire WIFOM mess, which means that arguments as "I'm assuming you have brains!" doesn't really work in attempting to mount a case, because it'd more be gutsy than logical for scumBard to make a vote on you.
Assuming you've got brains was not about what you'd do as scum, but rather what you wouldn't do as town. That being voting the most town looking player with that kind of weak points and when there were enough people around looking far more scummy. Now I thought Kiro was most likely town even before Dormio's flip, but still, that might have been just how I perceived it and it still might have been skewed on D2 since I then knew he's town. Only as far as I can tell pretty much everyone and their dog thought Kiro was town, too. Hence if you didn't, there had to be a good reason for it, one way or another.
Now of course everyone could have overlooked some really scummy looking things about him that made him look scummy to you - but, again, the points you actually brought up were damn weak for making him your prime suspect.
And at this point, I'm wondering why townBard would do this. "You simply made a mistake" is one possibility - which I'm pretty much discarding because of the brains thing. Which leaves me with "you deliberately did it for some reason" - and now the speculation comes in and makes a scum-intended move on your part seem far more likely to me than a town-intended one; your move already looked scummy without the whole Doc thing, the latter is just the icing on the cake.

And we really have to lynch Sect now, huh. Not much to add for me until I see his flip.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: WHMZakeri on April 26, 2011, 03:26:04 PM
Bardiche is my top suspect right now, and is probably who I'm going to concentrate my rereads for tomorrow on. I'll also reread Polaris, and make a few other Iso on people not on my town list. My town list however, only really consists of people Dormio And Sect wanted lynched, so it's a little short.

Mostly, what I want to see is Bardiche making more cases. Those always seem to turn up funny when he's scum, so either He's town and they convince me not to lynch him, or they'll be good entertainment value for the remainder of the game.

Bard's argument that Scum wouldn't want to try and get a lynch on Kiro after the NK failed on him is silly. Being the Nightkill (especially on night one) Doesn't nessicerily mean that you're the hardest to lynch. It could mean no one has expressed the want to lynch, it could mean they've expressed want to lynch of a member of the mafia, it could mean the random number generator hates them. And in the case of MotK Mafia, it could also mean that they are Kiro (isn't one of the general rules of doctor play on MotK "Always Protect Kiro"? I remember a game where scum tried to kill Kiro repeatedly, even after the doctor claimed).

I'm pretty certain the point Bard is trying to get across is the same point that I'm making, and that the fact that Bardiche made a Case on whoever was last night's NK is a nulltell. Of course, that's the farthest his counterpoint goes, it it should be obvious from the post above mine, if not before that, that Omba's case on Bardiche has evolved beyond just "Making a case on the guy he failed to NK."

Also, it occurs to me I've been ignoring HW. His day one play, I fall under the category of "Okay, I get how he responded wrong, but how does that make him scum" line of thinking. Focusing on UK was definitely bad, but it's obvious the only reason he did that was because UK was intentionally trying to provoke him. You could have infered this from my earlier omittions, but HW is not a prime suspect to me right now.

Oh, dear Town Belle, you seem unusually quiet this game. Are you not feeling well? Do you need another posting restriction handkerchief?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 03:49:57 PM
Actually you're all right, I'm scum with Sect. I completely voted Kiro not because I thought there was something scummy about it and look at things in a different way, it's because I do but look at it from a scum perspective. ScumBard would totally do that.

##Unvote
##Vote: Sect


Sorry buddy, bussing you hard for town cred, maybe it'll let me live. <3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 26, 2011, 03:58:00 PM
Votecount: In English, because I cannot present a votecount in facepalm-ese

Hanged Hourai (2) - Kiro, Polaris
Sect (5) - Action Dan, UncertainKitten, Zakeri, Sect, Bardiche
Bardiche (1) - Omba
Polaris (1) - Hanged Hourai

Sect is at L-1!

~25 hours remain.  11 alive takes 6 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 04:06:27 PM
To further explain, I voted Kiro because in my one game with him, I immediately perceived the MotK meta of always attacking Kiro, and always defending him. I further believed the best course of action was to do something completely nonsensical to anyone but me so as to further throw off people's guards.

Why am I scum? It's because I never took to easy trains in a calculated move to garner townie cred while obfuscating my real status as the scum roleblocker, master of gambits and the purveyor of fine suits. In fact, I am so scummy that once Sect flips as my scumbuddy (I love you man but you totally shouldn't have revealed Dan annoyed you so much you wanted him gone as a requirement for enjoying this game), you'll win the game once you tie me up for the lynch.

Never bother that I made a case on Kiro that reeks of ten kinds of bad. I do this as town as much as I do it as scum, but this game it's scum-oriented because Kiro is my failed nightkill, and like a real man Bard never lets his real target die. Tonight I'll be offing Ombra who is on to me, further pointing that I am scum aiming at people who MAY BE ON TO ME because this is in my meta.

Also, I tried to get rid of Dan on D1 because he is the most helpful obvtown the game has ever known.

Now, can we lynch Sect and I, preferably in that order? I don't mind if I go before Sect either, but I'm not sure if he'll last another day of these shenanigans.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 26, 2011, 04:21:16 PM
See? Now he even confessed!!!1

... :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Kiro on April 26, 2011, 04:29:27 PM
Oh my...

Should we just go with this? Worst case scenario is that Bard is telling the truth about himself, but Sect is actually Townie and he's buying his final hidden buddy an extra day. Might feel like lynching Bard first to be safer.

If Sect is truly Scum as well, he doesn't need to say anything in Day 3 (save him the stress). Maybe we can just ask Edible to wrap up the game (if Sect and Bard are indeed the last Scum) and send us straight to postgame commentary which is far more interesting than going through the motions. Maybe a shortened Night if all the actions come in real quick?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 04:34:25 PM
Of course, Sect is actually town and I'm trying to get a mislynch on him! ... except he was already on the road to a lynch! All part of a calculated plot that I would NEVER do anything like that! Except I would!

Gambits, gambits everywhere. WIFOM and self-fulfilling prophecies on the road! Now let's go! On to a future where scumBard hangs! Whether it be Sect or me to die today, either option guarantees your road to happiness!

And worst case scenario is that not only is Sect actually Town, but I am as well and I'm doing what I like best: unlimited gambit works. :V Of course, that's completely unlikely because if you assume I'm scum, you can explain all my actions from a scum perspective. If you assume I'm town you could explain them from a town perspective but that's unlikely, because I'm scum.

With Sect. He already admitted he was scum but as a true party connoiseur I always arrive fashionably late at the scumclaiming parties.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 04:42:18 PM
Bard, I'm sorry to have ruined your game.  This was such a predictable outcome too, if only you would have known!

I ruin everygame I play.  When I play monopoly, I flip the **** when I land on Boardwalk with a hotel on it.  I mean, WTF, I have to give up all my hard earned brightly colored money just because I landed on one space out of 40 spaces that happens to have a little piece of plastic on it?  What BS is that?  When that happens, I toss the board into the air, scatering our playing pieces, houses and hotels, and the piles of chance and community cards. Next, I take the nearest 2000 hard cash, lick it, and stamp it on my friend's face, declaring, "How do you like DEM MONIES?" before promptly spitting on his face (aiming for the eye of course), and storming out of the room.

It's a wonder that I'm ever invited to play again!

Unfortunately, before I finish up here as a raving lunatic, with absolutely no contributions of valid arguements or any injections of logical sense, I must lynch both you and Sect before I go out of pure spite.

Also, Problem?  :smug:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Kiro on April 26, 2011, 04:44:47 PM
Blast, where's that edibledoesnotapprove.jpg

Pesco, I know you have it ready. Unleash it to us postgame.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 26, 2011, 04:51:23 PM
Seriously though, what do?
My fuckup aside, the game is still on.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 04:52:37 PM
Zak: This entire game is a posting restriction. I hadn't realized how wordy I am until now. ;-; I've taken to making my posts directly in the wordcounter instead of cutting paragraphs after the fact. I'm going to be depressed if(when) Sect flips scum too. This game seems too easy. If Bard flips scum I will probably spend the post-game sobbing in a corner.

Bard: You know if Omba dies I would actually believe you did it now that you said it >_> That IS how Scum Bard works. Stop making WIFOM for everyone and present a well-thought out case on someone you think is scum instead of lashing out in trollation! Someone besides Sect please. Play Mafia with us!

Kiro: Uhm, no? No we should not go with this. We should lynch the person who is actually claiming scum seriously first. Worst case scenario would be both of them being Town quitting because this game has devolved from Mafia into Trollzilla.

STOP TROLLING EACH OTHER AND PLAY MAFIA. >:(
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 05:02:43 PM
Unfortunately, before I finish up here as a raving lunatic, with absolutely no contributions of valid arguements or any injections of logical sense

Is it bad that I can't tell if this is passive-aggressive criticism or self-awareness? :V



Shadoweh: I would, but everyone's busy falling over themselves in self-fulfilling prophecies. Dan's spent all his D1 trying to push one, now Omba's throwing away the Doctor to present one, and Kiro's going in circles that no matter WHAT I do, it could all be part of a massive ploy. The way I figure, until I die, these guys will keep running in circles that state I am scum because I am scum, with WIFOM arguments to support their case or blatantly terrible images of one's self to support terrible earlyday1 cases as being cases-on-scum.

And hey! If everyone's departing from following the logical course of action, and town is joining hands in lynching someone for quite blatantly saying removing Dan was a requirement for him to enjoy the game, I figure I should exit, stage left as well.

Either that, or I am still pulling a gambit to ensure victory for my side in my own way.

... or doing what seems fun to me at the time. :V I've already declared what I have on Hourai, and there's nothing I can say about Zakeri because I can't account him for Neo's actions and he has posted all of one post today. Huh What isn't interesting to pursue at this point in time, because I do not share the sentiment that he was "flailing" at D1 start, and UK being aggressive is completely in line with how Town UK normally acts, except the lurking now is Bard sad faze naow.

If I had suspicions to materialise beyond what I have already posted I would have done so! (except I wouldn't because I'm scum, see. The self-fulfilling prophecy works out, except unless it's meant to work out. WIFOM, WIFOM everywhere.)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 05:23:40 PM
Bard, I think you are scum because to my mind you have not adequately defended yourself from attacks against you.  I interpret your rageing now as avoiding the problem.  Whatever my arguements where D1 against you (and I still think most were valid), Today is a whole new day, and with the flip, you are on slippery ground.  My main concerns are A) why you were on my wagon, and B) why you were on Shadow's wagon.

A) you answered, (and I think it was a weak answer, that I didn't answer "counters" to my case against you, while ignoring everything else along the way)
B) you have still yet to account for

I also think your case against Kiro was bad in and of itself regardless of the Doc claim.

It's true HH hasn't been productive today, and he also stands quite badly (I place him as 3rd most likely scum), there is more evidence against you.

Please answer why you were on the shadow wagon, and why you got off it.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 05:27:23 PM
@Bard: I'm lurking because I honestly have no fucking idea what to DO anymore. I have no theory. I have no leads. I have NO IDEA HOW TO PLAY THIS GAME.

I mean, I'll post responses to things I see but...honestly, it's just been trolls trolling trolls. It's not *fun*, it's just...what the fuck. I don't even feel like rereading until we get Sect's flip. Honestly, I don't even think HW is scum anymore. I got tunnely and was wrong. If I had a vig I'd probably shoot Bard or Hourai right now.

Good enough?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: WHMZakeri on April 26, 2011, 05:43:01 PM
I can understand the general confusion and disappointment going around right now. I don't Think anyone besides Wheatley Dan is happy with the way this game is turning out.

Shadoweh: Yeah, I kind of realized after I posted that you weren't being quiet so much as just plain. I guess I just miss the long, flowing dialogs, and the cute nicknames you've been forced to use for the past few games.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 05:53:42 PM
@Bard: I'm lurking because I honestly have no fucking idea what to DO anymore. I have no theory. I have no leads. I have NO IDEA HOW TO PLAY THIS GAME.

I mean, I'll post responses to things I see but...honestly, it's just been trolls trolling trolls. It's not *fun*, it's just...what the fuck. I don't even feel like rereading until we get Sect's flip.
Yeah, this is pretty much me. <____<

Seriously, Bard, I kind of want to punch you over the internet now. Why would you do this.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 05:55:58 PM
I'd respond, Huh What, but I have a wordcount to think of, and things to say directly related to the matter.


Dan. You didn't respond to anything that was said until Day 2. When it was made on Day 1. No, you cannot claim that "you never explained why you voted me" because I have. Numerous times. The reason I am admitting I am scum is because there is no getting through to you.

And B) is because I thought Shadoweh was scum. Honestly, what answer do you expect? "Because I'm scum and thought Shadoweh an easy wagon to hop onto! :V" I mean, pygmalion comes into play right here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611374.html#msg611374), where my vote on UK is apparently a "scumslip" because I didn't think it interesting that UK declared you town. (UK does this in any game she plays about any player she likes best at the time, subject to her whims) From that time, no matter what I did, you've done nothing but construe it as, "ScumBard does this because", rather than wonder whether it could maybe, possibly! be that your case on Bard is bad and that's why no one else is giving you the time of day.

Until Omba comes into play, with the beautiful gem that "I protected Kiro, no one died, Bard attacks Kiro, ergo Bard is scum" until that finally evolves into, "But everything you do makes sense as scum - it could make sense as town but I choose to assume that you aren't". The entire thing about "brains" is objectively silly - making a case on someone you think is scum and truly believing it isn't necessarily stupid. It only becomes that when people rebut your points and you blindly keep insisting it.

The support that "[Bard] is scum" rests solely in a deep-rooted case of the pygmalion-effect, where y supports that x is true, on the basis that y must support x if x is true. My actions are scummy, but only on the basis that I am scum - Omba himself already said he could reason the actions as town, but thought it "too stupid" to possibly be town-motivated. Ergo, I must be scum, and therefore my actions are scummy.

I'd say why I dislike the Sect train but no words left! Someone post.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 05:57:03 PM
Actually, fuck it.

Would anybody mind if I just hammered Sect right now? This day is a trainwreck.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 05:57:34 PM
##Unvote Can't let you do that bro.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 05:58:19 PM
:|
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 26, 2011, 05:59:34 PM
I'm posting a votecount to intentionally add WIFOM elements to future votecounts... or am I?

Hanged Hourai (2) - Kiro, Polaris
Sect (4) - Action Dan, UncertainKitten, Zakeri, Sect
Bardiche (1) - Omba
Polaris (1) - Hanged Hourai

Not voting: Shadoweh, huh what, Bardiche

Sect is at L-2!

~23 hours remain.  With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 06:04:44 PM
I think Bardiche is the cop.

##Vote Bardiche
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 06:09:16 PM
Hilarious trollposts aside, I honestly think Bard is a townie who got fed up with the cases on him and is playing selfishly. <_< Still... this is a really irritating game and I wish the people who haven't contributed since Sect's claim would hurry up and post so we can hammer and move on.

##Unvote
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 06:11:10 PM
Now then, to continue.

The Sect train is bad to me because its major proponent was that "a townSect would not say this". [This] being an admission that Sect wanted Dan gone before Dormio, and the game end before Dormio. I read this as that he really wanted Dan gone above everything, because another Day with Dan would be less preferable than the game to end.

However, why would a scumSect say this, and what does he have to gain from it? If Sect were scum, and his scumbuddies were buddies, then we'd now be talking about tea and crumpets over Dan's N1 body. There is no logical reasoning to support that what Sect said was objectively scummy - he was venting frustration.

When Sect made this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg614997.html#msg614997), it struck me as having good observations. Ironically, the good reason for citing I am scum is brought up by Sect, who elegantly points out my D1 contributions were limited to telling Dan to play and making minor observations that never found a place.

He made a pronounced case (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg614996.html#msg614996) on Dan, but people vote him (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615062.html#msg615062) on his D1 and end-of-day vote, or he's obvscum (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615134.html#msg615134), UK correctly pointing out why Dan is unlikely to be scum (but forgetting Sect might've just not thought about that) (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615194.html#msg615194), and Zakeri twisting Sect's words and admitting the point is made in frustration but still voting it (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg616160.html#msg616160).

In fact, I'd say Zakeri's vote there is the worst of the set, but the rest are also pretty terrible. Sect was crystal clear he thought the game was a trainwreck (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613870.html#msg613870), in the same post he made The Golden Statement that raised everyone's heckles.

Honestly, I cannot see anything in the Sect train other than jumping on an easy bandwagon for terribad reasons, with Zakeri's being the worst by far.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 06:13:05 PM
And yes, I am fed up with how the cases on me all consist of pygmalion-effect at its finest, with Kiro throwing in some "everything is a WIFOM" logic. Can you blame me for thinking him scum, even now?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 06:32:52 PM
Must resist urge to TROLLOLOLOL...

In other news....

Quote
Dan. You didn't respond to anything that was said until Day 2. When it was made on Day 1. No, you cannot claim that "you never explained why you voted me" because I have. Numerous times. The reason I am admitting I am scum is because there is no getting through to you.

And B) is because I thought Shadoweh was scum. Honestly, what answer do you expect? "Because I'm scum and thought Shadoweh an easy wagon to hop onto! " I mean, pygmalion comes into play right here, where my vote on UK is apparently a "scumslip" because I didn't think it interesting that UK declared you town. (UK does this in any game she plays about any player she likes best at the time, subject to her whims) From that time, no matter what I did, you've done nothing but construe it as, "ScumBard does this because", rather than wonder whether it could maybe, possibly! be that your case on Bard is bad and that's why no one else is giving you the time of day.


Sorry that I didn't get to your "counters" I was only defending myself from 4 other people whilst attacking you and Hourai, doing my best to clarify Sect, and answering all other questions thrown at me D1.  Bard you only explain why you voted me D2, besides "answer my rebuttals" in the same post you voted for me. After that you went dark for the rest of D1, oblivious to anything else that was happening in the game.

Bard.. I know you voted for shadow because she was scum..  I want you to clarify WHY you voted her D1.  As far as I can tell you voted her for making the D1 lynch a choice between a HW/UK lynch.  Yet in the same post you ask opinions of both shadow and sect as to why they think HW/UK is the scummier one. 

D2 you attack Kiro partially on how Kiro handled his Shadow vote D1.  Yet the way you handled yours was suspect as well (Shadow is tunneling ----> vote her,  Shadow is not tunneling -----> unvote, change to dan).

Reading your Sect post.


cutcutcut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 06:40:27 PM
@Bard: You know what? I'm not even sure I believe Sect is scum. Hence why I'm not just assuming he is and analyzing from there. But you know what? At this point I've stopped caring. He wants to be lynched, let's give him his damn wish and hopefully get back to actually turning our brains on and not fucking trolling each other. K? Sound like a deal? Because it's not, it's what's going to damn well happen whether you want it to or not.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 06:52:52 PM
I already know he'll be lynched, I just wanted to get out that I hated it and it's honestly feeling like town falling over itself to mislynch.

Then it's not a mislynch and I'll eat my hat.

##Vote: Sect

Dan, you just explained perfectly clear why I voted her. I unvoted her because you abandoned all logic and were worse, and because it was correctly countered that the tunnel was not that strong as I had thought it was.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 06:54:03 PM
I don't think this is an good defense of Sect.

I'm voting Sect based on his actions.

His entire D2 case on me is IIoA.  All Sect did was flavor it against me, which is not unheard of for a scum to do. It's funny how the "personal insults" he refers to were me calling him a derp in one post, when the entire game I've been called this same oh-so-bad word.  I'm sorry you couldn't take the heat Sect. 

I find his observations add nothing new, while he draws out questionable conclusions from them.

Bard, I am not sure what you find in Sect's 2nd post that validates town!Sect.  In case you haven't forgotten, I was the first to point out how little you contributed D1 in my case (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611989.html#msg611989) against you.

My vote for Sect is for objective reasons (not hammering, bad voting history), I really don't care how much he hates my guts.  He should learn to
 :dealwithit:

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 26, 2011, 06:55:57 PM
One... two... three votecounts.  Ah-ah-ah.

Hanged Hourai (2) - Kiro, Polaris
Sect (5) - Action Dan, UncertainKitten, Zakeri, Sect, Bardiche
Bardiche (1) - Omba
Polaris (1) - Hanged Hourai

Not voting: Shadoweh, huh what

Sect is at L-1!

~22 hours remain.  With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 06:58:28 PM
Quote
Then it's not a mislynch and I'll eat my hat.


REMEMBER THE CONQUEROR

Also I want Hourai to do the honors.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 26, 2011, 06:59:27 PM
Bard: Way to prove my point about you by writing something intelligent about Sect.

Seriously though, do we hammer right now, or do we wait for the guys who haven't posted?

##Unvote
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 07:03:31 PM
Pygmalion-effect at its finest, clearly everything I do is just to further prove I'm scum.

Let's just hammer and get it over with.

Dan, I'm not even going to respond because it's so different from Sect's observation that it isn't even funny.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Sect on April 26, 2011, 07:05:43 PM
Omba: If you think that they'll actually vote, or even contribute, it's not a bad idea.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Kiro on April 26, 2011, 07:06:41 PM
Bard, man, if you don't believe Sect is Scum and think Zak's jump onto the Sect wagon is bad, you could have said so without the shenanigans. I just don't know why you believe causing a scene the way you did would be effective. Sect's lynch may not be avoidable and if he flips Town, you could go on with your Zak case in Day 3 and I'd listen. Hell, if Sect flips Scum, a lot of these cases could still apply since Sect is a sunk cost ever since his first Day 2 post.

We can do whatever, Bard made his point. Hourai and Polaris aren't around, but not sure if they can provide anything meaningful now that Bard jumped the gun. Polaris needs a prod.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 07:09:17 PM
well I don't exactly want to argue with bard anymore for today (he doesn't want to either I gather), and if polaris and HH want to make themselves look bad, it's their business. Tougher questions for tomorrow! 

Go for the Hammer!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 07:10:34 PM
Polaris is at 2 days - 5 hours.  HH is 1 day - 2 hours I think.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 26, 2011, 07:15:10 PM
 :( This game...

##Unvote
Welp, Polaris is no way getting lynched today, and I would still like him to tell if he still thinks he has a good case on me, considering the one I have on him. Still want him dead.

Regarding Sect and Bard because they're the hot things right now.

Sect-
I don't really know what to make of his self-vote and disappearance. If you could come back and play the game, that'd be great. In regards to his earlier case on Dan, it seems like it's based off Dan being confusing and basically a new player. The emotions are in place, I guess. His frustration with the game is understandable, but his actions are not very good. And I can't believe I'm saying this, but I don't think scum would push for Dan that hard after Dormio's flip. I don't support the lynch, but I do not think it's avoidable at his point.
And I find his giving up and not finding a replacement not really to be a scumtell, given what's happened already in this game.

Bard-
Audacious! Hides in sarcasm and circular reasoning. Now this is more purposely trying to confuse town. I would like seeing him lynched more than Sect at this point.
Seriously, barring you, who is scum?

I'm going to press the preview button and see how many shocking revelations I missed while making this post.
...
brb hanging myself

:( This game...


Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 26, 2011, 07:21:48 PM
Well, I guess that's that.

##Vote: Sect
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 26, 2011, 07:25:26 PM
Up, hammer shut.

Polaris needs a prod.

Polaris got one a while ago, he has confirmed he's still in as of yesterday evening.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Edible on April 26, 2011, 07:28:59 PM
SECT, PLAYING A MAFIA GOON, HAS BEEN LYNCHED

You have 24 hours to punch yourself in the face.

I mean submit night actions.

Maybe both.  Whatever.  I'm open for suggestions.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Omba on April 26, 2011, 07:31:07 PM
Err... yeah. :colonveeplusalpha:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 26, 2011, 07:31:15 PM
Well it's official, I have no idea how to play this game.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 07:34:04 PM
well... MAYBE we can make this into a flawless town Victory!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 26, 2011, 07:35:27 PM
Mod, final D2 votecount for convenience?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Edible on April 26, 2011, 07:36:53 PM
No.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 07:40:26 PM
Wow. He actually was fucking scum.

/me slow claps.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 07:44:04 PM
I'll take facepunching. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 07:48:30 PM
I believe Dormio wants VORE.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 08:00:25 PM
I believe Dormio wants VORE.
He's not the only one. <_<;
Yadda Edible can deletes if I'm not welcome v:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 08:04:03 PM
sigh
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Omba on April 26, 2011, 08:04:44 PM
[nsfw]http://gelbooru.com/index.php?page=post&s=view&id=561867[/nsfw]

There you go.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 08:08:36 PM
On the plus side, at least we'll probably walk away with a town win for once!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 08:14:53 PM
Hey guys I'm back did I miss anything important?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 08:15:32 PM
Hey guys I'm back did I miss anything important?

No, but I missed you~!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 08:39:32 PM
:< :< :< Bard it's pouring rain out and I'm soaked now, I need someone to warm me up. :< :< :<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Edible on April 26, 2011, 08:42:51 PM
:< :< :< Bard it's pouring rain out and I'm soaked now, I need someone to warm me up. :< :< :<

(http://i54.tinypic.com/2rp3eb7.jpg)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 09:02:32 PM
:< :< :< Bard it's pouring rain out and I'm soaked now, I need someone to warm me up. :< :< :<

/me spreads his arms wide.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 09:13:13 PM
Shadoweh, just because Schezo isn't playing in this game doesn't mean you have to betray him.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 09:17:44 PM
Shadoweh, just because Schezo isn't playing in this game doesn't mean you have to betray him.

Stop being jealous of our love. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 09:20:03 PM
Stop ruining my mafia OTP. :<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 09:22:28 PM
##Vote: Huh What

Preposterous. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 09:27:55 PM
Shadoweh, just because Schezo isn't playing in this game doesn't mean you have to betray him.
:< Schezo was here earlier! I said I needed someone! If he wants he can come snuggle too~ There's enough Shadoweh for everyone <^_^> Especially that Choco-Behemoth guy over there <3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 09:31:01 PM
... I see. Ditched for Schezo.

Fine, you can go snugglybuns with Schezo for all I care!

/me slams with the door.

...

/me returns to slam with the door again, for good measure.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 09:33:11 PM
HA! Bard, as if you ever had Shadoweh. You know who was here for her in a neko nurse outfit when she came in from the rain, sneezing? ME. You know who had hot chicken soup ready for her when she sat down, weary from a long day? Yeah, ME!

It's CLEAR the true OTP is ShadowehxUK!

I AM A BETTER WAIFU THAN YOU, BARD!!!!!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 09:35:34 PM
That's okay, I was the hasubando in the relationship. But Shadoweh can rot with Schezo for all I loopy care!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 09:41:04 PM
Quote
Losing battle there, Dan. You're not implying I'd cheat on my girlfriend with a guy, right?

*Dan prepares a trap
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 09:43:21 PM
See how easily he gave up on you Shadoweh?  He obviously doesn't care about you like you think. >.>
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 09:45:48 PM
Germany x Russia Forever!

...

until the stabbing occurs.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 09:47:43 PM
"till the stabbing occurs"

Where the hell have you been?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 09:49:08 PM
What noooo Bard, I'm cold now, come back! ;-;
Oh hai Schezo, I uhm, actually that chicken soup from UK is the most tempting thing all day!
Oh come on it was just a little stabbing and I let you keep Prussia for like two years :<

..This is why it was so easy to write Shadoweh X Everyone fanfics last game!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 26, 2011, 09:52:50 PM
Oh sorry, I was distracted by the 3-way between spain, france, and italy.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 09:53:21 PM
And that's why Bard x Shadoweh will never be reality and ever be confined to fiction. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 10:01:05 PM
;~; Nooooes you know nothing sways me like your gambits and I can't resist your adorahuggy Jest avatars!
So cute. Must huuuuuug <3 <3 <3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 10:01:54 PM
So let me come in and take Berlin for like two years. :B

And are you saying your done, are going to tell Norway to GTFO of St Petersburg and you're going to just turn around to fully focus on the west? :3

I don't know but those answers are like you are trying to make me leave too.  For UK?!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 10:15:50 PM
You will have your answers in the thread where it belongs~
In this game there are already too many pairings to pursue!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 10:24:12 PM
Please, Schezo, you're out of your league. It's clear Shadoweh needs a feminine touch to fulfill her desires. After all, a woman knows what a woman likes best~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 10:30:30 PM
Fine!  I don't need a woman anyway. Kitten4U can just be my good friend.  :3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Polaris on April 26, 2011, 10:30:41 PM
I am back from school and what is this.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 10:32:14 PM
Something a lot more entertaining than the actual game, that's what.

Also, I only ship Schezo/K4U as moirails. :33
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Polaris on April 26, 2011, 10:33:28 PM
I was talking about what happened in D2 but okay.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 10:35:48 PM
I was talking about what happened in D2 but okay.
Psst psst~ you can't talk about the game at night.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 10:36:56 PM
Bard x Gambits, OTP.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 10:37:49 PM
Who wants to talk about that anyways? NOOO BARD I WILL WIN YOU BACK YOU WILL SEE!
Why do we not have a crack team of fiction writers working on this 24/7 seriously
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 10:38:28 PM
You can HAVE your stupid gambits, TARDiche >=[! Shadoweh is mines!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 26, 2011, 10:39:23 PM
This is getting more activity than the game ever did. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 10:40:59 PM
Also, I only ship Schezo/K4U as moirails. :33
Daww. :*
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 10:43:27 PM
This is getting more activity than the game ever did. :V
So is my shipping wall right now.

:33
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 26, 2011, 10:43:51 PM
Fine!  I don't need a woman anyway. Kitten4U can just be my good friend.  :3
<3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 10:43:57 PM
NOOO BARD I WILL WIN YOU BACK YOU WILL SEE!

MY HEART IS A RAGING, BLAZING INFERNO OF HATRED. HATRED FOR YOU!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 26, 2011, 10:45:11 PM
SEE!? BARD DOESN'T LOVE YOU! HE'S JUST TRYING TO MAKE HIS GAMBITS JEALOUS! BUT YOU AND I, WE HAVE SOMETHING REAL! SOMETHING SPECIAL!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 10:46:42 PM
<3
<3

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 10:48:58 PM
SEE!? BARD DOESN'T LOVE YOU! HE'S JUST TRYING TO MAKE HIS GAMBITS JEALOUS! BUT YOU AND I, WE HAVE SOMETHING REAL! SOMETHING SPECIAL!

Psh, walking the safe and secure road is for wusses. Men's men walk the road of danger and risk! Even if there is no woman along that road, as long as I walk it, I'll be victorious!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 10:49:56 PM
I still think that this is more entertaining and less of a clusterfuck than the actual game.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 26, 2011, 10:50:03 PM
What is this I don't even.

*Dormio runs away to the safety of the graveyard*
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 26, 2011, 10:54:05 PM
I sadly can't think of a valid reason to ship Dormio with Shadoweh. Not even the twitterposts.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 26, 2011, 10:56:11 PM
Bard, who's that in your avatar? You've switched between him like 3 times in this game. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 10:57:27 PM
It's Just. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 10:58:31 PM
He's from the Cavalier of the Abyss Manwha. Preparations for a CotA themed game are already underway! It's all sorts of fun. You should read it to warm up to it even though knowledge of the theme won't be required. :<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 10:59:03 PM
I sadly can't think of a valid reason to ship Dormio with Shadoweh. Not even the twitterposts.
Which is why you shouldn't do it. :getdown:

No Bardiche, I'm pretty sure Dormio and I are waiting on that vore story about your hat. Just think, you can go in and interchange hat for Shadoweh. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 26, 2011, 11:00:28 PM
What's Cavalier of the whozywhazit?
I could easily google it, but indulge me. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 26, 2011, 11:01:09 PM
Hat >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mafia >> shadoweh



Cavalier of the Abyss is a story of love, trust and ancient evils engaging in gambits.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 11:03:56 PM
Cavalier of the Abyss is a story about Just and how incredibly huggable he is in every panel he appears in while he plots to kill everyone. K4U and I have entire conversations about him consisting of 'eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee' and 'SO CUTE'

Just like Bard ;-;
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 26, 2011, 11:06:13 PM
I meant the medium. :V
I'm just gonna assume manga.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 26, 2011, 11:07:00 PM
Cavalier of the Abyss is a story about Just and how incredibly huggable he is in every panel he appears in while he plots to kill everyone. K4U and I have entire conversations about him consisting of 'eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee' and 'SO CUTE'
I think I spent more time rambling about how awesome everyone's pants are. :V  He IS pretty adorable though. <3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 26, 2011, 11:08:17 PM
What!  pants?  Pfft I'm sold.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Omba on April 26, 2011, 11:13:28 PM
Who cares about Just anyway when there's Depore. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 26, 2011, 11:24:15 PM
Just could take Depore any day of the week @_@ I'm still trying to figure out who that annoying kid is that keeps taking away Just's screentime.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 02:33:16 AM
Well, since this manga is such a hot topic, I guess I'll just have to read it!  =-)  I have sneaking suspicions that Bard will use his godlike mod powers to strike me from the game and obliterate me the second I try to join.  I know! Let's decide this game by how scummy our avatars are:

On that note,

##Vote Omba

This one just kind of hits you after looking at it for a while. With all the blood and stuff.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 27, 2011, 02:36:32 AM
##Vote UncertainKitten

Her avatar is terrible and her thought experiment with it CANNOT END SOON ENOUGH.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 27, 2011, 03:56:54 AM
##Vote: Uncertain Kitten

Yeah that pirate hotlinker thing is bad dood. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: PX on April 27, 2011, 04:03:01 AM
:| Since when did people who weren't in the game able to post?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: WHMZakeri on April 27, 2011, 04:06:52 AM
A loud crash.
The doors to the town hall open in the midst of the night.

A beautiful young woman runs crying, wearing a black tuxedo. A young man follows her, angry, shouting, yelling. "And Keep the damn Tuxedo! I don't need it anymore."
Schezo, who wasn't even taking part in the town's meetings stood by shocked. Shadoweh ran past him, sobbing. The only one there to receive her tears, the only one who's shoulder provided warmth was UncertainKitten, a gruff woman known for her agressive hunting tactics. Tonight, she wore a diamond spectacled gown, the flowed beautifully to her ankles. it shown in the moonlight of the night.
"Shadoweh? What's the matter?" She asked.
"It's Bardiche!" the young woman cried. "I was only being kind to Schezo, but he-" She paused to sniff back her tears "He said I was cheating on him. He said It was only because I loved Schezo more that I would do something like this. I- I would never."
UK patted Shadoweh's back, guiding her into her arms. Shadoweh sobbed quietly onto UK's chest. "It'll be alright, Shadoweh. He'll see the truth soon enough."
Shadoweh pounded futilely onto her shoulders. "How soon is soon?" She demanded.
"Sooner than you'd realize" UK said with a mysterious, yet somehow comforting tone.

"There you are!" Shouted Bardiche. He had stomped up to the pair with Schezo in tow. "I've decided. ##Vote: Shadoweh"
Shadoweh was stunned by this, and could only revert to her town reaction. "What? So- so why? What's your case on me, then?"
"It's simple." Bardiche replied. His tone had an unusual sharpness to it. He intentionally weaponized his words while feigning emotional distance. "For buddying up to Schezo. Since Schezo is town, you're attempting to sway his vote away from you. That's it, isn't it? That has to be." His voice cracked during the last sentence. He could barely hold himself together.
Schezo was the one who butted in. "Whether or not Shadoweh really was buddying up to me, I don't think she believes my vote is swayed that easily."
Shadoweh shook her head and screamed "That's not it at all! Why can't I just be nice? This has nothing to with with me being scum, or with Schezo being town, or even with the relationship you and I shared!"
"Then prove it." Bard Challenged. "Prove it has nothing to do with at least one of those things."
"Very well." Said a cool, calm voice. Shadoweh turned her head around. She still felt the warmth of UK's arm around her shoulder. Without letting go of her hold, UK took a step forward, flipped her dress upwards, and exposed the leg holster hidden underneath. She drew the gun in her free hand, pointed forward,

...And a gunshot rang out in the night.

Shadoweh look onward in shock. "Why...?" She asked. "UK, why did you shoot him?"
"Because" UK tossed her gun to the side. It fell with a clang. "He was scum."
Bardiche's breathing had stopped.
...And then resumed.
He turned around
and Schezo collapsed to the ground, clutching his chest.

Schezo has been killed during the night. He was a Mafia goon

The shock had cause Bardiche to pant, but his breath returned to normal. In the fear of the situation, he let go of his anger, and could see Shadoweh clearly for the first time that night. "I'm sorry, Shadoweh. I should learn to wait until I sort my feelings before making cases."
"Bardiche" Shadoweh said softly. "I'm sorry. I didn't realize Schezo was ..."
"No, it's alright. I believe you didn't know. I... believe you, Shadoweh."
UK Smiled as Shadoweh and Bardiche embraced once again, their misunderstanding behind them, if not ultimately cleared.
"UK..." Bardiche broke their hug, and turned towards her. "Thank you for bring Schezo's flip to light. How can we ever thank you?"
Her reply gave off a somewhat cocky attitude. "You can thank me by finding and rooting out the last scum tomorrow."
The two of them gave each other a confused look. "But, UK, you're so much better than picking them out on instinct. Why are you leaving it to us?"
"I trust you both know what to do tomorrow." Was all she could say. Another pop, no louder than a firework being blown off from down the block resounded in the air. UK fell backwards onto the ground with a sickening crunch. The two rushed to her side.
"Oh god, UK!" Shadoweh cried. "Why? How? How were we suppose to know? UK we"re sorry, we didn't know!"
"It's alright." She said peacefully. "Nobody ever knows. That's why they call me 'UncertainKitten'."
"No!" Shadoweh cried. Bardiche could do nothing but turn away.

UncertainKitten has been killed during the night. She was a Town One-shot Vigilante

UK closed her eyes. Tonight, she wore a ruby spectacled gown.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 27, 2011, 04:12:56 AM
Darnit Zak, I can't do a reread with all these shipping shorts around.
... Urgh, the worst possible idea just plagued my mind. I'll get to work on it later.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 27, 2011, 04:20:30 AM
That was the best. Fanfic. Ever.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Schezo on April 27, 2011, 04:21:59 AM
Dammit!  How did you find out?!  I was... supposed... to be... the secret winner...(that was badass WMZ)

(I'll go away if you want me to since I just appeared in the night when you were talking about me and Edible didn't tell me to stop and go away after the first post.  I guess I am a little intrusive, and took "do whatever" (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613953.html#msg613953) a bit too far as a bystander. >_>; I thought it was fun sorry :< )
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Conqueror on April 27, 2011, 04:22:45 AM
It's okay Schezo, we can all hijack the thread together!

Zak, that was fantastic.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 27, 2011, 04:33:05 AM
The dead send their warmest regards to Zakeri for his amazing and fantastic post.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: PX on April 27, 2011, 04:36:17 AM
I think someone should give him IP. Like Dormio.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 04:57:02 AM
I want this night to eeeeeeeeeeeend.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 05:00:36 AM
I think we all do.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Edible on April 27, 2011, 05:07:32 AM
Should've lynched earlier, then!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 05:22:42 AM
##VOTE: Edible :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: PX on April 27, 2011, 05:23:54 AM
##YuyukoDoll: Edible
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 07:33:19 AM
Why does anyone want it to end ;-; I want this night to last foreeeever <3 At this rate I'll be the one that dies of massive embarrassment attax! Good thing UK is there for me ;~; We should always policy lynch Schezo. FOREVER SCUM! Even if he's sooooo kyoot~!

I think someone should give him IP. Like Dormio.
Uh, you know, we can like, all give him IP together <.< You're cyan too you kitzblurgen!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 27, 2011, 07:39:14 AM
We should always policy lynch Schezo. FOREVER SCUM! Even if he's sooooo kyoot~!
Do this and I might have to consider getting irritated with you. >:(
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Pesco on April 27, 2011, 07:48:19 AM
What the hell is going on in here?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 07:51:46 AM
Hey huh what want to be my co-host for Shipper's Wall Mafia? Pesco said he loves the idea! :D
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 27, 2011, 07:57:51 AM
What the hell is going on in here?
Something amazing.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Edible on April 27, 2011, 03:07:00 PM
Zak, I loved your fanfic, but I had to make one minor correction.

UncertainKitten has been killed during the night. She was a Vanilla Town

Fixed.

It is now Day 3.  You have 72 hours to play.  With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Triumph or die!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 2)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 27, 2011, 03:08:28 PM
Wait, what? I was seriously killed? What the HELL?

Well, have fun guys.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 03:11:02 PM
So this is where I go :derp: at Sect actually flipping scum and me claiming to be his scumbuddy. Ahahahaha... ha. Can't you see how hilarious this is? Are you laughing? I am laughing.

##Vote: Zakeri, for the reasons stated before. Bad jump on Sect looks bad still, it's like a bus! Whoosh!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 03:38:04 PM
Time for some hard maths

I present: The Living!

2) Bardiche
4) Shadoweh
6) Action Dan
7) NeoSerela
8) huh what
9) Hanged Hourai
10) Omba
11) Kiro
12) Polaris (K4U hydra)

Anyway, 9 people total, 7 whose alignments aren't know,

MAY the COP come FORTH!

LET us say he/she cleared 2 people not dead/not already confirmed.  IF not ignore EVERYTHING I HAVE TO SAY

then I think we win. NO MATTER WHAT

9 people 5 confirmed 4 unconfirmed

lynch one kill one.

7 people 4 confirmed 3 unconfirmed

repeat.

5 people 3 confirmed 2 unconfirmed

3 people 2 confimed 1 unconfirmed

BINGO

TOWN WIN!




Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 03:42:49 PM
Normally I hate gaming the setup but that is a surprisingly erudite thought and I find myself drawn to you.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 03:50:15 PM
This also works if the cop at least cleared only one other person (that wasn't me) and everybody assumes I'm town (which should be almost as clear as day at this point).  But since hates banking on ObvTown/ObvScum, I won't push this.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 27, 2011, 03:52:46 PM
I apparently have no idea how to play this game.

Ok, I look super horrible, so I'm gonna try and present an alternate lynch.

##Vote: Polaris

My case on him from yesterday with Dormio still stands. In addition to the only time he mentioned Sect D1 was to have someone explain their thought process on why he's scum.

Then we jump over to D2 where Polaris actually says something on him, and Sect already has 3 votes while everyone else has 1. In that post, you express willingness to lynch him, but disappear for the rest of the day and not do anything.
Plus, your case on me reeks of easy target. Do you still find it valid?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 03:58:49 PM
Anyway.... Not that Zak isn't suspicious, but he is clearly not the guy to go after.

 aside from our two confirmed towns, the day 3 color scale list looks like the day 2 one.

ME!
Shadoweh
Zak
Polaris
HW
Bardiche
Hourai

Bard I thought your priorities were on HH, who didn't even seem willing to mention Sect yesterday (or did he in  his last post? checking later, but if so it was far too late). The vote on Zak seems way to early to think of busing yet.

So, ##Vote Bard, but I'd be willing to change to HH.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 04:08:48 PM
So, no matter what Polaris has done, or said, I still clear him because of the Dormio switch vote.  It was the crucial vote that decided the D1 lynch.  He knew that the Dormio supporters were all up and awake.  I am pretty sure that you guys would have crumbled and voted me (some of you even stated you would *coughshadowehcough*), had it still been 5-5.  I still can't think of any good reason for him to switch to make it 6-4 in my favor.  If he were scum!Polaris he would have waited, let you guys lynch me, had no one suspect him, and on top of that, save a scum and draw attention to my wagon, which would have had 7 people on it.

Tell me that you would seriously vote him over Bard, HH, HW, and hell, zak or even freaking shadoweh. 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 04:11:07 PM
EBWOP: I only put him at red because he has, in many of his posts, felt quite scummy.  BUT his actions are townie, and actions speak louder than words (*coughsectcough*).
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Omba on April 27, 2011, 04:24:34 PM
About the cop thing: It might be a good idea for him to claim now even if he's cleared only 1 other living person; we don't know if ActionDan is town, so we won't have the certain victory we would if the cop had already cleared 2 people, but in exchange, we won't risk the cop getting killed next night before he can claim. Not sure though.

Will re-read later before voting.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 04:34:13 PM
o ya, Omba you didn't sheild UK did you?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 05:29:34 PM
ME!
Shadoweh
Zak
Polaris
HW
Bardiche
Hourai

This is all personal opinion and you shouldn't pass it off as being anything other than that. Moreover, touting how townie you are will either annoy people, or make you look like you deliberately set yourself up for that and it hurts your position more than it supports it.

Quote
Bard I thought your priorities were on HH, who didn't even seem willing to mention Sect yesterday (or did he in  his last post? checking later, but if so it was far too late). The vote on Zak seems way to early to think of busing yet.

Scum lost one of them on D1, and opinion was swaying heavily to lynching Sect - no better time for a bus than right then. I changed my mind while raging about the Sect wagon, so I'm more content with sticking to Zak than to Hourai.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 06:10:49 PM
Bard is town. Don't lynch him.

More on this later.

Top pick for the third scum is Hourai but I like Bard's case on Zak.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 06:11:53 PM
Whatever, I actually just want the cop to claim with at least one other "innocent".  I'm fairly confident that the last scum is either Bard, HH, or HW.  The rest of us pale in comparison to how scummy these 3 are.  My criteria for traits of scumminess are A) if you were on the shadoweh wagon. B) if you were on my wagon.  I am not necessarily compounding the conditions as A+B > B, A+B > A. 

Also, considering the NK.  it is very possible that the last scum roleblocked the cop now or before.

I think HW had the most to gain from a UK NK.  True, he started out the day voting Sect.  But he did so for obvious reasons, yet later targeted HH, who perhaps was the closest thing to a Counter Wagon. Honestly this doesn't tell us that much... but I dunno if "bussing" is a good, reliable reason to vote someone nowadays, I'd vote HW.

And yes, I am town.  And no, Scum!me unfortunately does not have the super cunning to get Scum!Sect to try and attack Scum!me D1 while simultaniously Scum!Dormio establishes damning ties to Scum!Sect, whilst both Scum!Dormio and Scum!me end up on a Scum/Scum wagon D1.

Meanwhile Scum!me tries to NK Kiro, one of my two defenders D1(the other being UK).  Scum!me would have killed the non-contributer Neoserela/Zak.

You may call this WIFOM, I call this "Obvious". 

   
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 06:12:27 PM
CUT

WHATATATATATAT??? OK mr. cop why don't you just claim it?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 06:14:09 PM
##Unvote

and do go on
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 06:18:55 PM
I'm the Town Macho Cop, yes.

I have a few (fairly obvious) crumbs lying around if people don't believe me, and I can explain my early D1 play from the PoV of a power role as well. But this should all hopefully be unnecessary because I can't see myself getting counterclaimed at this juncture because it would effectively out the last scum.

My N1 target was UK. In hindsight it was a really bad choice, but I had recalled reading things about her abusing swing votes and bussing a lot in her scum meta and got paranoid. Though, even if I had targeted somebody else, it probably would have been Sect or Omba, which would have mattered just as little at this point.

N2 I scanned Bardiche, who is town.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 06:21:06 PM
I'm claiming early because Bard seems to be the most obvious lynch today so saving him gives us a confirmed and stops the day from being wasted. Town can likely win without an active cop right now regardless.

Omba should be sure not to waste his protect on me (in case he forgot I'm unprotectable), in case scum decides to keep me alive via roleblocking while picking off a confirmed townie.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 06:23:48 PM
Out of curiousity, did you crumb D1 or D2?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 06:24:15 PM
Both.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 06:30:09 PM
For those who haven't been paying attention, the current people who aren't essentially confirmed town are Shadoweh, Dan, Zakeri, Hourai and Polly. Shadoweh and Dan are probably town, but Zak, Hourai and Polly are all fair game. It should be noted that we could in theory go through the rest of the game by hammering one of those three every day, and we'd even have an extra day left over if the final scum was Shadoweh or Dan by some chance. This obviously isn't the most optimal play, but it's amusing nonetheless.

... Votewise, I'm just going to go with Hourai for now. Most of my case on him was already mentioned here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg616304.html#msg616304) and here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg616340.html#msg616340), and little about Hourai has changed since that post (except Sect flipping scum), so I feel no need to restate it.

##Vote Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 06:34:17 PM
Huh What's claim is believable because he's right.

If he's scum, then the Town Cop needs just counter-claim and we've nailed the third scum. If he's the Town Cop, anyone counter-claiming and getting him lynched would thereafter be immediately lynched as the third scum.

As a result, our list of targets is reduced to the following:
4) Shadoweh
6) ActionDan
7) Zakeri
9) Hanged Hourai
12) Polaris

Of these, I think Zakeri is the most likely to be scum, followed shortly by Hanged Hourai. Should neither flip scum, I'd be inclined to look at Shadoweh, Dan and Polaris more, but not right now. We have four lynches to secure victory, and five targets to pass it around. I think we can do that just fine.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 06:37:44 PM
##Vote Hanged Hourai

Well... objectively I always thought HH was only slightly better than Bard, but lynching Scum!Bard would have been much more satisfying!

If Hourai is Scum at least I can claim FPMH!  I think if you guys are up to it.... well this is a bit much to ask.... plz reread ALL OF SECT, ME, HH, and skip every other post!  Have fun!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 06:38:45 PM
ScumBard would've been hilarious because then the entire scumteam'd claimed on D2.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 06:41:21 PM
I had you pinned as scum because you knew that Sect wasn't the scum roleblocker while scumclaiming (among the reasons I already had for suspecting you).

Except then you ended up being town anyway.  :colonveeplusalpha:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 06:46:00 PM
Is it bad that I was kind of hoping the cop'd check me? I mean, there was a chance you'd get the actual scum! But I always like staying alive to the end of the game!

(Also, I just guessed)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 06:46:49 PM
I figured that if you were town you were gambiting to get the cop to check you so you could possibly get people to stop attacking you.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Omba on April 27, 2011, 06:46:58 PM
ScumBard would've been hilarious because then the entire scumteam'd claimed on D2.
Not to mention you'd have been correctly pinned as scum by two people for all the wrong reasons. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 06:55:38 PM
Lolz I guess some apologies are in order (perhaps from both sides).  Yes, I'm sure I had confirmation bias just oozing out in someplaces of my posts.  I did think that my UK case was weak, but I didn't want to let it go (and not that many people paid it any attention)  Scum of course used it against me *coughsectcough*.  I still think your shadow vote (or at least the way you went about it) was fairly weak, and I'm still ready to at least defend that part of my attacks. 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 06:58:33 PM
Btw, If your name is Hourai, Zak, or Polaris, AND you are scum, I'd suggest waving the white flag, cause I seriously doubt anyone is willing to lynch me or shadoweh over you guys.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 07:02:37 PM
Oh, Since I can PR speculate to my heart's content, I thought that Kiro was the detective, Polaris was the doctor, and Omba was a detective if Kiro wasn't.

... I sure was wrong.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 07:02:55 PM
I figured that if you were town you were gambiting to get the cop to check you so you could possibly get people to stop attacking you.

You know me so well. :V


I'd lynch you just out of spite, Dan. Just out of spite. I was truly frustrated people were arguing I was scum based on evidence that only supported the claim IF you assumed the conclusion was correct. Pygmalion-effect always annoys because you can't defend against it. :V

Then Kiro went, "WIFOM gambits everywhere" and I cried.

Regardless, I want Zak to die first. >_> I can get into a HH lynch but Zakeri is so much more delishus.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 07:10:53 PM
(of course, my plan involved the N1 target actually living and thus netting us more than just Don't Lynch Bard, but wcyd)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Omba on April 27, 2011, 07:13:17 PM
I nearly died of laughter when you made those sarcastic posts. :V
Anyway,

##Vote Hanged Hourai

I think it's best we just get that lynch done quickly. If both HH and Zakeri flip town for some reason, we can go back to actual analysis.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 07:14:39 PM
It's all good to me, as long as the lynch is Hourai, Zak, or Polaris.

Definitely most satisfying for me would be Hourai though, No question.  All that BS between HH and Sect  thrown at me D1 made me rage harder than anything else.  Also I'll get an e-cookie.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 07:16:06 PM
Honestly, I really think that if scum is one of Hourai, Zak or Polaris they should just throw the game, considering that their loss is inevitable at this point and we'd be able to move on if they scumclaimed.

But eh.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 07:20:56 PM
Also, if case of a mislynch, night time should be instantaneous. (and flavor should reflect this :D)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 07:23:38 PM
If Hourai is Scum at least I can claim FPMH!  I think if you guys are up to it.... well this is a bit much to ask.... plz reread ALL OF SECT, ME, HH, and skip every other post!  Have fun!
It was bad enough we had to read it when it was happening ;-; Why would you make us do this again.

I think it's best we just get that lynch done quickly. If both HH and Zakeri flip town for some reason, we can go back to actual analysis.
I'd really rather not skip two days since if you were reading yesterday you'll see I think Polaris is the last scum. I don't think the part where he made one post yesterday and disappeared speaks well for him now, especially after Sect threw in the towel.

##Vote: Polaris

At least we're done trying to lynch Bard for being scum because he must be scum. I thought he was the cop trying to make sure he'd live to Day 3 with his ~*GAMBITS*~ but a huh what is fine too. Will post more when I'm not running out the door for work later.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 07:35:45 PM
I nearly died of laughter when you made those sarcastic posts. :V

I wasn't laughing when I never seemed able to convince you it was reasoning that validated itself on the basis that it was true. :(

You have a point that the Kiro move was silly, but I always like exploring exciting new venues.

That said, Zakeri lynch please. :(
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 07:40:51 PM
WE CAN GAME THIS EVEN MORE!!!

Let me and shadow modkill ourselves. NO WAIT. listen.

doing that we have 9 people 5 unconfirmed, 4 confirmed. Let's kill off me and shadoweh.

now we have... 7 people, 4 confirmed 3 unconfirmed,

lynch one kill one.

5 people, 3 confirmed, 2 not

repeat

3 people, 2 confirmed, 1 not.

BINGO. TOWN WIN.  I'm perfectly willing if shadoweh is, I'll even go first! just agree.  If she doesn't kill herself, then you guys can all hammer her.

Problem, remaining Scum?  :smug:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 07:43:08 PM
Modkills are lame and you are lame for even suggesting it.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 07:45:32 PM
well...... I see nothing wrong with tactics... whatever I've leave the question up to edible.

I doubt this has ever happened before.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 07:47:01 PM
Also I believe the Scum are in Lylo
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Omba on April 27, 2011, 07:53:54 PM
I wasn't laughing when I never seemed able to convince you it was reasoning that validated itself on the basis that it was true. :(
I wasn't laughing either when I realized that...

And please, let's at least finish the game in an orderly fashion without modhax.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 07:57:14 PM
Here's an exciting idea. Let's pretend we don't have high odds of victory and still make elaborate cases and such. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Omba on April 27, 2011, 08:01:02 PM
Zakeri has to be scum because he already knew UK would be killed. It's so obvious! :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 08:05:48 PM
Hey guys it's pouring rain out still so I'm back!

I just glanced at what Dan said and we're not doing that.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 08:07:43 PM
Alright, Alright, I'll make a serious case for Hourai to sway the crowds! I will try to condense the finer points of D1 between Hourai Sect and myself I guess, cause no one else wants to touch it.  The only reason I'm trying to steamroll through the end-game here is that this feels like a chess game where we have the overwhelming advantage of being a queen up yet not ending the game.  It's pure agony for the opponent. (Also a little boring for the victor).
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 08:12:11 PM
Speaking of chess, I was playing with my little brother earlier. I tried to finish the game in three moves, but he saw through my ploy by expertly blocking me with a Rook.

I set my Rook up to protect the Queen for a checkmate, but I needed his Rook gone... and moved my Bishop in his Rook's range. He never questioned my infinite Gambit works. AHAHA

That said, I'll lynch Hanged Hourai only if you promise to lynch Zakeri if Hourai turns up town. :(
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 08:12:16 PM
Also I am officially going to call you Capt.Dan for at least the next two games if you keep playing. It doesn't matter if your plan would work or not. What you just suggested goes against the spirit of the game we're playing. We're playing Mafia, not Super Game the Setup Chessmasters. Make cases, take chances, and make a ton of mistakes, but PLAY MAFIA while you're doing it.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 08:24:55 PM
Quote
That said, I'll lynch Hanged Hourai only if you promise to lynch Zakeri if Hourai turns up town. :(

Fair enough,

Quote
Also I am officially going to call you Capt.Dan for at least the next two games if you keep playing.

Fair enough,

however be warned I play to win games, this is my MO. I haven't been entirely reasonable this game, but I'm not enough using what I consider "tactics" to win them.  I respect strategy, and er.. for lack of a better word/chess analogy, "positioning" (like.. this post feels scummy, this one reeks of townie intent, etc.),  but "tactics" have a place.  For example, let's say HW had scouted say, Bard and Hourai, and found them both to be town.  What would you do?  Still argue when there is the clearest of paths ahead?  I do feel strongly about this concept.   
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 08:29:51 PM
EBWOP: should read:

Quote
I haven't been entirely reasonable this game, but I don't mind using what I consider "tactics" to win.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 08:32:53 PM
What you call tactics would be labeled as 'Cheating' or 'Douchebaggery.' It goes against Rule 11, have fun and play nice. Modkills are a penalty, not a game winning tactic. Process of Elimination is fair, trying to abuse how cheating will get you killed to win is not. Seriously, what you're suggesting is wrong. I'd rather give the scum the game then win that way.

For example, let's say HW had scouted say, Bard and Hourai, and found them both to be town.  What would you do?  Still argue when there is the clearest of paths ahead?  I do feel strongly about this concept.   
I'm going to go out on a limb and say I would keep trying to lynch Polaris. Because I think Polaris is scum! LYNCH POLARIS FOR GAME ENDING PROFITS!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Edible on April 27, 2011, 08:34:08 PM
Modkills are lame and you are lame for even suggesting it.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 08:42:20 PM
Ok, I'll never ever suggest modkills ever again in forever.

I'll get on with my Hourai case.  While I do that how about we all make a post dedicated to our top suspect.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Kiro on April 27, 2011, 08:52:41 PM
Well, these new revelations means I can just focus on 3 people. How nice.

First off, Polaris has #207 which says he'd vote Dormio second. Couple that with the fact that he did shift the lynch from Dan solidly to Dormio and I'm willing to think he's most ok of the 3.

Hourai is still weird. One positive point is that he votes Sect as his first serious vote in Day 1 for reasons I agreed with later. But then he drops off and goes on Dan as if chainsawing over Sect. In the meanwhile, Dormio get lynched and Dan gets psuedo-cleared. So he lost all his traction. Day 2, Hourai goes after Bard for lurking then Polaris. All while Sect is about to eat rope. There's no way this feels like optimal Scum play. If Hourai is Scum, he knows he's either gonna get Copped or be lynched very soon. That's not a winning strategy and he as Scum should know it.

Zakeri: Serela's only post was a UK vote at the beginning. Meh-ish. The kicker with Zakeri is the immediate questioning of Sect in Day 2, but no vote to go with it. Definitely looks like he's trying to avoid committing to it. But then he gets himself onto it as the 4th vote. Perhaps to coincide with things, Sect gives up after that. That's really all there is to him. But I think his play fits Scum trying to win more than Hourai's does. While looking ahead to a possible 9 on 1 scenario, Scum has to be thinking: "I've got to avoid getting Copped, maybe get lucky and hit him tonight, and then BS my way through." Avoiding getting copped probably means not being completely wrong on everything. Zak's play fits that the best: he's the only 1 of the 3 to get Sect right, and yet he was late on the actual vote.

Due to that, I'd probably say Zak, then Polaris, then Hourai. If it came to it, I'd probably lynch Shadoweh over Dan if it got down to that Day. Scum were on both, but both Scum pushed Dan harder.

Bard: I never intended to vote you in Day 2. I thought all your shenanigans meant you were the Cop, and not Scum. So I was a little alarmed when HW made the joke about that. I figured you did what you did to make yourself not an NK target (kinda like Serp in his first game). So I just tried to feed the fire you started knowing full well that we'd still see Sect lynched first. But yes, I was still exasperated.

##Vote Zakeri
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 2)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 08:54:01 PM
Polaris: I might be biased from the start since I never liked his 'forgettable' comment. At least he's easy to read over! The first thing he does is vote for Dan. He stays on Dan for the entire day, making comments on Dan, Omba, Dormio, myself and huh what. Two names that are missing from this list that pertain to Day 2 are Sect and Hourai. His points against Dormio are always secondary to Dan and even when he votes for Dormio he makes it obvious he's still willing to go the other way. His Day 2 post does the same thing with Sect, saying he wouldn't mind a Sect lynch but pursuing Hourai instead. Since Kiro was already voting for Hourai it's possible he saw this as the best viable counter-wagon to Sect.
I would add points based on new posts he's made but you might notice he hasn't MADE any. Everyone's been asking the last scum to surrender. Have you considered maybe he IS surrendering by not posting until he gets modkilled?

Also I asked this question earlier but I'm not sure if Hourai answered it. "His reasoning for unvoting Bardiche is incredibly vague. What about his content was better and made you believe he looked better then Polaris? " Just link me if you did please.

capt.Dan, everything you've done until now has been understandable from a newbie perspective, but if you don't want to be policy vigged or spend every game until LYLO (Unless you get policy lynched) being kicked in the balls by Town, don't ever, ever suggest anything close to breaking the rules or gaming the setup ever again. I'm dead serious. I will shoot you in the face. Every game.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 09:09:21 PM
Hmm, after pondering things over a bit more, I think I'd actually rather see Zak die than Hourai, or at least from a vote analysis standpoint. It makes more sense if the Dan wagon was started by two townies (Hourai and Polly) and then used as refuge for scum after the Shadoweh hate died down rather than all three scum being on the Dan wagon. Bard and Kiro have already covered the actual case on Zak quite nicely so I have nothing to contribute to it beyond that.

##Unvote
##Vote Zakeri

This is probably a kind of sudden switch, but I dunno, the current situation we're in has kind of made me go :effort: (and I think that it has done that for a lot of the town). I'll try to take another look at Polly soon too.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 09:13:09 PM
Quote
First off, Polaris has #207 which says he'd vote Dormio second. Couple that with the fact that he did shift the lynch from Dan solidly to Dormio and I'm willing to think he's most ok of the 3.

This is precisely why I'm giving him a clear over the other two.  I see shadoweh's point, but it's hard to see Polaris make moves like the dormio vote switch (that vote switch was the single most damaging thing to the scum team), as Scum!Polaris. 

Small point- NeoSerela was definitely not here for last minute vote squabbling, correct? Doesn't much change things anyway I guess.

Quote
capt.Dan, everything you've done until now has been understandable from a newbie perspective, but if you don't want to be policy vigged or spend every game until LYLO (Unless you get policy lynched) being kicked in the balls by Town, don't ever, ever suggest anything close to breaking the rules or gaming the setup ever again. I'm dead serious. I will shoot you in the face. Every game.

I do not want to suffer your anger! Spare me plz!  :)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Omba on April 27, 2011, 09:14:39 PM
I'm fine with either a Zakeri or a HH lynch, so

##Unvote
##Vote Zakeri


I think he's at L-1 now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Pesco on April 27, 2011, 09:15:43 PM
Just bringing it up that you'll get Modkilled from RPG permanently.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 09:17:34 PM
Alright I thought I would make a case on Hourai using D1 stuff.  But maybe that is just simply not the way to go (After all I should learn my lesson with Bard).

Kiro's behavioral analysis plus HW's VCA actually are quite telling.  I guess the best apology I can give bard is voting with him!

##Unvote
##Vote Zakeri

If this fails I guess I'll present a case on HH on D4.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 09:18:59 PM
Quote
Just bringing it up that you'll get Modkilled from RPG permanently.

Wait... is this a conditional statement or is this in affect?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 09:19:56 PM
Quote
Bard: I never intended to vote you in Day 2. I thought all your shenanigans meant you were the Cop

That would actually have been cool to do as cop. Although, fun fact:

I (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg610921.html#msg610921) - actually (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611008.html#msg611008) - roleclaimed (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611046.html#msg611046) - Vanilla (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611086.html#msg611086) - already (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611129.html#msg611129)! First word in each post. :V :derp:

Yay, Zakeri kill~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 09:21:18 PM
..Did you just hammer Zak before he got a chance to post today?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 09:21:37 PM
Hm, I don't think Polly switching to Dormio really clears him like Kiro said. He said he thought town wasn't going to get a majority on Dan, and in this game a no majority means that scum loses as well as town.

Otherwise, he doesn't look as bad as Hourai and Zak do. Despite the lurking, he was at least vigilant at getting his opinions out (especially against Dormio despite being on the Dan wagon), and I honestly can't see strong ties to the two flipped scum we have like I can with the other two possibilities. I'm not saying I can't see scum!Polly at all, but he's my lowest priority right now (apart from Shadoweh and Dan).

Also lmao at superbreadcrumber!Bard striking again.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 09:22:10 PM
... Oh, I thought Dan was the L-1 vote, not the hammer.

<_____<

Well, I guess that post was completely illegal. Sigh.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Edible on April 27, 2011, 09:22:38 PM
Votecount schmotecount, I have a bazooka.

Zakeri (5) - Bardiche, Kiro, huh what, Omba, ActionDan
Polaris (2) - Hourai, Shadoweh

Zakeri is at L-0!

Zakeri was lynched!  He was a townsperson.

It is now Night 3.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Conqueror on April 27, 2011, 09:23:19 PM
Dan the next time you come over I am going to throw you out the balcony wtf was that nvm I'm not even in the game bye.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 09:23:30 PM
I didn't look at Omba's post before posting
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 09:23:39 PM
:<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 09:24:24 PM
:<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 09:25:52 PM
hmmm, well that was silly, I will try to heed that warning next time... T_T
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 27, 2011, 09:26:10 PM
:<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Omba on April 27, 2011, 09:26:28 PM
:<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Conqueror on April 27, 2011, 09:27:32 PM
Lazy ass confirmed townies.  ;)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 09:30:08 PM
probably too game-related so whatever removed

Bluh.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 09:30:23 PM
 :V

I mean

:<

....sorry
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 3)
Post by: WHMZakeri on April 27, 2011, 09:32:48 PM
[redacted]

Okay, thanks for letting me defend myself and make a case on the other suspects. :colbert:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 09:36:47 PM
:<

Scum Zak probably wouldn't have wrote a story about who he was going to kill last night either. I still wuv you, it makes up for the three games I've been waiting for my sonnets! ;~;
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Conqueror on April 27, 2011, 09:37:21 PM
Zakeri has been defenestrated for slow posting.

I am reminded of GDC mafia.

Oh sonnets, right, heh.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Bardiche on April 27, 2011, 09:37:58 PM
Well, see you when night phase ends.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 09:39:05 PM
Oh sonnets, right, heh.
>:C
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 09:40:02 PM
Quote
##Vote: Capt.H

Quote
Cut: What the hell Zak. I hate you.

:D anyone remember? (not that the circumstances were the same at all.... but STILL!)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on April 27, 2011, 09:42:29 PM
Wait, when did K4U replace Polly entirely?

I never noticed that.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Edible on April 27, 2011, 09:44:00 PM
Effective immediately.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Conqueror on April 27, 2011, 09:48:03 PM
@Dan: I was more reminded of this.

It doesn't matter who we lynch (Besides Edible) does it? IF Dormio is scum, we would win, wouldn't we? If he's town, we'll still win, wouldn't we?

##Vote: Dormio
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 27, 2011, 09:48:30 PM
You derpaholics.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Schezo on April 27, 2011, 09:50:29 PM
Gah. UK just didn't shoot me cleanly. I'm still alive and counting as the third scum until you lynch me again or something. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 27, 2011, 09:50:46 PM
You derpaholics.

Derpguzzlers >=[
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Conqueror on April 27, 2011, 09:53:02 PM
Gah. UK just didn't shoot me cleanly. I'm still alive and counting as the third scum until you lynch me again or something. :V

Solution is clearly to lynch the mod. He lied about the setup, obv.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Edible on April 27, 2011, 09:53:20 PM
Gah. UK just didn't shoot me cleanly. I'm still alive and counting as the third scum until you lynch me again or something. :V

It is now Night 3!

Not voting: Everyone

With Schezo alive, it takes 0 to lynch him.

Schezo was lynched!  He was about as relevant to this game as Roukanken!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 27, 2011, 09:53:51 PM
O ya, the post restriction game! 

Dormio: I didn't get one?

##Vote Dormio
##Vote Dormio
##Vote Dormio
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 27, 2011, 09:55:13 PM
Obviously the last scum is Edible and this is a bastard mod game. We all should have listened to UK in her first post!

I'VE BEEN TRYING TO SAY THIS SINCE BEFORE CONQUEROR STOLE MY IDEA STOP CUTTING ME DAMNIT
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Kiro on April 27, 2011, 10:08:49 PM
Jesus Christ. I go do work for an hour with the game at L-3, come back and it's Night. Zak seriously got shafted, man that is so uncool.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 12:17:43 AM
Eh... Mia culpa....

@Mod, if and when all night actions are submitted, will the night end? Is there a grace period after all actions? Or will it end only after ~24 hours (N2 lasted ~20)?

Note: I'm NOT asking this to try and do something crazy like monitor everyone's activity times. But this night is kinda.. er.. well w/e.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 12:23:43 AM
eh nvm it's nestled in rule 1)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 12:23:57 AM
The word you're looking for is ZZZZZZZzzzZZzzzZZZZZ
This is what you get when you hammer the entertainment ;-;
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 28, 2011, 12:37:18 AM
Hey Edible, I hope you don't mind that I never posted on D3.  I'm not lurking, promise! :V

brb, banging my head against the wall
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 3)
Post by: Polaris on April 28, 2011, 12:56:13 AM
Hi I am back from school late and I'm ready to po--

...

Well this sucks.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Edible on April 28, 2011, 03:38:32 AM
A mysterious force causes the earth to rotate faster!

CHIRP CHIRP IT'S DAY 4

Perhaps unsurprisingly, huh what died last night!  He was the macho cop.

72 hours.  7 alive, 4 to lynch.  Get to it.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 28, 2011, 03:43:50 AM
I think everyone else should shut up and let K4U get the first bits of conversation going today.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 28, 2011, 03:52:41 AM
Give me a bit to reread the game.  I've only sort of been keeping up with it.  All the content so far is...about 98% Polly's.  I only had a few questions I wanted answered D1 (for clarification, my questions were "what does 'interesting' mean Dan?" and "can you tell me a bit more on how you feel about UK Omba?"  The former because "interesting" doesn't mean anything and the latter because I felt like Omba was trying to have it both ways with UK and I wanted him to clarify, might also be because I had a complete brain crash ED1 and I just didn't remember him answering more throughly).  Beyond that, I just gave him ideas on where to look and stuff.  I didn't help him write posts.

Should have the reread done in a few hours.  In the mean time, I'd be happy to answer any questions anyone has.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 28, 2011, 04:00:14 AM
Do you believe Polaris's case on me (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615334.html#msg615334) being courteous + my interactions with Dormio are valid given the case I have on his interactions with Dormio (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg616089.html#msg616089)?

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 04:07:22 AM
I have no questions until you actually tell me what your opinions are. On people that aren't Super Townie like the two you mentioned.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 28, 2011, 04:19:41 AM
Do you believe Polaris's case on me (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615334.html#msg615334) being courteous + my interactions with Dormio are valid given the case I have on his interactions with Dormio (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg616089.html#msg616089)?
I'm not quite sure what you want me to say here.  It's not like Polly was ever going to think he was scum since he knows he's not.  He realized that the Dormio flip made him look bad.  I told him to check out people off the wagon because that was a pretty good place to look for scum.  It's entirely possible that you were just wrong like he was, but I don't see how it's unreasonable for him to think that you were scum considering the circumstances.

So, put simply, Dormio's flip did make you look bad.  It made Polaris look bad.  I don't see why him attacking you was wrong.  As for his case, I think the point on you apologizing was nit-picky and the last point (about you asking questions) was incredibly silly, but I don't have a problem with this second point (you saying his vote was not bad, but calling it bad).

@Shadoweh: There were no opinions in that post. :V  I just wanted to clarify what the things I myself did.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 04:29:31 AM
That just means I have nowhere to go from at all until you post more. You obviously understand why you look bad right now. Mainly I'm wondering who YOU think is scum, and if it's still Hanged Helper over there.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 28, 2011, 06:00:30 AM
Bard, Kiro and Omba are confirmed town.  Nothing else needs to be said there. 

As it stands Hourai > Dan > Shadoweh

The roleblocker is the only scum left alive right now.  This is also the most valuable scum.  I'm finding it very unlikely that the goons would want to kill it off early when BOTH the cop and the doc were still alive.  Seriously, cop + doc with no roleblocker would be the worst thing ever.  So:

Hourai: Was not really mentioned by either of the goons.  He wasn't on the Dormio wagon D1 (only person that isn't a confirmed townie from my perspective to not be on it).  Wasn't on the Sect wagon D2.  Didn't even MENTION Sect until he suicided D2.

Dan: The fact that he was Dormio's counter-wagon gives him enormous town-cred in my book.  The fact that Dormio didn't want to vote him to save himself lessens that a bit, but I still think that 2 competing scum wagons D1 would be incredibly weird.  I don't really like a lot of his posts, and I feel like his posting style is extremely reactionary (his D1 cases were basically anyone that attacked him, anyone that attacked someone that thought he was town, anyone that attacked Sect and anyone that was a popular wagon at the time), but I am willing to give him a pass because of the counter-wagon thing.

Shadoweh: I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!  I don't see how Shadoweh being scum could possibly work.  He posts read as very town motivated to me in general, AND BOTH goons were on her for a while D1.  I think Dormio really wanted her lynched too.  I think the only reason he got off Shadoweh was because he realized he had a "better case" on UK.  I'm satisfied with her reasons for being on the Dormio wagon and off the Sect wagon.  I cannot see scum!Shadoweh.

##Vote Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 28, 2011, 06:19:56 AM
Right, can't say I didn't see that coming. As it stands, me, Dan, and Kitten are the only ones really viable to be scum at this point.

If it is Kitten, then getting a replacement this far in the game for scum is plain BS. She's not getting lynched today, pretty much.

Process of elimination leaves me or Dan for today. I know I am not scum.
##Vote: Dan

I don't really have much left to say on the matter. I would be glad to answer questions though, if anyone has them.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 06:40:03 AM
So uh, Hourai, if you actually want to be not thrown out the door faster then Zak you might want to make a case to back up that vote for the rest of us that think you just might be scum. Maybe. Consider it the answer to the question, how do you justify Dan as scum? Also, can you come up with a reason to clear Kitten4u better then replacing in? Because it seriously looks like you just got scared by your target turning into someone who can out-argue you. I would vote you right now but I fear our mighty duo of hammerers would make even L-2 the danger zone.

Kitten4me: I don't know if I can judge that properly. :S Obviously it sounds good to me. Can you explain why Polaris favored a Dan lynch over a Dormio lynch at the end of Day 1?

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 06:41:40 AM
This post is being followed by sleep! Leave your answers in the postbox so Shadoweh can pick them up in the morning~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 28, 2011, 07:02:51 AM
It's hard for me to say tbh.  I only kind of remember D1 (again, I had a complete brain crash pretty early), and there isn't that much back and forth in the QT for me to reread.  From what I remember, he felt like Dan was being dismissive of cases and cared more about looking town than finding scum.  His complaints on Dormio were that he was really reportery and didn't say much.  He thought the former was worse than the latter.

It may also be partially my fault.  I 1.) didn't want my opinions to color his too much and 2.) was having trouble reading the game.  Once he gave some opinions on people I was willing to give some of my own, but not before.  He gave opinions on Dan way sooner than Dormio, so he got my opinions on Dan way sooner.  I really did not like Dan D1.  I still don't like his posts and I'm really only clearing him because of the counter-wagon thing.  Dormio I had a much less solid read on.  His D1 posts always confuse me, so I did what I did with him in every other game I've been town in: ignored him completely.  So, it's also very possible that because I had solid opinions on Dan, but not Dormio, that he thought Dan was more likely to be scum.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Bardiche on April 28, 2011, 11:22:48 AM
Omba should probably protect one of Kiro, himself and me tonight. Don't share whether you can or cannot self-protect. <3

I could get on-board with a Dan lynch because I still raeg at his forced case, but uh. Uh. K4mi, Hourai or Dan. We have two more lynches we can do. Hourai was my second-favourite after Zakeri, so yeah.

It's amusing scum can still win this game if town derps and mislynches too often, haha.

##Vote: Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Omba on April 28, 2011, 11:55:27 AM
We have two more lynches we can do.
It's 3 unless I overlooked something. There's 3 confirmed and 4 unconfirmed, so we'd end up with 1 confirmed 2 unconfirmed for the last day.

I'm going to vote HH later, barring something unexpected happening.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 12:25:09 PM
Yes, but Bard, and this is more important to me from my selfish perspective of thinking Polaris was worse then Hanged Helper, do you think Kitten4all here is sounding like the Town or like the Scum? As much fun as skipping down the road to orderly lynching seems to be I'd like it if we actually answered silly questions like that. I will flip tables if Hourai gets lynched before he can answer me.

Kitten4u: So what were your opinions when Day 2 came around? Polaris seemed to have an opinion on Sect alright, that he wasn't interesting, and then nothing at all. Did any discussion or thinking happen after Sect eloquently told us what he was?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Bardiche on April 28, 2011, 12:34:32 PM
It's 3 unless I overlooked something. There's 3 confirmed and 4 unconfirmed, so we'd end up with 1 confirmed 2 unconfirmed for the last day.

I'm going to vote HH later, barring something unexpected happening.

Enter the night with 5/1, next day is 4/1, we lynch and end up at 3/1, -- oh, right. You're absolutely right.

We can lynch all unconfirmed.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Bardiche on April 28, 2011, 12:36:41 PM
-1. Wait, we have to think. FFFFFFFFFFF.

Anyway, Shadoweh, I think HH is worse than K4me, who sounds reasonable. Polaris sounded reasonable to me, too.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 28, 2011, 12:46:32 PM
I remember having a lot of thoughts on who was town, but not so much on who was scum.  I wasn't expecting to have to replace in like this, so I really wasn't keeping up with the game at all. :V  I mean, I was reading the posts, but I wasn't thinking all that hard.  I barely remembered anything from D1, and I really didn't want to reread all that so I didn't.  Opinions from D2 were Polly's, I just gave him ideas on where to look.  As for who those people were in no particular order: HW, UK, Zak, Dan, Omba, Kiro, Shadoweh.  I guess I would have gone after someone not on that list.

As for Polly, he really didn't talk to me at all.  Really, he's lazier with this game than I am. :V  The only things he said in the QT D2 was "I want to read HW, but he's boring," "Kiro, UK, Shadoweh and Omba are town," "I don't want to lynch Bard, Zak or HW because they're smart."  Soooooo yeah.  I have no idea why he thought Hourai was worse than Sect.  His opinion on Sect after he suicided can be summed up as "wat."
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 01:53:07 PM
I didn't think lazier was possible <.< If those are all true I am so sorry I didn't ask for your hydra instead. Waiting on Kiro and Hourai now, and.. I'd swear there was someone else playing. Someone really hyperactive and postalicious. It's been so eerily silent that I must be mistaken! :P
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 28, 2011, 02:05:22 PM
Right, to clarify, I find the Cat most likely to be scum, based of Polaris, at this point, more so than Dan. But we aren't going to get a lynch on her today, out of the question. I do wish that tomorrow, you lynch her.

The Dan vote is basically a not-me thing. Buy yeah, I saw how today was going to play out.
 
Now that that's said, I'm ok with getting lynched at this point.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 02:16:14 PM
Or you could like not make a case on anyone and give up, that's cool too I guess no it isn't IF YOU'RE ACTUALLY TOWN FIGHT LIKE A TOWNIE AND GIVE US SOMETHING TO WORK WITH HERE!

If you think Kitten is the scum and not Dan then why are you voting for Dan in the first place?!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 02:17:17 PM
Hint the answer to this question is not K4U is too cute to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 28, 2011, 02:24:05 PM
Cause the cat isn't getting lynched today. No one is going to want to kill the replacement the first day they walk in. starting a wagon on her now would be fruitless. Dan is the only viable alternate wagon to my own. Besides, I've been everyone's second scumpick for the entire game. It would take an analytic miracle I'm not capable of to prevent my death. I really don't think there's anything I can to to stop it now.

I've stated why I think Polaris is scum. Go off that if you want when I'm dead.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 28, 2011, 02:24:37 PM
That, and the fact she's too cute to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 28, 2011, 02:32:22 PM
I walked into this totally prepared to die.  My situation is just as hopeless as yours and it's not stopping me from trying to get scum lynched. :/
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 02:34:24 PM
brb buying tables so I can flip them. >:(
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Omba on April 28, 2011, 02:39:44 PM
brb buying tables so I can flip them. >:(
Hey, at least you got some kind of answer. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 28, 2011, 02:41:28 PM
Oi.
##Unvote
##Vote: Polaris4U


I made a case on why I think s/he's scum and now I'm voting him/her. I don't know what else I can do at this point.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 03:36:57 PM
Quote
I made a case on why I think s/he's scum and now I'm voting him/her. I don't know what else I can do at this point.

I have the funniest feeling that if UK was here she'd say: You can dieeeeeeeeeeeeee~

anyway... I'll look over the cases more seriously, but I cannot see polaris as scum easily.  Just warning everyone my vote will be placed on HH most likely.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 03:39:58 PM
just in case I obtain the conviction to vote without thinking, could a votecount be posted?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Edible on April 28, 2011, 03:57:36 PM
Oh, fine.

Votecount Scrolls 5: Skyrim

Hanged Hourai (2): Kitten4U, Bardiche
Kitten4U (1): Hanged Hourai

Not voting: Omba, Shadoweh, Kiro, Action Dan

7 alive, 4 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 28, 2011, 05:15:53 PM
Ergh, before I decide on Polaris vs Hourai, I'm curious about something I saw awhile ago which clicked again when I see Hourai's initial vote on Dan.

Sect's first Day 2 posts were posted ahead of time. He says that at the beginning and the timestamps agree. That's kinda ok... except he did this as Scum! And they were long posts #298 and #299. WHY?! Why would he put in the effort to do this on a game that stressed him out to the core and where he pretty much threw in the towel? Why make that last ditch effort? Furthermore, there's a high chance he discussed this with his final scumbuddy during night chat. What would the purpose be?

He posts a case on Dan. Rereading it, it looks rather decent. There's good effort there. But here's Dan's response in #300.

Sect:

First, your opinions might have been valid day one, and that's a big maybe, but they have absolutely no place after Dormio's flip.

I'll get into your first post later,

Unless you think Scum wanted to go into a scum/scum wagon D1, I'm confirmed town right after UK, the first person to Call out Dormio. 

Notice the acknowledgment of points, but the quick dismissal that it doesn't matter. And I don't recall a followup to Sect's Day 2 post there Dan. Also the cocksureness of that second quote is now irking me. I'm sensing a huge bus.

We as Town are supposed to get things right and lynch Scum. There are 4 viable targets today. Final question, do we play it safe and lynch Hourai and K4U first, then finalize on the Occam Razors of Dan/Shadoweh? Or do we chance Dan first, then go Hourai/K4U? The latter almost automatically gives a Scum Shadoweh the victory while the former splits the chance between Scum Dan and Scum Shadoweh. I want to say the former because we can do it with no reprecussions, but I'm getting a really BAD feeling about Dan now. While we still got a sizable amount of Townies alive, I want to discuss the worst case scenario that Dan or Shadoweh is the last one.

Because of all of the above, I don't feel like thinking about K4U or Hourai yet.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 05:51:14 PM
My case on HH boils down to.... associative tells between Hourai and Sect.  If you guys want more details I'm go into it, but for now I'll get the basics down.

The first [ur=http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611036.html#msg611036l]vote[/url] HH places is on Sect. To me this looks rather forced, and I think the reasons for voting are not great, but I'll admit this is nothing terrible.  Everyone wants to place a vote down for some reason, HH just nitpicked on little stuff. W/e.. Both me (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611064.html#msg611064) and shadoweh (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611122.html#msg611122) called Hourai on it.  This leads to a very strong reaction (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611451.html#msg611451).  This reactionary post  does a few things.  It reaffirms the first, forced case on Sect while A) prodding Sect in a rather obvious way to "make a case," which presumably was all Hourai wanted to hear from Sect.  B) It turns an "attack against Hourai" into a "defense of Sect,"  by adding motives like "you are contradicting yourself or don't want people attacking Sect," and C) serves as the starting point for a vote on me due to dubious reasons (defending someone who I never tired to defend).

So all this looks like IIoA, or there abouts.  So why are there associative tells? getting to it.  First none of them (Sect and HH) directly answer the others concerns.. It's always through a medium.  This is probably why shadoweh was so confused. 

A.k.a when Hourai asks Sect for a case: Sect doesn't start out with: "Hourai, I think..."  It's always, "so this is what I think shadoweh.." anyway to use an analogy, it felt as if Sect and Hourai were playing a game of ping pong where Shadoweh was the ball.  This is exactly how I felt later.  Similarly, Hourai never presses Sect again, ever, after the ED1.  In fact I would even call the pair defensive over one another.

The first true signs of it come from this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611621.html#msg611621) by Sect.  Sect acknowledges the question from HH, yet answers only very weakly, and I see no bones about it from HH's side.  However, that doesn't stop HH from attacking me over Sect  again in what I can only consider a ridiculous post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612284.html#msg612284) where HH construes every word I utter as motivated to defend Sect.

cut by Kiro, I thought I made a very quick reply to Sect's 2nd post, in fact wasn't it that one?? you know the one UK went *headdesk* on? I felt quite strongly at the time that Sect's points were weaker than charlie sheen's torpedo tour.  I'll give a more detailed opinion if you want later.

Where was I? O yes.. then Sect votes me and asks this "Dan! Why am I the focal point behind your attack on Bardiche and your defense against HH?" (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612492.html#msg612492)
I just don't get it. At all. This is why I thought Sect had ties to Bard, because this question is just....  Let's skip the first part and answer the 2nd, a.k.a "Dan! Why am I the focal point behind your defense against HH?"

Two things: 1) Sect deliberately interpreted framed the question as a "defense" instead of a attack. 2) Did Sect really forget that Hourai is claiming I am defending him? Of course not. This is some sort of protection of HH, in a really odd manner.  Anyway these are the basics and I am well over the word limit.  But HH and Sect are just too damn friendly for my tastes.

There is also that slip form HH later.. which now reads a little like HH knew Sect was Scum..  more on this later.

 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 28, 2011, 06:09:46 PM
Dan: Your case on Hourai isn't anything new. Yes, he could very well be Scum although framing the case primarily by these so called associative tells that "Hourai knew Sect was Scum" doesn't make it strong on its own. Hourai could very well have thought Sect was Town and chose not to acknowledge him; I was thinking that during Day 2. Also, build your cases on vote history and patterns first before worrying about possible scumslips. I did something like that once before and it cost us the game in PC-98 Mafia.

Also, opinions on Shadoweh please. If you are Town, I want you to think ahead and realize that if we get to LYLO, it'll be you, Shadoweh, and a confirmed Townie. Give us a case on why Shadoweh could be Scum over you.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 06:16:13 PM
Kiro: That WIFOM is alot easier from my perspective, but my opinion is a little biased about who you should choose if it came down to it. I hope it won't. I would pick Hourai over Kittens at this point after his giving up case, and Kitten over Dan. None of the situations you pose should guarentee anyone a win, it would come down to whoever's still alive.
Are you phrasing this argument in my favor on purpose?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 06:23:02 PM
Really, I'm not interested in setting our lynches in stone. Lynch whoever you think is scum, at that point in time.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 06:27:02 PM
Kiro: the scumslip thing I'm talking about comes a later (when both me and Hourai went to point-quote-point arguing).

I've thought about shadow, and it's very hard for me to think of her as scum... The best I can do is 2nd guess vote-count analysis.  D1: HH----->Sect------>HW-----> Dormio.   It's fairly straightforward.  I find it really hard to believe that the scumteam would all vote each other without reservations D1.  Sect/Shadow relations don't tell as much as Dormio/Shadow relations which were pretty much at a standstill. Let's say it's a bus. At that point in the game, If I were scum Dormio I would see no reason to change my vote on Scum Shadow after waiting so so long.  I just can't see scum Dormio taking the chance that another wagon would jump up (mine) where he could conveniently switch his vote.  Her D2 voting record was Bard---->UK---->no one, I think?  It wasn't exactly all that distracting, but I dunno, the most questionable of all her actions?.. W/e If Shadoweh is the last scum, then freaking good job! 

You know, I'll post the HH slip up shortly so everyone can see it in a clearer light.   cut-cut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 06:47:19 PM
Correct. I would have voted Sect but he was already at L-1 by that point and he got hammered while I was at work. Not that anyone else was going to get hammered at that point. Despite what Kiro tricked me into thinking he considered with Bard. >.> I would've been so mad if I came home and Bard was gone.

Thanks but I'm not the last scum ^-^;
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 06:58:24 PM
Alright, I'm sure everyone's gonna hate me for doing this... BUT IT MUST BE DONE.

Definitions:  Post #143, "my case" on HH, (this is not exactly how I stated it, but w/e we are going with it (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612264.html#msg612264);
HH's Response following "my case" (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612284.html#msg612284)

Ok then, with those as references I shall begin:  In this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613288.html#msg613288)  HH thinks I think Sect is derpscum by the time of my case post #143.  I only claim this in post #169
But HH insists... (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613358.html#msg613358)
But I clarify (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613406.html#msg613406) what "case" I'm talking about and why HH is not making sense to me.
and then minces words.. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613639.html#msg613639)

To be honest this was really really clear at the time.. Now I have to run and I posted this quickly.. I still feel strong about this so leaving it up.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 06:59:47 PM
And also ##Vote Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Edible on April 28, 2011, 07:02:28 PM
Thou Shalt Not Covet Thy Neighbor's Votecount

Hanged Hourai (3): Kitten4U, Bardiche, Action Dan
Kitten4U (1): Hanged Hourai

Hanged Hourai is at L-1!

Not voting: Omba, Shadoweh, Kiro

7 alive, 4 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 28, 2011, 07:04:39 PM
Shadoweh: Let me ask you the same question too then. If it were between you and Dan, make the case how Dan is more likely Scum than you?

When I think about you, you did a pressure vote on Sect and cleared him without explanation right away. And you avoided Sect in Day 2, instead deciding on UK. No, I haven't done the reread on you yet which is why my initial Day 4 post does seem to be framed in your favor. The 3rd vote on Dormio boosted his wagon, but I still think Dan's was higher at the time. So it perhaps gave you Town cred with the possibility that we wouldn't actually see the Dormio lynch come to fruition on Day 1. You can correct me on parts I'm wrong about, but I don't have time to do the full reread on you yet.

At that point in the game, If I were scum Dormio I would see no reason to change my vote on Scum Shadow after waiting so so long.  I just can't see scum Dormio taking the chance that another wagon would jump up (mine) where he could conveniently switch his vote.

I disagree with that first point. Dormio might have made a mistake and underestimated the pressure put on Scum Shadoweh. He looked agreeable to me on his first post. From there, he goes off on a tirade about me and UK. Don't know why? Maybe looking for dirt on somebody else? I need to reread again why he decided to switch off. And I think my earlier observation about lynching Shadoweh over you still holds. When it comes down to the end of the Day, whoever Scum wanted dead more at deadline "probably" was Townie, especially considering how difficult that wagon was to move.

Yeah, feeling weird about you two all over again. If there's one person I want to clear as Townie for gut reasons, it's Hourai for reasons I stated in start of Day 3. And I have to think about K4U/Polaris more.

*this is gonna be one of those Days*

Dan: Unvote now. I don't want an accidental hammer. There are things to discuss. Bard, Omba, and K4U have not put in their comments yet. I know your stance. Leave the vote off for now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 07:11:40 PM
##Unvote

:D Lucky I came back!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 07:21:36 PM
Well the part where he just put a vote down tempting someone to hammer instead of us actually having this conversation is pretty damn scummy Dan cut it out!

I've been considering it actually, since everything else about this game has been seven levels of wrong. The weirdest point for me between Dormio and Dan was the part where Dormio literally didn't want to support his own 'town' counter-wagon. He tried to start a wagon on UK that was never going to go anywhere instead of saving himself.  I wouldn't come at this from proving Dan is scum, the only reason people have cleared him is because he's confirmed town via being the counter-wagon. As he's reminded us over and over. The thing is, what was he actually a counter-wagon to when his wagon started in the first place?

Massive Facepalm Votecount

Bardiche (1) - Action Dan
Shadoweh (2) - Dormio, huh what
UncertainKitten (1) - NeoSerela
huh what (3) - UncertainKitten, Omba, Shadoweh
Action Dan (4) - Hanged Hourai, Polaris, Sect, Bardiche
Dormio (1) - Kiro

Not voting:

~22 hours remain in the Day.  With 12 alive, 7 are required to lynch.

In theory, if Dan is scum, then everyone on his wagon at this point was town except Sect. He wasn't originally a counterwagon to Dormio, he was a wagon beside our Town Cop. From my perspective, the wagon on huh what suddenly disappeared and became an all-town wagon on Dormio. If we're considering the entire scum team being made of newbies, why aren't we considering that the newbies managed to be seperately bad enough to become dual Scum Wagons? Sect's vote can be explained not as a bussing, but by Sect really, really hating his scum partner. He could have just given up when he saw no one else wanted to lynch Dan anymore.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 07:23:15 PM
Those are suposed to be bolds instead of strikes. >.< Why can I not type words.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 07:30:08 PM
Of course since everyone else on his wagon was five-hundred times scummier I'd rather lynch THEM. Dan still seems like an obvtown newbie to me.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Omba on April 28, 2011, 07:47:30 PM
I'm almost tempted to say whoever ends up having to decide between Shadoweh and Dan should flip a coin. On the one hand, I can't really see Shadoweh as scum from what I remember, on the other hand the massive amount of :gambit: involved if Dan is scum is making my head spin. But then losing through coin flip totally sucks, so :re-reading:.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 07:55:22 PM
Shadoweh would appreciate if no one did that and made choices based on actual mafia instead ;-;
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 08:01:42 PM
Oh I have more words now.

If we want to get technical Kiro, Omba as the doctor is the only real confirmed town. There's technically still a chance of you being scum. As the roleblocker you could have blocked the nightkill, gambitting that the Doctor would protect you. This would be impossible to prove and you'd win the game even if you made it to LYLO. The odds of this actually being true are astronomical, but for the sake of considering every possibility I feel the need to point this out.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 08:02:35 PM
Quote
Well the part where he just put a vote down tempting someone to hammer instead of us actually having this conversation is pretty damn scummy Dan cut it out!
Hehe, I thought it would be better if I just placed down my vote while we had the extra room.  And yes, it's super super tempting to hammer! :D

Well.. not to say we should waste days, but if everyone who is not HH/Polaris/K4U is fine with HH/Polaris dying before Dan/Shadow, I don't think much could come out of these lynches that would help determining our alignments (Dan/shadow).  Think what you will, but if one of us is scum... there is just so much ample evidence to convict HH/Polaris that both of us could point to.  And none of that evidence really distinguishes much between me and shadoweh, because our situations are so similar (kinda/sorta, scum targets etc.). 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 08:12:35 PM
Lol, Gambits! I am so curious as to what the dead QT is saying.

Even if no one had even spoken one word this entire game..  I still think HH's vote choices are vastly more scummy than Polaris'.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 28, 2011, 08:56:24 PM
If we want to get technical Kiro, Omba as the doctor is the only real confirmed town. There's technically still a chance of you being scum. As the roleblocker you could have blocked the nightkill, gambitting that the Doctor would protect you. This would be impossible to prove and you'd win the game even if you made it to LYLO. The odds of this actually being true are astronomical, but for the sake of considering every possibility I feel the need to point this out.

Fair enough. My primary counters to that are that while I as Scum could have gone for the super bus on Dormio and set my team back further by not having a successful NK, roleblocking Scum's own NK is against the spirit of Mafia play. Especially in a simple game like this. I'm not the kind of player to do that. If I want to win as Scum, I want to win straight up.

Yes, the whole Shadoweh/Dan argument could be merely academcal and I would have only gotten my gray hair count to increase as a result of it. But you know what, better now than later, or never. Yes, now that I've thought about it some more, I do think we should lynch Hourai and K4U first because they ARE more likely to be Scum. But if we're wrong about that, at least they have their opinions on Shadoweh and Dan that whoever the unlucky chap is in LYLO can draw upon.

So I need to reread Hourai and K4U again, but I'm leaning towards K4U first.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Omba on April 28, 2011, 09:05:15 PM
Great... now I've spent an hour reading and still don't know anything new.
scumShadoweh looks like the more reasonable version to me, but given how this game played out, I'm leaning more towards scumDan. Either way my head hurts from all the WIFOM.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 28, 2011, 09:23:53 PM
Well, you already have my opinions on Shadoweh and Dan.  I cannot see Shadoweh!scum no matter how hard I look, it just doesn't make any sense at all.  I can see Dan!scum, but I find it considerably less likely that he is scum than Hourai.

I don't really have anything else to add.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 28, 2011, 09:28:39 PM
Omba: I prefer to think we're both Town and this is just an exercise in you getting to know us better for the next game. <3

Kiro: The spirit of your response is more telling then even your Pro-Town play. Also you aren't the Gambiteer like someone else here >.>  I wouldn't consider it a bad idea, it would be a novel win. But more importantly I'll wait to see what you think of Kitten4cute and Hanged Helper.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 09:29:12 PM
Well, I've said what I could about Hourai, and I guess Shadow today, so I'm just gonna link my thought processes on Polaris,
From Day1: "lurkscum" (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg612002.html#msg612002)
Also from Day1: [urlhttp://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613232.html#msg613232]PR spec![/url]
EVEN MORE! Day1: I'm scummy?, no you're scummy! (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613297.html#msg613297)

More relevent Day2 stuff: Polaris is my angel (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg615134.html#msg615134)

DAY 3!: a.k.a the day Zakeri died~ (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg617788.html#msg617788)

anyway some of these opinions remain valid, so don't really want to see a Polaris Lynch before one on HH
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 09:30:45 PM
EBWOP: the messed up link is REALLY!... (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613232.html#msg613232)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 10:06:14 PM
Ok... Stances!

barring HH/Polaris:

Bard: favor HH
me: favor HH
shadow:lean Polaris
Omba: favor HH
Kiro: lean Polaris

Let's go with the majority on this...  :D  No one seems to have any brilliant ideas yet (except Gambits~!).
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Omba on April 28, 2011, 10:43:12 PM
There's no rush though.
Let's take it easy for now. :V

Shadoweh: Yeah, I hope it's just that. Otherwise I'm going to be really paranoid in the next games about whoever of you two is scum.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 28, 2011, 10:59:09 PM
Wanted to make another comment after the reread.  Except I will steal it from Kiro!

Quote
First off, Polaris has #207 which says he'd vote Dormio second. Couple that with the fact that he did shift the lynch from Dan solidly to Dormio and I'm willing to think he's most ok of the 3.

Hourai is still weird. One positive point is that he votes Sect as his first serious vote in Day 1 for reasons I agreed with later. But then he drops off and goes on Dan as if chainsawing over Sect. In the meanwhile, Dormio get lynched and Dan gets psuedo-cleared. So he lost all his traction. Day 2, Hourai goes after Bard for lurking then Polaris. All while Sect is about to eat rope. There's no way this feels like optimal Scum play. If Hourai is Scum, he knows he's either gonna get Copped or be lynched very soon. That's not a winning strategy and he as Scum should know it.

This. It's why I'm clearing Polaris logically, but subjectively Scum!Hourai would have seemed to play all wrong.  On D1 I thought HH could potentially be a misguided town at one point.  But... HH has to me burned all his bridges, as the town play is just not visable or surrounded by deep fog.  I think these 2 statements by Kiro get to the heart of the matter. I just can't condone Hourai's play.

Also I can't wait much longer!  :D
Also I want an entertaining votecount!
##Vote Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 29, 2011, 01:48:24 AM
As much as I'm itching to see if the game ends as you do I'm not hammering anything before Bard gets to comment. He seems to be posting in the morning more then night so we might be waiting awhile. Bardy Bard tell me tell me cause I really wanna knoooaooh!

Hourai has such a hammerable style. He makes you wanna go faster faster hammer hammer faster! I'M PRETTY SURE HE'S NOT THE DOC FOR REALS THIS TIME THOUGH!

Omba: Considering who our benevolent mod is this game:  :yukkuri: :yukkuri: :yukkuri:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 29, 2011, 03:04:01 AM
Alright, doing the reread on our worst case scenarios wasn't as bad as I thought. Seconding K4U's idea that Shadoweh can't be Scum for pretty much the same reasons. A few things I saw:

Dormio #97: "Shadoweh is still looking off to me, it seems like she's tunneling on Sect." Wow... can a Scum defend and bus buddies at the same time? Even if it were so, why would Dormio put the supposed Roleblocker in danger more than the Goon?

Edible's votecount at #141.... wow, that'd be an insane bus and really early if Shadoweh was the Scum roleblocker. Are Sect and Dormio gutsy enough to try something like that? Even if their play was a bit nubby this game, I'd think they'd try to avoid bussing in ED1.

Sect's #158 is weird. Because in my #157, I unovte Shadoweh and he follows my unvote with his own right away and decides on Dan.

Dormio drops from the Shadoweh wagon and goes on UK. Doesn't really seem interested in Dan.

Dormio #227: Says Shadoweh might be Scum, this while tied with Dan. Still can be seen as mislynch material.

Conclusion: I think Dormio treats Shadoweh as a mislynch opportunity throughout the entire Day 1. Sect drops Shadoweh to pursue a full time hate-on-Dan career. Sect's actions "might" suit a Scum Shadoweh more, but Dormio's treatment feels more traditional and I'd prioritize that over Sect's immense rage at Dan.

Furthermore, Shadoweh's posts are good overall. I think she's shrewd enough to play for the Scum endgame everyone saw once the cop claimed in Day 3, but Dormio's actions seem to clear her convincingly. If I'm wrong about all of the above and she is Scum, she deserves the win.

Along with the reread, changing my mind back to wanting Hourai dead first. There are way more scummy signs there than with Polaris. If it's not Hourai, I'm currently not sure if it'd be K4U or Dan. While Dormio's hesitancy to go for Dan and the fact that Sect may have tried something weird with Dan as mentioned earlier might mean he's actually Scum, Dan himself does not seem to be outwardly worried about being stuck in LYLO with Shadoweh and himself. In other words, he doesn't seem to be playing with Scum endgame in mind. And personally, he still reads like Town. Day 5 could be interesting if it gets there.

I guess we can get Bard's and Hourai's comments and then I'm ok with a Hourai hammer.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 29, 2011, 05:30:50 AM
Right then. I'm not dead yet?

Final comments:
Polaris is my scumpick and you should go after him when I die. I've explained why based on his interactions with Sect and Dormio.
Dan is my second, and the most viable one to be scum if Polaris does not yield good results.

Have fun.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 29, 2011, 05:46:27 AM
I would make a comment about hammering yourself but I wouldn't want the newbies to think I'm serious. It does remind me of another game for some reason.. Girls are waiting for hasubandos, please wait warmly until the hammer is ready!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 29, 2011, 08:14:36 AM
I can't for the life of me stay awake any longer. Will hopefully have a Bard post to hammer after when I wake up!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 12:54:18 PM
 :( I wish I had two votes.. everyone besides me + Shadowed + Kiro seem so lazzzZZZZzzzzzyyy~

Bard I dare you to hammer without saying anything;
JUST DO IT! :D
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 29, 2011, 12:56:54 PM
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Bard can't hammer he's already voting, we're waiting for his  :wikipedia: :wikipedia: :wikipedia:
I'm the one with ze Hammah!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 01:14:28 PM
oops, Man maybe I'm the lazy one....... just woke up and its been like 14 since my 2nd to last post.
yawnnnnn~~
who needs Bard's  :wikipedia: when you can just imagine HH's name like this : Hanged Hourai (mafia roleblocker)
can you resist the hammer?  :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Edible on April 29, 2011, 02:21:02 PM
Bard was poked.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Bardiche on April 29, 2011, 03:42:18 PM
Prod prod. :(

Current lynch order of preference is Hourai->Polaris->Shadoweh->Dan. Dan only because first day scum train seems unlikely but as he continues to talk he continues to look more scummy. Hourai for obvreasons, Polaris by process of elimination and Shadoweh beats out Dan by suggesting Kiro could still be scum, by denying that the Cop cleared me as town and general shenanigans. :|
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 29, 2011, 04:05:09 PM
Bard: Yes, I can see some really off things with Shadoweh. Between Dan and Shadoweh, I can see Shadoweh more likely NKing UK than Dan. There are signs it could be Shadoweh, particularly since she's deciding to address the possibility of Dan being Scum more than Dan is addressing the possibility of Shadoweh being Scum. But argh, the confirmed Scum's actions patterns are the ones I want to take heed of. Unless Scum decided to bus in Night 0 scum chat and without daytime communication, it doesn't seem to match up for Shadoweh.

Dan, you're being lazy. I want a stronger case of how Shadoweh could be Scum in your eyes. If it's between you two at LYLO and you're Town, you're doing us a disservice by not tackling the issue earlier.

Could we let Dan comment on this before a hammer?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 04:21:22 PM
T_T I've been waiting!

You say you want a stronger case.... yet ..... there is so so little to go on.  The best I can think of was actually... her D1 wagon.  It may not be the mislynch material everyone thinks it is.  It was fast.. and apparent.  I believe Omba said something reactionary at one point.  Basically, it's possible that it was planned from the start.  Dormio and Sect developed weak cases on Shadoweh, while Sect swelled the wagon to a non-critical level.  No one actually wants to lynch an early D1 wagon, so with this in mind scum N0 decided to take a small gambit.  Shadow's posts D1 are not so bad, but I found them a little lackluster perhaps.  D2 Shadoweh didn't really produce too much.  But none of us did either.  I'd look more into the UK shadoweh relation is its a necessity later.

FOR NOW HAMMMMMMMMMMER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 29, 2011, 04:28:46 PM
Doublechecking something.

While Dormio had the joke vote on Shadoweh early on, I vote Shadoweh on #72. Dormio kind of acknowledges that in #76.

Also, Sect hesitates for so long to vote, but then decides to go Shadoweh. Then there's the weird unvote by Shadoweh on Sect with little need for Shadoweh to have voted Sect in the first place. Trying to act Townie maybe? And Sect does drop the vote on Shadoweh and go for Dan afterwards. All of this could indeed counter my earlier points about Shadoweh saying that Scum wouldn't dare to bus their roleblocker so early because they might have accidentally gotten roped into it and Sect jumped off as soon as he could.

I want K4U to think about this on Day 5 if she's Town.

Yeah, I'm about to devolve into a "Head says Dan, Heart says Shadoweh" decision for LYLO.

Goddamnit Dan, why am I possibly writing this case up for you? Don't be lazy about this worst case scenario if you're Town.

Cut: Oh, you're here. *shrug*. Seems like you care a little.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 04:40:30 PM
Can I get a Hammer?  :(
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 29, 2011, 05:13:17 PM
Rereading UK and Shadoweh Day 2. Shadoweh goes on Bard, then decides to go on UK. Her case is on ironic because "I think it's possible you as scum would superbus an obvious liability and coast on townie cred," could also apply to her if UK wished to make the same case on Shadoweh. And UK clearly was thinking about Shadoweh before the Bard mess kicked in.

You know, Shadoweh is the most dangerous of the unconfirmed players. And I really do think she wanted UK out more for the suspicion than for looking for the Cop. Because UK was not giving Cop tells imo. I think I'm now in agreement with Bard. I'd rather see Shadoweh lynched over Dan in LYLO. Also because Dan just reads like Town. I don't like all of his actions (passing off his eagerness to hammer as derpish), but I can agree with what he says as a Townie. He just doesn't look like Scum. Shadoweh's actions play more like Scum than Dan's.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Omba on April 29, 2011, 06:30:37 PM
Also, Sect hesitates for so long to vote, but then decides to go Shadoweh. Then there's the weird unvote by Shadoweh on Sect with little need for Shadoweh to have voted Sect in the first place. Trying to act Townie maybe?
If the reason was as she stated - to get him to vote -, then that actually goes both ways. It works as "help town, damnit" as well as "try to look towny instead of scummy, damnit". In either case, Sect might just have gone for the easiest vote available to him when Shadoweh told him to do so. And unvote because of "ah, he got it" would also work either way.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 29, 2011, 07:11:46 PM
That was the opposite of awesome.
Dan: CAN YOU RESIST HAMMERING?!
*SHADOWEH'S INTERNET STOPS WORKING FOR 5 HOURS*
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH
reeeeding
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 29, 2011, 07:12:27 PM
I've already thought about it Kiro.  I couldn't have possibly declared that there is no way Shadoweh could be scum without doing that.

-Not really sure why Dormio acknowledging you makes Shadoweh scum vs Dormio going "yes I agree.  lookit me agreeing with the smart townperson! :D"

-I don't see what's wrong with the Sect vote/unvote to begin with.  It just looks like typical Shadoweh D1 rage to me.  I know for a fact that she's read GDIC because we make constant jokes about that game. :V  The entire conversation reads to me as "DO SOMETHING DAMMIT!" because Sect did nothing but be awesome with flavor in GDIC.  The entire conversation reads very naturally for town!Shadoweh, so I have no idea why people have a problem with this.

-I think Sect also really hated Dan.  Speculation yes, but I think he would have switched regardless of who he was voting before.  Sect's voting patterns could indeed suggest scum!Shadoweh.  However,  I think Dormio was treating her like mislynch material.  He only got off of her AFTER her wagon completely dissolved.  So yeah.  Sure, Sect's vote could indeed be him trying to get off his buddy.  I really doubt that's what it is.

So I have to ask.  If they were really roped into voting for the roleblocker ED1 like that, why didn't Sect vote for Dormio once his wagon took off?  And why didn't Dormio vote for what would have to be town!Dan in order to save himself?  Personally, I consider it more likely that there was no super bussing going on at all based on how infrequently Dormio and Sect mentioned each other (hence my vote for Hourai), but if it came down to Shadoweh vs Dan the choice would be easy for me.  If the scum team was going to super bus I don't see why Sect wouldn't have been on Dormio.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 29, 2011, 07:48:55 PM
Current lynch order of preference is Hourai->Polaris->Shadoweh->Dan. Dan only because first day scum train seems unlikely but as he continues to talk he continues to look more scummy. Hourai for obvreasons, Polaris by process of elimination and Shadoweh beats out Dan by suggesting Kiro could still be scum, by denying that the Cop cleared me as town and general shenanigans. :|
But Kiro could still be scum. :/ I forgot to mention you with Omba because I was thinking of the doctor situation on Day 2 but yes, you're obviously clear as well Bard. I forget things like this when I write posts before sleeping. And you calling me on shenanigans is amusing but I can't defend myself from something general like that. Considering I think the question is academic I'm not overly worried about arguing over it.

I've thought about it because every possibility has to be considered. It's why I can't sleep at night all this thinking! I can sum up every game town has lost as 'they didn't consider everything.' If it seriously somehow comes down to it I'd rather know now what to expect then to have someone flip a coin for what should have been the easiest town win in the history of ever.
-I don't see what's wrong with the Sect vote/unvote to begin with.  It just looks like typical Shadoweh D1 rage to me.  I know for a fact that she's read GDIC because we make constant jokes about that game. :V  The entire conversation reads to me as "DO SOMETHING DAMMIT!" because Sect did nothing but be awesome with flavor in GDIC.  The entire conversation reads very naturally for town!Shadoweh, so I have no idea why people have a problem with this.
This is really why. The voting/unvoting was really getting on my nerves. If someone is allowed to go through Day 1 without taking a stand they might as well not be here at all. I asked him at least three times to vote with just words before voting him and he ignored the hell out of me until I phrased it in the form of CONTRIBUTE OR DIE. I unvoted because his 'case' on me was hilariously bad but I could see where he got it from. I honestly thought it came from a silly newbtown. Everything he did screamed derptown. I'm still depressed he ended up being scum.

Dan: It might be just us arguing for the sake of arguing but you could at least try not to speed conversation of your own fate along. :/ This kind of thinking is good for a newbie like you the most, you're playing to learn aren't you?

Aaaaahhh going to be late for work. No Dan I'm not hammering while people who might not be here tomorrow want to say something. I'll be back in a few hours.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 07:52:32 PM
Quote
I think Sect also really hated Dan.  Speculation yes, but I think he would have switched regardless of who he was voting before
"hate" is a rather strong word. dislike, maybe.  Also I don't think Sect hated me, because he made references to "shenanigans" which suggest that perhaps he was really tired of trying to keep up his ruse (a.k.a fake rage).  Then again, as Scum I would have adopted George Constanza's beliefs, one of which is, "It's not a lie if you believe it!" 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 29, 2011, 08:14:01 PM
I used the word I thought was most appropriate. :V  I think he just really didn't want to play with you.  Meaning he would have voted for you regardless of your alignment or anyone else's. 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 29, 2011, 08:24:47 PM
Quote from: Shadoweh
But Kiro could still be scum. :/
Bringing this up while I'm thinking about it.  Stopping the NK like that when you don't plan on claiming doc is incredibly silly.  If the doc had, say, protected UK all it would have done was clear a townie.  Since Kiro was already looking townie enough to be defended there's no real advantage in making such a gambit.

In other words, this is bad and you should feel bad for suggesting it. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 08:33:40 PM
Quote
Dan: It might be just us arguing for the sake of arguing but you could at least try not to speed conversation of your own fate along. :/ This kind of thinking is good for a newbie like you the most, you're playing to learn aren't you?

Aaaaahhh going to be late for work. No Dan I'm not hammering while people who might not be here tomorrow want to say something. I'll be back in a few hours.
It could be because I'm dense, but I don't understand the first statement.  About hammering: I understand that optimally we should use the whole day, but these so called "people" (confirmed townies with the exception of Kiro) haven't said much in a one day period going on 2 days.  Also I'm pretty sure (and I bet he thinks so too) that Kiro will be the NK tonight, so the others not saying much doesn't matter at this juncture.   I doubt activity will pick up any time soon today. Tomorrow is a different story. If HH is town, then there will be more activity because K4U's opinion will carry a little more weight. 

Other random thoughts:  I don't place much stake in shadoweh's Vote/Unvote of Sect, just seems silly.  When and if it comes down to a Dan/shadoweh slapfight later :D then I'll consider it.  Also the probability that Kiro is scum is literally <1%, so let's drop it, and worry about other things :D

cut- by Kitten4u: 
on "hate": :( The only game I have seen if the archives go like that was the game affinity super bussed Roukanken and the tracker failed so hard that Rev voted him..... ...... ..... even though he knew he was town.  I just can't see Sect hating me if we were both Scum, I mean could you imagine the scum QT??  Your entitled to call it a ruse if you feel it was for Scum purposes.... but not hate.
on Kiro: precisely  :D     
 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 29, 2011, 08:37:36 PM
Dan, just wondering.  What makes you think there will even BE a NK tonight?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 08:51:45 PM
I was talking about whether or not lazy confirmed townies being lazy and not talking actually mattered.  It doesn't of course if we hammer HH and he's scum, I didn't think I needed to point this out. Assuming HH is town, there will be a NK.  Curious you picked at this point, perhaps you just read it a little fast  ;)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 29, 2011, 08:56:18 PM
##Unvote

I need a bit to think about things.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 29, 2011, 08:59:36 PM
K4U; The point about Dormio acknowledging me would be the following: he put his vote on Shadoweh as part of Ed1. Then after I voted Shadoweh, he agreed with me. Why he would agree with me seems to be the point of contention. Was it mislynch material or was he kind of stuck with a vote that he doesn't feel like he can walk away from so easily? It's a push though depending on who you ask.

The Sect/Shadoweh thing is a town meta read to you. I don't have that experience so I had an eyebrow raise when I saw that. The action by itself, stands as more scummy than not. And if I recall from someone else's comment, Shadoweh hasn't been Scum yet here. Clearing this as a Town only meta is reckless. Much like how UK can trap and tunnel as both alignments.

Dormio only got off the Shadoweh wagon after I did with Sect immediately getting off as well. Sect helped facilitate the weakening of the Shadoweh wagon and for a really weird reason: talking about 3 people and then simply voting Dan.

And the Day 2 case Shadoweh has on UK is bad. Why did you decide to go on UK framing the point as a superbus suspicion? It's hypocritical given you did the same thing and your position is worse because you were later on the wagon. I think in this game, it was more dangerous for Scum to bus Sect on Day 2 than Dormio on Day 1. The Day 2 bus means that Scum is alone and much more vulnerable to Town powers and process of elimination. Dan was on Sect early and Shadoweh waffled on it. I know I did too, but between the two of them, Dan came out looking better than Shadoweh on that point.

I'm torn about this because both K4U and Bard have different beliefs on this, but I can see how both people as Town could believe their stances. This admittedly would be an unusual showdown. I don't care if one of Hourai or K4U is the real Scum and is trolling me/us and Town has no way to lose this game against those 2. Scum has had it rough the first 2 days. The kill on UK rather than perhaps Omba in my opinion was relatively smart. And quite frankly, these are probably the 3 deciding factors for me.

1) Scum Dan has far less of a reason to kill UK than Scum Shadoweh does.
2) A double Scum wagon on Day 1 does not seem plausible in any game, ESPECIALLY with how difficult the wagons were to move in this one.
3) Sect wanted Dan dead more than either Sect or Dormio wanted Shadoweh dead just by looking at their votes before Day 1 deadline.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 29, 2011, 09:12:41 PM
I checked the vote count as of 76 real quick.  You and Dormio were the only ones on Shadoweh at the time.  Considering there was a delicious town vs town slapfight going on, and his goon buddy was being pretty useless, I don't think it would have been hard for him to get off of Shadoweh if he wanted to.  I really do read Dormio's vote as "I can lynch this."

I will take back my thing on Sect not voting Dormio at the end of the day though, because I realize it's stupid now.  His Dan vote feels like a vote on emotion that would ignore any amount of reason, the positives and negatives, and everything else.  Regardless of his alignment, he wanted Dan dead.

The Sect/Shadoweh thing really isn't that much of a meta read to me.  Parts of it are based in meta sure, but I really see nothing scummy about it at all.  I still don't understand why so many other people do.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 10:38:32 PM
Quote
1) Scum Dan has far less of a reason to kill UK than Scum Shadoweh does.
2) A double Scum wagon on Day 1 does not seem plausible in any game, ESPECIALLY with how difficult the wagons were to move in this one.
3) Sect wanted Dan dead more than either Sect or Dormio wanted Shadoweh dead just by looking at their votes before Day 1 deadline.
I agree with points 2) + 3) fully, but must disagree about 1).  When UK died I immediatly thought of Shadoweh, because of their exchange D2.  However, that may have been the point.  I was suspecting that Omba would go down or someone who scum thought was the Cop, and UK didn't give off that impression (especially with her Omba cop post).  the UK kill probably served Polaris/HH's purposes more.  Why? because UK was on HH for both days, and she was suspecting Polaris.  Basically she was more of a threat to them.  O wait I just misinterpreted the point.. T_T. So... Scum!me would have killed Polaris or finished off Omba, no actually definitely Polaris, I really thought he was a PR.  Ya.. I doubt Scum!me would have killed UK, who was always one of the people who awarded me more town cred than others.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 29, 2011, 10:48:21 PM
Dan, what is your definition of a scum slip?  Is there any difference between a scum slip and a scummy action in your opinion?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 10:59:22 PM
Apparently I use the word scumslip as much as a certain lawyer cries, "OBJECTION!".  So.. Ya, Bard's scumslip was not a scumslip, just imo scummy. The late D1 arguement I had with HH probably qualifies. Sect's question when he first voted me at the end of his post I guess was less of a "slip" then completely unfathomable.

So yes there is a difference, but I was trying to grope for one way too hard.  I think Hourai still slipped up in D1 with mixing up the timeline of posts.   
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Bardiche on April 29, 2011, 11:00:19 PM
WIFOM everywhere.

If the game hadn't already become boring by this point it has now. :V

Can we just lynch Dan for good measure?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 29, 2011, 11:01:29 PM
If Hourai slipped why did you lead D2 with a vote on Sect instead of Hourai?  And D3, why did you hammer Zak if Hourai slipped and there was only one scum left?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 29, 2011, 11:03:48 PM
ZZZzzzzzzzzz
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 11:08:08 PM
Quote
Can we just lynch Dan for good measure?

AFFEFEAASDFEF;
only If I can troll Bard for good measure

If Hourai slipped why did you lead D2 with a vote on Sect instead of Hourai?  And D3, why did you hammer Zak if Hourai slipped and there was only one scum left?
I was convinced Sect was Obvscum.  The hammer on Zak was not on purpose. I did vote HH first.  It's not absolutely clear that HH was scum.  People with greater knowledge than me were switching to Zak (I always get glossy eyed now when I read Kiro's posts).  In the end I thought we were going to vote HH next so I didn't care too much.  I think everyone is far far far far FAR more town than HH. 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 11:10:12 PM
ZZZzzzzzzzzz
I'm also wondering why you are not yet as well. 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 11:14:38 PM
Key word missing in last post being "Dead"
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 11:18:37 PM
I say it's time for a motion to mass vote Hourai!  I'll Start!
##Unvote
##Vote Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 29, 2011, 11:20:59 PM
kldsnfkdsndf

I really, really dislike all that.  But I finished my read of D1 again.  This is still more likely imo.

##Vote Hanged Hourai
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 11:33:41 PM
Just saying this now, After game can we all discuss scum slips and examples thereof.  I promise to look at each one in context for a good long while.  I am 90% certain that HH will flip scum, if not I will be very angry at myself.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 11:37:19 PM
Also won't be here for the next few hours ( I have to go in 5 min or so).  And since I expect that the hammer is around the corner, I'd rather it come sooner!
If it comes when I am gone, I shall feel trolled.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Edible on April 29, 2011, 11:42:39 PM
Sure Is Votecount In Here

Hanged Hourai (3): Kitten4U, Bardiche, Action Dan
Kitten4U (1): Hanged Hourai

Hanged Hourai is at L-1!

Not voting: Omba, Shadoweh, Kiro

~28 hours remaining?  7 alive, 4 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kiro on April 29, 2011, 11:52:13 PM
Whatever, got the posts out that I wanted. Although I'd prefer to let Shadoweh have the hammer in case she wants to address any of the above.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 29, 2011, 11:56:06 PM
Quote
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Bard can't hammer he's already voting, we're waiting for his  :wikipedia: :wikipedia: :wikipedia:
I'm the one with ze Hammah!
You have the Poweh!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 30, 2011, 12:27:04 AM
In other words, this is bad and you should feel bad for suggesting it. :V
Oh come on that's mean >_> I wouldn't seriously push that view unless Kiro was still alive in LYLO anyways.

And the Day 2 case Shadoweh has on UK is bad. Why did you decide to go on UK framing the point as a superbus suspicion? It's hypocritical given you did the same thing and your position is worse because you were later on the wagon. I think in this game, it was more dangerous for Scum to bus Sect on Day 2 than Dormio on Day 1. The Day 2 bus means that Scum is alone and much more vulnerable to Town powers and process of elimination. Dan was on Sect early and Shadoweh waffled on it. I know I did too, but between the two of them, Dan came out looking better than Shadoweh on that point.
If that was my only reason I would agree it was hypocritical, but the reason I was suspicious in the first place was because I thought huh what should have been considered more town after his hammer plus UK pushing for him on the basis of a flip that hadn't happened yet. I also didn't spend alot of Day 1 trolling people. We didn't have any confirmed town at this point and I was seriously afraid of dying and no one ever considering this. It also got me answers, from both UK explaining her view and Edible clarifying what Rocks Fall means. No, I seriously didn't think he would just Game Over if there wasn't a lynch. It seems excessive and not fun.

Most of the other points you're all bringing up are things I can't answer for you, besides saying I am town and wouldn't do that. Since Kiro has given the clear and I'm pretty sure Bard is okay with it too, or bored stiff, let's try and end the game before we WIFOM each other to death.

Also, for the sake of trolling Dan, because I haven't gotten to troll anyone and feel really left out:

##VOTE HANGED HOURAI
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 30, 2011, 12:28:09 AM
Hammer says shut up
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 30, 2011, 12:28:14 AM
The Name Prophecy Fulfilled Final Day 4 Votecount

Hanged Hourai (4): Kitten4U, Bardiche, ActionDan, Shadoweh
Kitten4U (1): Hourai

Not voting: Omba, Kiro

Hourai is at L-0!

Hourai was lynched!  He was a townsperson.

It is now Night 4.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Omba on April 30, 2011, 12:41:00 AM
Oh yeah.  :colonveeplusalpha:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 30, 2011, 12:47:07 AM
Edible, you look funny.  Are you feeling okay?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 4)
Post by: Edible on April 30, 2011, 01:01:42 AM
The Name Prophecy Fulfilled Final Day 4 Votecount

Hanged Hourai (4): Kitten4U, Bardiche, ActionDan, Shadoweh
Kitten4U (1): Hourai

Not voting: Omba, Kiro

Hourai is at L-0!

Hourai was lynched!  He was a townsperson.

It is now Night 4.


rofl

What he said.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Conqueror on April 30, 2011, 01:05:39 AM
>_>

<_<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 30, 2011, 01:06:07 AM
;_;
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 30, 2011, 01:06:28 AM
Hourai you suck >.<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 30, 2011, 01:07:10 AM
tee hee
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Bardiche on April 30, 2011, 01:11:25 AM
Since we're all active how about we skip the formalities and get to D5 already. >_>
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 30, 2011, 01:18:37 AM
But I'm sunburnt and I want to sleep Bard ;~;
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Omba on April 30, 2011, 01:20:32 AM
Also, ActionDan hasn't been online since the beginning of the night.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 30, 2011, 01:20:54 AM
I have become the Edible, only better.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Edible on April 30, 2011, 01:23:04 AM
I have become the Edible, only bulimic.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on April 30, 2011, 01:27:09 AM
This is incredibly silly!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 30, 2011, 01:27:15 AM
I... I can't stop watching both of them.. at once.. it's so..
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: PX on April 30, 2011, 01:29:49 AM
This has suddenly made this game slightly more entertaining.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on April 30, 2011, 01:32:52 AM
I... I can't stop watching both of them.. at once.. it's so..
Oh my god.
It's... it's...
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: ActionDan on April 30, 2011, 02:38:46 AM
Well then....
 :colonveeplusalpha:
at least the boredom is over................................for now
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 30, 2011, 05:09:36 AM
I totally think we should start the new day RIGHT NOW. 2am lynch time YEAH. I think I'm hallucinating too because I'd swear UK just proposed to me in #t-m
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on April 30, 2011, 02:10:35 PM
I did not! I absolutely did not think you died right before I was about to not propose to you in a bid that wouldn't wrest you away from Bard. Never.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 4)
Post by: Pesco on April 30, 2011, 02:46:56 PM
brb rereading the logs :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Edible on April 30, 2011, 03:59:05 PM
Here lies Kiro.  He died peacefully in his sleep after a prolonged battle with a knife to the face.  He was a townsperson.

It is now Day 5!  You have 72 hours.  With 5 living, it takes 3 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on April 30, 2011, 04:10:36 PM
The knife of lies! If anyone gets that reference I will be highly impressed.  I don't have much time now but the confirmed townies should say more say than what they said Day 4.  My vote will most likely go to polaris/K4U, although I'm not certain.  HH flipping town was a serious wakeup call.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kiro on April 30, 2011, 04:33:54 PM
As I lay there dying and drowning in despair, Madoka whispered to me that everything would be alright. With those gentle words, I felt at peace and closed my eyes.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 30, 2011, 07:19:02 PM
##Vote ActionDan

Shadoweh still isn't scum.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 30, 2011, 08:34:19 PM
This is so hard.

##Vote: Kitten4u

I'm sorry. Even after re-reads, and even though I want to believe in you so badly, I can't see how you aren't the last scum. Even if Dan annoys the hell out of me, he's still bleeding town idiocy. I shouldn't have doubted what I've been thinking just because Hourai was a foolish townie that gave up and you sound more reasonable then him. 

Dan: We're still in no rush. We have another three days to look over the evidence. Bard and Omba call the shots today.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Omba on April 30, 2011, 09:06:26 PM
Kitten4u looks like the most likely candidate to me now, too. Well, there's not that many choices remaining.
But yeah, we've got lots of time on our hands, so no vote from me yet.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 30, 2011, 09:14:53 PM
I'll be sure to type up a nice defense and my case on why Dan is scum and why Shadoweh is town.  I gave the short versions yesterday, but I might as well get everything out if I'm going to die today.  Don't expect me to go down without a fight though.  :P
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Bardiche on April 30, 2011, 10:12:29 PM
Well Omba, guess you gotta protect me or yourself tonight! (if that last option's impossible, don't tell us anyway)

So how about you three make up marvelous reasons why I shouldn't lynch you today and why person x is a better choice? :lazy:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on April 30, 2011, 10:15:53 PM
I guess it can be a blessing when someone has very few posts.  Polaris is not so difficult to analyze.  I read his D1 and D2, and there is a word I can use to describe all his posts: Gutless.  I think Polaris' first post against me was weak as it was unoriginal.  I'd descible the other posts that followed that gave opinions as general laundry lists.  Polaris' posts is the very definition of "half-assed cases" that zak mentioned D2.  Polaris' D2 case against  Hourai is barely 4 lines long, focuses on minor issues that border on whatever Bard likes to call "Dormio = Scum, so Hourai doing this and that makes sense if Hourai is Scum."  Hourai's case on Polaris D2 relies on this too, but, HH's case presented much stronger ties between Polaris and Dormio.

I don't like Polaris' exchange with Sect D2.  It was a mutual "I don't like you, and you don't like me, but let's go after the other people and give each other a break." For Sect, that meant "I'll keep a vote on Dan."  For Polaris, that meant "I'll attack the easy target Hourai."
gotta go! be back
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on April 30, 2011, 10:48:38 PM
Bard, I'm confirmed town, super cool, have a Governor claim and can edit flavor (it's even crumbed everywhere!), I was the counter-wagon (and the wagon proper before Dormio's wagon kicked off) D1 and logically that beats out most everything else. It doesn't end there either.  I can even do a barrel roll to dodge flying bullets.  If shadoweh is indeed Scum I shall fight the good fight D6, but I have infinitely more reason to lynch Polaris right now.

His one saving grace was his vote change to Dormio when he didn't have to.  Unfortunately the cred that was earned can bring him no further. Why? because I'm finding it more believable that it was bad Scum play.  I don't really like K4U's posts either D5, but I can't place a reason on it just yet.  Obviously Polaris sunk himself long before.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 30, 2011, 10:50:31 PM
What was wrong with my posts?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on April 30, 2011, 10:57:57 PM
You could at least pretend to put some effort into it Bard ;-; Stop teaching the children lazy confirmed townie habits! I'll update my case on Polaris4u and how Dan compares after some sleep. Hourai was just an easy target for them to concentrate on, both early and later game. Dan's cases on Hourai seem more motivated by earnest trying then Polaris's disappearing act.  I've already done my own analysis of Polaris's posts, that you can go find yourself :P

And if you have any questions about my own play you are free to ask and I will try to answer to the best of my ability, if you didn't get enough yesterday.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on April 30, 2011, 11:11:48 PM
I can't deny that Polaris was incredibly lazy.  There's a reason I'm playing right now instead of him. :V  Considering he was lazy enough that Edible replaced him I don't think his laziness makes him scum (though I'm pretty biased here).  I think it's just a personality trait like my laziness/lurkiness or UK's aggressiveness.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Bardiche on April 30, 2011, 11:33:35 PM
You know, "I was the counter-case to confirmed scum on D1!" isn't as strong an argument as you'd like it to be, Dan, and the more you purport it to be so the more I feel inclined to suspect a scum gambit setup.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Omba on May 01, 2011, 12:19:11 AM
Dan has been burning his town-status ever since he got it and even before.
I'll probably be away for approximately 24 hours. If you guys do anything besides not lynching or triple-lynching until I'm back, I'm going to rage hard. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Bardiche on May 01, 2011, 12:21:05 AM
Want to lynch him just to be sure?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Omba on May 01, 2011, 12:25:51 AM
Why yes, I'd like to quarter him to make sure.
If that didn't mean I'd have to forgoe lynching Kitten4u and/or Shadoweh. Though I'm still not sure whether it's better to go with the reasonable choices (those two) or the totally lunatic one (Dan).
The amount of gambit involved if Dan really is scum is just so damn huge.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Bardiche on May 01, 2011, 12:28:46 AM
Well to be fair, he has done everything he can to ensure it'll look like a scum gambit moreso than a townie blundering into town status. I've never quite seen someone try so hard to look like scum as a vanilla townie.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Omba on May 01, 2011, 12:33:21 AM
Yes. That's exactly the giant wall of WIFOM that's confusing me.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 01, 2011, 02:29:47 AM
Let's do this objectively, because another brilliant idea just flashed through my brain.
Let us all measure up town cred (objectively):
Quote
You know, "I was the counter-case to confirmed scum on D1!" isn't as strong an argument as you'd like it to be, Dan, and the more you purport it to be so the more I feel inclined to suspect a scum gambit setup.
Let's also ignore gambits as non-existant for establishing town cred (-_-).
town cred:
Dan: A lot
shadoweh: A lot
Polaris: not so much

Let's work from that, and call Dan and shadoweh town cred equal (although I think I have more, but that shouldn't affect this much)
Let's also assume that one of us is scum.  As scum need two mislynches anyway, what is of relative importance is the order in which the mislynches occur.  I'd wager that scum would rather get the person with substantial town cred first and then face an easier opponent head-on later.  But what have me and shadoweh been doing the last 2 days?  holding hands, and not casting much doubt on each other at all (unless forced to).  There are no signs of scum intent to attack the other.  Now let's look at the flip side. That is, what would Scum and Town K4U do in this situation.  Town K4U would take hard looks at both of us, knowing one of us is scum.  AND town Polaris  would make good cases on both of us, preserving his opinion in case of death.  What town K4U would not and should not do, is go ahead and say "I can't see shadoweh as scum, here are my reasons, therefore it must be Dan," that is simply not a town instinct.  Scum K4U would do this, in what I will call "divide and conquer," attack one of us, pray for survival, and then attack the other after.  It wouldn't matter that K4U said "Shadoweh can't be scum," because if K4U makes it alive to the next day, K4U will have to attack Shadoweh and claim the duty as a townie.  Obviously I'm not saying that Scum K4U will survive this, but it's Scum K4U's best bet.

With this I am placing my vote.
##Vote Kitten4u
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 01, 2011, 02:35:20 AM
EBWOP: considering this is pretty much an arguement concerning D4 + D5 behavior, that last "Polaris" should read "K4U".
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 02:36:44 AM
So your problem with my posts is that I declare someone I think is town as town?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 01, 2011, 03:01:24 AM
I honestly don't know what Scum K4U would do as her meta, since she'd be fakeclaiming right now. I don't believe in using meta as a certainty anyways. To be fair I don't think it's out of town's interests to make their opinions known on who they believe is scum, it's the only thing that can outlast their death. I have to agree that a Scum Dan should have at least been considering me seriously when Kiro brought up the possibility instead of calling for more hammers. His play is weird but in the end Polaris's play was more explainable then scum, whereas Dan would have had to have been in a freak accident.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 01, 2011, 03:02:20 AM
EBWOM: *as scum, not then scum
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 03:12:10 AM
I can tell you that I wouldn't have done that.  I know better than to assume that you would be on my side just because I called you town (Dan would have been a much better choice based on his interactions with UK).  My typical strategy would be (since I can't hide behind a fake claim) cast suspicion on EVERYONE because I need them all lynched.  If I only needed two people lynched, then sure, there's no harm in declaring someone town like that, but that's not the case here.

Naturally, this is all WIFOMy nonsense.  Unfortunately, it's hard to defend against being wrong and bad luck, so it's all I can do.  I'll be sure to get those cases up before the day ends though, so don't hammer me please. <3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 01, 2011, 06:31:20 AM
Quote
Let's also assume that one of us is scum.  As scum need two mislynches anyway, what is of relative importance is the order in which the mislynches occur.  I'd wager that scum would rather get the person with substantial town cred first and then face an easier opponent head-on later.
Dan, can you explain this line of thinking from the perspective of Kitten4u being scum? We both have 'substantial town cred' as you said. I'll also point out that she doesn't really need to convince us. The other two confirmed towns and herself have enough votes to lynch either of us right now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 07:04:23 AM
Alright, I'm going to start with Polaris.  I can't dissect his thoughts perfectly because I'm not him, but hopefully this will help all of you see where he was coming from.

First thing to remember is that I was NOT helping with his posts.  I was not helping him build any cases (though I did offer to help him build a case D1 in which he opted to be lazy instead of actually taking me up on that), the only thing I did was ask a couple of questions on things that I was not clear on.  We talked about people some.  I never spoke about someone until he provided an opinion on said person.  This was about him learning to play Mafia, not me playing for him, so I did little more than try to point him in the right direction.  This means that newb cases, improper use of terms and all that fun newbie stuff is to be expected.  When reading his posts keep this in mind: is he someone trying to force a case on someone, or is he a confused newbie with ideas, but not sure how to express them properly?

Second, Polly is definitely lazy.  Probably lazier than I am, and that's really saying something. :V  I remember after I offered to help him build a case on Dan D1 he said something along the lines of "I could have spent the day making a case on Dan, but I decided to be lazy and waste it instead."  Later he said that he wanted to read HW but never did because he was boring.  There were a couple of moments I really wanted to smack him. >x>  So yeah, there's a reason I'm playing and it's not because he requested a replacement.  I think Edible just got sick of dealing with him because he stuck me in almost immediately after I offered. :V

I think I summed up what I think his opinions on Dormio (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg618485.html#msg618485) and Sect (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg618562.html#msg618562) pretty well in those posts.  There wasn't much for me to go off of.  Again, it's pretty hard for me to defend against being wrong and bad luck.  I hope how I see his mentality clears things up a bit.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 01, 2011, 04:59:43 PM
Zzzz Or you can all be silent for hours and not say anything. Bard, what's going through that crazy mind of yours? Dan, wake up and chat with me, the people need to see our thoughts. I guess Omba won't be back for a few hours still.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 01, 2011, 06:33:13 PM
Zzzz Or you can all be silent for hours and not say anything. Bard, what's going through that crazy mind of yours? Dan, wake up and chat with me, the people need to see our thoughts. I guess Omba won't be back for a few hours still.
That's mildly amusing, grown used to my chatter heh? :D Srrz I was in the middle of a paper that could make or break the next few years of my life.  Anyway that fact that only us three are posting is a major turnoff.
Dan, can you explain this line of thinking from the perspective of Kitten4u being scum? We both have 'substantial town cred' as you said. I'll also point out that she doesn't really need to convince us. The other two confirmed towns and herself have enough votes to lynch either of us right now.
That part was only intended if you or I were scum.  Again, if K4U is scum she would just pick on one us,since we have equal town cred, and largely ignore the other and try to survive.  After she would go attack the one she ignored the next day.  Yes I don't put much stake in this meta, but it's worth something at least.  I judge Polaris much more harshly of course.  the arguement is mainly my justification of the feeling that the last 2 days haven't changed the picture from after D2.

K4U: It's true polaris was lazy, and you may not share his opinions, but I think it would be better to embrace his play D1 and D2 as if it were your own.  You tend more than not to dismiss them (at least that's the feeling I get).  Plus no one can be sure that there wasn't a little more in the QT than you let on.  Lettme read Polaris' first post again, he commented on it. 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Bardiche on May 01, 2011, 06:41:38 PM
Zzzz Or you can all be silent for hours and not say anything. Bard, what's going through that crazy mind of yours?

Right now? Zzzzz game. Zzzzz game.

I want to lynch each and every single one of you. That's what's going through my mind. Polaris was quite agreeable but I admit I haven't really looked at his posts from any perspective other than "hatin' on Dan, AWRIGHT".

How many lynches do we have, again?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Edible on May 01, 2011, 06:47:56 PM
Vote Countess, Wife Of Vote Count

Kitten4U (2) - Shadoweh, ActionDan
ActionDan (1) - Kitten4U

Not voting: Omba, Bardiche

Less than 48 hours remain.  With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 06:51:07 PM
We have two more lynches.

---

Dan, I am in no way dismissing Polaris' play and I have no idea what gave you the idea that it was.  Naturally, in order to defend myself I MUST defend Polaris because we are the same entity.  I see no reason to just roll over and die like Hourai did.  I know what it looks like.  I also know I am town.  I can't defend against the actions, so I'm trying to show the mentality behind the actions.  It's all I can do.

Quote from: Dan
Again, if K4U is scum she would just pick on one us
This is flat out false.  I'll pretend like there's any sense in declaring someone town when I would have to get everyone lynched for a moment for the sake of argument.  Why the hell would I buddy up with SHADOWEH, who I KNOW would not be swayed by it over YOU who seemed content to not only call people that called you town, town, but to defend them as well?  Town cred is meaningless to scum when they need every non-confirmed townie to get lynched.  It's only about who they can get lynched and who they can't and who they can manipulate into helping them.

But I've already explained why assuming scum!me defending someone doesn't make any sense.  I would need to cast enough suspicion on EVERYONE to convince the confirmed townies to lynch them over me.  Put simply, you, Hourai and Shadoweh to scum!me would be nothing more than fodder I needed to die.  Only the confirmed townies would matter.

To town!me however, I realize two things: 1.) as long as I don't get lynched town can't lose. 2.) the chances of me getting lynched are high, therefore I must make it so my town read does not get lynched.  I must convince everyone else that Shadoweh MUST NOT DIE because I do not expect to live.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 06:52:25 PM
Still WIFOM, yes, but trying to argue that line is silly and makes no sense.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 01, 2011, 07:27:48 PM
I want to lynch each and every single one of you. That's what's going through my mind. Polaris was quite agreeable but I admit I haven't really looked at his posts from any perspective other than "hatin' on Dan, AWRIGHT".
That's probably a bad criteria to judge from Bard, unless you think Dan is the scum. Which is a possibility we have to take seriously at this point, but if you aren't really reading anyone you aren't being any help at all in making the judgement. Don't go all Zzzz game on me, we have a responsibility to all the townies that have come before to take this seriously and make the right decisions in the end.
Quote
How many lynches do we have, again?
If you mean today, one. In theory that's all we need, but if there's a tomorrow it will be LYLO.
Anyway that fact that only us three are posting is a major turnoff.
Well, we're the three suspects, there's not much the others can do besides judge us. Can you explain what basis or example you're judging K4u's meta on and why you think she would want you gone before me?

K4U: The problem with your reasoning for Polaris's actions is his laziness to the point of being replaced actually is a scumtell for him. The cases you write yourself are more useful, since they come directly from you with no garbled lazy translator.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 01, 2011, 07:34:38 PM
Quote
To town!me however, I realize two things: 1.) as long as I don't get lynched town can't lose. 2.) the chances of me getting lynched are high, therefore I must make it so my town read does not get lynched.  I must convince everyone else that Shadoweh MUST NOT DIE because I do not expect to live.
Alright So point 1) I understand, and I too am trying to follow this. 2) This I don't get.  It's fine to say who you think is the last scum before you go, but town!K4U should at least make counter points on the person who you do think is town.  Otherwise you are giving that person a free pass after you flip town.  Why? because if shadoweh is in fact Scum you have done little to catch her, in fact you can even say you helped expedite her victory.
Also, we can do another thought experiment.  Say you got your way, and I die.  If I'm scum you can say, "told you so!" If I'm town, what are you going to do, curl up in ball and die submissively because Shadoweh can't possibly be scum?  That would go against 1.)  The only reason me and shadoweh are holding hands and targetting you is that we have much more reason to do so than attack the other  (based off of town cred).  you on the other hand, should be doing your best to dig up every last bit of dirt on the both of me and shadoweh so your reasoning can see the light of day.  That way, even if you are wrong about your scum pick today, you can fight well against the other guy you nailed as town the next day.   

Also there is not as much WIFOM here as perhaps you perceive. cut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 07:46:50 PM
@Shadoweh
Not really.  He's lurkier than I am in general (see MSR Steven Stone and Vanilla Mafia).  Considering Edible's stance on not wanting to deal with lurkers I don't think it's too surprising that he replaced him even though he didn't actually flake.  It's a personality trait, not a tell.  Don't worry, I'll get my cases up later.  Promise! <3

@Dan
It's not complicated.  Shadoweh is not scum.  I must convince others that this is true in the event I get lynched today because if I lose because people decided to lynch the obvious town I'm going to be kind of pissed.  I hate losing, especially when I lose in a stupid way.

Yes, if we do lynch you and you flip town I will have palmface for being shitty at this game and then try to get Shadoweh lynched.  But considering Shadoweh is town this is a non-issue for me.  I have no doubt that you will flip scum at this point.

Also, why should I try to dig up dirt?  Shadoweh is town.  There is no reason for me to try and dig dirt up on her.  I want her to look town so that you will get lynched over her in the event that I am lynched.  Trying to make her look like scum would be counter-productive and silly.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 01, 2011, 07:51:09 PM
Quote
Well, we're the three suspects, there's not much the others can do besides judge us. Can you explain what basis or example you're judging K4u's meta on and why you think she would want you gone before me?

I still want feedback -_-.  I'm judging K4U on what I would do in her position as town!K4u.  Since I don't see town motivated actions, I am rationalizing what I do see as scum motivated actions, and I think they make sense.  Why K4u would want me gone before you I am unsure of, however, perhaps it is easier to make a case on me for subjective reasons (because objectively I think it is the opposite).

cut by K4u... .....  ... ..... ... .... ... .... I'll wait for the cases because I am distracted by the ironic red coloring.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 07:52:28 PM
It's not ironic, I'm just an Umineko nerd. :(

Respond please.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 01, 2011, 08:04:09 PM
It's not ironic, I'm just an Umineko nerd. :(

Respond please.
Ok.  Since I'm town I think I will have you facepalm!  nuff' said.  Now how about your cases?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 08:07:47 PM
I will get those up when I have time.  I still would like you to explain why I should be trying to throw dirt on Shadoweh even though I think she is totally and completely town and I think I would lose in the event that she got lynched after I did.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 01, 2011, 08:16:47 PM
dig up dirt != throw dirt.  This is what I consider acceptable: You make two cases on why both of us (me and shadoweh) could be scum: You then state which case is stronger and vote based on that. 
To be honest, your blindness this late in the game is really, really weird, no matter which alignment you are.  However we will know why soon enough once you make your cases.  (If shadoweh is indeed scum and you are not I bet she would be LHAO)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 08:22:49 PM
But I still do not understand.  As of now I do not expect to live through the day.  I think Shadoweh is town.  I do not want her lynched after I am because, from my PoV, that would mean I lose.  I have no reason to try to make her look bad, I have no reason to pull up things that make her look bad.  I DO NOT WANT HER LYNCHED!  I DID think about which of you two were likely to be scum already!  I spent HOURS going through the game trying to see how scum!Shadoweh made any sense at all and I found nothing.

Ergo, I see no reason to make a case on why she is scum.  The case I intend to type up on her is why she is town.  I fail to see how this is complicated or hard to understand, and I find it terrible that you're trying to push me into trying to make a case on someone I think is town.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 01, 2011, 08:54:11 PM
Kitten, objectively Dan is right. :/ I feel left out of this entire conversation. If neither of you bother to ask me any questions today I'm not going to be in a very good position to defend myself tomorrow, in the situation where you are town and Dan is scum. Frankly this entire exchange is bizzare and I'm doubting myself all over again. This is why I want to hear from the people who aren't involved and can give an unbiased opinion.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 09:01:51 PM
I'm still not really understanding what's so bizarre about it.  I have no doubt that you are town.  I see no need to question you.  All I need to do is make sure Dan gets lynched over you.  Ideally, that will be today, but even if I do end up being lynched today I want to make sure my words help you stay alive.  That is all I care about at this point.

I'll totally get those cases up as promised, I just have stuff I need to work on right now.  Poking in to answer questions and make comments every-so-often is doable, but I can't make the full cases right now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 01, 2011, 09:06:57 PM
Actually, let me put that a different way.

-I do not expect to live through the day.
-I think I will lose if Shadoweh gets lynched.
-My top priority is making sure Shadoweh does not get lynched because I do not see how I could possibly survive myself.
-I know I am town.
-Dan is trying to get my lynched.  This is as expected.
-Dan is trying to get me to type up a case/throw dirt around/whatever you want to call it on someone I think is 100% town cannot be scum.
-Dan will need to get Shadoweh to get lynched tomorrow in order to win.
-Having my case would help that.

That is how I see this conversation.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 01, 2011, 11:39:47 PM
I understand what you're getting at. At this point I think we seriously need to see your cases to go any further on our own. Sure would be nice if the other two got involved. ;-;
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Omba on May 01, 2011, 11:52:29 PM
Kitten4u:
You forgot the part where your own perception could be skewed, causing you to overlook something. Well, if you're going to write up a case on why Shadoweh is town, I'm assuming you'll also take a look at things that could somehow make her look like scum, even if only to refute that they actually make her scum.

Either way, I'll want you dead after you've made your cases and we've discussed them. Simply to see the cases you've made in perspective.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 02, 2011, 06:25:05 AM
(http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a197/Lilium1/untitled.jpg)

So, I've spent the past several hours staying away from this game because it took all my self control to not just self-hammer and say screw you all.  Seriously Omba, as if people dismissing what I'm saying wasn't bad enough you have to throw in my face that all my efforts are futile anyway? :|

Cases will come when I feel less emo.  If I feel like doing it at all.  I personally think the cases I posted yesterday suffice, but whatever.  The ones I was going to post today were just more detailed versions of what I said yesterday.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 02, 2011, 06:42:35 AM
You sound like you just got hit by a wave of apathy. :/ There's no way I can believe you're town now. Giving up is the worst possible thing you can do now, for either alignment's sake.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 02, 2011, 06:46:01 AM
Nothing I do is going to matter at all.  I have no reason to care.

Unless any of you is willing to explain why Dormio would want his roleblocker lynched and why any sane townie would ask someone to "throw dirt" on someone they think is town rather than asking "Hey Kitten4u, why do you think Shadoweh is town?" then it's clear I'm just wasting my time here.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 10:18:24 AM
If that's the best you've got than it's just not good enough.  Let's pretend Sect doesn't count as anything but a placeholder vote/person whose reason is blinded entirely by "Dan hate".  You are basing your arguement on me that I'm the last scum because Dormio didn't switch fast enough when It came down to a Scum/Scum roleblocker wagon?  Ok... What do you make of Dormio's first serious post which targeted.. gee.. me and shadoweh.  And his 2nd which pressed me for my WIFOM crap.  Not even Bard was willing to go into that. 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Bardiche on May 02, 2011, 11:22:09 AM
##VOTE: ActionDan

OK~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Bardiche on May 02, 2011, 12:27:44 PM
To explain, Dan had a terrible forced case on D1, which was Terrible Beyond All Belief. And these few days he has been arguing he is town not by the strength of his actions, but because circumstances dictate he cannot be scum. This defence reeks of incredible amounts of KEIKAKU DOORI, and from someone who self-proclaimed that "tactics > game", I don't think it's too far sought this was all according to plan and he deliberately set himself up here.

Since the roleblocker hasn't died, and given we've lynched scum each game on D1, a two-scum train becomes less unlikely as Dan keeps on bringing arguments on how he cannot be scum based solely on this fact.

The defence is too one-dimensional, the insistence of his townieness too blatant and "in your face".

There's a certain amount of leniency I am willing to lend town who have just had their position made secure through circumstances. But I forego any passes if they spend the rest of the game debunking that position so he looks scummier by the hour.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 02, 2011, 01:12:44 PM
##Unvote

Kitten, I'll ask you again, please present the full cases you have for both of us. If Bard is willing to consider the other side then so am I. I don't believe in a time when it's too late to prove yourself, one way or the other. The only thing you can do wrong in the end is giving up. Bard, you don't think this sounds like Scum Kitten4u?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 02, 2011, 01:19:06 PM
@Dan
Yeah, never mind his next post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg611570.html#msg611570). :V  I also like how you don't address any of my other concerns.

@Shadoweh
Because scum!Kitten4u is always hyperacitve, works really fucking hard at trying to figure things out, and would take anything but the most direct route to victory. :|  Personally, if you want to go by meta this looks far more like RKS!Kitten4u and MSR!Kitten4u (granted, I was third party in that one, but I was acting as a townie more or less).  I just absolutely cannot take having the futility of my actions shoved in my face like that.  It pokes at things in me that I simply cannot deal with.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 02, 2011, 01:46:19 PM
Kitten4u: You're touching on exactly why I'm having trouble deciding at this point. It feels like you have too much conviction.

There is something that's been seriously bothering me since this day started. We've gone into three days now where all our lynches were written out for us in stone before the day even began. No arguments, no proof, no excuses were considered above the standard of how much Townie Cred each of us have. It's Day 5 now. We need to throw this idea out the fucking window because the person who set this standard is still alive.

Anyway.... Not that Zak isn't suspicious, but he is clearly not the guy to go after.

aside from our two confirmed towns, the day 3 color scale list looks like the day 2 one.

ME!
Shadoweh
Zak
Polaris
HW
Bardiche
Hourai

Everyone remembers this day, right? Note that Dan thought Zak was less scummy then anyone but me, and Zak is the guy he accidentally hammered. He said yesterday it was because the other townies started the wagon and he knew he could get Hourai lynched the next day anyways. I understand why Kitten's been suspicious of you through reading you. From an emotional standpoint, you don't make sense. Your posts literally fill me with bad feelings once I stop ignoring them for coming from an 'obvtown newbie'. All your cases and points are based on assumptions without allowing other possibilities to exist. Until they do. Dan, we can't keep ignoring each other, it would be a disservice to town if I didn't ask you to set aside the defense that you MUST be town and ask you to prove how these actions don't have scum intent.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 01:47:03 PM
Quote
The defence is too one-dimensional, the insistence of his townieness too blatant and "in your face".

Man, that reminds me of the time Kitten4u was defending Shadoweh... O wait that's now isn't it. 
You are making a very heavy accusation based on KEIKAKU DOORI, at least have some courtesy to explain how this could come about instead of something like:
Quote
Since the roleblocker hasn't died, and given we've lynched scum each game on D1, a two-scum train becomes less unlikely as Dan keeps on bringing arguments on how he cannot be scum based solely on this fact.
Its quite unfair to apply Bayesian probability to this situation.  The chance that the uninformed town caught 2 informed scum D1 is not increased by future events (the depletion of village numbers).  I have more than this "scum/scum train D1 is impossible" defense (On a side note: Europeans spell defense with a "c" right).  Frankly I have Sect.  Sect attacked me D1 and I attacked back.  It was clear by the end of D1 that Sect was willing to keep his vote on me over Dormio, one of his scum buddies.  It makes no sense now as it did then.  The next day I keep my vote on Sect the whole day declaring him ObvScum, and stated that I wanted him dead over Bard.  I saw Sect's vote on me Day 2 more as a placeholder vote (and in light of developments probably a vote that Sect would have switched to Hourai).  Do you think that as Scum I would willingly sacrifice two of my scumbuddies while there was a detective out there and BANK that I'd kill him?  I'm sorry if you think these are "Circumstances," but my actions and posts are town intended. 

Bard, even though my case was "forced," I still had the balls to make one.  Why don't you piece together this grand conspiracy. cutcutcut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 02, 2011, 01:59:38 PM
Quote from: Dan
Man, that reminds me of the time Kitten4u was defending Shadoweh... O wait that's now isn't it. 
You still have yet to explain why this would be the optimal path for me to take.  I've already stated how silly this line of thought is and you have yet to counter it.

Quote from: Dan
The next day I keep my vote on Sect the whole day declaring him ObvScum, and stated that I wanted him dead over Bard. 
Y'know, now that I think about it I don't think you've ever explained why Sect was obvscum.  Can you explain now or link to the post where you did earlier if I missed it?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 02:30:49 PM
Kitten4u: You see what Dormio did? that was called "throwing dirt," on both me and shadoweh, fishing for support.  Dormio got that support on Shadoweh but not on me.  As far as I can understand, this is the source of shadoweh's innocence.  That scum dog-piled her early on.  Yes it is a point in her favor, but it can be interpreted differently "a la Bard."  What if Scum intentionally swelled her wagon to bring it up fast.  This was ED1 so moves like that would be very noticeable, and as such, it was noticed. Sect's vote was thrid, making shadoweh's wagon the largest so far.  HW and Bard followed shortly.   The very next post after Kiro unvoted, Sect unvoted and changed to me.  Basically this makes shadoweh's lynch more unlikely because of the loss of momentum (because the people who unvoted shadoweh most likely won't switch back again).  This partially answers shadoweh, but I have another post D4, (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg619555.html#msg619555) that is a condensed version. Hmm I guess I'll look at shadoweh's D2.

cut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 02, 2011, 02:41:19 PM
I have considered the possibility and dismissed it.  I can't read it as anything other than "Dormio wanted to lynch Shadoweh."
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 02:49:41 PM
Quote
You still have yet to explain why this would be the optimal path for me to take.  I've already stated how silly this line of thought is and you have yet to counter it.
I'm assuming the "would" is a "wouldn't".   This essentially gives Shadoweh a free pass once you die if you are town.  I want your case for why shadoweh is town and why I'm scum then we can debate properly.
Quote
Y'know, now that I think about it I don't think you've ever explained why Sect was obvscum.  Can you explain now or link to the post where you did earlier if I missed it?
Sect = Obvscum for not hammering scum D1 and going against town.  Did you really reread this game? Why do you think Sect gave up D2, because Sect couldn't keep up the act.

Post your cases . 

cut.  Great.  Now read Sect and tell me "Sect wanted to lynch Dan, but it's an obvious bus and obviously Sect hates Dan even though they are scum buddies"

makes. sense.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 02, 2011, 02:55:39 PM
I'd rather not add to the WIFOM you're proposing Dan, but the proven town that were on my wagon at the time didn't unvote me because it was too easy, it was because they didn't think a case on me had merit. huh what was on me as well before he got distracted by UK's amazing trollface, and Kiro is a very convincing player. It's entirely possible they thought they could ride out an easy wagon on me based on what Town was doing.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 02, 2011, 02:57:57 PM
You have them (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg618468.html#msg618468). 

Quote from: Dan
I'm assuming the "would" is a "wouldn't".
No, there is no mistake there.  You claim that me as scum would clear Shadoweh.  How is this optimal for scum that needs to get every non-confirmed townie lynched?

Quote from: Dan
Sect = Obvscum for not hammering scum D1 and going against town.  Did you really reread this game? Why do you think Sect gave up D2, because Sect couldn't keep up the act.
What made him worse than Bard, Serela/Zak, and Hourai?

Yes, there is absolutely a difference between what Sect did and what Dormio did.  I'm content to basically ignore Sect this game.  He compared you to Kips, said that you were stressing him out and said that he didn't really want to play with you.  I do not think his vote was founded in logic at all.  So yes, he wanted you dead, but he wanted YOU dead.  It had nothing to with your role.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 04:33:28 PM
Seriously Omba, as if people dismissing what I'm saying wasn't bad enough you have to throw in my face that all my efforts are futile anyway? :|
I never said your efforts are futile; that's assuming you're town. If you really are town and only want to ensure Shadoweh does not get lynched because you're dead sure she's town, too, then it shouldn't matter all that much to you if you're dying before Dan. It would only matter if you're considering the possibility of you being wrong about Shadoweh, in which case you'd of course need to stay alive so Shadoweh could get lynched next round if Dan somehow did end up flipping town.
Thing is, that's also exactly what you'd need to do if you're scum:

No, there is no mistake there.  You claim that me as scum would clear Shadoweh.  How is this optimal for scum that needs to get every non-confirmed townie lynched?
If you're scum, then the first thing you'd need to do is survive this day. The only way for you to do that is getting one of the other two possible candidates lynched. You increase the probability of that happening if you're concentrating on only one of them. Of course that means you're likely screwed once your target flips town, but there's at least a chance that whoever is still alive next round will lynch Shadoweh instead of you. If you were to die this round, you'd have already lost. A small chance of winning is much better than no chance at all.
Doesn't mean you're scum because of this, of course. Just that it doesn't make you town. Still, there's no way in hell I'm going to bet on you being town. Your conviction that Shadoweh is town is pretty much what's still keeping you alive. But we won't know if that conviction is real until you're dead.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 04:34:11 PM
I don't want to get into a point quote point arguement again like I did with Hourai.  I'll settle this once and for all.
I'm assuming the "would" is a "wouldn't".   This essentially gives Shadoweh a free pass once you die if you are town.  I want your case for why shadoweh is town and why I'm scum then we can debate properly.
You have them (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg618468.html#msg618468). 
No, there is no mistake there.  You claim that me as scum would clear Shadoweh.  How is this optimal for scum that needs to get every non-confirmed townie lynched?
I said if you were town this is not optimal.  As scum!K4U I see this as a gambit to save you a day by attacking me as hard as you can.  If you lynch me today then after I flip town you can say, "damn I screwed up, whelp, I guess shadoweh must be the scum, here's why."  Yes I think this is a dumb scum play, but I think what you are doing is dumber as town!K4U....

I thought you were going to right up cases today?  More definitive ones than the measly ones posted on D4.

Quote
What made him worse than Bard, Serela/Zak, and Hourai?

Yes, there is absolutely a difference between what Sect did and what Dormio did.  I'm content to basically ignore Sect this game.  He compared you to Kips, said that you were stressing him out and said that he didn't really want to play with you.  I do not think his vote was founded in logic at all.  So yes, he wanted you dead, but he wanted YOU dead.  It had nothing to with your role.
What made him worse was that Sect posted about not changing his vote to hammer scum, while the others you speak of were nowhere in sight (one was being replaced) and the other two I STATED WERE MY #2, and #3 choices for scum. 

About kips and rage: Here's the thing about scum, they can lie.  Maybe I was an obnoxious bastard (and I'd debate this) but does that mean Sect wanted me off the playing field only out of the goodness of his heart? Pffft.  If you want to see a good example of fakerage, just look at Dormio's play last game.

@shadoweh:  You were content to say earlier that Polaris and Hourai were 500 times scummier than I, so what do you say now? The only thing that has gone on today is a arguement over meta, which you don't put much stock in.     

cut reading

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Edible on May 02, 2011, 04:43:25 PM
V-O-T-E VOTECOUNT, HAI HAI

Kitten4U (1) - ActionDan
ActionDan (2) - Kitten4U, Bardiche

Dan is at L-1!

Not voting: Omba, Shadoweh

~24 hours remain.  With 5 alive, it takes 3 to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 02, 2011, 04:47:52 PM
Dan: I was. Then Hourai flipped town, Kitten replaced in and actually started using :effort: and you kept pushing the idea that your townie cred should get everyone lynched before you. I've been ignoring you for way too long and it's that hesitation that I've always regretted for myself in the end.
I never said your efforts are futile; that's assuming you're town. If you really are town and only want to ensure Shadoweh does not get lynched because you're dead sure she's town, too, then it shouldn't matter all that much to you if you're dying before Dan.
I don't actually think this is true. For a townie, sacrificing themselves for any reason means there's one less town in the game and puts town one move closer to an outright loss. No town should ever be willing to give up on the hope that people they can't trust will make the right decision for them. You can't rely on other people to trust your reads.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 04:54:10 PM
I don't actually think this is true. For a townie, sacrificing themselves for any reason means there's one less town in the game and puts town one move closer to an outright loss. No town should ever be willing to give up on the hope that people they can't trust will make the right decision for them. You can't rely on other people to trust your reads.
Hence why I said "all that much" instead of "at all". Either she really considers you to be 100% town like she said, or she doesn't.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 04:54:40 PM
EBWOP: Omba sums it up quite nicely. also I missed this post:

I'd rather not add to the WIFOM you're proposing Dan, but the proven town that were on my wagon at the time didn't unvote me because it was too easy, it was because they didn't think a case on me had merit. huh what was on me as well before he got distracted by UK's amazing trollface, and Kiro is a very convincing player. It's entirely possible they thought they could ride out an easy wagon on me based on what Town was doing.

Well I did think you were scummy for liking HH's arguements and posts for a while, but I thought there was scum on your wagon (and I wasn't wrong: Dormio + Sect, although I also thought Bard was scum at the time and I was suspicious of HW also).  Sect switched to me, Dormio switched to UK.  I do have a WIFOMy theory about why dormio didn't switch his vote to me.  And it's precisely that Dormio, in case his flip was known (his wagon was gaining rapidly),  didn't want to give me a clear pass as town.  Yes it is entirely possible that scum thought you were an easy wagon, that's why I think Polaris/K4U is 500 times more scummy than you are. 
cutcutcut
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 05:08:38 PM
Dan: I was. Then Hourai flipped town, Kitten replaced in and actually started using :effort: and you kept pushing the idea that your townie cred should get everyone lynched before you. I've been ignoring you for way too long and it's that hesitation that I've always regretted for myself in the end.

Hourai = town does not change the situation that much, I stated that I Hourai was 90% scum and went with my beliefs. Now I think Polaris/K4U is most certainly the last scum.  Kitten replaced in yet I think her :effort: is minimal.  She posted tidbits on us all D4.  She doesn't even want to consider you Scum now.  I push my "townie cred" because that "townie cred" carries weight.  Logical weight that tells everyone that it is much more likely that K4U is the last scum, and, if not, that I am at least as likely to be Scum as you Shadoweh.  This is supported by solid evidence. Not inflated Gambits.  I don't push aside Gambits either, I just put them in their place.



Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 02, 2011, 05:13:38 PM
Hourai wasn't really sounding scummy to me, even if I thought he was wrong at the time. I told you, it's possible for people to be both obviously town and wrong at the same time. The point about Dormio reminds me, you had to be prodded to vote for your opposing wagon by Kiro (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613479.html#msg613479), didn't you? You were still trying to push your case on Hourai with 14 hours left. Why did you think at that point Hourai was worse then Dormio?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 05:30:19 PM
Hourai wasn't really sounding scummy to me, even if I thought he was wrong at the time. I told you, it's possible for people to be both obviously town and wrong at the same time. The point about Dormio reminds me, you had to be prodded to vote for your opposing wagon by Kiro (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613479.html#msg613479), didn't you? You were still trying to push your case on Hourai with 14 hours left. Why did you think at that point Hourai was worse then Dormio?
Because of time. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg613429.html#msg613429)  The next post I switched. 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 02, 2011, 07:50:13 PM
That doesn't actually answer my question. :/ I didn't ask why you switched. I asked why you thought Hourai was scummier then Dormio. The person everyone thought was scum. You didn't actually answer me either earlier when I asked you why setting up all our lynches ahead of time was a pro-town action.

Okay, I've had it. I refuse to believe that difficult odds mean you can't be scum. Ignoring credentials, you read like scum. You misinterpret every post you have ever responded to. You spent Day 1 and 2 speculating power roles. You tried to make this a game of the most likely scenario when scum already know which statistics they need to push to make town fail. You make me feel like you could be the scummiest player on earth. Even more then that I have trouble believing Scum Kitten4u would be trying this hard. And after today's posts I actually think you're a better player then you've been pretending to be.

And the lack of posts this day is frankly disapointing. I want to move onto the next game.

##VOTE: ACTION DAN
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 07:56:01 PM
...
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Edible on May 02, 2011, 07:56:20 PM
Kitten4U (1) - ActionDan
ActionDan (3) - Kitten4U, Bardiche, Shadoweh

Not voting: Omba

Action Dan has been lynched!  He was, somehow, a townsperson.  Perhaps eventually we'll learn how this is possible.

It is now Night 5!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 07:57:05 PM
...
...
...
FUCKDAMNIT ARGH
...
...
...
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 5)
Post by: Conqueror on May 02, 2011, 07:57:17 PM
lololololololololol
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 02, 2011, 08:00:19 PM
Well balls.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Pesco on May 02, 2011, 08:02:35 PM
I can't even think of a word for us to play Hangmafia with.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Edible on May 02, 2011, 08:03:05 PM
I can't even think of a word for us to play Hangmafia with.

_ _ _ _
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Conqueror on May 02, 2011, 08:03:58 PM
A
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Edible on May 02, 2011, 08:04:49 PM
_ _ _ _

Used: A
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 08:05:13 PM
D
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Conqueror on May 02, 2011, 08:05:24 PM
U
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Edible on May 02, 2011, 08:05:41 PM
_ U _ _

Used: A D
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Pesco on May 02, 2011, 08:06:37 PM
F U C K

And you have to specify how many alive and lynches till lylo
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Edible on May 02, 2011, 08:07:02 PM
pesco is banned for cheating.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Pesco on May 02, 2011, 08:07:56 PM
Not my fault you leave the mod notes lying around.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Serela on May 02, 2011, 08:55:09 PM
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

Used:

:I
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 02, 2011, 08:57:52 PM
Who is this guy o.o

S E L F H A M R
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Edible on May 02, 2011, 08:58:39 PM
Who is this guy o.o

S E L F H A M R

You got it on the first try!

Away with you, Serela.  I'm going to figure out what to do with you when this game's over.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 09:26:24 PM
Away with you, Serela.  I'm going to figure out what to do with you when this game's over.
I still think he would make for some good bloody ice.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Bardiche on May 02, 2011, 10:10:29 PM
 :ohdear:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 10:11:03 PM
Please somehow survive the night so I can lynch you next day. :/
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Bardiche on May 02, 2011, 10:24:39 PM
Lol. :( But he really was scummy.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 10:28:51 PM
Of course he was. But if he really were actual scum, then just as you said, there'd have to be a giant amount of JUST AS PLANNED involved.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 10:30:49 PM
w/e, we're still going to win. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Edible on May 02, 2011, 10:32:50 PM
Ixnay on the ametalk-gay. :|
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on May 02, 2011, 10:40:33 PM
MAFIA SPOILERS
Rosebud is the final scum! That killed Dumbledore! On Good Friday
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Bardiche on May 02, 2011, 10:53:34 PM
IXNAY ON YOUR PIG
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: PX on May 02, 2011, 11:09:10 PM
Mission Accomplished. Now let's get out of here and onto the next game.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 02, 2011, 11:18:39 PM
I still hate everything. ;_;
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Omba on May 02, 2011, 11:25:38 PM
:V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Conqueror on May 02, 2011, 11:29:39 PM
ITT not all scum are mafia.  :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 11:38:48 PM
Bah: Bahhhhh- I r sheep
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 02, 2011, 11:42:51 PM
ITT not all scum are mafia.  :V
ITT not all scum are players.

Note PX's appearance five posts ago.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: capt. h on May 02, 2011, 11:58:28 PM
ITT not all scum are players.

Note PX's appearance five posts ago.

He's not even a player, and I'm already convinced he's scum.

Vote: PX
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: ActionDan on May 02, 2011, 11:59:19 PM
Playing a game with PX sounds like a lot of fun to me!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: PX on May 03, 2011, 12:09:08 AM
You guys all suck.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 12:14:32 AM
Assuming the night actions have been sent in, starting the last day would be great. Everyone's been online since the beginning of the night.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Schezo on May 03, 2011, 12:25:30 AM
ITT not all scum are players.
>_>

I don't know who you're talking about.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 12:25:49 AM
But Omba I'm sleepy ;-; I can't post when I'm cranky
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 12:29:52 AM
No one said you had to post right away. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: PX on May 03, 2011, 12:32:10 AM
Remember to quicklynch so it's over in 2 minutes. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (NIGHT 5)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 12:33:55 AM
I'm fine with quicklynching you, sure.
##Vote PX
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 12:34:51 AM
I like your pepper sauce, mister!

BARDICHE!  COME ON DOWN! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9hs08EteeU)

...

...

...

...

...

...

...

You died! :D

Bardiche was a townsperson.

BWEEP BWEEP BWEEP IT'S LYLO BWEEP BWEEP BWEEP

Shadoweh, Omba, and Kitten4U are alive.  Everyone else is dead.  Forever.  It is day 6.  With 3 alive, it takes 2 to lynch.  Don't screw this one up, kids.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 12:41:28 AM
Just as planned. Except Kitten4u is still alive so that plan died. :V

Anyway. Both of you please make a case on each other. Doesn't need to be long. Don't already assume you're going to win/die.

Shadoweh: Why did you hammer ActionDan before Kitten4u could post her full cases?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 12:45:35 AM
Because I make bad decisions after waking up she said she wasn't going to. She linked back to the old cases she made and they seemed good enough at the time. :fail:

I'm just going to get this part out of the way now. Kitten4u is truly too cute to lynch ;-;

##Vote: Kitten4u
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 12:54:12 AM
Only she never had a chance to reply to what I've wrote. And before that, she had cited my preceding post as a reason for not bothering to write the full cases.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 01:03:42 AM
Which of your posts are you talking about? I don't remember seeing anything that I thought would change her mind if even me asking directly didn't. You still seemed like you wanted her lynch regardless anyways. And I didn't think it mattered. Because I fell for what she was pushing. The impression I got was that she didn't care because you were making it impossible for her to win.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 03, 2011, 01:07:17 AM
##Vote Shadoweh

I...I'm sorry.  I've lost the game for us.  Omba, I don't think you realize exactly what you said to me yesterday.  I'll just say this now instead of waiting for the post game: never say something like that to someone ever again.  There is nothing more demoralizing, and like I said yesterday, you hit me in a spot I can't deal with.  I still can't even look at this game without crying.  I really don't want to give up, but I really don't think I can reread this game again.  Again, I'm sorry if this means we lose the game, but I can't do it.

I still want to address this line of thought (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg622101.html#msg622101) because it makes no sense.  As scum, I need EVERYONE lynched.  Trying super hard to make someone look townie is counter-productive to that goal.  It is not counter-productive to my town goal: keep people I think are town alive.  It is not helpful to focus on one person.  If I only needed ONE of them lynched it would be, but since I would need them both dead the only logical course of action would be to cast as much doubt on everyone as possible.  Declaring someone as town like that would just be stupid.  You said it yourself:
Quote from: Omba
Of course that means you're likely screwed once your target flips town,
It makes no sense.  "Divide and conquer" does not work in this situation.  My best chance of living did not come from buddying up to anyone.  My best chance of living came from casting enough doubt on everyone so that they would get lynched.  Two potential lynch targets > one potential lynch target.  At the very least, if I, for whatever reason, had a lapse of logic and did think that buddying was the best way to live why would I choose to buddy up to SHADOWEH of all people?  Dan had already proven that he was willing to ignore people that declared him town.  Hell, I didn't even need either of them on my side.  Why wouldn't I buddy up to the confirmed townies?  You know, the only ones that would matter at all?

Quote from: Omba
. If you really are town and only want to ensure Shadoweh does not get lynched because you're dead sure she's town, too, then it shouldn't matter all that much to you if you're dying before Dan.
While logically sound, this is a bad way to think.  I was trying SO hard to convince people I was town despite everything that happened with Polaris.  I was trying SO hard to get people to go after who I thought was scum.  I was trying SO hard to get people to think the person I thought was town was town.  You can't ignore the emotional side of Mafia.  You dismissed everything I said like it didn't even matter.  Even if that was not your intention, it's what you said to me.  I don't think you realize what this does to me, especially after working so hard.

Just something to think about for future games I guess.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 01:28:16 AM
I still want to address this line of thought (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg622101.html#msg622101) because it makes no sense.  As scum, I need EVERYONE lynched.  Trying super hard to make someone look townie is counter-productive to that goal.  It is not counter-productive to my town goal: keep people I think are town alive.  It is not helpful to focus on one person.  If I only needed ONE of them lynched it would be, but since I would need them both dead the only logical course of action would be to cast as much doubt on everyone as possible.
The thing is, the way you went about making me look super townie was by never presenting any proof on why I wasn't scum. And it WAS helpful to focus the way you did because you didn't just focus on me 'being town', you also focused on Dan 'being scum'. As long as you got one of us here you could hold out on the chance the other confirmed town would doubt me the same way. And frankly I think I look bad right now for believing you in the first place.
Quote
At the very least, if I, for whatever reason, had a lapse of logic and did think that buddying was the best way to live why would I choose to buddy up to SHADOWEH of all people?  Dan had already proven that he was willing to ignore people that declared him town.  Hell, I didn't even need either of them on my side.  Why wouldn't I buddy up to the confirmed townies?  You know, the only ones that would matter at all?
Because Dan was already tunneling on how you must be scum via his own system and I'm more likely to listen if you phrase your case with what I perceive to be town intent. We were all fed up with Dan's antics over the last few days. I was also more likely to listen to you on the basis that you are K4u and I'm terribly biased in your favor despite myself, and it probably makes me a terrible player but there it is.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 01:32:54 AM
Kitten4u:
Well, my actual plan was to lynch you and if you were to flip town, Shadoweh; unless you were to provide some new insight on ActionDan that would really make me think he's scum. I was actually already getting a feeling you'd flip town, but there was no way I'd get a Shadoweh lynch last day. Plus, stating I want Shadoweh dead before you would have made me the likely NK target if she is scum.

I still want to address this line of thought (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg622101.html#msg622101) because it makes no sense.  As scum, I need EVERYONE lynched.  Trying super hard to make someone look townie is counter-productive to that goal.[...]
I didn't say anything about buddying up. Taking a strong stance like that is good way to skew people's perception of something. If you had tried to attack both players that looked more town than you on the same day, that would not have worked nearly as well. Of course, if you are able to pull it off, attacking both would be best. But again, that's if you're able to.
Focusing on only one player would have been what I'd do as scum. Then hope I somehow don't get killed on the last day. Because in your position, I'd have been sure I'd die if went to for both others at the same time. But, as I said, that doesn't make you scum.

While logically sound, this is a bad way to think.  I was trying SO hard to convince people I was town despite everything that happened with Polaris.  I was trying SO hard to get people to go after who I thought was scum.  I was trying SO hard to get people to think the person I thought was town was town.  You can't ignore the emotional side of Mafia.  You dismissed everything I said like it didn't even matter.  Even if that was not your intention, it's what you said to me.  I don't think you realize what this does to me, especially after working so hard.
I only restated what you had already written. Namely that you were expecting to die and wanted to make sure Shadoweh does not get lynched. And yes, I did dismiss it, kind of. I should probably have stated that I was sleepy and just wanted to get that part out. On the other hand, you giving up would have had exactly the result I wanted if Bard didn't vote ActionDan.

Also, if you haven't noticed, I'm leaning towards lynching Shadoweh.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 01:35:50 AM
Which of your posts are you talking about? I don't remember seeing anything that I thought would change her mind if even me asking directly didn't. You still seemed like you wanted her lynch regardless anyways. And I didn't think it mattered. Because I fell for what she was pushing. The impression I got was that she didn't care because you were making it impossible for her to win.
This one. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg622101.html#msg622101)
Considering she said before that she mainly wanted to make sure you survive, I'd have thought that post might get her to flesh out her cases.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 03, 2011, 01:45:35 AM
Quote from: Omba
Well, my actual plan was to lynch you and if you were to flip town, Shadoweh;
This is what made me sadface in the first place. :V  And then you went all "nope going to lynch you anyway," which in my mind at the time, meant we were totally screwed no matter what I did.  So yeah, demoralizing.

Quote from: Shadoweh
The thing is, the way you went about making me look super townie was by never presenting any proof on why I wasn't scum.
But I did!  I responded to everything Kiro threw at me.  I responded to anything anyone asked me.  You don't need a huge wall of text to defend someone.

As for everything else I think I'd just be repeating myself at this point.  Scum's most powerful tools are doubt and confusion.  I was not using either.  That's really all I can say on that.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 01:47:06 AM
Kitten4u:
Well, my actual plan was to lynch you and if you were to flip town, Shadoweh; unless you were to provide some new insight on ActionDan that would really make me think he's scum. I was actually already getting a feeling you'd flip town, but there was no way I'd get a Shadoweh lynch last day. Plus, stating I want Shadoweh dead before you would have made me the likely NK target if she is scum.
You already made it clear a few times you wanted me dead before Dan. So did Bard before yesterday, and somehow I think he wouldn't be impressed with me right now either. I think either of you were likely to have voted for me at this point.

This one. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,9126.msg622101.html#msg622101)
Considering she said before that she mainly wanted to make sure you survive, I'd have thought that post might get her to flesh out her cases.
I didn't think so. It was pretty obvious she had already given up on trying to reason with anyone at that point, and since you were the one that set her off I didn't think anything you said could convince her. And you did sound unreasonable, that's why I unvoted in the first place. I thought you were likely to hammer her if you thought people were considering Dan instead.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 01:56:50 AM
This is what made me sadface in the first place. :V  And then you went all "nope going to lynch you anyway," which in my mind at the time, meant we were totally screwed no matter what I did.  So yeah, demoralizing.
I thought I hadn't made it obvious whom I wanted dead after you at that point. :V

I didn't think so. It was pretty obvious she had already given up on trying to reason with anyone at that point, and since you were the one that set her off I didn't think anything you said could convince her. And you did sound unreasonable, that's why I unvoted in the first place. I thought you were likely to hammer her if you thought people were considering Dan instead.
Huh. I wasn't going to hammer anyone before either the discussion ended or The Rocks were closing in. But I guess me previously helping Dan with hammering could have made you think that; you had no way of knowing I didn't plan on quicklynching Zakeri.

Anyway, seems there's not much left to add for either of you, so I'll end this.

##Vote: Shadoweh
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 03, 2011, 01:59:44 AM
>_>b

Too cute to kill.  Totally.  I'll spare you the suspense, this is town win.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 02:00:28 AM
Yep.

o/
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 03, 2011, 02:00:50 AM
Oh, and it was your D4 play that made me think you wanted to lynch Shadoweh over Dan btw.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 02:01:20 AM
Town wins!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: ActionDan on May 03, 2011, 02:01:22 AM
KEIKAKU DOORI!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Conqueror on May 03, 2011, 02:02:01 AM
Most sudden town win ever.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Schezo on May 03, 2011, 02:02:36 AM
Aww the kitten needs a hug. :(

~hug~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 03, 2011, 02:03:14 AM
*dies*

Yeah, sorry about the emoness.  Polaris4u QT (http://www.quicktopic.com/46/H/JHVUz77GEjncW).  I hope my emoness doesn't make you feel too bad Omba. :(
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 02:03:30 AM
Roles were posted D1, dead QT is here: http://quicktopic.com/46/H/H23unP5ur4p5

I'll leave it up to Shadoweh if she wants to post the scum QT, because 90% of it is The Shadoweh Show.

Thoughts in a bit.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 02:04:10 AM
So, I guess we're not getting proper flavor, then?

The overall level of townie play this game was kind of depressing, but the game was still surprisingly enjoyable to watch even after my death. Plus, we won, so that's awesome. Townie wins are always great. <3

I have no idea how to play investigative roles at all (this is my first time rolling one, derp). On D1 I tried to put myself in a line of fire that would be strong enough to make scum think I wasn't cautious enough to be a PR but have it also be a weak enough case that I probably wouldn't actually get lynched over it. I'm not sure if it worked out too well. <_<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Chaore on May 03, 2011, 02:04:35 AM
holy what since when the hell does town win in these games

I HAVE BEEN LIED TO MY ENTIRE LIFE.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on May 03, 2011, 02:05:33 AM
My personal thoughts QT where I stored stuff I wanted to remember later: http://www.quicktopic.com/46/H/SctPNCwFg7qSp

Anyway YAY TOWN WIN~

@HW: Well, you did fail to get lynched and I was wrong about your motivations :V.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 02:06:44 AM
Oh, and it was your D4 play that made me think you wanted to lynch Shadoweh over Dan btw.
Well yes. I just didn't think it looked like it was set in stone or anything. That, and I thought you'd think you dying as town after defending Shadoweh like that could sway my opinion. It actually might have.

Shadoweh: What made me lynch you was you hammering ActionDan. I had previously thought you'd do exactly this if you're scum. The timing was just too convenient.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (DAY 6)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 02:07:15 AM
What no couldn't you at least let me present my utterly bullshit case first?!?!

How did this happen? Can't you see I'm town? TOWN?! EVERYONE SAID IT, WOULD THEY LIE TO YOU!

AAAAAHHHH THIS IS ALL OF THEIR FAULTS! I SHOULD HAVE KILLED THEM SOONER! THAT STUBBORN UNCERTAINKITTEN! THAT MALICIOUS ZAKERI WHO DESTROYED MY MINION!

BUT MOST OF ALL I BLAME THIS ALL ON KIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

*Shadoweh foams at the mouth and falls off the stand*

Judge: Prosecutor, where is the witness now?

Payne: Ah, she was taken into custody and is being charged as we speak, your honor.

Judge: I see. Well, this is mostly a formality at this point, but I pronouce the accused, Kitten4u...

Too cute to kill! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lULkKtSbeZA)

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Schezo on May 03, 2011, 02:10:31 AM
holy what since when the hell does town win in these games
When you aren't modding them. :V

But really, as long as I'm not my 98.789% scum roll, town wins are good.  Well done.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 03, 2011, 02:11:49 AM
@Shadoweh
I'm finding it incredibly ironic that you're the one that told me to make this my personal text in the first place. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 02:13:04 AM
What have I done to myself? :ohdear: NOONE IS EVER GOING TO LET ME BE CONFIRMED TOWN AGAIN ;-;

Scum QT Shadoweh's Sing-Along Blog! (http://www.quicktopic.com/46/H/vBDueEyjQPFvS)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 02:14:13 AM
The first day of this mafia
I thought that I would die
I would leave the game forever 'cause I thought I couldn't lie!

Zak wrote me such a fable
But I was so forlorn
Such overwhelming guilt knowing UK was dead by morn :<

Then after huh what claimed his role
I knew what I would do
I'd bring the new players to the end and make them think it through~

This game was made for learning
I'd play it to the end
Show Dan that saying that you're town is no way to defend!

Poor K4U she had no chance
I fooled her from the start
I knew she'd never catch me if I played for town at heart~

And the funny thing is looking back
The rest of you should see
The one who said consider all your options that was me!

I told you not to mislynch
I told you it was wrong
I said that you were looking in the wrong place all along~

I gave you motivation
I kept you all in stride
What's the point of winning if the losers never tried?

And in the end I'm proud of you
For finding out the truth
I hope you learned a scumslip is the furthest thing from proof~

The moral of this story
Stop thinking that you've won
If you don't do scumhunting then you just might lose to scum~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 02:17:00 AM
I was writing up a rant about how poorly this game went for everyone but a select few players, but then Shadoweh posted that glorious piece of literature and I really have nothing else to say.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Conqueror on May 03, 2011, 02:17:35 AM
poem

Well said. :3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: PX on May 03, 2011, 02:18:52 AM
I still want that rant. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 02:21:01 AM
I still want that rant. :V
Same here. :3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 02:22:30 AM
Have some night actions instead.

N1
Shadoweh blocks Bardiche
huh what cops UncertainKitten
Omba protects Kiro
Scum shoots Kiro

N2
Shadoweh blocks Bardiche
huh what cops Bardiche
Omba protects Kiro
Scum shoots UncertainKitten

N3
Shadoweh blocks Bardiche
huh what cops Hourai
Omba protects Kiro
Scum shoots huh what

N4
Shadoweh blocks Omba
Omba protects Omba
Scum shoots Kiro

N5
Shadoweh blocks Omba
Omba protects Omba
Scum shoots Bardiche
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: ActionDan on May 03, 2011, 02:27:16 AM
That poem brought tears to my over-sensitive eyes. :)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 02:31:20 AM
Quote from: Shadoweh
AHAHAHAHA He scanned both the trolls. I so can't kill all these ~*CONFIRMED TOWN*~ before they find me~ You'll never take me alive coppas!
Is that really a surprise? I even stated that trolls ping my scumdar more frequently than actual scum. Again, people should troll less in mafia.

Also, I never got a nickname that applied to games outside of MRM. derp

That picture of Kiro is hilarious. Best thing to come out of this game by far.

Edible: If part of it applies to me, I'd like to hear it, at least. I like knowing where I fucked up and where I didn't, especially since this is my first time playing cop.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 02:35:37 AM
I'm posting this here because I think it sums up Omba's doctor strategy best:

Factual Representation of Scum Menace (http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/4821/kiromonster.jpg)

So.. yeah! That sure was a thing, how you all tried to puzzle out how that wagon could have possibly happened. You all think too hard about Xanatos Gambits. I can sum it up in DURRMIO DERPIN IT UP! I'm not kidding about the quitting thing, I thought if I was useless as scum there was no point in inning if I would lose the game for my side. <_< I think I'm okay with not doing that anymore. There were no players that registered in my mind that weren't named Zakeri, UncertainKitten or Kiro. Oh and Bard when I thought he was the cop. How did you all turn this into Zombie Apocalypse Mafia all over again? I probably would have kept playing even if it was 'impossible' to win and brought Kiro to the end, because as long as there's a tenth, a hundred, a million in one chance you can win, you should never just give up or devolve into laziness.

Because Townies should never give up until the bitter end. Even when they roll scum.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 02:37:22 AM
Hey, I was still trying. <_< Most of my laziness was more my personality than the situation we were in, you of all people should have been able to realize this after Zombie Apocalypse.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 02:39:46 AM
Also, I never got a nickname that applied to games outside of MRM. derp
:3 I was ignoring you on purpose by the way, so you wouldn't do that thing again. You PSYCHIC BASTARD!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on May 03, 2011, 02:40:19 AM
Well, I think I did all right. And HW, trollin is how I roll scum hunt. People don't hide their motivations well. Now if only I could, like, not tunnel on people :V.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 02:41:08 AM
Shadoweh: Why'd you kill Bard instead of me?
Also, that picture is really fitting. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Schezo on May 03, 2011, 02:41:29 AM
Scumdar?  What's this, something townies get when the don't roll mafia almost every time? :getdown:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 02:42:41 AM
:3 I was ignoring you on purpose by the way, so you wouldn't do that thing again. You PSYCHIC BASTARD!
I'm not a true psychic bastard until I catch three scum on night 1 with only the flip of a townie and a traitor. For now, I'm just low level.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 02:43:42 AM
Lessee.  Instead of rant, constructive criticism!

Kiro
Good work as always.  Stellar D1 got you both a doc block and a kill attempt and you were hot on scum's heels the rest of the game.

huh what
You may have been new at the role but you did a fine job and picked the right time to claim given your circumstances.

UK
Being scum's second choice for NK after failing the first time speaks for itself, really.

Bardiche
Sorry the game trainwrecked for you.  Hopefully you'll view it as a learning experience to, like, completely ignore derptown derpiness or something. :(  Thanks for stickin' in.

Zakeri
Totally didn't even remotely deserve your lynch.  Still not sure how it happened; you played exceptionally well, and thank you for switching in at short notice.

K4U
JESUS CHRIST I'M SORRY NEXT TIME YOU ASK FOR A HYDRA I'M GIVING YOU SOMEONE WHO ACTUALLY PLAYS ;_;  Admirable effort despite a crappy situation.  Thank you as well for switching in, again at short notice.

Dan
I like your pep!  I... don't really like your posting acumen, but as mentioned in the QT I think it's redeemable.  Put some effort into reading other games to get a firmer grasp on scumhunting theory and, well... calm down a bit!

Omba
Could've been worse, but you've a ways to go.  I don't like it when effectively confirmed town seem to stop playing and coast on other people's cases, and that's what it felt like with you.  Play every game like you don't get an easy confirmation, and never stop thinking!

Polaris
-_-;  Actually play next time, if there is one.

NeoSerela
Can't see this message because I Lynched him for reasons that are self-explanatory.

Sect
I think you were frustrated with the hand you were dealt, and Dormio's early departure, but never give up!  I think you can be a better player than this.

Dormio
I'm thinking maybe next time we don't give you a pesco, his ability to get killed early-on seems to have rubbed off on you.

Shadoweh
Entire team of newbie scum, both partners dead by N2, not a single town fatality, and you soldiered through the entire list one-by-one and almost made it at the end.  Superb grit, excellent effort.  Hats off to you.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 03, 2011, 02:44:57 AM
So just wondering Dead QT people, what made you so sure I was town?  I don't think I would have acted that much differently if I were scum.  That was total "Kitten4u is backed into a corner and does not want to lose" more than anything else.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on May 03, 2011, 02:47:45 AM
Hard to explain. Town vibes, yo :P. Also, Shadoweh was scum by her first two posts :V.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 02:49:23 AM
The part where the mod told us the final scum wasn't you. :V

Seriously, though, I think it was more that I thought Dan looked worse than you than that I thought you were scum. Once Dan died, Shadoweh's D5 probably would have caused me to look in her direction a bit more. I can't really say, though, since this situation is just figurative.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: PX on May 03, 2011, 02:51:36 AM
Kiro, you need your old avatar back! It's much better than the one you have now.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Polaris on May 03, 2011, 02:52:54 AM
I know my main problem is lurking but I swear at least half of that was sleep/school :( I know it's my fault that I agreed to taking the last spot when I was occupied with school but I'm a little annoyed at how Edible replaced me half an hour before I was supposed to get home (although I got home late that day regardless, so I guess it's kind of moot) I'm hoping I can actually play a proper game in the summer but I'm not sure if anyone's going to allow me in their games anymore because of my history.

One problem that I think I have is that I just dismiss people that I don't see anyying scummy about. I know I should be suspicious of everybody but maybe I'm too sympathetic or whatever a better word is.

Anyway, huge thanks to Kitten4u for helping me even though I failed pretty badly, and then picking up after me afterwards. I kept hesitating to talk to you because I didn't have anything substantial to bring up, so I was afraid I'd just be bothering you. But I stand by my opinion that huhwhat is uninteresting.

Congrats to town even though I thought it was hopeless after Dan flipped town. :x
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 02:53:05 AM
Also, I'm really disappointed I never picked up on Shadoweh's defensive vibes when she responded to my joke about my gut read. :< I probably would have been more motivated to press her instead of getting tunnel visioned on UK for like half the day had I noticed them.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 02:55:46 AM
I know my main problem is lurking but I swear at least half of that was sleep/school :( I know it's my fault that I agreed to taking the last spot when I was occupied with school but I'm a little annoyed at how Edible replaced me half an hour before I was supposed to get home (although I got home late that day regardless, so I guess it's kind of moot) I'm hoping I can actually play a proper game in the summer but I'm not sure if anyone's going to allow me in their games anymore because of my history.

I agree that I was a little abrupt with your replacement, but please understand that you gave me extremely little to work with and in reality should've been modkilled outright.

That said, bear in mind that you're still open to play.  In fact, I welcome it - however, you should be absolutely sure you'll have the free time to do so next time.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Schezo on May 03, 2011, 03:00:23 AM
Oh man, Edible I just saw your signature and you had me busting a gut for a second. :]
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 03:01:25 AM
I did a fucking spittake when I first saw that line, as I was at the time the only other person who knew huh what was the cop. <_<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 03:02:33 AM
Yeah, I can sum up my ED1 as me going ADGDFGDHHGHGTY HALP HOW DO I LYNCH TOWNIE :colonveeplusalpha:

My versions of the night actions are so much cooler btw:

Night 1:
Quote
I'm going to have Bardiche take me out to dinner, then we're going to read Cavalier of the Abyss together, and most importantly I'm going to make sure he's not doing a~nything else all night long. <3 It's better this way for the both of us~
##Roleblock Bardiche

>_> I don't know if Sect remembered to send in the kill, if he did disregard this messaje.
Otherwise it would be pretty cool if Sect suceeded in a ##Kill: Kiro action. Even if I think he's going to bounce. And we will spend Day 2 crying and lamenting life.
Night 2:
Quote
The voices have spoken. As a reward for her protection I will give UncertainKitten sweet merciful release from this circus. When she figures out who killed her please tell her I'm sorry. ;^;
##Kill: UncertainKitten

As for Bard, your gambits cannot stop me! NOTHING YOU DO CAN RESIST MY ABILITY TO SPEND EVERY NIGHT WITH YOU AHAHAHAHA
##Roleblock: Bardiche

I am not in fact going to change my mind on these. If the cop checks me and is going to live to tomorrow feel free to end the game before the night is even over. Until then I will press on to win this game for Town, the real town, which is ME AND ME ALONE!
Night 3:
Quote
Let's make this like, the shortest freaking night ever. DIE FPMX COP!
##KILL HUH WHAT

...Oh hell and I guess I'll ##Roleblock: Bardiche because BARDICHE <3 <3 <3

Seriously you could skip to tomorrow it's not like anyone else's actions can stop this. ;-;
Night 4:
Quote
DIE DEMON, YOU DON'T BELONG IN THIS WORLD!
##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO ##KILL KIRO

I AM SORRY BARD I CANNOT COME TO YOU TONIGHT, YOU WILL HAVE TO WAIT TOMORROW FOR MY LAST VISIT!
##ROLEBLOCK OMBA

AHAHAHAHA FINALLY MY NEMESIS GONE GONE GONE FOREVER AND EVER AND EEEEEEVEEEERRRR
Night 5:
Quote
For one of the most amusing players I know you sure were boring today Bard. I so do not want to deal with you tomorrow. Omba can be the one who points out how scummy I am. Also HOW COULD I VISIT ANYONE BUT YOOOOU~<3

##Kill: Bardiche

And doctors, as if they even work.

##Roleblock: Omba

Omba: I told you why, Bardiche is a better player then you~ and I was bringing you to the end~
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 03:05:27 AM
I actually had some reasoning for making my jokes about "I think ___ is the cop", in that I figured that if the last scum was somebody like Dan he would look into my post and assume that it meant I was not actually the cop. I'm not sure if that logic would actually work.

Plus, there was no risk of actually screwing with the real cop since it was me anyway.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 03:07:25 AM
Omba
Could've been worse, but you've a ways to go.  I don't like it when effectively confirmed town seem to stop playing and coast on other people's cases, and that's what it felt like with you.  Play every game like you don't get an easy confirmation, and never stop thinking!
One part was as Pesco said me looking at what Kiro'd do, the other part was not bothering to write out what I was thinking. It usually takes me at least as much time to write down what I've concluded as it takes me to get to that conclusion.
Still think my huge pile of fuck-up on Day 2 was much worse than posting less once I was confirmed. But yeah, I get what you're saying.

Shadoweh: Ah, ok. I was wondering whether you did it because I seemed more likely to lynch K4u instead of you. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 03:08:33 AM
Not really. I think Kitten would have killed Bard over you regardless.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on May 03, 2011, 03:10:18 AM
The part where the mod told us the final scum wasn't you. :V

Seriously, though, I think it was more that I thought Dan looked worse than you than that I thought you were scum. Once Dan died, Shadoweh's D5 probably would have caused me to look in her direction a bit more. I can't really say, though, since this situation is just figurative.

Actually, Shadoweh can tell you the first thing I asked after I died was why she killed me. I did more or less have her, though I let her go for a bit, then re had her (when I was joking about Narrative Causality), BEFORE Edible revealed her. So yes, I did catch her, but it was too late to actually matter. Which means it doesn't count. I mean, hell, the whole dead topic caught me last game but I still won.

@HW: Yeah, Shadoweh's first two posts were VERY nervous. I'm kicking myself for not seeing them at the time myself.

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 03:15:57 AM
Not really. I think Kitten would have killed Bard over you regardless.
Derp. Well, at least it contributed to lynching you. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Conqueror on May 03, 2011, 03:17:49 AM
By the way, huh what, what were your cop crumbs?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 03:19:54 AM
I never actually crumbed my role so much as my planned targets. Even if I changed them later on, I could at least point out the crumbs to show my thought process.

Quote
There are better ways the UK/HW scuffle could be resolved, anyway. :x
Quote
I'll have to take a closer look at Bard/Hourai overnight following Sect's flip.
(This one gave me some leeway.)

And of course, I intended to cite my jokes about the cop's identity as well as my D1 play if I was ever forced to claim when closed to lynch.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on May 03, 2011, 03:41:17 AM
Good game all.
Though I died D1. :(
Worst timing to start the game, I had no time during early D1, and I was way tired during the rest of D1.
And then I got better with my break but I was dead. :V

I like how much "Why would Dormio push for the scum roleblocker so much?" there was. :)

Oh yeah.
Also.
WHY CAN I NEVER BE VANILLA?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 03:43:29 AM
Three games. You have attempted to get me killed in THREE GAMES.
WE ARE ENEMIES FOREVER NOW DORMIO. I WILL DESTROY YOU!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: UncertainJakutten on May 03, 2011, 03:44:52 AM
I'll kneecap him for you, Shadoweh! Then you can carve him up as you please! I just call the spleen!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on May 03, 2011, 03:46:17 AM
attempted
##Saturn Ring Shadoweh
##Saturn Ring UncertainKitten

Coincidentally, both of you were the bombs. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 03:47:25 AM
Shadoweh's role made her immune to becoming a bomb, though.

Which means that in actuality, she wasn't Bardiche's Sex Bomb. How disappointing.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Hanged Hourai on May 03, 2011, 03:49:59 AM
Lessee.  Instead of rant, constructive criticism!
<lack of Hourai>

='[

But eh. Once again, I manage to reach the mid-bottom area of my mafia mood swing performance.
What does that make it now? Bad, good, meh, trololololo mass confusion, good, bad.
This all happened after Chaore made me bi-polar  GDI.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 03:51:11 AM
Hourai: You're not that horrible of a player, really. It's just that you somehow never manage to draw attention, even postgame, perhaps as a side effect of always rolling PRs.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 03:51:55 AM
It's just that you somehow never manage to draw attention

>_>; Even I forgot about him.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 03:53:05 AM
You should read the QT to think what I thought of you~ There is an entire post dedicated to me flipping tables at you! It's not even that you looked that scummy, Kiro even figured it out. It's just no one was willing to look instead of 'townie cred lynch!'

And considering the PR thing your non-detection aura is pretty good.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on May 03, 2011, 03:53:49 AM
But only she knew that.
To everyone else Shadoweh and UncertainKitten were confirmed bombs once Bardiche flipped, and if you believed his crumbs.
I hit both regardless. :V

I need to change the way I word my posts when I play this game. :(

Warning - CHOO CHOO I'M A TRAIN

(aseragfag I got cut 4 seperate times)
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Conqueror on May 03, 2011, 03:55:11 AM
I need to change the way I word my posts when I play this game. :(

Just don't waffle so much.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 03:55:45 AM
You need to go to a new school besides NeoSerela's Perfect Confirmation Bias Class and learn to make comments on everyone instead of pointing out how your scum partners are linked together :p
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Dormio Ergo Sum on May 03, 2011, 03:58:39 AM
It's how I type though. :(
I should totally play a game where all my posts are in Korean and run through google translate.
It would be amazing.

And about that, Shadoweh, I really didn't have the time to do anything on D1 aside from read you.
Blame Keine, the greatest mafia player in existence.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 04:32:11 AM
w/e
Nue Nue Dansu!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 04:38:19 AM
Edible: Are you going to post the Dormio/Pesco QT?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 04:39:44 AM
Oh yeah, and uh, every point of rage I posted about how Sect and Dan were the worst players in existance, except for the part about modkills, were all blatant lies. You newbies are so cute and I love each and every one of you <^_^>
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Pesco on May 03, 2011, 04:49:38 AM
http://www.quicktopic.com/46/H/KteWGUeN4qRsC (http://www.quicktopic.com/46/H/KteWGUeN4qRsC)

No time to read or comment.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Kiro on May 03, 2011, 05:04:33 AM
Wow Shadoweh. That is some monstrosity of a pic you put together. *instasaved* And the Sing-Along Blog was hilarious to read. I can feel those knife slashes on my face all over again.

That D1 timehax thing was really close. Kudos to Bard for directing me back onto the right track in Day 4. I was going along with K4U's logic and he just flats out state that he'd lynch Shadoweh over Dan. That got me to rethink the comparisons again and I changed my reads almost completely on the fly. It's never too late to pursue Sarah Conner new opinions.

Also UK got the good renewed suspicion on Shadoweh in Day 2 and then was killed for her troubles. Indeed, you shouldn't take who dies at Night as some all-defining sign as to who the Scum are and I tend not to. But Mafia is a game of advantages and in this case with this setup, it felt Scum motivated in the "she's onto me" sort of a vibe and that ended up being the one real reason I was going to put Shadoweh over Dan.

I really wanted to save Hourai Day 4, but I knew there was no chance it'd fly. I think that's probably my one real regret in the game. At that moment, I got lazy, said fuck it, better safe than sorry, and pushed it along. Because I still couldn't decide between Shadoweh and Dan and I should have pushed a vote on one of them in Day 4, backed by my Town confirmedness which is rare to get.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Kiro on May 03, 2011, 05:05:28 AM
EBWOP: Oh dear..................... I have a sig implanted onto me......  :ohdear:
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 05:08:37 AM
I now wonder what scum!Kiro looks like.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Kiro on May 03, 2011, 05:14:44 AM
I play average to below average as Scum. Trust me on this. Even in games I've won, I'm usually lynched or heavily suspicious/about to be lynched. It doesn't correlate with my Townie reputation.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 05:20:00 AM
At least half the quicktopic can be summed up as "FFFF KIRO!" I especially liked how Dormio tried to prove I was wrong and you aren't scary, and got lynched for his efforts. The only thing that scared me more then how close you were to pushing a case on me D4 was how much we thought alike. I think surviving four days with you STARING AT ME is it's own win condition. Since I've read all about you I knew how much danger I was in.  :ohdear: It just made me happy to meet another one of the interesting characters from the fabled times of old :3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Omba on May 03, 2011, 05:26:37 AM
I've only read one game with Kiro in it and that had Serp protecting him all the way. :V
But yeah, guess I'm going to read up more on you.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: ActionDan on May 03, 2011, 06:58:15 AM
Man shadoweh the worst part about D5 was that I could feel you trying to box me into a hole.  That's why I brought up the 500 times townier thing, just to break the flow a little.  I was pretty certain you were the scum once you unvoted.  I just thought I could 1v1 D6 after a K4U.  That would require me to stick to my guns and attack K4U though D5 despite my beliefs, or else I'd look quite bad.  So ya kitten I am srry, I *did* actually believe you after a while.  I also thought you would win against shadoweh after she hammered me!

I also thought Bard not posting much D5 was a ruse in order to get the scum to NK omba instead. :) 
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Pesco on May 03, 2011, 07:21:27 AM
Hey Edible can we get those ObvTown/ObvScum groupies?
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 07:40:52 AM
I also thought Bard not posting much D5 was a ruse in order to get the scum to NK omba instead. :)
I said that in the QT didn't I? I'm wondering if Bard will say so or not. Did you reed my blog Dan? I even included some actual scumslips just for you!
Quote from: ActionDan
Man shadoweh the worst part about D5 was that I could feel you trying to box me into a hole.  That's why I brought up the 500 times townier thing, just to break the flow a little.  I was pretty certain you were the scum once you unvoted.  I just thought I could 1v1 D6 after a K4U.  That would require me to stick to my guns and attack K4U though D5 despite my beliefs, or else I'd look quite bad.  So ya kitten I am srry, I *did* actually believe you after a while.  I also thought you would win against shadoweh after she hammered me!
I'm going to be blunt. I think you would have lost horribly. Between Kitten's defense of me, taken more seriously after her townflip, and your actions,  you would have lost because you spent the entire game acting like scum. The last day would have been me pointing out how every single post and action you ever made and took was leading up to you automatically winning the game as scum. You were always suposed to be the last lynch because the longer you played the scummier you sounded. Town won because K4u made ME feel like she couldn't be lynched, and I was worried Bard would come back and realize I sounded super scummy five-thousand, so I hammered too quickly. Also? I was bored. I wanted to play Mafia :<

Edit: Two things, One, you need to read posts made before yours before posting. That Zak hammer was pretty horrible :p Two, it is never a bad time to go after who you think is scum no matter how worried you are about changing your tunnel target. If you think someone is scum, vote for them.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Bardiche on May 03, 2011, 12:18:03 PM
Yeah, when Dan flipped town I knew Shadoweh had to be the scums because, you know, she hammered him while there was plenty of time left.

I just wanted to live to the final day to lynch her. </3
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Bardiche on May 03, 2011, 12:25:06 PM
Also I was terrible town at the end because I just did whatever I felt like at the time, so I forewent scumhunting by just relying on gut and looking at who was scummiest in the ten posts before me. Sadly, this turned out to be Dan when it shouldn't have. :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 12:25:57 PM
It was totally your fault for not posting enough >:( You gave me your apathy!
AND I'M LEAVING YOU FOR UNCERTAINKITTEN! SO THERE
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Bardiche on May 03, 2011, 12:27:03 PM
That's cool, I don't want you anyway. I told you.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 12:29:19 PM
>.> I thought that was your subtle way of telling people you suspected me actually. MISSION FAILEO!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: ActionDan on May 03, 2011, 12:32:09 PM
Ah, ok. I didn't have time last read to read your QT, but I did catch some *choice* entries :D
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Bardiche on May 03, 2011, 12:33:57 PM
Sorry, serious mafier is serious.

It was between Dan and you all along, because K4me was really reasonable and Polaris had truly read completely reasonable to me all game.

It's just that I gave you more of a pass than I should've because of our past love, and I gave Dan more of the Bad Eye than I should have due to him keeping on insisting he was town in what was likely obvtown but somehow read as obvscum.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: WHMZakeri on May 03, 2011, 01:08:50 PM
I didn't suspect Shadoweh as being the final scum ... pretty much until after I had read edibles admission that she was a second time (It didn't register the first time). She did a fairly good job of covering her tracks and seem like the cute Town Belle that she usually is. The Nightkill caught me off guard, and my first thought was scum actually switched their kill to UK just because of my story.  I pretty much wouldn't have even picked up on it myself until shadoweh hammered day five. That was pretty much the point where Shadoweh gave up all pretenses of being a pro-town player. If anyone who was in Lylo in this same situation with her and the Lurk Belle and actually voted Kitten4u, I would have questioned their ability to obtain and evaluate facts placed in front of them. Of course, this just means Omba is smart.

As for my own play, I'm very satisfied with it, even though I didn't get to do much. I tested out a new style of PBPA. Rather than listing everyone's own posts under their name, I instead listed all of the posts other people made that talked about them. It actually makes it a lot easier to see how the cases on people flow, and how the people on those cases move around. Like, for example, early day one, Dormio and Sect both wanted Shadoweh dead and gone until suddenly they didn't, and both switched away to two different town cases. In retrospect, this probably should have alerted me that they didn't really want Shadoweh dead.

My main problem however is that I tend to just lose interest and pester off the longer I spend being a part of the game, so of course I'm going to shine at my best when 1. I'm only alive for one day, and 2. That day is not day one.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 01:19:26 PM
>-> Oh come on that day was like wrist slittingly slow! My weakness is my manic inability to stop talking. I thought it was funny you asked me why I was being so quiet. All the flowy text and cute names were confined to a hidden place <3 Your story was still the best. Edible never answered me if I could no-kill and we could vote for Happily Ever After >.>
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 01:24:49 PM
Edible never answered me if I could no-kill and we could vote for Happily Ever After >.>

Nope! :D

BTW, I don't think the late hammer would have mattered either way (as stated in the dead QT, I felt Dan getting lynched would mean Shadoweh would be lynched the next day), but if you want to get away with it as scum or town next time, say "I'm announcing my intent to hammer in x hours" and then just wait a bit.  Sometimes days just drag on too damn long.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Bardiche on May 03, 2011, 02:13:39 PM
The best way to play the game is by not caring about your alignment and posting so that you will have fun. Always remember, though, that investing too much emotionally in Mafia is going to come back to bite you, because it WILL drain you. For example, Kiro and Kilga both have a posting style where they will often not say much unless they have a relevant and pertinent observation and/or interjection to make.

Talking too much should be dealt with in QTs or some other private channels of communication. I tend to PM the mod if I have things to share or whatnot, or when I fear my Unlimited Gambit Works will work adversely. Attracting the cop, for example, was something that was half-troll, half-gambit, so I wasn't sure if Edible would permit it in the spirit of the game. That, and I vented at him whenever I was seeing things in the game that made me sigh and want to blow off into a huge rant.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 03, 2011, 02:26:46 PM
I don't think I was actually as emotionally invested in the game as it looked.  Well, at least not anymore than I would be normally.  I was just backed into a corner, which meant if I wanted to not be lynched, I HAD DO TO SOMETHING.  The fact that I could not lose no matter what as long as I wasn't lynched just made that stronger.  Kitten4u does not like to lose. :P

What drove my total emotionalness was that I have serious issues with futility.  There are two things you never say to Kitten4u, even indirectly, unless you want her to hate you forever.

1.) That she doesn't care about something, especially if she really does/has worked really hard on it.
2.) That nothing she does actually matters.

So yeah.  I still realize it wasn't intentional, but seriously, that was like the worst thing he could have said to me.  It doesn't matter how these things are said, why they are said, what the person wanted me to get from it or any other factor.  Once it is said I fly into an emotional frenzy to the point that I often can't even look at the thing in question.  I'm totally serious when I said I seriously considered self-hammering after that.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 02:32:42 PM
Noooo don't be a NeoKitten ;_; Don't do eeeet
Bard I think I got the talking in QT down pat >.> This was as much a learning experience for me as the other newbies :3 Also I wanted to be the Macho Cop solely so when I claimed I could parody the Macho Man song.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Kitten4u on May 03, 2011, 02:33:47 PM
I didn't actually do it. :<
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em on May 03, 2011, 02:35:12 PM
@Bard: Please note that I originally sent in a PM to cop Hourai instead of you, which means that your Unlimited Gambit Works were not entirely effective. I would have just passed you off as bard!Town had I not noticed your apparent knowledge of Sect's role (except that turned out to be a guess, derp).
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Bardiche on May 03, 2011, 02:49:10 PM
Note to self: next time when you want to be copped, try to be more obvscum so people will definitely cop you.

And yes, it was a guess. I tend to have very lucky guesses, except on Who Is Actually Scum.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Pesco on May 03, 2011, 04:39:06 PM
But Bard why be a dick and make the cop waste his action on you?

Fuckin' jerk :V
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Bardiche on May 03, 2011, 04:51:24 PM
But Bard why be a dick and make the cop waste his action on you?

Fuckin' jerk :V

My side's victory condition is always overriden by my personal victory condition: stay alive until the end. Besides, else he'd have wasted it on Hourai instead anyway.

Thing is, at that juncture we had two people (among who the doc!) who really wanted me dead, and a shaky belief among people. I felt myself to be good mislynch material, and figured attracting the Cop would eliminate that. I found it a better plan to follow than hope the Cop pegged one of the two scum and the last one'd be a sail-on-by, and it was more amusing at the time to boot.

C'mon man, for all we knew ACTIONDAN was the Cop. That would've made me cry.

Also, to the Graveyard people who said I "forgot" about the roleblocker: no, not quite. Typically scum can only use their role OR kill, not do both: it'd be silly to work off of an assumption where they CAN do both.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Edible on May 03, 2011, 04:53:22 PM
Also, to the Graveyard people who said I "forgot" about the roleblocker: no, not quite. Typically scum can only use their role OR kill, not do both: it'd be silly to work off of an assumption where they CAN do both.

>_> Er.  The RB's ability to use both was spelled out in the role PMs, which were posted publically on D1.
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Shadoweh on May 03, 2011, 05:03:25 PM
I have no idea why people think Bard is unreadable >.> There's a huge difference between Scum Bard and lolBard. Scum Bard might actually make cases on the scum during the game!  :colonveeplusalpha: You were totally on the mislynch list :D I'm glad I read my role pm better then you did!
Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: ActionDan on May 03, 2011, 05:07:59 PM
"C'mon man, for all we knew ACTIONDAN was the Cop. That would've made me cry."

That would have been sweet!  I would have copped HH N1 and then Bard N2. :D

Title: Re: A Balanced Game of Mafia (Over; town wins)
Post by: Bardiche on May 03, 2011, 05:39:54 PM
>_> Er.  The RB's ability to use both was spelled out in the role PMs, which were posted publically on D1.

... wait, what.

I have no idea why people think Bard is unreadable >.> There's a huge difference between Scum Bard and lolBard. Scum Bard might actually make cases on the scum during the game!  :colonveeplusalpha: You were totally on the mislynch list :D I'm glad I read my role pm better then you did!

:( Bard sad faze now.