Author Topic: 東方意地奴 ~ Touhou Ijiyatsu - Monarchly Moron (Ver. 1.00e) (Read 62318 times)

Drake · « **Reply #540 on:** November 18, 2009, 12:54:24 AM »

Okay so I just realized that if there aren't any actual Touhous in the game world, then that means Gpop is a schizo and Koishi is pretty much his superbly well thought-out imaginary ~~wife~~.

Gpop · « **Reply #541 on:** November 18, 2009, 12:56:36 AM »

Quote from: Drake on November 18, 2009, 12:54:24 AM

Okay so I just realized that if there aren't any actual Touhous in the game world, then that means Gpop is a schizo and Koishi is pretty much his superbly well thought-out imaginary ~~wife~~.

Even if there isn't any actual Touhous in the game, doesn't mean that we're aware of Touhou itself :V

Doomsday · « **Reply #542 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:01:19 AM »

Also, maybe we should take Touhou out of the title, and just have Ijiyatsu - Monarchly Moron. (or maybe we've already done that and I'm just slow)

Suikama · « **Reply #543 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:13:17 AM »

IIRC tons of fan games like CtC (and periphery of power lol) all have 'touhou' in the title.

Actually pretty much every touhou fan game has Touhou in the title

Gpop · « **Reply #544 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:13:46 AM »

Quote from: Suikama on November 18, 2009, 01:13:17 AM

IIRC tons of fan games like CtC (and periphery of power lol) all have 'touhou' in the title

Because they're directly related to Touhou?

Drake · « **Reply #545 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:15:02 AM »

We had this discussion like three pages back.

Suikama · « **Reply #546 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:19:52 AM »

Quote from: Drake on November 18, 2009, 01:15:02 AM

We had this discussion like three pages back.

:V

Who's got the most updated version of the player scripts? Or is what's in the programming thread right now the newest versions?

Drake · « **Reply #547 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:34:42 AM »

Naut should be working on Zengar and Gpop, but he's waiting for me to give him the power system base code.

Fetch()tirade · « **Reply #548 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:35:26 AM »

In this post: catching up

If it would help ease the workload for the programmers, I'd be willing to drop out from being an embodiment. I don't think that it'll matter much to me anyways, I just want to see this game finished.
As for spell card ideas, I'm more than ready to continue ~~burning my precious time that I could be using on my studies~~brainstorming. However, I can't do this without at least a general idea of what the character it's for is about. For example, I could do Nobu's and Zengar's easily because I had a basis to work on (snake, swords). But that's it. Anything else I've posted like it is some random concept I thought of putting up before I forgot.
Lastly, I'd like to be a huma bird

Spoiler:

.

Nine West · « **Reply #549 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:40:40 AM »

Arrrghhhhh-

People should stop stepping down unless a formal problem is addressed by the programmers. The Embodiment list is *currently* as fine as it is now.

Fetch()tirade · « **Reply #550 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:45:42 AM »

I never said I had, just that I wasn't going to hold a grudge if ever such a travesty will occur.

Rikter · « **Reply #551 on:** November 18, 2009, 01:46:44 AM »

This means there are 4 birds in Ijiyatsu then Aya, Okuu, Mystia and Tokiko.
Skye, Prody, Flashtirade and I

Prody · « **Reply #552 on:** November 18, 2009, 04:00:05 AM »

Concerning embodiments, I do really agree with the fact that they should only be worked on after getting the game completed, unless the game can't really be completed without them.

Suikama · « **Reply #553 on:** November 18, 2009, 04:19:31 AM »

Quote from: Prody on November 18, 2009, 04:00:05 AM

Concerning embodiments, I do really agree with the fact that they should only be worked on after getting the game completed, unless the game can't really be completed without them.

Now here's a rather pressing issue.

Do we make embodiments now? Or do we finish the game first and implement them later? Surely it would be possible to make the entire game and then go back later and add embodiments, but then we risk having bad design. We don't want the embodiments to suddenly add undodgable walls, but on the other hand we don't want them to be trivial either, only shooting a lame three pronged aimed shot or something.

We want the embodiments to add a layer of depth to the game in terms of both scoring and survival, but it can't be imbalanced in either way. Ultimately getting this balance is key and will result in severe backlash if done improperly *CouhgUFORAGEcoughKefitcough*

So in that case it might not be a good idea to simply tack it on at the end. We have to design the stages with the embodiments in mind.

Also another thing about embodiments is this

Quote

# When an enemy is destroyed it releases IE.
# Idiot energy does not fall like other items do.
# Collecting IE increases the base point value by 10. (In Extra and Phantasm, it increases by 100.)
# Dying and bombing decrease IE and thus base point value, but bombing collects all IE on screen.
# If 100 IE is gathered on the screen, it will gather in the center and turn into an Idiot Embodiment.

Typically people will auto collect every item they see, so if they jump right into the game, they'll go through and end up never getting a single extra life or bomb and rage will surely ensue.

We need to alter this in some way. Maybe change it so that if the player collects 100 IE then it turns into an embodiment or make IE uncollectable or something like that.

Mounting Jaggis · « **Reply #554 on:** November 18, 2009, 04:29:54 AM »

Quote from: Suikama on November 18, 2009, 04:19:31 AM

Also another thing about embodiments is this
Typically people will auto collect every item they see, so if they jump right into the game, they'll go through and end up never getting a single extra life or bomb and rage will surely ensue

Didn't that happen in the UFO demo when people just grabbed random UFOs?

Drake · « **Reply #555 on:** November 18, 2009, 04:39:39 AM »

Except what's true in this case is that instead of collecting what you see, you don't collect what you see.

I rather like the balance I've set and I'm not quite sure how we could implement everything in another way. Perhaps in stage 1, when Jan explodes, he releases the entire 100 IE, that creates an Embodiment nigh-immediately. By then, the player will be accustomed to seeing IE, and if they see the IE gather when there's such a huge amount and they get a bomb or life piece, they'll almost certainly be convinced to replicate that scenario.

Suikama · « **Reply #556 on:** November 18, 2009, 04:42:39 AM »

Quote from: Drake on November 18, 2009, 04:39:39 AM

Except what's true in this case is that instead of collecting what you see, you don't collect what you see.

I rather like the balance I've set and I'm not quite sure how we could implement everything in another way. Perhaps in stage 1, when Jan explodes, he releases the entire 100 IE, that creates an Embodiment nigh-immediately. By then, the player will be accustomed to seeing IE, and if they see the IE gather when there's such a huge amount and they get a bomb or life piece, they'll almost certainly be convinced to replicate that scenario.

Ah yes that works too.

Also I'd imagine going to the POC won't collect IE (like UFO) to allow people to keep IE on the stage but still be allowed to use the POC

Quote from: Skye on November 18, 2009, 04:29:54 AM

Didn't that happen in the UFO demo when people just grabbed random UFOs?

Pretty much and I'm sure some idiot out there raged at it :V

Drake · « **Reply #557 on:** November 18, 2009, 04:49:11 AM »

It's the opposite; POC will collect all items while grazing just collects Power and Points.

Suikama · « **Reply #558 on:** November 18, 2009, 04:55:02 AM »

Quote from: Drake on November 18, 2009, 04:49:11 AM

It's the opposite; POC will collect all items while grazing just collects Power and Points.

So basically people who play for survival stay at the bottom of the screen, graze stuff, and let IE accumulate while people who play for score have to run around everywhere as usual, right?

Sounds good to me.

LHCling · « **Reply #559 on:** November 18, 2009, 05:07:31 AM »

Quote from: Suikama on November 18, 2009, 04:55:02 AM

So basically people who play for survival stay at the bottom of the screen, graze stuff, and let IE accumulate while people who play for score have to run around everywhere as usual, right?

Quote from: Suikama on November 18, 2009, 04:55:02 AM

Sounds good to me.

Scoring doesn't always running around everywhere as usual. It's all pre-planned :V
Anyway, I like the idea of running around the screen anyway.

Suikama · « **Reply #560 on:** November 18, 2009, 05:14:42 AM »

Quote from: Baity on November 18, 2009, 05:07:31 AM

Scoring doesn't always running around everywhere as usual. It's all pre-planned :V
Anyway, I like the idea of running around the screen anyway.

I meant comparatively. Like you have to actively destroy every enemy and collect all items at the POC and stuff like that, while if you play for survival you just stay at the bottom and stream everything (except in SA where you always do that but meh)

LHCling · « **Reply #561 on:** November 18, 2009, 05:21:18 AM »

I just realized I repeated myself. And failed a huge grammatical check. Eh; I blame the extremely high temperature today.

Quote from: Suikama on November 18, 2009, 05:14:42 AM

I meant comparatively.

I get what you mean.

nintendonut888 · « **Reply #562 on:** November 18, 2009, 05:38:00 AM »

Speaking of scoring, IMO more games should have the PC-98 convention of giving various musings depending on your score. Even if I can't read them in those games I think the concept is a nice touch.

Suikama · « **Reply #563 on:** November 18, 2009, 05:42:33 AM »

Quote from: nintendonut888 on November 18, 2009, 05:38:00 AM

Speaking of scoring, IMO more games should have the PC-98 convention of giving various musings depending on your score. Even if I can't read them in those games I think the concept is a nice touch.

Please do explain for those of us who don't play PC98 too often

LHCling · « **Reply #564 on:** November 18, 2009, 05:56:48 AM »

Donut is referring to the messages that you get when you 1cc the game, such as "Legendary Man". Which was dependent on your performance in the game overall.

Hold on, I'll get screenshots.

Quote from: Baity on August 04, 2009, 11:25:30 PM

Quote from: Signum-hime on August 05, 2009, 05:39:54 AM

魔人 - Demon
究極の名人 - Ultimate Master

For both, the goal is to say "Reduce the number of deaths!"

Drake · « **Reply #565 on:** November 18, 2009, 06:03:39 AM »

You have pros and cons of summoning Embodiments.

In scoring there would be a qualm of to-collect-or-not-to-collect. If you summon an Embodiment and not die, you get all 100 IE back, in addition to extra graze possibilities which nets you multiplier and max-value Points. On the flip side, the pattern decided (originally) will be randomized, so depending on where you are in the stage and what pattern you get it might throw you totally off. If you bomb or die you lose IE and also some of the stored IE as well, which altogether would be worse than just collecting all the IE in the first place. It will require planning, that's for sure.

Survival on the other hand is simpler, but you still have a decision to make. If you want lives or bombs you do need to summon Embodiments, but you can't bomb them all because if you kill them you get bombs back (redundant gain), and if you die while trying to survive to get the life piece the result is the same, redundant. If you kill it as soon as possible you get your bomb piece quickly, which is the method with the best danger-reward ratio, which encourages people to bomb more. It's all if the player decides whether or not they want to take a risk with the stage, in both scoring and survival. It's just that the reasons for doing so are different.

An experimental part of the power formula is also based on getting you to bomb. When you die, the amount of power you get back is (bear with me, it's more simple than it looks)
floor(power) - ((1-bombed)/2) + ((10-lives)*0.05) - 1
Where power is the amount of power you had when you died, bombed is 1 if you had bombed before and 0 if not, and lives is your current lives (after death), unless you have no extra lives in which case you just get 4.00 regardless. Let's say you have 3.15 power, you hadn't bombed and 4 lives after death. You'll get 3 - 0.50 + 0.20 - 1 = 1.70 power. If you had bombed you would get 2.20.

Anyone like this idea?